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Moore and the Age of Geeks

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  • smoky man
    Take a look to this TCJ article here: http://www.tcj.com/?p=2326 smok!
    Message 1 of 28 , Jan 2, 2010
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      Take a look to this TCJ article here:
      http://www.tcj.com/?p=2326

      smok!

    • AWDonkin@AOL.com
      Thank indeed Smoky. And a HAPPY NEW YEAR to you all. A
      Message 2 of 28 , Jan 3, 2010
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            Thank indeed Smoky.
         
            And a HAPPY NEW YEAR to you all.
         
            A
      • smoky man
        I wish you all a FANTASTIC 2010!!! smok! :) ... Da: AWDonkin@AOL.com Oggetto: [alanmoore] Re:Moore and the Age of Geeks A:
        Message 3 of 28 , Jan 3, 2010
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          I wish you all a FANTASTIC 2010!!!

          smok! :)

          --- Dom 3/1/10, AWDonkin@... <AWDonkin@...> ha scritto:

          Da: AWDonkin@... <AWDonkin@...>
          Oggetto: [alanmoore] Re:Moore and the Age of Geeks
          A: alanmoore@yahoogroups.com
          Data: Domenica 3 gennaio 2010, 14:53

           

           
              Thank indeed Smoky.
           
              And a HAPPY NEW YEAR to you all.
           
              A

        • chinaboatman
          ... I couldn t get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem
          Message 4 of 28 , Jan 4, 2010
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            --- In alanmoore@yahoogroups.com, smoky man <smoky_man@...> wrote:
            >
            > Take a look to this TCJ article here:
            > http://www.tcj.com/?p=2326
            >
            > smok!
            >


            I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

            Also: you can't disguise an inability to write legibly and cohesively with a quirky or offbeat 'style'. That article is pretty much the archetypal 'I have a vague and irrelevant point to make but i don't have the ability to make it' Internet article we see so much.

            Yes, the christmas spirit has well and truly departed! ;)

            That's a criticism of the article Smoky, not yourself of course. Thanks as ever for the link :)
          • K. A. Laity
            I couldn t get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem Logic:
            Message 5 of 28 , Jan 4, 2010
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              I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

              >>It's the "one theory" approach. I have found a key and it unlocks all doors. With respect to Moore, his bottom line seems to be that Moore writing anything but superheroes is crap. On the larger topic, the geeks have inherited the earth, he has some merit. It's what makes Watchmen such a crap film. A little less dogged attention to reproducing panels and a lot more to making it a *film* would have improved things.

              Kate

              =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
              "We are all born mad. Some remain so."
              -- Samuel Beckett, Waiting for Godot
              www.kalaity.com
            • George Vincent
              While someone borrowed my copy of THE WATCHMEN without asking me if they could, I found it an excellent movie, and I am prejudiced, being a movie buff and a
              Message 6 of 28 , Jan 4, 2010
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                While someone borrowed my copy of THE WATCHMEN without asking me if they could, I found it an excellent movie, and I am prejudiced, being a movie buff and a onetime comics collector [who has several of Moore's works hidden where nobody can find em and walk off with them.]
                Incidently I recently saw V FOR VENDETTA not having read the graphic novel I couldn't compare movie to book but for me the movie worked quite well.

                --- On Mon, 1/4/10, K. A. Laity <klaity@...> wrote:

                From: K. A. Laity <klaity@...>
                Subject: [alanmoore] Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks
                To: alanmoore@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Monday, January 4, 2010, 12:51 PM

                 
                I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

                >>It's the "one theory" approach. I have found a key and it unlocks all doors. With respect to Moore, his bottom line seems to be that Moore writing anything but superheroes is crap. On the larger topic, the geeks have inherited the earth, he has some merit. It's what makes Watchmen such a crap film. A little less dogged attention to reproducing panels and a lot more to making it a *film* would have improved things.

                Kate

                =-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-= -=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-= -=-=-=-=- =-=
                "We are all born mad. Some remain so."
                -- Samuel Beckett, Waiting for Godot
                www.kalaity. com

              • Ryan Dunne
                Personally, I really liked the Watchmen movie too (in its own right, not because of its accuracy as an adaption). From Hell is a crap movie, but not solely or
                Message 7 of 28 , Jan 4, 2010
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                   Personally, I really liked the Watchmen movie too (in its own right, not because of its accuracy as an adaption). From Hell is a crap movie, but not solely or even primarily because it deviated from the graphic novel. And Watchmen wasn't really a flop. For an R rated movie that it is *about* something , and with no recognisable stars, it was surprisingly successful. The credits sequence, set to Dylan's The Times They Are A-Changing, was one the scenes of the year. And the changed ending could have been a lot worse. The flashy action direction, although probably an understandable attempt to appeal to yoof, was a mistake ( I saw it with someone who hadn't read the graphic novel, who didn't know whether Dr.Manhattan was the only superpowered hero or not - understandable, when the Nite Owl is punching people through walls!).  Has anyone bought the extended or 'special' (with The Black Freighter edited back in) editions? Am not sure which DVD version to go for. 

                   ryan


                  2010/1/4 George Vincent <adirondackgeorge1952@...>
                   

                  While someone borrowed my copy of THE WATCHMEN without asking me if they could, I found it an excellent movie, and I am prejudiced, being a movie buff and a onetime comics collector [who has several of Moore's works hidden where nobody can find em and walk off with them.]
                  Incidently I recently saw V FOR VENDETTA not having read the graphic novel I couldn't compare movie to book but for me the movie worked quite well.

                  --- On Mon, 1/4/10, K. A. Laity <klaity@...> wrote:

                  From: K. A. Laity <klaity@...>
                  Subject: [alanmoore] Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks
                  To: alanmoore@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Monday, January 4, 2010, 12:51 PM


                   
                  I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish. I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

                  >>It's the "one theory" approach. I have found a key and it unlocks all doors. With respect to Moore, his bottom line seems to be that Moore writing anything but superheroes is crap. On the larger topic, the geeks have inherited the earth, he has some merit. It's what makes Watchmen such a crap film. A little less dogged attention to reproducing panels and a lot more to making it a *film* would have improved things.

                  Kate

                  =-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-= -=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-= -=-=-=-=- =-=
                  "We are all born mad. Some remain so."
                  -- Samuel Beckett, Waiting for Godot
                  www.kalaity. com




                  --
                  ryan

                  "Give thanks to God for His glorious Vestments (and His mercy endureth forever)"
                • Chris
                  On Thu, Jan 1st, 1970 at 10:00 AM, K. A. Laity ... How does this reconcile with the article being reprinted from the 300th issue of a
                  Message 8 of 28 , Jan 4, 2010
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                    On Thu, Jan 1st, 1970 at 10:00 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@...>
                    wrote:

                    > I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish.
                    > I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print
                    > media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and
                    > anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

                    How does this reconcile with the article being reprinted from the
                    300th issue of a print journal, then?

                    > >>It's the "one theory" approach. I have found a key and it unlocks
                    > all doors. With respect to Moore, his bottom line seems to be that
                    > Moore writing anything but superheroes is crap.

                    It's more that this was written for the one super-hero-focussed
                    column in the magazine that this approach was taken, one imagines. I
                    read it a few months ago when the issue actually came out, but IIRC, his
                    personal opinion that Moore's 80s work often took a specific structural
                    focus that benefitted the final product was genuinely earned. One might
                    not agree with it, but it's an arguable reading.
                  • smoky man
                    take a look here: http://emmatinker.oxalto.co.uk/thesis/ smok!
                    Message 9 of 28 , Jan 8, 2010
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                    • smoky man
                      Here a preview: http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/01/12/avatar-plug-of-the-week-alan-moore-and-jacen-burrows-neonomicon/ smok!
                      Message 10 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                        Here a preview:

                        http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/01/12/avatar-plug-of-the-week-alan-moore-and-jacen-burrows-neonomicon/


                        smok!:)

                      • Michael Norwitz
                        ... Thanks. Look like Moore doing a Lovecraft pastiche on automatic. Doubt I ll be bothering with this one. When they do that Fashion Beast thing I will pay
                        Message 11 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                          On Jan 15, 2010, at 4:00 AM, smoky man wrote:

                          Here a preview:

                          Thanks.  Look like Moore doing a Lovecraft pastiche on automatic.  Doubt I'll be bothering with this one. When they do that Fashion Beast thing I will pay attention.
                        • Michael Thomsen
                          It s certainly being taken seriously by other comics critics: http://www.metabunker.dk/?p=2270#more-2270 To: alanmoore@yahoogroups.com From: mute@tpg.com.au
                          Message 12 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                            It's certainly being taken seriously by other comics critics:

                            http://www.metabunker.dk/?p=2270#more-2270


                            To: alanmoore@yahoogroups.com
                            From: mute@...
                            Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2010 13:03:21 +1100
                            Subject: Re: [alanmoore] Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks

                             


                            On Thu, Jan 1st, 1970 at 10:00 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@earthlink. net>
                            wrote:

                            > I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish.
                            > I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print
                            > media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and
                            > anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

                            How does this reconcile with the article being reprinted from the
                            300th issue of a print journal, then?

                            > >>It's the "one theory" approach. I have found a key and it unlocks
                            > all doors. With respect to Moore, his bottom line seems to be that
                            > Moore writing anything but superheroes is crap.

                            It's more that this was written for the one super-hero-focussed
                            column in the magazine that this approach was taken, one imagines. I
                            read it a few months ago when the issue actually came out, but IIRC, his
                            personal opinion that Moore's 80s work often took a specific structural
                            focus that benefitted the final product was genuinely earned. One might
                            not agree with it, but it's an arguable reading.



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                          • K. A. Laity
                            ³Other comics critics²? a random panel of five who only chose ³the year¹s best comics criticism hosted at The Hooded Utilitarian² and in all likelihood
                            Message 13 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                              Re: Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks “Other comics critics”? a random panel of five who only chose “the year’s best comics criticism hosted at The Hooded Utilitarian” and in all likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular press. I would refer to “serious” comics critics as also appearing in journals like IJOCA, Image/Text, etc ( http://comicsresearch.org/periodicals.html).


                              On 1/15/10 9:33 AM, "Michael Thomsen" <mtxxforum@...> corresponded:   

                              It's certainly being taken seriously by other comics critics:

                              http://www.metabunker.dk/?p=2270#more-2270


                              * * * By the by, although credited here, I did NOT write the paragraph appearing below

                              On Thu, Jan 1st, 1970 at 10:00 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@...>
                              wrote:

                              > I couldn't get anymore than halfway through that incoherant rubbish.
                              > I guess these sorts of articles are why Alan Moore profers print
                              > media for Dodgem Logic: there's too little quality control online and
                              > anyone can and does 'publish' utter garbage.

                               
                              =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
                              Unikirja [Dreambook] by K. A. Laity
                              http://tinyurl.com/unikirja
                              "full of fluent style and poetic dialogue" - Clive Barker

                            • Michael Thomsen
                              well maybe. I m no expert. Nevertheless that list still points out some good recent pieces on comics for those who missed them. “Other comics critics”? a
                              Message 14 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                                well maybe. I'm no expert. Nevertheless that list still points out some good recent pieces on comics for those who missed them.




                                 
                                “Other comics critics”? a random panel of five who only chose “the year’s best comics criticism hosted at The Hooded Utilitarian” and in all likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular press. I would refer to “serious” comics critics as also appearing in journals like IJOCA, Image/Text, etc ( http://comicsresear ch.org/periodica ls.html).





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                              • Pádraig Ó Méalóid
                                Some preview pages available here: http://issuu.com/avatarpress/docs/neonomiconhornbook   Avatar kindly sent me a pdf of the whole thing, and it really does
                                Message 15 of 28 , Jan 15, 2010
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                                  Some preview pages available here: http://issuu.com/avatarpress/docs/neonomiconhornbook
                                   
                                  Avatar kindly sent me a pdf of the whole thing, and it really does look like excellent stuff. I know Alan has been cautious about it in interviews - especially as I was the one doing the interviews! - but I'm really looking forward to seeing this when they finally publish it, which unfortunately is not until August, when it'll come out as four regular sized comics.
                                   
                                  Best,
                                  Padraig

                                  My LiveJournals:
                                  http://slovobooks.livejournal.com/
                                  http://glycon.livejournal.com/
                                  Http://reviewsnthings.livejournal.com/

                                  --- On Fri, 15/1/10, Michael Thomsen <mtxxforum@...> wrote:

                                  From: Michael Thomsen <mtxxforum@...>
                                  Subject: RE: [alanmoore] Re: Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks
                                  To: "alanmooregroup" <alanmoore@yahoogroups.com>
                                  Date: Friday, 15 January, 2010, 17:36

                                   
                                  well maybe. I'm no expert. Nevertheless that list still points out some good recent pieces on comics for those who missed them.




                                   
                                  “Other comics critics”? a random panel of five who only chose “the year’s best comics criticism hosted at The Hooded Utilitarian” and in all likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular press. I would refer to “serious” comics critics as also appearing in journals like IJOCA, Image/Text, etc ( http://comicsresear ch.org/periodica ls.html).





                                  Keep your friends updated— even when you’re not signed in.

                                • Chris
                                  On Sat, Jan 16th, 2010 at 2:03 AM, K. A. Laity ... How many copies per issue do IJOCA distribute, to mark them as less popular than
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Jan 17, 2010
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                                    On Sat, Jan 16th, 2010 at 2:03 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@...>
                                    wrote:

                                    > and in all
                                    > likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular press.

                                    How many copies per issue do IJOCA distribute, to mark them as less
                                    popular than TCJ? (And does the fact that the founder, publisher and EIC
                                    of IJOCA is a TCJ contributor taint him as being worthlessly popular, or
                                    not?)
                                  • K. A. Laity
                                    Where did I ever imply that anything was ³worthlessly popular²? Does anyone actually read the words that I type? All I said was that both the selection
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Jan 18, 2010
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                                      Re: Re: Re: Re: Moore and the Age of Geeks Where did I ever imply that anything was “worthlessly popular”? Does anyone actually read the words that I type? All I said was that both the selection committee and the net they threw were small, thus hardly indicative of “best” so much as “best of the small amount of things we looked at.”

                                      K


                                      On 1/17/10 8:44 PM, "Chris" <mute@...> corresponded:


                                      On Sat, Jan 16th, 2010 at 2:03 AM, "K. A. Laity" wrote:

                                      > and in all
                                      > likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular press.

                                      How many copies per issue do IJOCA distribute, to mark them as less
                                      popular than TCJ? (And does the fact that the founder, publisher and EIC
                                      of IJOCA is a TCJ contributor taint him as being worthlessly popular, or
                                      not?)
                                       
                                      =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
                                      Unikirja [Dreambook] by K. A. Laity
                                      http://tinyurl.com/unikirja
                                      "full of fluent style and poetic dialogue" - Clive Barker

                                    • Chris
                                      And how much smaller is IJOCA than TCJ? On Tue, Jan 19th, 2010 at 9:28 AM, K. A. Laity
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Jan 18, 2010
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                                        And how much smaller is IJOCA than TCJ?


                                        On Tue, Jan 19th, 2010 at 9:28 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@...>
                                        wrote:

                                        > Where did I ever imply that anything was ³worthlessly popular²? Does
                                        > anyone
                                        > actually read the words that I type? All I said was that both the
                                        > selection
                                        > committee and the net they threw were small, thus hardly indicative
                                        > of
                                        > ³best² so much as ³best of the small amount of things we looked at.²
                                        >
                                        > K
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > On 1/17/10 8:44 PM, "Chris" <mute@...> corresponded:
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > On Sat, Jan 16th, 2010 at 2:03 AM, "K. A. Laity" wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > >> > and in all
                                        > >> > likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular
                                        > press.
                                        > >
                                        > > How many copies per issue do IJOCA distribute, to mark them as
                                        > less
                                        > > popular than TCJ? (And does the fact that the founder, publisher
                                        > and EIC
                                        > > of IJOCA is a TCJ contributor taint him as being worthlessly
                                        > popular, or
                                        > not?)
                                        >
                                        > =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
                                        > Unikirja [Dreambook] by K. A. Laity
                                        > http://tinyurl.com/unikirja
                                        > "full of fluent style and poetic dialogue" - Clive Barker
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                      • Kate Laity
                                        Let me be simple in my words. I was referring to the size of the sample, not the size of any particular journal. I do not have circulation stats at my
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Jan 18, 2010
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                                          Let me be simple in my words. I was referring to the size of the sample, not the size of any particular journal. I do not have circulation stats at my fingertips for any journal of any kind, popular, unpopular or middling.

                                          [Sent from Ianto, my iPod]

                                          On Jan 18, 2010, at 18:14, Chris <mute@...> wrote:

                                           


                                          And how much smaller is IJOCA than TCJ?

                                          On Tue, Jan 19th, 2010 at 9:28 AM, "K. A. Laity" <klaity@earthlink. net>
                                          wrote:

                                          > Where did I ever imply that anything was ³worthlessly popular²? Does
                                          > anyone
                                          > actually read the words that I type? All I said was that both the
                                          > selection
                                          > committee and the net they threw were small, thus hardly indicative
                                          > of
                                          > ³best² so much as ³best of the small amount of things we looked at.²
                                          >
                                          > K
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > On 1/17/10 8:44 PM, "Chris" <mute@.... au> corresponded:
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > On Sat, Jan 16th, 2010 at 2:03 AM, "K. A. Laity" wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > >> > and in all
                                          > >> > likelihood ignore actual comics criticism beyond the popular
                                          > press.
                                          > >
                                          > > How many copies per issue do IJOCA distribute, to mark them as
                                          > less
                                          > > popular than TCJ? (And does the fact that the founder, publisher
                                          > and EIC
                                          > > of IJOCA is a TCJ contributor taint him as being worthlessly
                                          > popular, or
                                          > not?)
                                          >
                                          > =+=+=+=+=+=+ =+=+=
                                          > Unikirja [Dreambook] by K. A. Laity
                                          > http://tinyurl. com/unikirja
                                          > "full of fluent style and poetic dialogue" - Clive Barker
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >

                                        • Chris
                                          ... But if TCJ printed fewer copies of (say) #299 than IJOCA did of (say) v10.2, TCJ would still be the popular press ? (Just curious!)
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Jan 18, 2010
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                                            On Tue, Jan 19th, 2010 at 10:21 AM, Kate Laity <klaity@...> wrote:

                                            > Let me be simple in my words. I was referring to the size of the
                                            > sample, not the size of any particular journal. I do not have
                                            > circulation stats at my fingertips for any journal of any kind,
                                            > popular, unpopular or middling.

                                            But if TCJ printed fewer copies of (say) #299 than IJOCA did of
                                            (say) v10.2, TCJ would still be "the popular press"?

                                            (Just curious!)
                                          • K. A. Laity
                                            ³Popular² as in appealing to a popular audience ‹ as opposed to academic or scholarly. ... (Just curious!) Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Moore and Living in the Age
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Jan 18, 2010
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                                              Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Moore and Living in the Age of Geeks “Popular” as in appealing to a popular audience — as opposed to academic or scholarly.

                                              On 1/18/10 8:47 PM, "Chris" <mute@...> corresponded:

                                              On Tue, Jan 19th, 2010 at 10:21 AM, Kate Laity <klaity@... <mailto:klaity%40earthlink.net> > wrote:

                                              > Let me be simple in my words. I was referring to the size of the  
                                              > sample, not the size of any particular journal. I do not have  
                                              > circulation stats at my fingertips for any journal of any kind,  
                                              > popular, unpopular or middling.

                                              But if TCJ printed fewer copies of (say) #299 than IJOCA did of
                                              (say) v10.2, TCJ would still be "the popular press"?

                                              (Just curious!)
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