Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [alternate-history] No cover up

Expand Messages
  • Thomas P Roche
    ... Why do you think he pardons the flunkies, rather than letting them go to jail to demonstrate his own lack of involvement? ... Special prosecutors? ... Any
    Message 1 of 6 , Jun 6, 2000
    • 0 Attachment
      On Sat, 27 May 2000, scott palter wrote:

      > Hypothetically Nixon gives the following speech:'We did a lot of silly
      > things. That's the way politics used to be played. I see now that those
      > days are past. I'm taking the blame myself. There will be no more dirty
      > tricks. However, these good men acted in good faith and I'm pardoning them
      > all. If this offends you please do not vote for me. '
      >
      > Politically itsa 3 days wonder. He loses Vermont and Rhode Island as well
      > as Massachusettes.
      >

      Why do you think he pardons the flunkies, rather than letting them go to
      jail to demonstrate his own lack of involvement?

      > The House Dems try hearings but they get nowhere. Its clearly a partisan
      > witch hunt. Nixon's officials develope accute lack of recall but absent
      > criminal proceedings to compell further testimony the line holds. Deep

      Special prosecutors?

      > throat and the rest of the agency minions decide to cool it.
      >

      Any notion on who Deep Throat was? Will the liberal media establishment
      let this lie?

      > When the NVA make their first move in '74 Nixon send sthe 52's back for a
      > week. The 75 offensive never happens. The 74 Congressional elections give
      > the GOP the Senate and a working majority in the House with a Dixiecrat
      > Speaker and a split of committee chairs. The war winds down through the
      > 80's to a de facto partition of RVN, Cambodia and Laos. Fewer battles every
      > year but no formal peace (Korea as example).

      Very likely.
      >
      > NASA keeps going to the moon. We now have moonbases, L bases, space
      > stations and a full SPS (funding provided as a consequence of the great 70's
      > oil crisis). Two years ago we began to mine the first captured near earth
      > asteroid.
      >
      Do you think the American People are up for the cost of doing this?

      > We also embargoed eastern hemisphere oil after the first crisis. We're back
      > at a protected US oil industry as in Ike's days with licensed exports from
      > Canada, Mexico, Venezuela, Columbia, Ecudor and Angola( the hemispheric
      > exception - see below).

      What does this do to fuel prices and the economy at large?

      >
      > The great Red offensive in Portuguese Africa is rolled back in Angola with S
      > Af and CIA help. Holden Roberto holds the capital and North. Savimbi holds
      > the rest of the country. He knocks out Roberto and takes the rest in round
      > 2 in the early 80's.

      Implications for Africa/ rest of 3d world's relationship to USA?

      >
      > Scott
      >
      >
      > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
      > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
      > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
      > >Subject: [alternate-history] No cover up
      > >Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 21:47:21 -0400 (EDT)
      > >
      > >Nixon finds out about Watergate and CREEP illegality, July 1972, and hangs
      > >all the dirty laundry out to dry. What happens?
      > >
      > >
      >
      > ________________________________________________________________________
      > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.
      > Remember the good 'ol days
      > http://click.egroups.com/1/4053/2/_/537028/_/959486329/
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      >
      >
      >
    • scott palter
      ... In OTL the stiff sentences by Sirroco and his turning the screws on the burglars lead to the whole thing unravveling. Pardoned, they keep their mouths
      Message 2 of 6 , Jun 9, 2000
      • 0 Attachment
        >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
        >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
        >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
        >Subject: Re: [alternate-history] No cover up
        >Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2000 17:15:34 -0400 (EDT)
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >On Sat, 27 May 2000, scott palter wrote:
        >
        > > Hypothetically Nixon gives the following speech:'We did a lot of silly
        > > things. That's the way politics used to be played. I see now that
        >those
        > > days are past. I'm taking the blame myself. There will be no more
        >dirty
        > > tricks. However, these good men acted in good faith and I'm pardoning
        >them
        > > all. If this offends you please do not vote for me. '
        > >
        > > Politically itsa 3 days wonder. He loses Vermont and Rhode Island as
        >well
        > > as Massachusettes.
        > >
        >
        >Why do you think he pardons the flunkies, rather than letting them go to
        >jail to demonstrate his own lack of involvement?

        In OTL the stiff sentences by Sirroco and his turning the screws on the
        'burglars' lead to the whole thing unravveling. Pardoned, they keep their
        mouths shut.


        >
        > > The House Dems try hearings but they get nowhere. Its clearly a
        >partisan
        > > witch hunt. Nixon's officials develope accute lack of recall but absent
        > > criminal proceedings to compell further testimony the line holds. Deep
        >
        >Special prosecutors?

        Special prosecutors come after he fires the regular prosecutors. Without
        the burglars breaking and burning up the ladder there is nothing to
        prosecute besides an endless stream of convenient bad memory.

        >
        > > throat and the rest of the agency minions decide to cool it.
        > >
        >
        >Any notion on who Deep Throat was? Will the liberal media establishment
        >let this lie?

        Woodward and Burnstein claim they'll ultimately give a name. Without
        documentation neither has any credibility left. I believe Deep Throat was
        actually a string of Agency people determined not to take the rap for a
        president they dispised who tried to abuse their cover for political
        purposes.


        >
        > > When the NVA make their first move in '74 Nixon send sthe 52's back for
        >a
        > > week. The 75 offensive never happens. The 74 Congressional elections
        >give
        > > the GOP the Senate and a working majority in the House with a Dixiecrat
        > > Speaker and a split of committee chairs. The war winds down through the
        > > 80's to a de facto partition of RVN, Cambodia and Laos. Fewer battles
        >every
        > > year but no formal peace (Korea as example).
        >
        >Very likely.
        > >
        > > NASA keeps going to the moon. We now have moonbases, L bases, space
        > > stations and a full SPS (funding provided as a consequence of the great
        >70's
        > > oil crisis). Two years ago we began to mine the first captured near
        >earth
        > > asteroid.
        > >
        >Do you think the American People are up for the cost of doing this?

        The American people didn't dump the space program. The povertycrat wing of
        the Democratic House and Senate membership did.


        >
        > > We also embargoed eastern hemisphere oil after the first crisis. We're
        >back
        > > at a protected US oil industry as in Ike's days with licensed exports
        >from
        > > Canada, Mexico, Venezuela, Columbia, Ecudor and Angola( the hemispheric
        > > exception - see below).
        >
        >What does this do to fuel prices and the economy at large?

        Fuel prices are higher than in OTL but as we are buying from folks who spend
        the dollars here the net economic effect is to marginally slow down
        suburbanization, exurbanization and the growth of the Sun Belt at the
        expense of the Lakes States.

        >
        > >
        > > The great Red offensive in Portuguese Africa is rolled back in Angola
        >with S
        > > Af and CIA help. Holden Roberto holds the capital and North. Savimbi
        >holds
        > > the rest of the country. He knocks out Roberto and takes the rest in
        >round
        > > 2 in the early 80's.
        >
        >Implications for Africa/ rest of 3d world's relationship to USA?

        More antiUS rhetoric in 3rd world and Europe. A US dominated block in the
        West African bulge and across central Africa.
        Scott
        >
        > >
        > > Scott
        > >
        > >
        > > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
        > > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
        > > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
        > > >Subject: [alternate-history] No cover up
        > > >Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 21:47:21 -0400 (EDT)
        > > >
        > > >Nixon finds out about Watergate and CREEP illegality, July 1972, and
        >hangs
        > > >all the dirty laundry out to dry. What happens?
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________________________________________________
        > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
        > >
        > >
        > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.
        > > Remember the good 'ol days
        > > http://click.egroups.com/1/4053/2/_/537028/_/959486329/
        > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >

        ________________________________________________________________________
        Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
      • Thomas P Roche
        ... Yes, but wouldn t this produce the potential Gerry Ford pardon problem? ... What about the effects of the crusading leftie mass media? ... Colson agrees.
        Message 3 of 6 , Jun 10, 2000
        • 0 Attachment
          On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, scott palter wrote:

          >
          >
          >
          > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
          > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
          > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
          > >Subject: Re: [alternate-history] No cover up
          > >Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2000 17:15:34 -0400 (EDT)
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >On Sat, 27 May 2000, scott palter wrote:
          > >
          > > > Hypothetically Nixon gives the following speech:'We did a lot of silly
          > > > things. That's the way politics used to be played. I see now that
          > >those
          > > > days are past. I'm taking the blame myself. There will be no more
          > >dirty
          > > > tricks. However, these good men acted in good faith and I'm pardoning
          > >them
          > > > all. If this offends you please do not vote for me. '
          > > >
          > > > Politically itsa 3 days wonder. He loses Vermont and Rhode Island as
          > >well
          > > > as Massachusettes.
          > > >
          > >
          > >Why do you think he pardons the flunkies, rather than letting them go to
          > >jail to demonstrate his own lack of involvement?
          >
          > In OTL the stiff sentences by Sirroco and his turning the screws on the
          > 'burglars' lead to the whole thing unravveling. Pardoned, they keep their
          > mouths shut.

          Yes, but wouldn't this produce the potential Gerry Ford pardon problem?
          >
          >
          > >
          > > > The House Dems try hearings but they get nowhere. Its clearly a
          > >partisan
          > > > witch hunt. Nixon's officials develope accute lack of recall but absent
          > > > criminal proceedings to compell further testimony the line holds. Deep
          > >
          > >Special prosecutors?
          >
          > Special prosecutors come after he fires the regular prosecutors. Without
          > the burglars breaking and burning up the ladder there is nothing to
          > prosecute besides an endless stream of convenient bad memory.

          What about the effects of the crusading leftie mass media?
          >
          > >
          > > > throat and the rest of the agency minions decide to cool it.
          > > >
          > >
          > >Any notion on who Deep Throat was? Will the liberal media establishment
          > >let this lie?
          >
          > Woodward and Burnstein claim they'll ultimately give a name. Without
          > documentation neither has any credibility left. I believe Deep Throat was
          > actually a string of Agency people determined not to take the rap for a
          > president they dispised who tried to abuse their cover for political
          > purposes.

          Colson agrees. He says there could be no one Deep Throat who knew all
          attributed to him, saying t here h ad to be a minimum of three different
          figures.

          >
          >
          > >
          > > > When the NVA make their first move in '74 Nixon send sthe 52's back for
          > >a
          > > > week. The 75 offensive never happens. The 74 Congressional elections
          > >give
          > > > the GOP the Senate and a working majority in the House with a Dixiecrat
          > > > Speaker and a split of committee chairs. The war winds down through the
          > > > 80's to a de facto partition of RVN, Cambodia and Laos. Fewer battles
          > >every
          > > > year but no formal peace (Korea as example).
          > >
          > >Very likely.
          > > >
          > > > NASA keeps going to the moon. We now have moonbases, L bases, space
          > > > stations and a full SPS (funding provided as a consequence of the great
          > >70's
          > > > oil crisis). Two years ago we began to mine the first captured near
          > >earth
          > > > asteroid.
          > > >
          > >Do you think the American People are up for the cost of doing this?
          >
          > The American people didn't dump the space program. The povertycrat wing of
          > the Democratic House and Senate membership did.

          What would we gain by running th e space program as you wish?
          >
          >
          > >
          > > > We also embargoed eastern hemisphere oil after the first crisis. We're
          > >back
          > > > at a protected US oil industry as in Ike's days with licensed exports
          > >from
          > > > Canada, Mexico, Venezuela, Columbia, Ecudor and Angola( the hemispheric
          > > > exception - see below).
          > >
          > >What does this do to fuel prices and the economy at large?
          >
          > Fuel prices are higher than in OTL but as we are buying from folks who spend
          > the dollars here the net economic effect is to marginally slow down
          > suburbanization, exurbanization and the growth of the Sun Belt at the
          > expense of the Lakes States.

          OK..

          tr

          >
          > >
          > > >
          > > > The great Red offensive in Portuguese Africa is rolled back in Angola
          > >with S
          > > > Af and CIA help. Holden Roberto holds the capital and North. Savimbi
          > >holds
          > > > the rest of the country. He knocks out Roberto and takes the rest in
          > >round
          > > > 2 in the early 80's.
          > >
          > >Implications for Africa/ rest of 3d world's relationship to USA?
          >
          > More antiUS rhetoric in 3rd world and Europe. A US dominated block in the
          > West African bulge and across central Africa.
          > Scott
          > >
          > > >
          > > > Scott
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
          > > > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
          > > > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
          > > > >Subject: [alternate-history] No cover up
          > > > >Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 21:47:21 -0400 (EDT)
          > > > >
          > > > >Nixon finds out about Watergate and CREEP illegality, July 1972, and
          > >hangs
          > > > >all the dirty laundry out to dry. What happens?
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > >
          > > > ________________________________________________________________________
          > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          > > > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.
          > > > Remember the good 'ol days
          > > > http://click.egroups.com/1/4053/2/_/537028/_/959486329/
          > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > >
          >
          > ________________________________________________________________________
          > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          > Visit Expedia.com for a chance to win airfare to Vegas for you and
          > 20 friends, $15,000 and a suite at Bellagio for New Year's. Or get a
          > shot at 2 roundtrip tickets anywhere in the U.S. given away daily.
          > http://click.egroups.com/1/5291/2/_/537028/_/960604332/
          > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >
          >
          >
        • scott palter
          ... Ford pardoned a President who when he resigned was several weeks from successful impeachment. Nixon would have pardoned the perps of a 3rd rate political
          Message 4 of 6 , Jun 10, 2000
          • 0 Attachment
            >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
            >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            >Subject: Re: [alternate-history] No cover up
            >Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 20:14:40 -0400 (EDT)
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >On Fri, 9 Jun 2000, scott palter wrote:
            >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
            > > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            > > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            > > >Subject: Re: [alternate-history] No cover up
            > > >Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2000 17:15:34 -0400 (EDT)
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >On Sat, 27 May 2000, scott palter wrote:
            > > >
            > > > > Hypothetically Nixon gives the following speech:'We did a lot of
            >silly
            > > > > things. That's the way politics used to be played. I see now that
            > > >those
            > > > > days are past. I'm taking the blame myself. There will be no more
            > > >dirty
            > > > > tricks. However, these good men acted in good faith and I'm
            >pardoning
            > > >them
            > > > > all. If this offends you please do not vote for me. '
            > > > >
            > > > > Politically itsa 3 days wonder. He loses Vermont and Rhode Island
            >as
            > > >well
            > > > > as Massachusettes.
            > > > >
            > > >
            > > >Why do you think he pardons the flunkies, rather than letting them go
            >to
            > > >jail to demonstrate his own lack of involvement?
            > >
            > > In OTL the stiff sentences by Sirroco and his turning the screws on the
            > > 'burglars' lead to the whole thing unravveling. Pardoned, they keep
            >their
            > > mouths shut.
            >
            >Yes, but wouldn't this produce the potential Gerry Ford pardon problem?

            Ford pardoned a President who when he resigned was several weeks from
            successful impeachment. Nixon would have pardoned the perps of a 3rd rate
            political black bag job. I can write the speech in my dreams : A run
            through of how everybody did it but he now realizes that times have changed.
            But he cannot let good men who thought they were doing no wrong suffer for
            his sins. So he's pardoning them as the fault lies on his doorstep. And if
            you don't like it or don't like him we've got a system in this country where
            you can have your say. Cuts his popular margin by 2-3% and he loses Rhode
            Island. Wow...

            > >
            > >
            > > >
            > > > > The House Dems try hearings but they get nowhere. Its clearly a
            > > >partisan
            > > > > witch hunt. Nixon's officials develope accute lack of recall but
            >absent
            > > > > criminal proceedings to compell further testimony the line holds.
            >Deep
            > > >
            > > >Special prosecutors?
            > >
            > > Special prosecutors come after he fires the regular prosecutors.
            >Without
            > > the burglars breaking and burning up the ladder there is nothing to
            > > prosecute besides an endless stream of convenient bad memory.
            >
            >What about the effects of the crusading leftie mass media?
            > >

            Even the NYT ggot sick of a story going nowhere. Without a stream of
            headlines from the Dc courts as the case progressed and Woodward and
            Burnstein kept using each piece of procedural trivia from Siricca's
            courthouse as a hook to hang the next 2-3 days stories on it dies. Just
            another part of the left's endless list of conservative crimes - same as
            IranContra - Mother Jones and the Village Voice do endless pieces and the
            NYT reports on it in one paragraph on page 110 Sunday under the bottom of a
            one collumn story on Iranian wheat production.

            > > >
            > > > > throat and the rest of the agency minions decide to cool it.
            > > > >
            > > >
            > > >Any notion on who Deep Throat was? Will the liberal media
            >establishment
            > > >let this lie?
            > >
            > > Woodward and Burnstein claim they'll ultimately give a name. Without
            > > documentation neither has any credibility left. I believe Deep Throat
            >was
            > > actually a string of Agency people determined not to take the rap for a
            > > president they dispised who tried to abuse their cover for political
            > > purposes.
            >
            >Colson agrees. He says there could be no one Deep Throat who knew all
            >attributed to him, saying t here h ad to be a minimum of three different
            >figures.

            The base belief is that the Agency resented Nixon's use of its assets for
            domestic purposes without its consent and double resented being asked to
            take the fall. They set out to burn him so as to cover their own trail on
            SouthEast Asia and other issues.



            >
            > >
            > >
            > > >
            > > > > When the NVA make their first move in '74 Nixon send sthe 52's back
            >for
            > > >a
            > > > > week. The 75 offensive never happens. The 74 Congressional
            >elections
            > > >give
            > > > > the GOP the Senate and a working majority in the House with a
            >Dixiecrat
            > > > > Speaker and a split of committee chairs. The war winds down through
            >the
            > > > > 80's to a de facto partition of RVN, Cambodia and Laos. Fewer
            >battles
            > > >every
            > > > > year but no formal peace (Korea as example).
            > > >
            > > >Very likely.
            > > > >
            > > > > NASA keeps going to the moon. We now have moonbases, L bases, space
            > > > > stations and a full SPS (funding provided as a consequence of the
            >great
            > > >70's
            > > > > oil crisis). Two years ago we began to mine the first captured near
            > > >earth
            > > > > asteroid.
            > > > >
            > > >Do you think the American People are up for the cost of doing this?
            > >
            > > The American people didn't dump the space program. The povertycrat wing
            >of
            > > the Democratic House and Senate membership did.
            >
            >What would we gain by running th e space program as you wish?

            1. Votes in the South and west Coast - as the war winds down you need space
            contracts to replace aero contracts to keep Marietta Georgia and Long Beach
            CA and
            Seattle Washington as safe GOP vote zones
            2. TV spectaculars - first space station, first moon base - the vision thing
            to contra the endless Demo whining about the poor and how evil the US is
            3. SPS as the energy crisis hits
            Scott

            > >
            > >
            > > >
            > > > > We also embargoed eastern hemisphere oil after the first crisis.
            >We're
            > > >back
            > > > > at a protected US oil industry as in Ike's days with licensed
            >exports
            > > >from
            > > > > Canada, Mexico, Venezuela, Columbia, Ecudor and Angola( the
            >hemispheric
            > > > > exception - see below).
            > > >
            > > >What does this do to fuel prices and the economy at large?
            > >
            > > Fuel prices are higher than in OTL but as we are buying from folks who
            >spend
            > > the dollars here the net economic effect is to marginally slow down
            > > suburbanization, exurbanization and the growth of the Sun Belt at the
            > > expense of the Lakes States.
            >
            >OK..
            >
            >tr
            >
            > >
            > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > The great Red offensive in Portuguese Africa is rolled back in
            >Angola
            > > >with S
            > > > > Af and CIA help. Holden Roberto holds the capital and North.
            >Savimbi
            > > >holds
            > > > > the rest of the country. He knocks out Roberto and takes the rest
            >in
            > > >round
            > > > > 2 in the early 80's.
            > > >
            > > >Implications for Africa/ rest of 3d world's relationship to USA?
            > >
            > > More antiUS rhetoric in 3rd world and Europe. A US dominated block in
            >the
            > > West African bulge and across central Africa.
            > > Scott
            > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > Scott
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > >From: Thomas P Roche <troche@...>
            > > > > >Reply-To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            > > > > >To: alternate-history@egroups.com
            > > > > >Subject: [alternate-history] No cover up
            > > > > >Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 21:47:21 -0400 (EDT)
            > > > > >
            > > > > >Nixon finds out about Watergate and CREEP illegality, July 1972,
            >and
            > > >hangs
            > > > > >all the dirty laundry out to dry. What happens?
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            >________________________________________________________________________
            > > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
            >http://www.hotmail.com
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            >------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > > > > Failed tests, classes skipped, forgotten locker combinations.
            > > > > Remember the good 'ol days
            > > > > http://click.egroups.com/1/4053/2/_/537028/_/959486329/
            > > > >
            >------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > > ________________________________________________________________________
            > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > > Visit Expedia.com for a chance to win airfare to Vegas for you and
            > > 20 friends, $15,000 and a suite at Bellagio for New Year's. Or get a
            > > shot at 2 roundtrip tickets anywhere in the U.S. given away daily.
            > > http://click.egroups.com/1/5291/2/_/537028/_/960604332/
            > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >

            ________________________________________________________________________
            Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.