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Brief hello and a quick question to ponder.

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  • goldlion973
    Hi there, glad to have found you guys have been scouring the net for facts, journals and info on the Abramelin Op for a while now... well... since my renewed
    Message 1 of 4 , Jan 1, 2010
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      Hi there, glad to have found you guys have been scouring the net for facts, journals and info on the Abramelin Op for a while now... well... since my renewed intrest in the operation. Am currently 2=9 with a Golden Dawn group and am planning for the ritual soon after my passing the outer order.

      That was the introduction, now the question 8)

      There are now two versions or translations of the operation and most seem to take to one over the other namely the 6 month operation over the 18... am not sure if anyone here has done the full 18 month version but if so what's the diffrence? I mean, if I can drive and take the motorway to my destination why would I chance a walk?

      Personally hoping to do the 18 month version so the question isn't personal but dosent one translation mark the other as redundant and if not then dosent the other then make its counterpart seem long winded and unessary?

      Ie; Are people talking from the same page after having done either?

      Thats the question 8) Have another on evoking the angelic counterparts of the demonic forces... the Abramelin op as a complete system of white magick rather than, "grey". Have read on someone who considers the evokation (subduing) of negative forces to be a blind... will save it for the next topic.

      Opinions?

      Peace
      GD
    • Athena
      At a guess the person who said it is a blind hasn t actually performed the operation, correct? From my experiences I would say the 6 month version is
      Message 2 of 4 , Jan 1, 2010
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        At a guess the person who said it is a blind hasn't actually performed the operation, correct?

        From my experiences I would say the 6 month version is equivalent to running straight up a mountain; whereas the 18 month version is equivalent to taking switchbacks.  If you can do the 18 month version I recommend it.  I also think more people would actually be able to complete the 18 month one as it spreads the difficult stuff out more.  If you check through the archives we have discussed this a few times.  I don't think one translation/version discounts the other.  Some are of this opinion, but personally I don't think so.

        Athena
        --
        www.enochian.org

        On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 7:50 PM, goldlion973 <goldlion973@...> wrote:
         


        Hi there, glad to have found you guys have been scouring the net for facts, journals and info on the Abramelin Op for a while now... well... since my renewed intrest in the operation. Am currently 2=9 with a Golden Dawn group and am planning for the ritual soon after my passing the outer order.

        That was the introduction, now the question 8)

        There are now two versions or translations of the operation and most seem to take to one over the other namely the 6 month operation over the 18... am not sure if anyone here has done the full 18 month version but if so what's the diffrence? I mean, if I can drive and take the motorway to my destination why would I chance a walk?

        Personally hoping to do the 18 month version so the question isn't personal but dosent one translation mark the other as redundant and if not then dosent the other then make its counterpart seem long winded and unessary?

        Ie; Are people talking from the same page after having done either?

        Thats the question 8) Have another on evoking the angelic counterparts of the demonic forces... the Abramelin op as a complete system of white magick rather than, "grey". Have read on someone who considers the evokation (subduing) of negative forces to be a blind... will save it for the next topic.

        Opinions?

        Peace
        GD




        --
        Odo cicle qaa
        --
        www.enochian.org

        "When a thing is hidden away with so much pains, merely to repeal it is to destroy it." Tertullian
      • David Stolowitz
        I agree with Athena s assessment. I would also add though that Abraham recommends periods of retreat and contemplation AFTER the operation as well. For
        Message 3 of 4 , Jan 2, 2010
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          I agree with Athena's assessment. I would also add though that Abraham recommends periods of retreat and contemplation AFTER the operation as well. For example, after the week of summonings and oaths that completes the formal operation, you are to take a break for awhile before you begin utilizing and experimenting with your new authority and powers. Also Abraham recommends a yearly holiday in commemoration of your operation's success.

          I think the thing to remember is that the operation itself is not the end-all be-all. As Brother Rufus has been trying to explain to people recently, you are not going to walk away from this thing as an enlightened master with all power in the universe (Although you will have a newly cemented connection to the Source and the power that flows from that). So with that in mind, plan (as much as one can plan such a process) according to your station in life, your goals, what's reasonable, etc. This is actually a great opportunity to pursue studies and practices that you've always wanted to do but "never had the time". Its a once-in-a-lifetime period, so use it well. But at the same time, know that you will be learning a lot after the formal operation as well, so don't feel like you have to do it all.

          The negative forces are not a blind. Certainly, the allure of magical power is a primary motivator for people doing this operation, but you discover something greater along the way. Its not a blind so much as an advertising trick :) The spirits and squares contain the means to practically apply the connections and wisdom you acquire in the course of the angelic consummation. The thing I have discovered is that these spirits have power over everything temporal and temporary. Alone they run amok - reigned in, they can provide a platform for something holy, but even then its with the knowledge that they can never create something of permanence.

          There's a lot of talk back and forth on the various groups about whether these spirits are good, evil, material, etc. My take is that it is their nature to demonstrate the nature of material reality in such a way as to point the way to Mastery for humans. Rufus says they lead people back to God by forcing people to face up to their limitations. I would also like to draw attention to the traditional Tarot image of the Devil - he holds up a large mirror that reveals our ugliness, as well as the chains by which we are bound. Black magic is, essentially, the magic of Maya/Illusion. Everything in this illusory world is under its power in one form or another. Its not that its evil so much as it is demonstrative of the nature of our world and existence. It points the way to God and Eternity by demonstrating the great AYN - The NOT - the Negative Veil of Existence. Socrates stated that Truth is only known through negative contrast - we can know what it isn't, but not what it is, because positives only have meaning in contrast to negatives. That which is Transcendent is self-sufficient and cannot be defined, much less contained.

          Keep in mind also that you will establish contacts with all the various angelic and mixed powers during the operation as well. Many of the squares depend on their powers, though the lesser spirits are used to apply and enforce them.

          David
        • goldlion973
          Sorry... didn t read this until now, thanks David... man this yahoo groups thing is confusing, you d think they d make it more user friendly huh? .lol.
          Message 4 of 4 , Jan 4, 2010
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            Sorry... didn't read this until now, thanks David... man this yahoo groups thing is confusing, you'd think they'd make it more user friendly huh? .lol.

            --- In abramelin@yahoogroups.com, "David Stolowitz" <david@...> wrote:
            >
            > I agree with Athena's assessment. I would also add though that Abraham recommends periods of retreat and contemplation AFTER the operation as well. For example, after the week of summonings and oaths that completes the formal operation, you are to take a break for awhile before you begin utilizing and experimenting with your new authority and powers. Also Abraham recommends a yearly holiday in commemoration of your operation's success.
            >
            > I think the thing to remember is that the operation itself is not the end-all be-all. As Brother Rufus has been trying to explain to people recently, you are not going to walk away from this thing as an enlightened master with all power in the universe (Although you will have a newly cemented connection to the Source and the power that flows from that). So with that in mind, plan (as much as one can plan such a process) according to your station in life, your goals, what's reasonable, etc. This is actually a great opportunity to pursue studies and practices that you've always wanted to do but "never had the time". Its a once-in-a-lifetime period, so use it well. But at the same time, know that you will be learning a lot after the formal operation as well, so don't feel like you have to do it all.
            >
            > The negative forces are not a blind. Certainly, the allure of magical power is a primary motivator for people doing this operation, but you discover something greater along the way. Its not a blind so much as an advertising trick :) The spirits and squares contain the means to practically apply the connections and wisdom you acquire in the course of the angelic consummation. The thing I have discovered is that these spirits have power over everything temporal and temporary. Alone they run amok - reigned in, they can provide a platform for something holy, but even then its with the knowledge that they can never create something of permanence.
            >
            > There's a lot of talk back and forth on the various groups about whether these spirits are good, evil, material, etc. My take is that it is their nature to demonstrate the nature of material reality in such a way as to point the way to Mastery for humans. Rufus says they lead people back to God by forcing people to face up to their limitations. I would also like to draw attention to the traditional Tarot image of the Devil - he holds up a large mirror that reveals our ugliness, as well as the chains by which we are bound. Black magic is, essentially, the magic of Maya/Illusion. Everything in this illusory world is under its power in one form or another. Its not that its evil so much as it is demonstrative of the nature of our world and existence. It points the way to God and Eternity by demonstrating the great AYN - The NOT - the Negative Veil of Existence. Socrates stated that Truth is only known through negative contrast - we can know what it isn't, but not what it is, because positives only have meaning in contrast to negatives. That which is Transcendent is self-sufficient and cannot be defined, much less contained.
            >
            > Keep in mind also that you will establish contacts with all the various angelic and mixed powers during the operation as well. Many of the squares depend on their powers, though the lesser spirits are used to apply and enforce them.
            >
            > David
            >
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