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Re: [agile-usability] Partial Progress

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  • Alexander Johannesen
    ... That only works until a point. ... We re doing this already. The problem is the size of projects, the type of management, and the processes already in
    Message 1 of 62 , Aug 30, 2006
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      On 8/31/06, William Pietri <william@...> wrote:
      > You realize you can keep it secret, right?

      That only works until a point.

      ...

      > Most waterfall project plans I've seen are works of fiction anyhow, so
      > wrapping some of that around a more fact-centered agile process strikes
      > me as a step forward.

      We're doing this already. The problem is the size of projects, the
      type of management, and the processes already in place which we all
      are expected to follow. All of this is stuff one can deal with.
      Something far more problematic is people who are not convinced agile
      stuff is the right thing to do. If you can hide your work from them,
      then great, but there is this notion of teamwork going on here that
      requires a certain ... mediation to old progroms.


      Alex
      --
      "Ultimately, all things are known because you want to believe you know."
      - Frank Herbert
      __ http://shelter.nu/ __________________________________________________
    • William Pietri
      ... Which, honestly, I don t think is unreasonable. From the perspective of the waterfall person, all problems can be solved with a little more planning, and
      Message 62 of 62 , Aug 31, 2006
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        Alexander Johannesen wrote:
        > If you can hide your work from them,
        > then great, but there is this notion of teamwork going on here that
        > requires a certain ... mediation to old progroms.
        >

        Which, honestly, I don't think is unreasonable. From the perspective of
        the waterfall person, all problems can be solved with a little more
        planning, and failing to plan it all up front looks dangerous and the
        fast route to failure. Until you have seen it work, it's easy to believe
        that agile processes are impossible. I sure did.

        When dealing with people like that I'll generally try one of two
        approaches. The first is "Well, let's try an experiment." We find some
        level of risk that they are comfortable with and try out agile methods
        in that context. If the experiment is a success, we try a bigger experiment.

        The other is, "You do what you think it takes." If they want a big spec,
        then sure, they can write one up as we have our discussions around the
        product. If they think a continuously updated spec is important, then
        great, they should keep updating it. If they want a big MS Project
        thingy, fine, we'll make sure all the necessary data is on our wall of
        cards.

        I don't know if those are helpful to you, but they've worked for me.

        William
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