Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

RE: [agile-usability] follow the leader

Expand Messages
  • Ignacio Facello
    I haven t used Excel much, but I remember having the opposite problem -- I am editing a cell, and left-right moves the caret in the text. How do I go to the
    Message 1 of 22 , Nov 4, 2005
      I haven't used Excel much, but I remember having the opposite problem -- I am
      editing a cell, and left-right moves the caret in the text. How do I go to the
      previous cell?
      And also, I had the problem the OP described. It all depended on what I was
      doing, which was frustrating. I think Excel should behave the same no matter
      what you were doing -- whether left moves the caret or changes cell, I wouldn't
      care, I would get used to it. What bothers me is the different behaviour with no
      significant visual cue that you are in a different mode.

      Quoting "Desilets, Alain" <alain.desilets@...>:

      > -- Alain:
      > It's interesting that you would write this. What you are describing
      > above is in all respects equivalent to MS Excel defining <Left> as
      > meaning "move to the previous cell". In a spreadsheet context, moving
      > from one cell to an adjacent cell is more frequent than moving from one
      > character to an adjacent one. Yet, while you loved the fact that Uedit
      > assigned word navigation to the <Left> key, you hate the fact that Excel
      > assigns cell navigation to the <Left> key. OK, Excel does not even have
      > a separate key sequences (ex: <Ctr>+<Left>) for moving to the previous
      > character, but I gather that your annoyance was caused by the fact that
      > Excel overrode the standard meaning of <Left>.
      >
      > So there must be something else that bothers you about the way MS Excel
      > supports cell vs character navigation with arrow keys. What is it?
      > ----



      Internet Banda Ancha Todo el Dia desde $u 490 por mes!
      ______________________________________________________
      http://www.internet.com.uy - En Uruguay somos internet
    • Phlip
      ... Now there s an example of slick usability that did everything _wrong_ by todays standards. Everyone nowadays does Object- Action. First you select the
      Message 2 of 22 , Nov 4, 2005
        Jon Kern wrote:

        > Lotus 1-2-3

        Now there's an example of slick usability that did everything _wrong_
        by todays standards.

        Everyone nowadays does Object->Action. First you select the object,
        then you pick an action. Example: Select some cells, then Copy them.

        In Lotus 1-2-3, you declare Copy, and get a Cell Selector Mode to pick
        the cells to copy.

        So the amazing thing was this got useful and intuitive, after you
        start using it.

        --
        Phlip
        http://www.greencheese.org/ZeekLand <-- NOT a blog!!
      • Phlip
        ... It s because Microsoft invented it! Snarl! Drool! Drool! (Uh, the principle of least surprise might also apply...) -- Phlip
        Message 3 of 22 , Nov 4, 2005
          Desilets, Alain wrote:

          > So there must be something else that bothers you about the way MS Excel
          > supports cell vs character navigation with arrow keys. What is it?

          It's because Microsoft invented it! Snarl! Drool! Drool!

          (Uh, the principle of least surprise might also apply...)

          --
          Phlip
          http://www.greencheese.org/ZeekLand <-- NOT a blog!!
        • Phlip
          ... The CUA sez it should be . ... Arrow to a cell and start typing alpha without . You are still in arrow among cells mode , not text edit
          Message 4 of 22 , Nov 4, 2005
            Ignacio Facello wrote:


            > I haven't used Excel much, but I remember having the opposite problem
            > -- I am
            > editing a cell, and left-right moves the caret in the text. How do I go to the
            > previous cell?

            The CUA sez it should be <Shift+Tab>.

            > And also, I had the problem the OP described. It all depended on what I was
            > doing, which was frustrating.

            Arrow to a cell and start typing alpha without <F2>. You are still in
            "arrow among cells mode", not "text edit mode", and the system allows
            you to enter text essentially as a "convenience".

            > What bothers me is the different behaviour with no
            > significant visual cue that you are in a different mode.

            Not at all. The frame around the cell goes from a focus-style to an
            edit field frame style.

            Can't you tell? ;-)

            --
            Phlip
            http://www.greencheese.org/ZeekLand <-- NOT a blog!!
          • Anthony Williams
            ... XEmacs does this, and I presume emacs does too. Anthony -- Anthony Williams Software Developer Just Software Solutions Ltd
            Message 5 of 22 , Dec 16, 2005
              Phlip <phlip2005@...> writes:

              > On UEdit, when you type off the end of a window, the caret would
              > scroll to the center of the window. This is the correct behavior, and
              > I never saw any editor since use it.

              XEmacs does this, and I presume emacs does too.

              Anthony
              --
              Anthony Williams
              Software Developer
              Just Software Solutions Ltd
              http://www.justsoftwaresolutions.co.uk
            • Desilets, Alain
              ... XEmacs does this, and I presume emacs does too. -- Alain: Yes it does, and I HATE it (eventhough I have been using Emacs for 12 years). Whenever the screen
              Message 6 of 22 , Dec 16, 2005
                > On UEdit, when you type off the end of a window, the caret would
                > scroll to the center of the window. This is the correct behavior, and
                > I never saw any editor since use it.

                XEmacs does this, and I presume emacs does too.

                -- Alain:
                Yes it does, and I HATE it (eventhough I have been using Emacs for 12
                years). Whenever the screen jumps like that, I completely loose my sense
                of where I am within the buffer.
                ----
              • Anthony Williams
                ... Interesting. I never really noticed until I read Phlip s message, despite the fact that I use XEmacs all the time (including writing this email). But then,
                Message 7 of 22 , Dec 16, 2005
                  "Desilets, Alain" <alain.desilets@...> writes:

                  >> On UEdit, when you type off the end of a window, the caret would
                  >> scroll to the center of the window. This is the correct behavior, and
                  >> I never saw any editor since use it.
                  >
                  > XEmacs does this, and I presume emacs does too.
                  >
                  > -- Alain:
                  > Yes it does, and I HATE it (eventhough I have been using Emacs for 12
                  > years). Whenever the screen jumps like that, I completely loose my sense
                  > of where I am within the buffer.
                  > ----

                  Interesting. I never really noticed until I read Phlip's message, despite the
                  fact that I use XEmacs all the time (including writing this email). But then,
                  I'm particularly good at keeping my place when the text moves --- I can read
                  whilst scrolling the buffer at a reasonable pace (e.g. when hunting through
                  a long list of search results for something relevant).

                  I can see the benefit of not having the text jump around whilst you're
                  working, but if it doesn't, then the cursor is almost always at the bottom of
                  the window, which strikes me as less than ideal.

                  Anthony
                  --
                  Anthony Williams
                  Software Developer
                  Just Software Solutions Ltd
                  http://www.justsoftwaresolutions.co.uk
                • Desilets, Alain
                  Interesting. I never really noticed until I read Phlip s message, despite the fact that I use XEmacs all the time (including writing this email). But then, I m
                  Message 8 of 22 , Dec 16, 2005
                    Interesting. I never really noticed until I read Phlip's message,
                    despite the fact that I use XEmacs all the time (including writing this
                    email). But then, I'm particularly good at keeping my place when the
                    text moves --- I can read whilst scrolling the buffer at a reasonable
                    pace (e.g. when hunting through a long list of search results for
                    something relevant).

                    -- Alain:
                    I'm a very spatially challenged person. I get lost rapidly when my
                    environment keeps changing dynamically.
                    ----
                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.