Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: Yuricon Mailing List Policy - Please Read

Expand Messages
  • EricaF
    ... I think these are different situations. Moore said that he didn t want to be associated with any movies made by DC. However... He had previously signed
    Message 1 of 9 , Jul 24, 2011
      --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, Rei Shaw <rei.shaw@...> wrote:
      >

      > >> I suppose that all depends on perspective, is the artist always right?
      > Just for arguements sake, Alan Moore hates having any of his work adapted to
      > movies, yet in terms of the work he did for DC Comics he has no say, and
      > films have been made of several of his creations. It's an example of an
      > artist thinking that something is bad but it still happening, in that
      > context it's totally legal so is anyone in the wrong there?

      I think these are different situations.
      Moore said that he didn't want to be associated with any movies made by DC. However...

      He had previously signed agreements that allowed media companies to make those movies so whether he wanted them to or not, it was a moot issue. He was certainly within his rights to state that he had nothing to do with the movies and did not wnat to be associated from them (and, I believe, he donates a great deal of the proceeds from them to local charities.) Is DC "ethically wrong"? Perhaps. If you believe that a creator's wishes at the moment surpass the agreements they signed previously. It's not in DC's best interests to be ethical in this case, so The Watchmen was made. It was in Moore's best interest *at the time* to sign that contract, and he didn't consider buying the rights back from DC, so he lost out on trying to put his new best interests forward.

      In Toboso's case, or Nakamura's, no agreements of any kind have been made and scanlators have no rights of any kind to the material they are appropriating. In these cases, the creator is right, full stop. Scanlators have absolutely no viable claim to own what they distribute. When a manga artist says "stop, please, this upsets me" the only ethical thing to do is to stop.

      Cheers,

      Erica
    • Rei Shaw
      ... I do recognize how they are different situations, I was simply talking about the artists intent arguement in and of itself... There are many other
      Message 2 of 9 , Jul 24, 2011
        In Toboso's case, or Nakamura's, no agreements of any kind have been made and scanlators have no rights of any kind to the material they are appropriating. In these cases, the creator is right, full stop. Scanlators have absolutely no viable claim to own what they distribute. When a manga artist says "stop, please, this upsets me" the only ethical thing to do is to stop.

        Cheers,

        Erica


        I do recognize how they are different situations, I was simply talking about the "artists intent" arguement in and of itself... There are many other situations where things are done against an artists wishes Which are not in the legal grey zone of scanlations and fansubs... that was the point I was trying to make.

        I'm not saying I disagree with you, I'm just saying I can understand that there are reasons why they might continue and still feel they're in the right.  They might feel that in the long run they are helping the artist out because fans will buy merchandise etc. If I was scanlating something and the creator asked me to stop, I would... but I can understand dissenting points of view.

        But again when it becomes a harassment issue, they loose any moral high ground they might try to claim.

      • EricaF
        ... The ethicality of companies making decisions based on exploitative contracts is a whole topic of discussion on many sites. ^_^ There really isn t a grey
        Message 3 of 9 , Jul 25, 2011
          --- In Yuricon@yahoogroups.com, Rei Shaw <rei.shaw@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > I do recognize how they are different situations, I was simply talking about
          > the "artists intent" arguement in and of itself... There are many other
          > situations where things are done against an artists wishes Which are not in
          > the legal grey zone of scanlations and fansubs... that was the point I was
          > trying to make.

          The ethicality of companies making decisions based on exploitative contracts is a whole topic of discussion on many sites. ^_^

          There really isn't a "grey zone" in the case of scanlations. All there is is the lack of creators knowing about it or feeling that they have any power to approach overseas illicit distributors. Most "ethical" scanltors know perfectly well thatmanga artists don't like scans, but waiting until they are actively told to stop by threat from company, lawyers or manga artists is hardly a "grey zone," really


          > But again when it becomes a harassment issue, they loose any moral high ground they might try to claim.

          Yes, there is that.

          I will repeat - I completely, totally sympathize with the frustration fans feel in not being able to get what they want. (I don't sympathize with fans who want it for free. That is simply childish selfishness.)

          I support the companies, the editors, artists, printers and distributors that make manga possible buy buying as much as I can. And so do *many* Yuricon members and Okazu readers. I'm very proud of all of you who do support the industry to the best of your ability. I also am with you all in wanting a system that provides a reasonably priced digital delivery system for translated manga, so we can all read what we want. I'm hoping that MangaReborn and JManga.com will be those solutions so that we can get what we want and still support the creators.

          Cheers,

          Erica
        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.