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Re: [a_film_by] Yvonne Rainer

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  • Fred Camper
    ... The KEY one, and I think this is especially true for auteurists who love melodrama as opposed to deconstructivists for whom Godard is a bit old-fashioned,
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 11 10:10 AM
      Dan Sallitt wrote:

      >>.
      >>
      >>
      >>Yvonne's a teriffic filmmaker.
      >>
      >>
      >
      >Would you care to recommend any individual films?
      >
      The KEY one, and I think this is especially true for auteurists who love
      melodrama as opposed to deconstructivists for whom Godard is a bit
      old-fashioned, is "Film About a Woman Who...." A deeply personal film
      about rejection and a suicide attempt (inspired, I believe, by an
      incident in her own life), it's both incredibly emotional and a film
      that uses titles and spoken texts to decenter the autobiographical self
      in a way that points the way to the "theory" underpinning her later work
      but also illuminates the pathos of a self that defines herself in terms
      of others, that is, men.

      The floating titles and text and fragmented images all create something
      quite moving, I think, and "getting" this film is a key to seeing the
      deeply emotional subtexts of films like "The Man Who Loved Women." The
      emotional subtext is clearer in "Journeys From Berlin/1971," my other
      favorite.

      If there are defenders of "MURDER & murder" I'd like to hear from them.

      A suggestion, especially for those of us who have been left in the dust
      by the number of posts here: please, when you change the subject line,
      indicate the previous one: "Yvonne Rainer (was: Guzetti)" etc. Using the
      search function to read prior posts, I can confirm that Petric is
      retired; he still lives in Cambridge, though.

      - Fred C.
    • Dan Sallitt
      ... I enjoyed this film. Is there any source that gives the cast members? I can t find one on the net. - Dan
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 11 9:52 PM
        > The KEY one, and I think this is especially true for auteurists who love
        > melodrama as opposed to deconstructivists for whom Godard is a bit
        > old-fashioned, is "Film About a Woman Who...." A deeply personal film
        > about rejection and a suicide attempt (inspired, I believe, by an
        > incident in her own life), it's both incredibly emotional and a film
        > that uses titles and spoken texts to decenter the autobiographical self
        > in a way that points the way to the "theory" underpinning her later work
        > but also illuminates the pathos of a self that defines herself in terms
        > of others, that is, men.

        I enjoyed this film. Is there any source that gives the cast members?
        I can't find one on the net. - Dan
      • Fred Camper
        Dan Sallitt wrote: I enjoyed this film. Is there any source that gives the cast members? I can t find one on the net From The Films of Yvonne Rainer, by
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 12 6:15 AM
          Dan Sallitt wrote:

          "I enjoyed this film. Is there any source that gives the cast members?
          I can't find one on the net"


          From "The Films of Yvonne Rainer," by Yvonne Rainer (Bloomington and
          Indianapolis: Indiana University Press, 1989):

          "With Dempster Leech, Shirley Soffer, John Erdman, Renfreu Neff

          and James Barth, Epp Kotkas, Sarah Soffer, Yvonne Rainer, Tannis
          Hugill,, Valda Setterfield"

          The cinematographer is of course the superb Babette Mangolte.

          This is a useful book with a couple of good essays, an interview, and
          (the bulk of the book) scripts of her first five films.

          - Fred C.
        • Dan Sallitt
          ... I ve now seen FILM ABOUT A WOMAN WHO... and JOURNEYS FROM BERLIN - had a bigger response to the former, but was interested in both. The Rainer series is
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 12 8:04 PM
            > The KEY one, and I think this is especially true for auteurists who love
            > melodrama as opposed to deconstructivists for whom Godard is a bit
            > old-fashioned, is "Film About a Woman Who...."

            > The floating titles and text and fragmented images all create something
            > quite moving, I think, and "getting" this film is a key to seeing the
            > deeply emotional subtexts of films like "The Man Who Loved Women." The
            > emotional subtext is clearer in "Journeys From Berlin/1971," my other
            > favorite.

            I've now seen FILM ABOUT A WOMAN WHO... and JOURNEYS FROM BERLIN - had a
            bigger response to the former, but was interested in both. The Rainer
            series is underway: would Fred, David, or any other Rainer fans like to
            prioritize the rest of her work, as I won't be able to catch everything?
            Thanks in advance. - Dan
          • Fred Camper
            Dan asks for Rainer s films in order of preference: My personal order of preference (pasting in titles from IMDB): Film About a Woman Who... (1974) Journeys
            Message 5 of 8 , Jun 12 8:39 PM
              Dan asks for Rainer's films in order of preference:

              My personal order of preference (pasting in titles from IMDB):

              Film About a Woman Who... (1974)
              Journeys From Berlin/1971 (1980)
              Lives of Performers (1972)
              Man Who Envied Women, The (1985)
              Kristina Talking Pictures (1976)
              MURDER and murder (1996)

              I like all of these to some degree except for MURDER & murder. As I said
              before, I'd like to hear a defense of this. And though this wouldn't
              usually kill a film for me, the "romantic" scene in which one woman
              fingers another seems utterly ridiculous. The avant-garde has never been
              very good at convincing "narrative" long takes meant to convey emotion,

              There's one that I've not seen, Privilege (1990). Some of her other
              partisans are somewhat mixed on it.

              - Fred C.
            • David Ehrenstein
              Don t miss Lives of Performers or Privilege ... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Friends. Fun. Try the all-new Yahoo! Messenger.
              Message 6 of 8 , Jun 12 8:55 PM
                Don't miss "Lives of Performers" or "Privilege"

                --- Dan Sallitt <sallitt@...> wrote:
                > > The KEY one, and I think this is especially true
                > for auteurists who love
                > > melodrama as opposed to deconstructivists for whom
                > Godard is a bit
                > > old-fashioned, is "Film About a Woman Who...."
                >
                > > The floating titles and text and fragmented images
                > all create something
                > > quite moving, I think, and "getting" this film is
                > a key to seeing the
                > > deeply emotional subtexts of films like "The Man
                > Who Loved Women." The
                > > emotional subtext is clearer in "Journeys From
                > Berlin/1971," my other
                > > favorite.
                >
                > I've now seen FILM ABOUT A WOMAN WHO... and JOURNEYS
                > FROM BERLIN - had a
                > bigger response to the former, but was interested in
                > both. The Rainer
                > series is underway: would Fred, David, or any other
                > Rainer fans like to
                > prioritize the rest of her work, as I won't be able
                > to catch everything?
                > Thanks in advance. - Dan
                >
                >





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              • Jonathan Rosenbaum
                ... other ... I consider it the major turning point in her work--the point at which she became seriously political. Though I also agree with you that the
                Message 7 of 8 , Jun 12 11:14 PM
                  > There's one that I've not seen, Privilege (1990). Some of her
                  other
                  > partisans are somewhat mixed on it.
                  >
                  > - Fred C.


                  I consider it the major turning point in her work--the point at
                  which she became seriously political. Though I also agree with you
                  that the earlier stuff may be better, at least in other respects.
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