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Re: [agile-usability] Agile vs. Creativity

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  • Mike Dwyer
    While stfu mat be a bit on the harsh side to describe the way most any good designer (of anything) would act, It is one way to tell when a person is over
    Message 1 of 118 , Dec 6, 2009
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      While 'stfu' mat be a bit on the harsh side to describe the way most any good designer (of anything) would act, It is one way to tell when a person is over their head.
      At the same time people with no clue, who insist thinking their opinion has equal weight as a professional, can elicit the same response from most sainted practitioner.
      I suggest adopting the same approach a local mechanic has for his rates.
      80.00 @ hour if he fixes the problem.
      60.00 @ hour if you answer his questions with useful information.
      90.00 @ hour if you want to learn how to fix it yourself.
      300.00 @ hour if you need it done your way.
      The phone number of another shop if you get to reverse his approach.

      Works for him and for those of us who like the way ours cars run.

      Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T


      From: Ron Jeffries <ronjeffries@...>
      Date: Sun, 6 Dec 2009 11:02:37 -0500
      To: <agile-usability@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: Re: [agile-usability] Agile vs. Creativity

       

      Hello, glen. On Sunday, December 6, 2009, at 9:54:18 AM, you
      wrote:

      > Well, having worked directly these systems since the early 1990's
      > I have sat weekly in the CAM meetings with the System Engineering,
      > UI, and Human Factors, and Verification and Test of the operability folks.

      > So maybe a bit of knowledge that might be useful to the conversation.

      Yes. Your example is one of ongoing collaboration working well.
      That's what I would expect also, of course.

      There is a recurring meme here that suggests that designers are
      special, and should be allowed to "go off" and figure out the whole
      design, and then bring it back to the camp to be produced. The
      sub-text often seems to be "we are designers and we know what's good
      and you ordinary people should STFU".

      I think that is a mistaken paradigm and that almost every example of
      good design will be found to be a product of designers
      /collaborating actively/ with the rest of the product team, not a
      result of stone tablets of design from on high.

      So I am asking for /counterexamples/ to the examples you have given
      and to the thing I expect, where good design collaborates as part of
      the team.

      If there is actually a case for "let me go off and design, and then
      I'll bring it back and you can just use it", I'd like to hear about
      an example where it worked. My guess is that there are few, if any.

      Ron Jeffries
      www.XProgramming. com
      www.xprogramming. com/blog
      If you don't push something beyond its boundary of usefulness
      how do you find where that boundary is? -- Martin Fowler

    • mark schraad
      I ve been called pedantic on occasion. I m ok with that ; )
      Message 118 of 118 , Dec 10, 2009
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        I've been called pedantic on occasion. I'm ok with that ; )

        On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 6:56 PM, Jeff Patton <jpatton@...> wrote:
         

        On Dec 6, 2009, at 12:22 AM, mark schraad wrote:

        Jeff,


        I run with a few definitions of design. When Alan Cooper (I can hear the cackles rise) came to talk with us a while back he spoke of differentiating the design of code (structure), from the design of the application, which is of course much different that designing labels and graphics for functionality.

        For me separating different kinds of design starts to get a bit tedious.  When you think about it, it's like night and day - which although you can tell me to the second when sunrise or sunset is, it's a pretty academic discussion when it's still light outside.  OK, bad metaphor - my point is that all design decision run together.  They just do.  Giving precise definitions for one type or another doesn't seem to help people make better decisions in practice. 

        Reading "the oatmeal" has put me in a strange mood.  Yes I am the mother-f**ing pterodactyl: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/ptero



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