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RE: [albanach] Digest Number 550

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  • Derek Godfrey
    The Muslim symbols are the Half moon emblems that the Oasis and Shriners use. The fez the Shriners use is distinctly Muslim and represents a massive slaughter
    Message 1 of 25 , Sep 7, 2003
      The Muslim symbols are the Half moon emblems that the Oasis and Shriners
      use. The fez the Shriners use is distinctly Muslim and represents a massive
      slaughter of Christians in the past...it took place in a town called "Fez"
      and the red color represents the blood from the be-headings that took place
      during that massacre. It is easy to verify this information, historically
      speaking. Shall I give details as to what the Eastern Star represents?? If
      you are interested in this, e-mail me privately and I will give more
      details. My point being that "carpenters and mathematicians" are NOT
      necessarily Muslim. The Square and the Compass are indeed tools of the
      masonry trade...but when inverted you see a different picture...again ask
      privately if you want to know.

      As for the Masons in general, the Title of Knight Templar (Order of Knights
      Templar Commandery) is granted at the highest level of the York Rite. Level
      32 in the Scottish Rite is "Master of the Royal Secret". There is a legend
      that the Templar Knights still exist and are guardians of the Holy
      Grail...but that is just a legend/myth.

      I have included this info so this thread is of some relevance to this list.

      -----Original Message-----
      From: scotsfencer@... [mailto:scotsfencer@...]
      Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 11:54 PM
      To: albanach@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [albanach] Digest Number 550


      Tigherna,

      My friend also made reference to the building of King Solomon's temple.
      Interesting thing is I am a firefighter, and a large number of my fire dept
      "brothers" are masonic. Another thing I found interesing (I dont know how
      accurate perhaps you could shed light) was that the Shriners, well known for
      their burn center and such, to become a shriner you must be a mason.

      Also something that Ive found, the actual masonic symbol as commonly
      displayed is of a T-square and a compass style tool. Both of these are tools
      in the stone working trade. And if these are Muslim... then I guess all
      carpenters and mathemeticians are muslim also......

      Gavine


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    • Derek Godfrey
      Ok. I don t know if my reply to Lindsey made it to the list or not. I am interested in the garb of a Protestant minister post 1550. I am actually thinking
      Message 2 of 25 , Sep 7, 2003
        Ok. I don't know if my reply to Lindsey made it to the list or not. I am
        interested in the garb of a Protestant minister post 1550. I am actually
        thinking about 1615 to be more precise. This would be a Scottish Highland
        persona. I'd like to know what vestments would be worn during services by a
        Protestant minister, but also what normal daily wear would be. If it's
        Cavalier garb, that would be awesome...LOL...especially since I am a Rapier
        fighter.

        Aonghus


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • K K
        many simbols are used by groups today without knowing the beginings the half moon symbol is used by over 20 older ethic groups including the jewish groups it
        Message 3 of 25 , Sep 7, 2003
          many simbols are used by groups today without knowing the beginings

          the half moon symbol is used by over 20 older ethic groups including the
          jewish groups
          it was a time marker to most and was connect to the event that happen at
          that time

          and using a older pagan symbol does not make you pagan if it did the
          christains would be one of the most pagan groups next too wiccan asd many of
          their symbols have pagan roots as well as almost all of the hollidays....





          merry meet and merry part
          and merry meet again

          kevin

          //http:www.justjokeing.com/fooled_ya.html
          hee hee hee

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        • Chris Greek
          And let s not forget hundreds, nay, thousands of outhouses across the land...does that half-moon on the door designate it non-Christian friendly ? ... From: K
          Message 4 of 25 , Sep 7, 2003
            And let's not forget hundreds, nay, thousands of outhouses across the land...does that half-moon on the door designate it "non-Christian friendly"?
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: K K
            To: albanach@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 1:25 AM
            Subject: RE: [albanach] Digest Number 550


            many simbols are used by groups today without knowing the beginings

            the half moon symbol is used by over 20 older ethic groups including the
            jewish groups
            it was a time marker to most and was connect to the event that happen at
            that time

            and using a older pagan symbol does not make you pagan if it did the
            christains would be one of the most pagan groups next too wiccan asd many of
            their symbols have pagan roots as well as almost all of the hollidays....





            merry meet and merry part
            and merry meet again

            kevin

            //http:www.justjokeing.com/fooled_ya.html
            hee hee hee

            _________________________________________________________________
            Get a FREE computer virus scan online from McAfee.
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          • Lora Ludwikowski
            There is a mason group right on yahoo. I was allowed to join and I am a female. All they did was list jobs and resumes. Nothing else was done. Thought I might
            Message 5 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
              There is a mason group right on yahoo. I was allowed to join and I am a
              female. All they did was list jobs and resumes. Nothing else was done.
              Thought I might see a listing for my area. I stayed on awhile saw nothing
              and got out after about a month or so. Maybe they did not know I was female
              not sure they never ask though.



              Lora in northern NY
              http://community.webshots.com/user/loradcl
              ICQ 818456
              Yahoo & MSN loradcl
              AIM loradcl96

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            • Peter A. Kincaid
              ... These days the close minded use the weapon of calling others who don t agree with them close minded. There seems to be any attempt to shame a person into
              Message 6 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                >I personally am not a mason, nor do I wish to be. And I respect your choice
                >in the same. I must say however that some of your statements come off as
                >almost closed minded christian. To say that any other persons beliefs would
                >be "satanic" is amazing. However, one of my favorite sayings (and one that I
                >live by) "I may disagree with what you say, but I will fight to the death
                >for your right to say it". It would be interesting to dig up some more
                >research on the subject though. Anyone ever seen that movie "The Skulls"....
                >hahahaha


                These days the close minded use the weapon of calling others
                who don't agree with them close minded. There seems to be
                any attempt to shame a person into sharing their beliefs by this
                way. This is shameful. The truth is that most religious groups and
                even fraternal organizations are meant to be close minded. People
                gather together with common beliefs to the exclusion of those
                that don't share theirs. Christians (ie. fundamental ones) have every
                right to be against Freemasonry as some of its symbols and
                practises are against its teachings. Moderate christians may be
                more accepting. However, a christian is a loose term these days
                as many churches are being organized under the christian banner
                to propogate very right wing or very liberal views. Freemasonry
                and other fraternal organizations have every right to exist and
                share their views. Nobody outside the organization has to agree
                with them. If one doesn't like it then don't join.

                I can say from my study of them that freemasony is meant to
                be inclusive of most religions. Their beliefs were reflected in
                the American constitution via the separation of church and state.
                One has to look at the period in which it was formed. Most of
                religions outside the established church were banned or their
                members were prohibited from have any beneficial rights (ie. right
                to own property). However, one has to recognize that this inclusive
                belief while being noble is contrary to traditional christianity. One should
                love your neighbor and be in peace with them but you can't
                have your feet in two camps. In my opinion there was and still is
                an attempt by some freemasons to connect its past to that of the Scottish
                templars. The reason being that the templars had a romantic impression
                among the populace. However, one forgets that the templars themselves
                were disbanded in Scotland and their property was transferred to
                that of the Knights of St. John of Jerusalem. The true Knights
                Templar history in Scotland was mainly confined to the 13th and
                14th century in Scotland. The Knights of St. John were a very
                open group (no secrets) but they were very Christian and were
                almost fanatical about defending the Holy Land and Europe for
                Christians. They failed.



                Peter A. Kincaid
                Hampton, NB, Canada
              • Matthew Newsome
                ... I m wondering how far, if at all, Protestantism had spread into the Highlands by 1615. All I know is that it took much longer to gain acceptance by the
                Message 7 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                  Derek Godfrey wrote:

                  > Ok. I don't know if my reply to Lindsey made it to the list or not.
                  > I am
                  > interested in the garb of a Protestant minister post 1550. I am
                  > actually
                  > thinking about 1615 to be more precise. This would be a Scottish
                  > Highland
                  > persona. I'd like to know what vestments would be worn during
                  > services by a
                  > Protestant minister, but also what normal daily wear would be. If
                  > it's
                  > Cavalier garb, that would be awesome...LOL...especially since I am a
                  > Rapier
                  > fighter.

                  I'm wondering how far, if at all, Protestantism had spread into the
                  Highlands by 1615. All I know is that it took much longer to gain
                  acceptance by the Highland Scots than in the lowlands. In the
                  eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, a lot of Scottish Presbyterians
                  still considered the Highlands "missionary territory." So to make this
                  work you may have to move your Highland persona into the Lowlands....

                  Aye,
                  Eogan

                  --
                  Matthew A. C. Newsome
                  http://albanach.org
                  Highland Dress Historian
                  Catholic Apologist

                  TURRIS FORTIS Catholic Apologetics
                  on line at http://turrisfortis.com

                  "To whom shall we go?" -- St. Peter
                  John 6:68
                • Derek Godfrey
                  Well, I will have to take that into account...I wonder where I might find some more info on that? Again, this is merely something I am researching at this
                  Message 8 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                    Well, I will have to take that into account...I wonder where I might find
                    some more info on that? Again, this is merely something I am researching at
                    this point, nothing is set in stone concerning the persona.

                    Aonghus

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Matthew Newsome [mailto:eogan@...]
                    Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 7:31 AM
                    To: albanach@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [albanach] Back on-topic


                    Derek Godfrey wrote:

                    > Ok. I don't know if my reply to Lindsey made it to the list or not.
                    > I am
                    > interested in the garb of a Protestant minister post 1550. I am
                    > actually
                    > thinking about 1615 to be more precise. This would be a Scottish
                    > Highland
                    > persona. I'd like to know what vestments would be worn during
                    > services by a
                    > Protestant minister, but also what normal daily wear would be. If
                    > it's
                    > Cavalier garb, that would be awesome...LOL...especially since I am a
                    > Rapier
                    > fighter.

                    I'm wondering how far, if at all, Protestantism had spread into the
                    Highlands by 1615. All I know is that it took much longer to gain
                    acceptance by the Highland Scots than in the lowlands. In the
                    eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, a lot of Scottish Presbyterians
                    still considered the Highlands "missionary territory." So to make this
                    work you may have to move your Highland persona into the Lowlands....

                    Aye,
                    Eogan

                    --
                    Matthew A. C. Newsome
                    http://albanach.org
                    Highland Dress Historian
                    Catholic Apologist

                    TURRIS FORTIS Catholic Apologetics
                    on line at http://turrisfortis.com

                    "To whom shall we go?" -- St. Peter
                    John 6:68




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                    Scotland c. 503-1603 AD. Post messages to albanach@egroups.com. Alter
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                  • scotsfencer@aol.com
                    In a message dated 9/7/03 11:59:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, croaker@circlewolf.org writes:
                    Message 9 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                      In a message dated 9/7/03 11:59:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                      croaker@... writes:

                      << The "All-seeing eye" for example is an occult symbol
                      >representing the Illuminati. >>

                      OOOO and the "All-seeing eye" can be found on the american one dollar
                      bill.... WAHOOO MONEY IS WORTHLESS. Also, cult is a nasty word to use..... one must
                      remember that one persons "cult" is anothers religion, and of course one
                      persons "religion" will be another persons cult.
                    • Derek Godfrey
                      Unfortunately, the reason the all-seeing eye is on the dollar bill is because the founding fathers, some were Masons. ... From: scotsfencer@aol.com
                      Message 10 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                        Unfortunately, the reason the all-seeing eye is on the dollar bill is
                        because the founding fathers, some were Masons.

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: scotsfencer@... [mailto:scotsfencer@...]
                        Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 12:25 PM
                        To: albanach@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [albanach] Digest Number 550


                        In a message dated 9/7/03 11:59:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                        croaker@... writes:

                        << The "All-seeing eye" for example is an occult symbol
                        >representing the Illuminati. >>

                        OOOO and the "All-seeing eye" can be found on the american one dollar
                        bill.... WAHOOO MONEY IS WORTHLESS. Also, cult is a nasty word to use.....
                        one must
                        remember that one persons "cult" is anothers religion, and of course one
                        persons "religion" will be another persons cult.


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                        This is Albanach, a group devoted to the study and re-enactment of
                        Scotland c. 503-1603 AD. Post messages to albanach@egroups.com. Alter
                        your account or view the archives at www.egroups.com/list/albanach

                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
                        <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .




                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Derek Godfrey
                        I was hoping for Protestant actually, rather than Catholic. But some older style cassocks look really nice. ... From: Lindsay
                        Message 11 of 25 , Sep 8, 2003
                          I was hoping for Protestant actually, rather than Catholic. But some older
                          style cassocks look really nice.

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Lindsay [mailto:lindsay@...]
                          Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 5:41 AM
                          To: albanach@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [albanach] Digest Number 550


                          Derek

                          I depends what you mean by 'priest' since Scotland went Protestant in 1560.
                          If you mean one of the few remaining Catholic priests, they would have
                          dressed in the manner of priests everywhere in Europe at the time. If you
                          mean a Protestant minister, the closest pictures you can probably find are
                          those of John Knox, George Buchanan etc. They mainly wore black.
                          The Clan Tartan's are an early 19th Century concepts (blame Walter Scott)
                          and the Clergy tartan will be an even more recent idea.
                          On the subject of Tartans, has everyone heard that there is going to be a
                          special Freemason tartan. This has struck me as odd since aren't they
                          supposed to be a 'secret' society???

                          Lindsay
                          www.gaddgedlar.com

                          >________________________________________________________________________
                          >
                          > Message: 4
                          > Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 03:13:44 -0400
                          > From: "Derek Godfrey" <derekg@...>
                          > Subject: Garb Question
                          >
                          > What would a Scottish "priest" of the Church of Scotland have worn in the
                          > 1600s? Playing with a new persona idea. Besides, the Clergy tartan and
                          the
                          > Clarke tartan are so very similar :)
                          >
                          > Thanks,
                          >
                          > Aonghus
                          > mka Derek
                          >







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