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More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

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  • Isha Khan
    ... From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@yahoo.com Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line To:
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 31, 2008
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      --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@...> wrote:
      From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@...

      Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

      Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

      My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
      poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
      it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
      fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
      by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
      to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

      I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
      more better off than the Indians.

      Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
      India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
      government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
      work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
      population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
      Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
      An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
      following manner:

      No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
      Rs./month
      1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
      2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
      3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
      16,000
      4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
      5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
      based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
      and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
      6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
      poverty line, for underdeveloped
      countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
      month Rs. 1,410
      7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
      about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
      person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
      1,250
      8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
      for
      explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
      per person, approx. Rs. 300
      Other related & relevant data In millions, people
      9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
      million (30 Cr.)
      10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
      Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
      Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
      11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
      Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
      12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
      About 320 million (32 Cr.)
      13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
      About
      300 million (30 Cr.)
      14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
      the
      aspirations of the people of India
      About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
      15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
      million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
      16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
      700 million (70 Cr.)

      1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
      under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
      or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
      Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
      As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
      Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
      per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
      As per GOI, this amount will buy food
      equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
      death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
      country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
      actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
      On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
      Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
      alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
      the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
      clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
      pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
      JUDGE!
      The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
      city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
      Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
      capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
      If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
      every village, it would improve, education, health,
      family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
      migration from vllages to cities.

      *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
      housing + perks + retirement benefits.

      **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
      million = 1,00,00,000.

      To verify you can look at this link:

      http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

      M .Javed Iqbal


    • Saj
      Dear Isha Khan. Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I
      Message 2 of 8 , Sep 1, 2008
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        Dear Isha Khan.
         
        Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
         
        Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
         
        His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
         
        I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
         
        If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
         
        Thanks.
         
        Saj
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Isha Khan
        Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
        Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



        --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
        From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

        Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

        Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

        My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
        poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
        it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
        fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
        by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
        to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

        I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
        more better off than the Indians.

        Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
        India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
        government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
        work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
        population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
        Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
        An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
        following manner:

        No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
        Rs./month
        1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
        2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
        3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
        16,000
        4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
        5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
        based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
        and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
        6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
        poverty line, for underdeveloped
        countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
        month Rs. 1,410
        7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
        about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
        person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
        1,250
        8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
        for
        explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
        per person, approx. Rs. 300
        Other related & relevant data In millions, people
        9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
        million (30 Cr.)
        10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
        Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
        Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
        11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
        Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
        12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
        About 320 million (32 Cr.)
        13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
        About
        300 million (30 Cr.)
        14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
        the
        aspirations of the people of India
        About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
        15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
        million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
        16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
        700 million (70 Cr.)

        1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
        under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
        or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
        Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
        As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
        Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
        per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
        As per GOI, this amount will buy food
        equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
        death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
        country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
        actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
        On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
        Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
        alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
        the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
        clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
        pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
        JUDGE!
        The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
        city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
        Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
        capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
        If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
        every village, it would improve, education, health,
        family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
        migration from vllages to cities.

        *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
        housing + perks + retirement benefits.

        **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
        million = 1,00,00,000.

        To verify you can look at this link:

        http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

        M .Javed Iqbal


      • Cyrus
        Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But
        Message 3 of 8 , Sep 3, 2008
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          Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But India is also the largest democracy, with a GDP of almost $3 Trillion, a growing middle-class, world-class education system, world-class technology sector, better infrastructure than most South Asian countries, more literacy rate relative to its massive population, and oh did I mention that it can obliterate Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal? Let's face it. Geographically, we cannot ever shake-off the influence of India. Might as well deal with the situation and advance our own country.

           

          On a separate note, stop the pro-Pakistani propaganda. Bangladesh needs to make its own mark. Why are we even talking about India or Pakistan in this forum? Got nothing productive to talk about Bangladesh? I am just tired of people's pro-Islamic bent 24/7. If you need spiritual redemption that much, go hide from the civilization. If your faith is really that flimsy that your neighbor could "force" you to convert, then you should worry about your own sanity. This is not a India-bashing forum. You would be welcomed in any other place, I am sure.

           

          By the way, the economic data that you present have little or no validation when it comes to evaluating the overall socio-economic indicators of India. I suggest, for once, you pick up the "Post American World" by Fareed Zakaria and read the sections about India instead of reading baseless theories by pseudo intellectuals. Judge for yourself!


          Cyrus Zulkarnaian Kazi



          ----- Original Message ----
          From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@...>
          To: alochona@yahoogroups.com
          Cc: Pakistan Front <pakistanFront@yahoogroups.com>; bd_mailer@...; zoglul@...; rehman.mohammad@...; premlaliguras@...; Bangladesh Researchers <bdresearchers@yahoogroups.com>; mahmudurart@...; rivercrossinternational@...; Bangla Vision <bangla-vision@yahoogroups.com>; rezwansiddique@...; farhadmazhar@...; shahin72@...
          Sent: Monday, September 1, 2008 10:40:10 AM
          Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

          Dear Isha Khan.
           
          Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
           
          Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
           
          His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
           
          I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
           
          If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
           
          Thanks.
           
          Saj
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Isha Khan
          Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
          Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



          --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
          From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

          Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

          Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

          My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
          poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
          it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
          fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
          by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
          to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

          I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
          more better off than the Indians.

          Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
          India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
          government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
          work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
          population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
          Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
          An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
          following manner:

          No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
          Rs./month
          1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
          2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
          3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
          16,000
          4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
          5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
          based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
          and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
          6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
          poverty line, for underdeveloped
          countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
          month Rs. 1,410
          7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
          about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
          person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
          1,250
          8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
          for
          explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
          per person, approx. Rs. 300
          Other related & relevant data In millions, people
          9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
          million (30 Cr.)
          10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
          Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
          Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
          11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
          Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
          12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
          About 320 million (32 Cr.)
          13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
          About
          300 million (30 Cr.)
          14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
          the
          aspirations of the people of India
          About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
          15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
          million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
          16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
          700 million (70 Cr.)

          1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
          under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
          or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
          Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
          As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
          Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
          per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
          As per GOI, this amount will buy food
          equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
          death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
          country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
          actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
          On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
          Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
          alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
          the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
          clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
          pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
          JUDGE!
          The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
          city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
          Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
          capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
          If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
          every village, it would improve, education, health,
          family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
          migration from vllages to cities.

          *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
          housing + perks + retirement benefits.

          **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
          million = 1,00,00,000.

          To verify you can look at this link:

          http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

          M .Javed Iqbal



        • Saj
          Very funny..... To whom you are responding? Where did you read statistics in my post, which you responding. Those who read your post, would be laughing on you.
          Message 4 of 8 , Sep 4, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            Very funny.....
             
            To whom you are responding? Where did you read statistics in my post, which you responding. Those who read your post, would be laughing on you. See who is saying what and then speak.
             
            Anyway, if India and Pakistan thread is not appropriate than why did YOU argued? Well, let's have a little analysis of your insertions.
             
            Yes, India has greatest democracy and now a days, Christians are enjoying this greatest democracy. Before them Muslims were tasting this democracy in Gujrat and elsewhere in India. By the way, Muslims are enjoying this democracy from the very first day. Did you notice the wonderful and beautiful treatment of Sikhs by this democratic country? I am sure you still remember that.
             
            Yes, India's GDP is 3 trillion dollar. In the meanwhile, do you know, 1.5 trillion dollars of looted money is also present in Swiss banks. This is the money which had been looted by Indian politicians, military servants, civil servants etc etc. Please also note that his looted money is almost 50% of India's total GDP. Indians would feel proud of it. Isn't it?
             
            Growing middle class.... yes growing middle class. Where India's population is increasing by millions every year, few of the poors of India manage to upgrade their social status and thus become a honorary member of so called middle class. Now, no doubt that the numbers of poors are increasing more than the number of middle class. But the reality is that middle class is increasing. Yes, yes and yes. It is increasing. With hundreds of billions dollars in foreign reserves, with hundreds of billion dollars in export, with thousands of billion dollars in Swiss banks and with 3 trillion billion dollars GDP, India is narrowly ahead of Pakistan in Per capita national income, government offers packages and incentives to the public to use government toilets just because they need to collect the samples or something else. I am sure that these payments of few rupees in a year will help to further increase the middle class.
             
            World class education system and high literacy rates. Yes, this is also true. Those who do not have proper toilet facilities in their homes are well educated. Thanks to the Indian education system. Those, who sleep under open air and with dinner also very educated and do not sleep in the middle of the roads to show their civilised behaviours, those hundreds of millions of Indians are also well educated who are living below poverty line, those who killed just because they were Christians or Muslims or Sikhs but not Hindus, were also well educated etc etc.
             
            And oh, I forgot to mention that India cannot obliterate Pakistan with its so called nuclear arsenal. As India will also have to face the same fate. Do you know the difference between the population of India and Pakistan? If one Pakistan will die in nuclear attack than 10 Indians will die in nuclear attack. India can target the whole Pakistan, infect only 160 people with its nuclear arsenal. But on the other hand, more than half of the Indian population is well in the range of Pakistan. What does it mean? Will you please dare to tell us? A hell not. Additionally, Pakistan's nuclear program is more sophisticated and advance than the Indian. India needs to wait for for good 10 years to overtake Pakistan. But until then..... hehehe
             
            It is difficult to determine the actual size and composition of India's and Pakistan's nuclear arsenals, but NRDC estimates that both countries have a total of 50 to 75 weapons. Contrary to the conventional wisdom, we believe India has about 30 to 35 nuclear warheads, slightly fewer than Pakistan, which may have as many as 48.
             
            .....
             

            Estimated nuclear casualties for attacks on 10 large Indian and Pakistani cities
            City NameTotal Population Within 5 Kilometres of Ground ZeroNumber of Persons KilledNumber of Persons Severely InjuredNumber of Persons Slightly Injured
            India
            Ban3,077,937314,978175,136411,336
            Bombay3,143,284477,713228,648476,633
            Calcutta3,520,344357,202198,218466,336
            Madras3,252,628364,291196,226448,948
            New Delhi1,638,744176,51894,231217,853
            Total India14,632,9371,690,702892,4592,021,106
            Pakistan
            Faisalabad2,376,478336,239174,351373,967
            Islamabad798,583154,06766,744129,935
            Karachi1,962,458239,643126,810283,290
            Lahore2,682,092258,139149,649354,095
            Rawalpindi1,589,828183,79196,846220,585
            Total Pakistan9,409,4391,171,879614,4001,361,872
            India and Pakistan
            Total24,042,3762,862,5811,506,8593,382,978
             
             
            So, Mr, Cyrus, who will obliterate who? There are hundreds of such research reports and articles are available over the internet. Increase your knowledge first and then speak. Additionally, geographical location of Pakistan also give certain advantage to us. If India every used Nuclear weapons against Pakistan and even if Pakistan do not respond, even then, India will have to face circumstances in the future and these suffering will start within few months. While most of the Indian targets are far away from Pakistani territories. So little need to worry about it. So, what I said, learn then speak. And Let's face it.
             
            India's influence is already in danger. Did you read the news that Pakistan already supporting Srilanka in their efforts to take down separatists, prepared and planted by Indian Intelligence agencies. Do you know that Pakistan send almost three shiploads every month to them? India's presence in Afghanistan is only because of the Americans. how long they gonna stay there and how long India will be present in Afghanistan. Then Let's talk about Bangladesh. Bangladesh is not ready to accept the supremacy of India. And making its own independent foreign policy. India's wish to become a regional power is just a dream of the fool. That country could never become a regional power, who invest more than half of its military in such a tiny area like the valley of Kashmir. More than 7,00,000 Indian army men are their and this is not it. They conduct fake battles with bogus insurgents and obtains medals and promotions. And also kill each other and their seniors too. This can't be the characteristic of the regional power. Isn't it? Forget about the China, which is building its naval presence in the region. India simply cannot compete them. What you say?
             
            I do not have to do pro-Pakistan propaganda. The fact is that the world have more information available than me. Whatever, you will write here will crosschecked over internet and People will automatically come to know that who id propagandists and who is not.
             
            Our neighbour can not simply do it. Instead the intellectuals of our neighbours are telling us something very interesting. Did you read something about what they saying? Read the following
             
            Kalki Autar Aur Mohammad
             
            Ready and enjoy.
             
            Asalam Alaikum to all Hindus and have a nice time.
             
            Your Muslim Brother
             
            Saj
             
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Cyrus
            Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 2:23 AM
            Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

            Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But India is also the largest democracy, with a GDP of almost $3 Trillion, a growing middle-class, world-class education system, world-class technology sector, better infrastructure than most South Asian countries, more literacy rate relative to its massive population, and oh did I mention that it can obliterate Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal? Let's face it. Geographically, we cannot ever shake-off the influence of India. Might as well deal with the situation and advance our own country.

             

            On a separate note, stop the pro-Pakistani propaganda. Bangladesh needs to make its own mark. Why are we even talking about India or Pakistan in this forum? Got nothing productive to talk about Bangladesh? I am just tired of people's pro-Islamic bent 24/7. If you need spiritual redemption that much, go hide from the civilization. If your faith is really that flimsy that your neighbor could "force" you to convert, then you should worry about your own sanity. This is not a India-bashing forum. You would be welcomed in any other place, I am sure.

             

            By the way, the economic data that you present have little or no validation when it comes to evaluating the overall socio-economic indicators of India. I suggest, for once, you pick up the "Post American World" by Fareed Zakaria and read the sections about India instead of reading baseless theories by pseudo intellectuals. Judge for yourself!


            Cyrus Zulkarnaian Kazi



            ----- Original Message ----
            From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
            To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
            Cc: Pakistan Front <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>; bd_mailer@yahoo. com; zoglul@hotmail. co.uk; rehman.mohammad@ gmail.com; premlaliguras@ hotmail.com; Bangladesh Researchers <bdresearchers@ yahoogroups. com>; mahmudurart@ yahoo.com; rivercrossinternati onal@yahoo. com; Bangla Vision <bangla-vision@ yahoogroups. com>; rezwansiddique@ yahoo.com; farhadmazhar@ hotmail.com; shahin72@gmail. com
            Sent: Monday, September 1, 2008 10:40:10 AM
            Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

            Dear Isha Khan.
             
            Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
             
            Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
             
            His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
             
            I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
             
            If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
             
            Thanks.
             
            Saj
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Isha Khan
            Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
            Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



            --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
            From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

            Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

            Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

            My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
            poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
            it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
            fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
            by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
            to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

            I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
            more better off than the Indians.

            Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
            India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
            government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
            work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
            population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
            Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
            An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
            following manner:

            No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
            Rs./month
            1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
            2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
            3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
            16,000
            4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
            5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
            based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
            and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
            6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
            poverty line, for underdeveloped
            countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
            month Rs. 1,410
            7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
            about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
            person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
            1,250
            8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
            for
            explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
            per person, approx. Rs. 300
            Other related & relevant data In millions, people
            9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
            million (30 Cr.)
            10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
            Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
            Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
            11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
            Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
            12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
            About 320 million (32 Cr.)
            13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
            About
            300 million (30 Cr.)
            14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
            the
            aspirations of the people of India
            About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
            15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
            million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
            16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
            700 million (70 Cr.)

            1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
            under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
            or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
            Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
            As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
            Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
            per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
            As per GOI, this amount will buy food
            equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
            death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
            country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
            actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
            On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
            Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
            alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
            the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
            clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
            pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
            JUDGE!
            The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
            city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
            Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
            capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
            If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
            every village, it would improve, education, health,
            family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
            migration from vllages to cities.

            *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
            housing + perks + retirement benefits.

            **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
            million = 1,00,00,000.

            To verify you can look at this link:

            http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

            M .Javed Iqbal



          • arjob_10
            What a funny stuff... Almost 90% Indians live below poverty line ...??? CLEAR UP DATA MAN!!! % OF PEOPLE LIVING POVERTY LINE IN INDIA IS 23.6% IN URBAN AND
            Message 5 of 8 , Sep 7, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              What a funny stuff...'Almost 90% Indians live below
              poverty line'...???
              CLEAR UP DATA MAN!!!
              % OF PEOPLE LIVING POVERTY LINE IN INDIA IS 23.6% IN URBAN AND 26.1
              IN RURAL AREAS.


              --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, Isha Khan <bd_mailer@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@...>
              wrote:
              >
              >
              > From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@...
              >
              > Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below
              poverty line
              >
              > To: notun_bangladesh@yahoogroups.com
              >
              > Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
              > poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
              > it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
              > fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
              > by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been
              increased
              > to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.
              >
              > I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
              > more better off than the Indians.
              >
              > Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
              > India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
              > government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
              > work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
              > population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
              > Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
              > An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
              > following manner:
              >
              > No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
              > Rs./month
              > 1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
              > 2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
              > 3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
              > 16,000
              > 4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
              > 5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This
              is
              > based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
              > and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
              > 6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
              > poverty line, for underdeveloped
              > countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30
              per
              > month Rs. 1,410
              > 7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
              > about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
              > person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
              > 1,250
              > 8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
              > for
              > explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
              > per person, approx. Rs. 300
              > Other related & relevant data In millions, people
              > 9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
              > million (30 Cr.)
              > 10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
              > Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
              > Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
              > 11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
              > Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
              > 12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
              > About 320 million (32 Cr.)
              > 13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
              > About
              > 300 million (30 Cr.)
              > 14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
              > the
              > aspirations of the people of India
              > About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
              > 15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
              > million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
              > 16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
              > 700 million (70 Cr.)
              >
              > 1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
              > under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
              > or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
              > Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
              > As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
              > Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
              > per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
              > As per GOI, this amount will buy food
              > equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
              > death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
              > country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
              > actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
              > On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
              > Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
              > alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
              > the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
              > clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
              > pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
              > JUDGE!
              > The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
              > city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
              > Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
              > capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
              > If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
              > every village, it would improve, education, health,
              > family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
              > migration from vllages to cities.
              >
              > *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
              > housing + perks + retirement benefits.
              >
              > **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
              > million = 1,00,00,000.
              >
              > To verify you can look at this link:
              >
              > http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_
              line.php
              >
              > M .Javed Iqbal
              >
            • Nasir Ali
              Hi all,   I just got curious. Where did you get this figure that India s GDP is 3 trillion dollars. Please give me reference.   Thanks   Ali ... From: Saj
              Message 6 of 8 , Sep 9, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi all,
                 
                I just got curious. Where did you get this figure that India's GDP is 3 trillion dollars. Please give me reference.
                 
                Thanks
                 
                Ali

                --- On Thu, 9/4/08, Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@...> wrote:
                From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@...>
                Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line
                To: alochona@yahoogroups.com
                Cc: "Pakistan Zindabad" <pakistan-zindabad@yahoogroups.com>, "Pakistan Post" <pakistanpost@yahoogroups.com>, "Pakistan Front" <pakistanFront@yahoogroups.com>, "Pak India Panel" <pakindiapenpals@yahoogroups.com>, "Pak Hope" <pakhope@yahoogroups.com>
                Date: Thursday, September 4, 2008, 10:33 AM

                Very funny.....
                 
                To whom you are responding? Where did you read statistics in my post, which you responding. Those who read your post, would be laughing on you. See who is saying what and then speak.
                 
                Anyway, if India and Pakistan thread is not appropriate than why did YOU argued? Well, let's have a little analysis of your insertions.
                 
                Yes, India has greatest democracy and now a days, Christians are enjoying this greatest democracy. Before them Muslims were tasting this democracy in Gujrat and elsewhere in India. By the way, Muslims are enjoying this democracy from the very first day. Did you notice the wonderful and beautiful treatment of Sikhs by this democratic country? I am sure you still remember that.
                 
                Yes, India's GDP is 3 trillion dollar. In the meanwhile, do you know, 1.5 trillion dollars of looted money is also present in Swiss banks. This is the money which had been looted by Indian politicians, military servants, civil servants etc etc. Please also note that his looted money is almost 50% of India's total GDP. Indians would feel proud of it. Isn't it?
                 
                Growing middle class.... yes growing middle class. Where India's population is increasing by millions every year, few of the poors of India manage to upgrade their social status and thus become a honorary member of so called middle class. Now, no doubt that the numbers of poors are increasing more than the number of middle class. But the reality is that middle class is increasing. Yes, yes and yes. It is increasing. With hundreds of billions dollars in foreign reserves, with hundreds of billion dollars in export, with thousands of billion dollars in Swiss banks and with 3 trillion billion dollars GDP, India is narrowly ahead of Pakistan in Per capita national income, government offers packages and incentives to the public to use government toilets just because they need to collect the samples or something else. I am sure that these payments of few rupees in a year will help to further increase the middle class.
                 
                World class education system and high literacy rates. Yes, this is also true. Those who do not have proper toilet facilities in their homes are well educated. Thanks to the Indian education system. Those, who sleep under open air and with dinner also very educated and do not sleep in the middle of the roads to show their civilised behaviours, those hundreds of millions of Indians are also well educated who are living below poverty line, those who killed just because they were Christians or Muslims or Sikhs but not Hindus, were also well educated etc etc.
                 
                And oh, I forgot to mention that India cannot obliterate Pakistan with its so called nuclear arsenal. As India will also have to face the same fate. Do you know the difference between the population of India and Pakistan? If one Pakistan will die in nuclear attack than 10 Indians will die in nuclear attack. India can target the whole Pakistan, infect only 160 people with its nuclear arsenal. But on the other hand, more than half of the Indian population is well in the range of Pakistan. What does it mean? Will you please dare to tell us? A hell not. Additionally, Pakistan's nuclear program is more sophisticated and advance than the Indian. India needs to wait for for good 10 years to overtake Pakistan. But until then..... hehehe
                 
                It is difficult to determine the actual size and composition of India's and Pakistan's nuclear arsenals, but NRDC estimates that both countries have a total of 50 to 75 weapons. Contrary to the conventional wisdom, we believe India has about 30 to 35 nuclear warheads, slightly fewer than Pakistan, which may have as many as 48.
                 
                .....
                 

                Estimated nuclear casualties for attacks on 10 large Indian and Pakistani cities
                City NameTotal Population Within 5 Kilometres of Ground ZeroNumber of Persons KilledNumber of Persons Severely InjuredNumber of Persons Slightly Injured
                India
                Ban3,077,937314,978175,136411,336
                Bombay3,143,284477,713228,648476,633
                Calcutta3,520,344357,202198,218466,336
                Madras3,252,628364,291196,226448,948
                New Delhi1,638,744176,51894,231217,853
                Total India14,632,9371,690,702892,4592,021,106
                Pakistan
                Faisalabad2,376,478336,239174,351373,967
                Islamabad798,583154,06766,744129,935
                Karachi1,962,458239,643126,810283,290
                Lahore2,682,092258,139149,649354,095
                Rawalpindi1,589,828183,79196,846220,585
                Total Pakistan9,409,4391,171,879614,4001,361,872
                India and Pakistan
                Total24,042,3762,862,5811,506,8593,382,978
                 
                 
                So, Mr, Cyrus, who will obliterate who? There are hundreds of such research reports and articles are available over the internet. Increase your knowledge first and then speak. Additionally, geographical location of Pakistan also give certain advantage to us. If India every used Nuclear weapons against Pakistan and even if Pakistan do not respond, even then, India will have to face circumstances in the future and these suffering will start within few months. While most of the Indian targets are far away from Pakistani territories. So little need to worry about it. So, what I said, learn then speak. And Let's face it.
                 
                India's influence is already in danger. Did you read the news that Pakistan already supporting Srilanka in their efforts to take down separatists, prepared and planted by Indian Intelligence agencies. Do you know that Pakistan send almost three shiploads every month to them? India's presence in Afghanistan is only because of the Americans. how long they gonna stay there and how long India will be present in Afghanistan. Then Let's talk about Bangladesh. Bangladesh is not ready to accept the supremacy of India. And making its own independent foreign policy. India's wish to become a regional power is just a dream of the fool. That country could never become a regional power, who invest more than half of its military in such a tiny area like the valley of Kashmir. More than 7,00,000 Indian army men are their and this is not it. They conduct fake battles with bogus insurgents and obtains medals and promotions. And also kill each other and their seniors too. This can't be the characteristic of the regional power. Isn't it? Forget about the China, which is building its naval presence in the region. India simply cannot compete them. What you say?
                 
                I do not have to do pro-Pakistan propaganda. The fact is that the world have more information available than me. Whatever, you will write here will crosschecked over internet and People will automatically come to know that who id propagandists and who is not.
                 
                Our neighbour can not simply do it. Instead the intellectuals of our neighbours are telling us something very interesting. Did you read something about what they saying? Read the following
                 
                Kalki Autar Aur Mohammad
                 
                Ready and enjoy.
                 
                Asalam Alaikum to all Hindus and have a nice time.
                 
                Your Muslim Brother
                 
                Saj
                 
                 
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Cyrus
                Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 2:23 AM
                Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But India is also the largest democracy, with a GDP of almost $3 Trillion, a growing middle-class, world-class education system, world-class technology sector, better infrastructure than most South Asian countries, more literacy rate relative to its massive population, and oh did I mention that it can obliterate Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal? Let's face it. Geographically, we cannot ever shake-off the influence of India. Might as well deal with the situation and advance our own country.
                 
                On a separate note, stop the pro-Pakistani propaganda. Bangladesh needs to make its own mark. Why are we even talking about India or Pakistan in this forum? Got nothing productive to talk about Bangladesh? I am just tired of people's pro-Islamic bent 24/7. If you need spiritual redemption that much, go hide from the civilization. If your faith is really that flimsy that your neighbor could "force" you to convert, then you should worry about your own sanity. This is not a India-bashing forum. You would be welcomed in any other place, I am sure.
                 
                By the way, the economic data that you present have little or no validation when it comes to evaluating the overall socio-economic indicators of India. I suggest, for once, you pick up the "Post American World" by Fareed Zakaria and read the sections about India instead of reading baseless theories by pseudo intellectuals. Judge for yourself!

                Cyrus Zulkarnaian Kazi


                ----- Original Message ----
                From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
                To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                Cc: Pakistan Front <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>; bd_mailer@yahoo. com; zoglul@hotmail. co.uk; rehman.mohammad@ gmail.com; premlaliguras@ hotmail.com; Bangladesh Researchers <bdresearchers@ yahoogroups. com>; mahmudurart@ yahoo.com; rivercrossinternati onal@yahoo. com; Bangla Vision <bangla-vision@ yahoogroups. com>; rezwansiddique@ yahoo.com; farhadmazhar@ hotmail.com; shahin72@gmail. com
                Sent: Monday, September 1, 2008 10:40:10 AM
                Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                Dear Isha Khan.
                 
                Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
                 
                Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
                 
                His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
                 
                I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
                 
                If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
                 
                Thanks.
                 
                Saj
                 
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Isha Khan
                Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
                Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



                --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
                From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

                Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

                My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
                poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
                it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
                fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
                by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
                to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

                I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
                more better off than the Indians.

                Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
                India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
                government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
                work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
                population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
                Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
                An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
                following manner:

                No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
                Rs./month
                1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
                2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
                3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
                16,000
                4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
                5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
                based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
                and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
                6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
                poverty line, for underdeveloped
                countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
                month Rs. 1,410
                7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
                about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
                person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
                1,250
                8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
                for
                explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
                per person, approx. Rs. 300
                Other related & relevant data In millions, people
                9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
                million (30 Cr.)
                10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
                Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
                Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
                11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
                Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
                12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
                About 320 million (32 Cr.)
                13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
                About
                300 million (30 Cr.)
                14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
                the
                aspirations of the people of India
                About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
                15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
                million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
                16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
                700 million (70 Cr.)

                1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
                under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
                or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
                Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
                As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
                Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
                per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
                As per GOI, this amount will buy food
                equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
                death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
                country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
                actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
                On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
                Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
                alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
                the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
                clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
                pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
                JUDGE!
                The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
                city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
                Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
                capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
                If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
                every village, it would improve, education, health,
                family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
                migration from vllages to cities.

                *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
                housing + perks + retirement benefits.

                **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
                million = 1,00,00,000.

                To verify you can look at this link:

                http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

                M .Javed Iqbal




              • Cyrus
                Mr. Ali:   Several sources, actually. The Purchasing Power Parity (2006 estimated) of India is $4.156 trillion (CIA Factbook). By July 2007, India s stock
                Message 7 of 8 , Sep 10, 2008
                • 0 Attachment

                  Mr. Ali:

                   

                  Several sources, actually. The Purchasing Power Parity (2006 estimated) of India is $4.156 trillion (CIA Factbook). By July 2007, India's stock market capitalization rose to over $944 billion and was expected to cross $1.1 Trillion by the end of the year (Morgan Stanley). IMF reported in 2007 that India's GDP (PPP) is $2.818 Trillion, while World Bank reported that India's GDP (PPP) for the same year is $3.092 Trillion.

                   

                  Please note that while the fundamentals of GDP (PPP) calculations are the same, from macroecnomic point of view, each of these sources (i.e. World Bank, IMF, et. al.) consider different independent variables that contribute to the GDP.

                   

                  Cyrus



                  ----- Original Message ----
                  From: Nasir Ali <nawshad1@...>
                  To: alochona@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 12:44:31 AM
                  Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                  Hi all,
                   
                  I just got curious. Where did you get this figure that India's GDP is 3 trillion dollars. Please give me reference.
                   
                  Thanks
                   
                  Ali

                  --- On Thu, 9/4/08, Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM> wrote:
                  From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
                  Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line
                  To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                  Cc: "Pakistan Zindabad" <pakistan-zindabad@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pakistan Post" <pakistanpost@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pakistan Front" <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pak India Panel" <pakindiapenpals@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pak Hope" <pakhope@yahoogroups .com>
                  Date: Thursday, September 4, 2008, 10:33 AM

                  Very funny.....
                   
                  To whom you are responding? Where did you read statistics in my post, which you responding. Those who read your post, would be laughing on you. See who is saying what and then speak.
                   
                  Anyway, if India and Pakistan thread is not appropriate than why did YOU argued? Well, let's have a little analysis of your insertions.
                   
                  Yes, India has greatest democracy and now a days, Christians are enjoying this greatest democracy. Before them Muslims were tasting this democracy in Gujrat and elsewhere in India. By the way, Muslims are enjoying this democracy from the very first day. Did you notice the wonderful and beautiful treatment of Sikhs by this democratic country? I am sure you still remember that.
                   
                  Yes, India's GDP is 3 trillion dollar. In the meanwhile, do you know, 1.5 trillion dollars of looted money is also present in Swiss banks. This is the money which had been looted by Indian politicians, military servants, civil servants etc etc. Please also note that his looted money is almost 50% of India's total GDP. Indians would feel proud of it. Isn't it?
                   
                  Growing middle class.... yes growing middle class. Where India's population is increasing by millions every year, few of the poors of India manage to upgrade their social status and thus become a honorary member of so called middle class. Now, no doubt that the numbers of poors are increasing more than the number of middle class. But the reality is that middle class is increasing. Yes, yes and yes. It is increasing. With hundreds of billions dollars in foreign reserves, with hundreds of billion dollars in export, with thousands of billion dollars in Swiss banks and with 3 trillion billion dollars GDP, India is narrowly ahead of Pakistan in Per capita national income, government offers packages and incentives to the public to use government toilets just because they need to collect the samples or something else. I am sure that these payments of few rupees in a year will help to further increase the middle class.
                   
                  World class education system and high literacy rates. Yes, this is also true. Those who do not have proper toilet facilities in their homes are well educated. Thanks to the Indian education system. Those, who sleep under open air and with dinner also very educated and do not sleep in the middle of the roads to show their civilised behaviours, those hundreds of millions of Indians are also well educated who are living below poverty line, those who killed just because they were Christians or Muslims or Sikhs but not Hindus, were also well educated etc etc.
                   
                  And oh, I forgot to mention that India cannot obliterate Pakistan with its so called nuclear arsenal. As India will also have to face the same fate. Do you know the difference between the population of India and Pakistan? If one Pakistan will die in nuclear attack than 10 Indians will die in nuclear attack. India can target the whole Pakistan, infect only 160 people with its nuclear arsenal. But on the other hand, more than half of the Indian population is well in the range of Pakistan. What does it mean? Will you please dare to tell us? A hell not. Additionally, Pakistan's nuclear program is more sophisticated and advance than the Indian. India needs to wait for for good 10 years to overtake Pakistan. But until then..... hehehe
                   
                  It is difficult to determine the actual size and composition of India's and Pakistan's nuclear arsenals, but NRDC estimates that both countries have a total of 50 to 75 weapons. Contrary to the conventional wisdom, we believe India has about 30 to 35 nuclear warheads, slightly fewer than Pakistan, which may have as many as 48.
                   
                  .....
                   

                  Estimated nuclear casualties for attacks on 10 large Indian and Pakistani cities
                  City NameTotal Population Within 5 Kilometres of Ground ZeroNumber of Persons KilledNumber of Persons Severely InjuredNumber of Persons Slightly Injured
                  India
                  Ban3,077,937314,978175,136411,336
                  Bombay3,143,284477,713228,648476,633
                  Calcutta3,520,344357,202198,218466,336
                  Madras3,252,628364,291196,226448,948
                  New Delhi1,638,744176,51894,231217,853
                  Total India14,632,9371,690,702892,4592,021,106
                  Pakistan
                  Faisalabad2,376,478336,239174,351373,967
                  Islamabad798,583154,06766,744129,935
                  Karachi1,962,458239,643126,810283,290
                  Lahore2,682,092258,139149,649354,095
                  Rawalpindi1,589,828183,79196,846220,585
                  Total Pakistan9,409,4391,171,879614,4001,361,872
                  India and Pakistan
                  Total24,042,3762,862,5811,506,8593,382,978
                   
                   
                  So, Mr, Cyrus, who will obliterate who? There are hundreds of such research reports and articles are available over the internet. Increase your knowledge first and then speak. Additionally, geographical location of Pakistan also give certain advantage to us. If India every used Nuclear weapons against Pakistan and even if Pakistan do not respond, even then, India will have to face circumstances in the future and these suffering will start within few months. While most of the Indian targets are far away from Pakistani territories. So little need to worry about it. So, what I said, learn then speak. And Let's face it.
                   
                  India's influence is already in danger. Did you read the news that Pakistan already supporting Srilanka in their efforts to take down separatists, prepared and planted by Indian Intelligence agencies. Do you know that Pakistan send almost three shiploads every month to them? India's presence in Afghanistan is only because of the Americans. how long they gonna stay there and how long India will be present in Afghanistan. Then Let's talk about Bangladesh. Bangladesh is not ready to accept the supremacy of India. And making its own independent foreign policy. India's wish to become a regional power is just a dream of the fool. That country could never become a regional power, who invest more than half of its military in such a tiny area like the valley of Kashmir. More than 7,00,000 Indian army men are their and this is not it. They conduct fake battles with bogus insurgents and obtains medals and promotions. And also kill each other and their seniors too. This can't be the characteristic of the regional power. Isn't it? Forget about the China, which is building its naval presence in the region. India simply cannot compete them. What you say?
                   
                  I do not have to do pro-Pakistan propaganda. The fact is that the world have more information available than me. Whatever, you will write here will crosschecked over internet and People will automatically come to know that who id propagandists and who is not.
                   
                  Our neighbour can not simply do it. Instead the intellectuals of our neighbours are telling us something very interesting. Did you read something about what they saying? Read the following
                   
                  Kalki Autar Aur Mohammad
                   
                  Ready and enjoy.
                   
                  Asalam Alaikum to all Hindus and have a nice time.
                   
                  Your Muslim Brother
                   
                  Saj
                   
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Cyrus
                  Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 2:23 AM
                  Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                  Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But India is also the largest democracy, with a GDP of almost $3 Trillion, a growing middle-class, world-class education system, world-class technology sector, better infrastructure than most South Asian countries, more literacy rate relative to its massive population, and oh did I mention that it can obliterate Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal? Let's face it. Geographically, we cannot ever shake-off the influence of India. Might as well deal with the situation and advance our own country.
                   
                  On a separate note, stop the pro-Pakistani propaganda. Bangladesh needs to make its own mark. Why are we even talking about India or Pakistan in this forum? Got nothing productive to talk about Bangladesh? I am just tired of people's pro-Islamic bent 24/7. If you need spiritual redemption that much, go hide from the civilization. If your faith is really that flimsy that your neighbor could "force" you to convert, then you should worry about your own sanity. This is not a India-bashing forum. You would be welcomed in any other place, I am sure.
                   
                  By the way, the economic data that you present have little or no validation when it comes to evaluating the overall socio-economic indicators of India. I suggest, for once, you pick up the "Post American World" by Fareed Zakaria and read the sections about India instead of reading baseless theories by pseudo intellectuals. Judge for yourself!

                  Cyrus Zulkarnaian Kazi


                  ----- Original Message ----
                  From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
                  To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                  Cc: Pakistan Front <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>; bd_mailer@yahoo. com; zoglul@hotmail. co.uk; rehman.mohammad@ gmail.com; premlaliguras@ hotmail.com; Bangladesh Researchers <bdresearchers@ yahoogroups. com>; mahmudurart@ yahoo.com; rivercrossinternati onal@yahoo. com; Bangla Vision <bangla-vision@ yahoogroups. com>; rezwansiddique@ yahoo.com; farhadmazhar@ hotmail.com; shahin72@gmail. com
                  Sent: Monday, September 1, 2008 10:40:10 AM
                  Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                  Dear Isha Khan.
                   
                  Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
                   
                  Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
                   
                  His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
                   
                  I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
                   
                  If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
                   
                  Thanks.
                   
                  Saj
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Isha Khan
                  Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
                  Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



                  --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
                  From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

                  Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                  Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

                  My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
                  poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
                  it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
                  fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
                  by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
                  to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

                  I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
                  more better off than the Indians.

                  Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
                  India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
                  government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
                  work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
                  population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
                  Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
                  An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
                  following manner:

                  No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
                  Rs./month
                  1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
                  2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
                  3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
                  16,000
                  4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
                  5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
                  based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
                  and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
                  6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
                  poverty line, for underdeveloped
                  countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
                  month Rs. 1,410
                  7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
                  about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
                  person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
                  1,250
                  8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
                  for
                  explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
                  per person, approx. Rs. 300
                  Other related & relevant data In millions, people
                  9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
                  million (30 Cr.)
                  10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
                  Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
                  Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
                  11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
                  Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
                  12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
                  About 320 million (32 Cr.)
                  13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
                  About
                  300 million (30 Cr.)
                  14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
                  the
                  aspirations of the people of India
                  About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
                  15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
                  million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
                  16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
                  700 million (70 Cr.)

                  1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
                  under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
                  or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
                  Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
                  As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
                  Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
                  per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
                  As per GOI, this amount will buy food
                  equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
                  death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
                  country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
                  actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
                  On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
                  Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
                  alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
                  the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
                  clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
                  pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
                  JUDGE!
                  The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
                  city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
                  Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
                  capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
                  If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
                  every village, it would improve, education, health,
                  family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
                  migration from vllages to cities.

                  *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
                  housing + perks + retirement benefits.

                  **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
                  million = 1,00,00,000.

                  To verify you can look at this link:

                  http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

                  M .Javed Iqbal





                • S Turkman
                  Yeah but IMF does not accept any Loan Payments in PPP Dollars and you can not import anything with your PPP Dollars. Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) Theory was
                  Message 8 of 8 , Sep 12, 2008
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Yeah but IMF does not accept any Loan Payments in PPP Dollars and you can not import anything with your PPP Dollars. Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) Theory was developed by a crazy Economist of Pakistan and all big Executives of Multi Nationals in the world working abroad accepted it to get raises in their Salaries and Allowances for working overseas.
                     
                    Purpose of finding-out GDP of a country is to find-out the Per Capita Income, not Purchasing Power Parity of a country. PPP Per Capita of India could be Rs. 95,000 a month but all it does is make people laugh at that lie since reality is not PPP but the real money.   

                    --- On Wed, 9/10/08, Cyrus <thoughtocrat@...> wrote:
                    Mr. Ali:
                     
                    Several sources, actually. The Purchasing Power Parity (2006 estimated) of India is $4.156 trillion (CIA Factbook). By July 2007, India's stock market capitalization rose to over $944 billion and was expected to cross $1.1 Trillion by the end of the year (Morgan Stanley). IMF reported in 2007 that India's GDP (PPP) is $2.818 Trillion, while World Bank reported that India's GDP (PPP) for the same year is $3.092 Trillion.
                     
                    Please note that while the fundamentals of GDP (PPP) calculations are the same, from macroecnomic point of view, each of these sources (i.e. World Bank, IMF, et. al.) consider different independent variables that contribute to the GDP.
                     
                    Cyrus


                    ----- Original Message ----
                    From: Nasir Ali <nawshad1@yahoo. com>
                    To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                    Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 12:44:31 AM
                    Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                    Hi all,
                     
                    I just got curious. Where did you get this figure that India's GDP is 3 trillion dollars. Please give me reference.
                     
                    Thanks
                     
                    Ali

                    --- On Thu, 9/4/08, Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM> wrote:
                    From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
                    Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line
                    To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                    Cc: "Pakistan Zindabad" <pakistan-zindabad@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pakistan Post" <pakistanpost@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pakistan Front" <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pak India Panel" <pakindiapenpals@ yahoogroups. com>, "Pak Hope" <pakhope@yahoogroups .com>
                    Date: Thursday, September 4, 2008, 10:33 AM

                    Very funny.....
                     
                    To whom you are responding? Where did you read statistics in my post, which you responding. Those who read your post, would be laughing on you. See who is saying what and then speak.
                     
                    Anyway, if India and Pakistan thread is not appropriate than why did YOU argued? Well, let's have a little analysis of your insertions.
                     
                    Yes, India has greatest democracy and now a days, Christians are enjoying this greatest democracy. Before them Muslims were tasting this democracy in Gujrat and elsewhere in India. By the way, Muslims are enjoying this democracy from the very first day. Did you notice the wonderful and beautiful treatment of Sikhs by this democratic country? I am sure you still remember that.
                     
                    Yes, India's GDP is 3 trillion dollar. In the meanwhile, do you know, 1.5 trillion dollars of looted money is also present in Swiss banks. This is the money which had been looted by Indian politicians, military servants, civil servants etc etc. Please also note that his looted money is almost 50% of India's total GDP. Indians would feel proud of it. Isn't it?
                     
                    Growing middle class.... yes growing middle class. Where India's population is increasing by millions every year, few of the poors of India manage to upgrade their social status and thus become a honorary member of so called middle class. Now, no doubt that the numbers of poors are increasing more than the number of middle class. But the reality is that middle class is increasing. Yes, yes and yes. It is increasing. With hundreds of billions dollars in foreign reserves, with hundreds of billion dollars in export, with thousands of billion dollars in Swiss banks and with 3 trillion billion dollars GDP, India is narrowly ahead of Pakistan in Per capita national income, government offers packages and incentives to the public to use government toilets just because they need to collect the samples or something else. I am sure that these payments of few rupees in a year will help to further increase the middle class.
                     
                    World class education system and high literacy rates. Yes, this is also true. Those who do not have proper toilet facilities in their homes are well educated. Thanks to the Indian education system. Those, who sleep under open air and with dinner also very educated and do not sleep in the middle of the roads to show their civilised behaviours, those hundreds of millions of Indians are also well educated who are living below poverty line, those who killed just because they were Christians or Muslims or Sikhs but not Hindus, were also well educated etc etc.
                     
                    And oh, I forgot to mention that India cannot obliterate Pakistan with its so called nuclear arsenal. As India will also have to face the same fate. Do you know the difference between the population of India and Pakistan? If one Pakistan will die in nuclear attack than 10 Indians will die in nuclear attack. India can target the whole Pakistan, infect only 160 people with its nuclear arsenal. But on the other hand, more than half of the Indian population is well in the range of Pakistan. What does it mean? Will you please dare to tell us? A hell not. Additionally, Pakistan's nuclear program is more sophisticated and advance than the Indian. India needs to wait for for good 10 years to overtake Pakistan. But until then..... hehehe
                     
                    It is difficult to determine the actual size and composition of India's and Pakistan's nuclear arsenals, but NRDC estimates that both countries have a total of 50 to 75 weapons. Contrary to the conventional wisdom, we believe India has about 30 to 35 nuclear warheads, slightly fewer than Pakistan, which may have as many as 48.
                     
                    .....
                     

                    Estimated nuclear casualties for attacks on 10 large Indian and Pakistani cities
                    City NameTotal Population Within 5 Kilometres of Ground ZeroNumber of Persons KilledNumber of Persons Severely InjuredNumber of Persons Slightly Injured
                    India
                    Ban3,077,937314,978175,136411,336
                    Bombay3,143,284477,713228,648476,633
                    Calcutta3,520,344357,202198,218466,336
                    Madras3,252,628364,291196,226448,948
                    New Delhi1,638,744176,51894,231217,853
                    Total India14,632,9371,690,702892,4592,021,106
                    Pakistan
                    Faisalabad2,376,478336,239174,351373,967
                    Islamabad798,583154,06766,744129,935
                    Karachi1,962,458239,643126,810283,290
                    Lahore2,682,092258,139149,649354,095
                    Rawalpindi1,589,828183,79196,846220,585
                    Total Pakistan9,409,4391,171,879614,4001,361,872
                    India and Pakistan
                    Total24,042,3762,862,5811,506,8593,382,978
                     
                     
                    So, Mr, Cyrus, who will obliterate who? There are hundreds of such research reports and articles are available over the internet. Increase your knowledge first and then speak. Additionally, geographical location of Pakistan also give certain advantage to us. If India every used Nuclear weapons against Pakistan and even if Pakistan do not respond, even then, India will have to face circumstances in the future and these suffering will start within few months. While most of the Indian targets are far away from Pakistani territories. So little need to worry about it. So, what I said, learn then speak. And Let's face it.
                     
                    India's influence is already in danger. Did you read the news that Pakistan already supporting Srilanka in their efforts to take down separatists, prepared and planted by Indian Intelligence agencies. Do you know that Pakistan send almost three shiploads every month to them? India's presence in Afghanistan is only because of the Americans. how long they gonna stay there and how long India will be present in Afghanistan. Then Let's talk about Bangladesh. Bangladesh is not ready to accept the supremacy of India. And making its own independent foreign policy. India's wish to become a regional power is just a dream of the fool. That country could never become a regional power, who invest more than half of its military in such a tiny area like the valley of Kashmir. More than 7,00,000 Indian army men are their and this is not it. They conduct fake battles with bogus insurgents and obtains medals and promotions. And also kill each other and their seniors too. This can't be the characteristic of the regional power. Isn't it? Forget about the China, which is building its naval presence in the region. India simply cannot compete them. What you say?
                     
                    I do not have to do pro-Pakistan propaganda. The fact is that the world have more information available than me. Whatever, you will write here will crosschecked over internet and People will automatically come to know that who id propagandists and who is not.
                     
                    Our neighbour can not simply do it. Instead the intellectuals of our neighbours are telling us something very interesting. Did you read something about what they saying? Read the following
                     
                    Kalki Autar Aur Mohammad
                     
                    Ready and enjoy.
                     
                    Asalam Alaikum to all Hindus and have a nice time.
                     
                    Your Muslim Brother
                     
                    Saj
                     
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Cyrus
                    Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 2:23 AM
                    Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                    Yes...like all countries, India has its home grown problems, and no I am not referring to sparks of religious and communal intolerance or rampant poverty. But India is also the largest democracy, with a GDP of almost $3 Trillion, a growing middle-class, world-class education system, world-class technology sector, better infrastructure than most South Asian countries, more literacy rate relative to its massive population, and oh did I mention that it can obliterate Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal? Let's face it. Geographically, we cannot ever shake-off the influence of India. Might as well deal with the situation and advance our own country.
                     
                    On a separate note, stop the pro-Pakistani propaganda. Bangladesh needs to make its own mark. Why are we even talking about India or Pakistan in this forum? Got nothing productive to talk about Bangladesh? I am just tired of people's pro-Islamic bent 24/7. If you need spiritual redemption that much, go hide from the civilization. If your faith is really that flimsy that your neighbor could "force" you to convert, then you should worry about your own sanity. This is not a India-bashing forum. You would be welcomed in any other place, I am sure.
                     
                    By the way, the economic data that you present have little or no validation when it comes to evaluating the overall socio-economic indicators of India. I suggest, for once, you pick up the "Post American World" by Fareed Zakaria and read the sections about India instead of reading baseless theories by pseudo intellectuals. Judge for yourself!

                    Cyrus Zulkarnaian Kazi


                    ----- Original Message ----
                    From: Saj <SAJJAD_PAK@HOTMAIL. COM>
                    To: alochona@yahoogroup s.com
                    Cc: Pakistan Front <pakistanFront@ yahoogroups. com>; bd_mailer@yahoo. com; zoglul@hotmail. co.uk; rehman.mohammad@ gmail.com; premlaliguras@ hotmail.com; Bangladesh Researchers <bdresearchers@ yahoogroups. com>; mahmudurart@ yahoo.com; rivercrossinternati onal@yahoo. com; Bangla Vision <bangla-vision@ yahoogroups. com>; rezwansiddique@ yahoo.com; farhadmazhar@ hotmail.com; shahin72@gmail. com
                    Sent: Monday, September 1, 2008 10:40:10 AM
                    Subject: Re: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                    Dear Isha Khan.
                     
                    Though the story of the poverty in India is true and the living conditions of good portion of there population are something more than worse. I do not believe that you need to copy paste the information, which is provided by the nut and world's most stupid person.
                     
                    Mohammad Javed Iqbal, whose posts you copied here, claim that he was used to write articles in Daily Jang, which is very famous newspaper in Pakistan. Like S Turkman, his posts are also available in the archive of yahoo based group, PakistanFront. He is, infect, not a real person but a fake Pakistani. He introduced himself as a Column writer in daily Jang and then he tried to frustrate the group members by saying that all of us should go to Jang building in Islamabad and destroy it. Later, he banned from PakistanFront.
                     
                    His tactics are very complicated, you can't read and understand him. He will write One thousands lines of true Islam and then will put his real massage somewhere into it. Similarly, now a days, he is intending to make as much reputation as possible. So that he can use such reputation for his hidden purpose. If you only SEARCH his name in google etc. I am sure you will find enough material about him.
                     
                    I know that you do not really know about him. He made himself disputed by planting hate, frustration in the people. Once caught red handed, he is, since then, writing about Islam and the greatness of Pakistan and writing smilar articles about India. So, please be carefull about him and do not forward his massages or atleast read the contents carefully and then forward. He does not deserve it, by the way.
                     
                    If you want to know more about him, please use google and search for his name. Read his posts all around the yahoo groups and many other forum like websites and observe by yourself. That, is this the way, someone present his country and people.
                     
                    Thanks.
                     
                    Saj
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Isha Khan
                    Sent: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:16 AM
                    Subject: [ALOCHONA] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line



                    --- On Sun, 8/31/08, Muhammad Javed Iqbal <javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com> wrote:
                    From: Muhammad Javed Iqbal javediqbalkaleem@ yahoo.com

                    Subject: [notun_bangladesh] More than 75% Indians live below poverty line

                    Date: Sunday, August 31, 2008, 12:22 AM

                    My heart bleeds for the Indian poor. Almost 90% Indians live below
                    poverty line. The government of India is callous and shameless when
                    it comes to rescuing its poors. To hide facts, it has arbitarily
                    fixed the povertyline at Rs 10 per day, whereas the standard fixed
                    by world bank and asian bank was US $ 1 which has now been increased
                    to 1.35 dollars due to increasing food prices.

                    I wonder how ungrteful and thankless we Pakistanis are who are far
                    more better off than the Indians.

                    Whereas the minimum wage in Paksitan is Rs 6000, Government of
                    India has fixed it at Rs 1250. No wonder, many emploees of Indian
                    government live below poverty line, not to speak of millions who
                    work in un-organized sectors or are unemployed. India's
                    population living below povertyline exceeds 90% because now the
                    Asian Bank has fixed povertyline at Us $ 1.35 per day per person.
                    An Indian expert has calculated Indian poverty in the
                    following manner:

                    No. Earnings of diffrent types of employees in India Converted into
                    Rs./month
                    1. Average cost of employee* in Air-India Rs. 53,000
                    2. Average cost of employee* in MARUTI UDYOG Rs. 24,000
                    3. Average cost of employee* in the MUMBAI MUNICIPAL CORP. Rs.
                    16,000
                    4. Minimum starting salary in the FIRE Dept. in Mumbai Rs. 7,000
                    5. Average earning of an Indian - US$ 440 per year or about (This is
                    based on a GDP of US$ 440 billion
                    and 1 billion people) Rs. 1,727
                    6. Minimum earning required, as per WORLD BANK, to live at above
                    poverty line, for underdeveloped
                    countries like India, China etc, about US$ 1.0 per day or US$ 30 per
                    month Rs. 1,410
                    7. MINIMUM WAGES, as per Government of India, for all the States,
                    about Rs. 40 to 60 per day per
                    person, average about Rs. 50 per day. For 25 days per month Rs.
                    1,250
                    8. POVERTY LINE definition, as per Government of India, see below
                    for
                    explanation, at Rs. 10 per day,
                    per person, approx. Rs. 300
                    Other related & relevant data In millions, people
                    9. Number of people, in India, who are below poverty line About 300
                    million (30 Cr.)
                    10. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Public
                    Sector, i.e. with the Central and State
                    Government About 19 million (1.9 Cr.)
                    11. Number of people, in India, who work in the organized Private
                    Secto About 8 million (0.8 Cr.)
                    12. Number of people, in India, who work in the unorganized Sector
                    About 320 million (32 Cr.)
                    13. Number of people, in India, who are unemployed approximately
                    About
                    300 million (30 Cr.)
                    14. Number of JOBS which need to be created every year, to fulfill
                    the
                    aspirations of the people of India
                    About 10 million/yr. (1 Cr.)
                    15. Number of people BORN every year in India (China is only 10
                    million per yea About 27 million/yr. (2.7 Cr.)
                    16. Number of people, in India, who are below 35 years of age About
                    700 million (70 Cr.)

                    1. About us The World Bank's definition of the poverty line**, for
                    under developed countries, like India, is US$ 1/day/person
                    or US $365 per year. As per this definition, more than 75% of all
                    Indians are, probably, below the poverty line!
                    As per the Government of India, poverty line for the urban areas is
                    Rs. 296 per month and for rural areas Rs. 276
                    per month, i.e. people in India who earn less than Rs. 10 per day.
                    As per GOI, this amount will buy food
                    equivalent to 2200 calories per day, medically enough, to prevent
                    death. At this level of earning, even in a poor
                    country like India, survival on Rs. 10 per day is a nightmare! This
                    actually translates to Rs. 3650 per year or US $ 75 per year.
                    On what basis have our planners decided this definition of "Poverty
                    Line"? Does it mean that the person will get enough food to stay
                    alive? How and where is he or she supposed to cook it? What about
                    the minimum needs in education, housing, health services,
                    clothing,and other basic necessities? Are we supposed to live on
                    pavements and sleep under trees from birth till death? YOU BE THE
                    JUDGE!
                    The minimum wages in India, vary from state to state and city to
                    city, and average Rs. 1000 - 1250/month or
                    Rs. 12,000 - 15,000/yr. Or US $ 250 - US $ 300/yr. India's per
                    capita is US $ 440 per year. (China's is US $ 990).
                    If India could provide Roads, Electricity, TV's and Telephones in
                    every village, it would improve, education, health,
                    family planning, agriculture, animal husbandry, GDP and reduce
                    migration from vllages to cities.

                    *Cost of employee = salary & wages + all allowances including
                    housing + perks + retirement benefits.

                    **1 million = 1,000,000 or 10 lacs. 1 lac = 1,00,000. 1 crore = 10
                    million = 1,00,00,000.

                    To verify you can look at this link:

                    http://www.wakeupca ll.org/administr ation_in_ india/poverty_ line.php

                    M .Javed Iqbal





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