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When does our purchase count the most?

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  • mara_papimer
    I while ago I asked a question to see if it really mattered where we bought our yuri now I would like to ask when buying our yuri makes the most difference.
    Message 1 of 8 , Jan 6, 2013
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      I while ago I asked a question to see if it really mattered where we bought our yuri now I would like to ask when buying our yuri makes the most difference.

      Obviously pre-ordering something is the best but if anyone knows how sales are tallied and what would be the point after release when a persons purchase would still be worth something on judging wow successful a book or other media is.

      I ask this is importing from outside your country of residence is best done in bulk and so it is sensible to wait until you have a decent list but at the same time I want to ensure that I support the sales of what I buy in the most effective way. If I know how long I can wait after the release of the book I can effectively plan my imports better.

      I assume many on this mailing list would feel the same way as we are dealing with very niche areas were every sale counts.

      Cheers in advance for any information.
    • Erica Friedman
      That s a terrific question. The real answer is Japanese companies don t pay the slightest bit of attention to overseas sales. Let s take something low-range
      Message 2 of 8 , Jan 6, 2013
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        That's a terrific question. The real answer is "Japanese companies don't pay the slightest bit of attention to overseas sales."

        Let's take something low-range like Hayate x Blade. A volume released in Japan might sell something like 12,000 copies. In the entirety of the rest of the world put together it's selling 2-3000.

        One Piece sells 4 million copies a volume in Japan alone, and how many thousands in the rest of the world?

        Fate/Zero sells 40K copies in Japan, I don't even know how many here, but probably closer to dozens at the price.

        You get the point, right? Sales of anime and manga overseas are such a ridiculously small part of overall sales that Japanese companies have no real interest in overseas audiences. That's why they contract with distribution companies to handle the issues of localization/printing/distribution. They make money on the license and don't have to deal with the costs or the issues of the local economy. In effect, overseas sales are pin money and no more.

        So, frankly, the few copies of anything we buy makes so little difference, it doesn't matter how you purchase them. "Collectors" has sold, oh, about 10 copies through my links to it. Let's be generous and say 40 other people bought it, not through my links. That's 50 overseas sales. It might make a difference if JManga was pushing Hakusensha to license books, but they can't, because Hakusensha's got an exclusive contract with Viz in America. So those 50 sales (and remember, I'm over-estimating generously with that number) is probably no more than a curiosity.

        Cheers, 

         Erica 

        Yuricon - "For real women who like their women...animated." http://www.yuricon.org 
        Hungry for Yuri? Have some Okazu: http://okazu.blogspot.com"World Shaking" Fanfic - http://www.worldshaking.net 


        > To: Yuricon@yahoogroups.com
        > From: in_the_name_of_union7@...
        > Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 17:18:08 +0000
        > Subject: [Yuricon] When does our purchase count the most?
        >
        > I while ago I asked a question to see if it really mattered where we bought our yuri now I would like to ask when buying our yuri makes the most difference.
        >
        > Obviously pre-ordering something is the best but if anyone knows how sales are tallied and what would be the point after release when a persons purchase would still be worth something on judging wow successful a book or other media is.
        >
        > I ask this is importing from outside your country of residence is best done in bulk and so it is sensible to wait until you have a decent list but at the same time I want to ensure that I support the sales of what I buy in the most effective way. If I know how long I can wait after the release of the book I can effectively plan my imports better.
        >
        > I assume many on this mailing list would feel the same way as we are dealing with very niche areas were every sale counts.
        >
        > Cheers in advance for any information.
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
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      • mara_papimer
        Thank you very much for you fast and comprehensive reply. Sadly while it was informative it missed the main focus of my question. I assume this is due to my
        Message 3 of 8 , Jan 6, 2013
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          Thank you very much for you fast and comprehensive reply.

          Sadly while it was informative it missed the main focus of my question. I assume this is due to my inappropriate wording and use of examples and I apologise.

          The main piece of information that I needed was how soon after release are sales numbers collated. In any country for many mediums, hence the placement on the mailing list as I assumed that would take information form at least a few people. How long is a property given after release to prove itself to be 'successful'?

          If I may offer different examples.

          "Penguin Drum" as it is called in the US has been released in the US. I however need to import it as it will probably never reach the UK. Although my purchase will only be an invisible dot of a single sale in terms of total sales but I would like it to count for all it can.

          I bought the Simoun complete collection late last year long after it came out. I can not imagine that my purchase counted much towards Simoun's success at that point.

          So this is not about buying things from Japan it really is about all our niche purchases and how we can make the market for the thinks we like look as profitable as possible.

          My appoligies again for essentially re-posting my question but I did not wish it to end at simply Japanese manga sales as that is not all I buy.

          Thank you again.

          Mara

          --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, Erica Friedman wrote:
          >
          >
          > That's a terrific question. The real answer is "Japanese companies don't pay the slightest bit of attention to overseas sales."
          > Let's take something low-range like Hayate x Blade. A volume released in Japan might sell something like 12,000 copies. In the entirety of the rest of the world put together it's selling 2-3000.
          > One Piece sells 4 million copies a volume in Japan alone, and how many thousands in the rest of the world?
          > Fate/Zero sells 40K copies in Japan, I don't even know how many here, but probably closer to dozens at the price.
          > You get the point, right? Sales of anime and manga overseas are such a ridiculously small part of overall sales that Japanese companies have no real interest in overseas audiences. That's why they contract with distribution companies to handle the issues of localization/printing/distribution. They make money on the license and don't have to deal with the costs or the issues of the local economy. In effect, overseas sales are pin money and no more.
          > So, frankly, the few copies of anything we buy makes so little difference, it doesn't matter how you purchase them. "Collectors" has sold, oh, about 10 copies through my links to it. Let's be generous and say 40 other people bought it, not through my links. That's 50 overseas sales. It might make a difference if JManga was pushing Hakusensha to license books, but they can't, because Hakusensha's got an exclusive contract with Viz in America. So those 50 sales (and remember, I'm over-estimating generously with that number) is probably no more than a curiosity.
          > Cheers,
          > Erica
          > Yuricon - "For real women who like their women...animated."
          > http://www.yuricon.org Hungry for Yuri? Have some Okazu: http://okazu.blogspot.com
          >
          > "World Shaking" Fanfic - http://www.worldshaking.net
          >
          > > To: Yuricon@yahoogroups.com
          > > From: in_the_name_of_union7@...
          > > Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 17:18:08 +0000
          > > Subject: [Yuricon] When does our purchase count the most?
          > >
          > > I while ago I asked a question to see if it really mattered where we bought our yuri now I would like to ask when buying our yuri makes the most difference.
          > >
          > > Obviously pre-ordering something is the best but if anyone knows how sales are tallied and what would be the point after release when a persons purchase would still be worth something on judging wow successful a book or other media is.
          > >
          > > I ask this is importing from outside your country of residence is best done in bulk and so it is sensible to wait until you have a decent list but at the same time I want to ensure that I support the sales of what I buy in the most effective way. If I know how long I can wait after the release of the book I can effectively plan my imports better.
          > >
          > > I assume many on this mailing list would feel the same way as we are dealing with very niche areas were every sale counts.
          > >
          > > Cheers in advance for any information.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------------------
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
        • Erica Friedman
          Distribution companies cannot see past pre-orders, because of the state of distribution here in the US. Pre-orders determine how many copies all distributors
          Message 4 of 8 , Jan 6, 2013
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            Distribution companies cannot see past pre-orders, because of the state of distribution here in the US. Pre-orders determine how many copies all distributors order, so strong pre-orders are critical. Sales after that are nice and contribute to "sales over lifetime" but if you want to make you purchase count, make it a pre-order.



            Cheers,Erica

            Yuricon - "For real women who like their women...animated." http://www.yuricon.org 
            Hungry for Yuri? Have some Okazu: http://okazu.blogspot.com "World Shaking" Fanfic - http://www.worldshaking.net 



            > To: Yuricon@yahoogroups.com
            > From: in_the_name_of_union7@...
            > Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 22:11:54 +0000
            > Subject: [Yuricon] Re: When does our purchase count the most?
            >
            > Thank you very much for you fast and comprehensive reply.
            >
            > Sadly while it was informative it missed the main focus of my question. I assume this is due to my inappropriate wording and use of examples and I apologise.
            >
            > The main piece of information that I needed was how soon after release are sales numbers collated. In any country for many mediums, hence the placement on the mailing list as I assumed that would take information form at least a few people. How long is a property given after release to prove itself to be 'successful'?
            >
            > If I may offer different examples.
            >
            > "Penguin Drum" as it is called in the US has been released in the US. I however need to import it as it will probably never reach the UK. Although my purchase will only be an invisible dot of a single sale in terms of total sales but I would like it to count for all it can.
            >
            > I bought the Simoun complete collection late last year long after it came out. I can not imagine that my purchase counted much towards Simoun's success at that point.
            >
            > So this is not about buying things from Japan it really is about all our niche purchases and how we can make the market for the thinks we like look as profitable as possible.
            >
            > My appoligies again for essentially re-posting my question but I did not wish it to end at simply Japanese manga sales as that is not all I buy.
            >
            > Thank you again.
            >
            > Mara
            >
            > --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, Erica Friedman wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > That's a terrific question. The real answer is "Japanese companies don't pay the slightest bit of attention to overseas sales."
            > > Let's take something low-range like Hayate x Blade. A volume released in Japan might sell something like 12,000 copies. In the entirety of the rest of the world put together it's selling 2-3000.
            > > One Piece sells 4 million copies a volume in Japan alone, and how many thousands in the rest of the world?
            > > Fate/Zero sells 40K copies in Japan, I don't even know how many here, but probably closer to dozens at the price.
            > > You get the point, right? Sales of anime and manga overseas are such a ridiculously small part of overall sales that Japanese companies have no real interest in overseas audiences. That's why they contract with distribution companies to handle the issues of localization/printing/distribution. They make money on the license and don't have to deal with the costs or the issues of the local economy. In effect, overseas sales are pin money and no more.
            > > So, frankly, the few copies of anything we buy makes so little difference, it doesn't matter how you purchase them. "Collectors" has sold, oh, about 10 copies through my links to it. Let's be generous and say 40 other people bought it, not through my links. That's 50 overseas sales. It might make a difference if JManga was pushing Hakusensha to license books, but they can't, because Hakusensha's got an exclusive contract with Viz in America. So those 50 sales (and remember, I'm over-estimating generously with that number) is probably no more than a curiosity.
            > > Cheers,
            > > Erica
            > > Yuricon - "For real women who like their women...animated."
            > > http://www.yuricon.org Hungry for Yuri? Have some Okazu: http://okazu.blogspot.com
            > >
            > > "World Shaking" Fanfic - http://www.worldshaking.net
            > >
            > > > To: Yuricon@yahoogroups.com
            > > > From: in_the_name_of_union7@...
            > > > Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 17:18:08 +0000
            > > > Subject: [Yuricon] When does our purchase count the most?
            > > >
            > > > I while ago I asked a question to see if it really mattered where we bought our yuri now I would like to ask when buying our yuri makes the most difference.
            > > >
            > > > Obviously pre-ordering something is the best but if anyone knows how sales are tallied and what would be the point after release when a persons purchase would still be worth something on judging wow successful a book or other media is.
            > > >
            > > > I ask this is importing from outside your country of residence is best done in bulk and so it is sensible to wait until you have a decent list but at the same time I want to ensure that I support the sales of what I buy in the most effective way. If I know how long I can wait after the release of the book I can effectively plan my imports better.
            > > >
            > > > I assume many on this mailing list would feel the same way as we are dealing with very niche areas were every sale counts.
            > > >
            > > > Cheers in advance for any information.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ------------------------------------
            > > >
            > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yuricon/
            >
            > <*> Your email settings:
            > Individual Email | Traditional
            >
            > <*> To change settings online go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yuricon/join
            > (Yahoo! ID required)
            >
            > <*> To change settings via email:
            > Yuricon-digest@yahoogroups.com
            > Yuricon-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
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            > Yuricon-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
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            >
          • EricaF
            Quick follow up to my comment from yesterday. Today on Twitter Ed Chavez from Vertical Publishing said this: obviously stores are influenced by demand, which
            Message 5 of 8 , Jan 7, 2013
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              Quick follow up to my comment from yesterday.

              Today on Twitter Ed Chavez from Vertical Publishing said this: "obviously stores are influenced by demand, which is why *preorders are what matter the most* for projects like this" (emphasis mine)

              As I said, your order counts most as a Pre-order. High pre-order demand means higher stock order and longer shelf life of a book.

              This is a hideous relic of a previous age of book/comic selling, but it is a publisher's reality. If there are no pre-orders, no one will ever see the book on the shelf as a walk-in. If you want a book, pre-ordering it means that you'll make it easier for someone who has never heard of that book to randomly find it on the shelf. But there is no way for you, an interested party, to not pre-order it, then be sure of finding it on the shelf when you want it to be there.

              For publishers it's pre-order or die.

              Cheers,

              Erica


              Cheers,

              Erica
            • EricaF
              To see another publisher other than me explaining all the same stuff, check out Ed s thread here: https://twitter.com/Vertical_Ed/status/288347408948133888
              Message 6 of 8 , Jan 7, 2013
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                To see another publisher other than me explaining all the same stuff, check out Ed's thread here: https://twitter.com/Vertical_Ed/status/288347408948133888

                Cheers,

                Erica
              • mara_papimer
                Wow. Thank you for such a extensive answer. This genuinely will at the very least change how I order books in the future, the only down side is that I do most
                Message 7 of 8 , Jan 7, 2013
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                  Wow. Thank you for such a extensive answer. This genuinely will at the very least change how I order books in the future, the only down side is that I do most of my ordering online and from a bookstore that has no physical shop anymore.

                  --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, "EricaF" wrote:
                  >
                  > To see another publisher other than me explaining all the same stuff, check out Ed's thread here: https://twitter.com/Vertical_Ed/status/288347408948133888
                  >
                  > Cheers,
                  >
                  > Erica
                  >
                • Erica Friedman
                  You are most welcome. I also do almost all of my ordering online. The only local Barnes & Noble is useless for ordering. They don t do it well, or at all. Ed s
                  Message 8 of 8 , Jan 7, 2013
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                    You are most welcome.

                    I also do almost all of my ordering online. The only local Barnes & Noble is useless for ordering. They don't do it well, or at all.

                    Ed's whole feed today was full of eye-opening numbers.

                    Cheers,Erica

                    Yuricon - "For real women who like their women...animated." http://www.yuricon.org 
                    Hungry for Yuri? Have some Okazu: http://okazu.blogspot.com "World Shaking" Fanfic - http://www.worldshaking.net 



                    > To: Yuricon@yahoogroups.com
                    > From: in_the_name_of_union7@...
                    > Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 20:44:15 +0000
                    > Subject: [Yuricon] Re: When does our purchase count the most?
                    >
                    > Wow. Thank you for such a extensive answer. This genuinely will at the very least change how I order books in the future, the only down side is that I do most of my ordering online and from a bookstore that has no physical shop anymore.
                    >
                    > --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, "EricaF" wrote:
                    > >
                    > > To see another publisher other than me explaining all the same stuff, check out Ed's thread here: https://twitter.com/Vertical_Ed/status/288347408948133888
                    > >
                    > > Cheers,
                    > >
                    > > Erica
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yuricon/
                    >
                    > <*> Your email settings:
                    > Individual Email | Traditional
                    >
                    > <*> To change settings online go to:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yuricon/join
                    > (Yahoo! ID required)
                    >
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