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Scripting for Testers

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  • Brian Marick
    Thanks for all who commented. It will be hard to winnow the suggestions down to a thin book. (People are much more likely to buy a thin book, I bet.) ...
    Message 1 of 87 , Feb 18, 2005
      Thanks for all who commented. It will be hard to winnow the suggestions
      down to a thin book. (People are much more likely to buy a thin book, I
      bet.)

      Some random comments:

      >
      > emacs vs vi
      > where to put the curly braces
      > perl vs python vs ruby

      Emacs. Not where Kernighan and Ritchie do. Ruby.

      Can't devote more room to those, else I won't have room to tackle
      salvation by works vs. salvation by grace, the proper disposition of
      the West Bank, evolution vs. Intelligent Design, and whether
      soft-boiled eggs should be opened on the big vs. little end. (Little.
      Obviously.)

      > On this topic, as an avowed Pythonista, I think that while Brian's
      > goals are laudable, he should name the book "Ruby Scripting for
      > Testers". I agree wholeheartedly with the goals of the book and I think
      > it's a very necessary and long-due book on this topic. The only goal I
      > don't agree with 100% is #3: "Push Ruby toward being the tester's
      > language (which is going to require some catching up with Python and
      > Perl in terms of libraries). "

      Provisional title is _Scripting for Testers Using Ruby_. I think it's
      unfair to expect the target audience to learn more than one scripting
      language, I think there's a global advantage to encouraging
      testers-who-might-produce-widely-useful-code to throw their weight
      behind one language rather than leave efforts diffuse among three, and
      I'm unabashed about pushing for my favorite language (after Lisp) to be
      that one so long as it's a reasonable choice.

      That said, I'm always careful to lay out the possibilities when I'm
      working with clients. My usual recommendation is that the testers use
      whatever scripting language most of the programmers know but, if that
      language is Perl, they be aware of the maintenance costs and learning
      curve.

      > Excellent! I know in our 'neck of the woods' a capture/replay device
      > is required for most people. It's a 'barrier to entry' for a lot of
      > the people do web app testing.

      If, by the time people get through the introductory example,
      capture/replay is a barrier to entry, I will have failed. (The replay
      part in particular: capture can be a handy way to figure out what's
      behind the pretty pixels.)

      > Note to Brian: Explain that XML is not the be-all and end-all of
      > manual data
      > formats. Then explain it's the easiest place to start, modulo your tool
      > quality. Then use it _correctly_, with XPath for queries, and XSLT for
      > transformations.

      I'll use XML instead of YAML as my concession to reality and penance
      for not talking about Perl. It will be hard not to launch into my old
      Lisp programmer's rant about how all the people who thought writing
      programs in tree structures with parentheses was unreadable now think
      writing data in tree structures with angle brackets and keyword
      arguments and quotes is somehow just the cat's pajamas. XPath:
      definitely. XSLT: Oh dear.

      -----
      Brian Marick, independent consultant
      Mostly on agile methods with a testing slant
      www.exampler.com, www.testing.com/cgi-bin/blog
      Book in progress: www.exampler.com/book
    • Frank Cohen
      Hi Brian: I m glad to see that you are going on Scripting for Testers. Please count on me as a reviewer when the time comes. I m also happy to give you a
      Message 87 of 87 , Mar 3, 2005
        Hi Brian: I'm glad to see that you are going on Scripting for Testers.
        Please count on me as a reviewer when the time comes. I'm also happy to
        give you a perspective on testing from a script writer (Jython, Java,
        Web) perspective. Feel free to put me on your list at
        fcohen@.... Thanks and good luck. -Frank


        On Feb 16, 2005, at 9:23 AM, Brian Marick wrote:

        >
        > At long last, I'm going to buckle down and write that _Scripting for
        > Testers_ book. You can tell me what should be in it. Current plans are
        > here:
        > <http://www.testing.com/cgi-bin/blog/2005/02/16#scripting-for-testers>
        > Thanks.
        >
        > -----
        > Brian Marick, independent consultant
        > Mostly on agile methods with a testing slant
        > www.exampler.com, www.testing.com/cgi-bin/blog
        > Book in progress: www.exampler.com/book
        >
        >
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        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
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        ---
        Frank Cohen, PushToTest, http://www.PushToTest.com, phone: 408 374 7426
        Author of "Java Testing and Design: From Unit Tests to Automated Web
        Tests"
        from Prentice Hall, details at http://thebook.pushtotest.com
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