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Re: [WorldTransport] TransMilenio/Metro comarisons/benchmarks

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  • Elaine Fletcher
    I don t have the time or resources to undertake such a project right now, but for anyone who is interested, one possible comparison would be with the recently
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 28, 2001
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      I don't have the time or resources to undertake such a project right now,
      but for anyone who is interested, one possible comparison would be with the
      recently completed Cairo metro system. Since Cairo is so badly polluted with
      vehicle emissions, comparisons of emissions savings would also be very
      relevant.

      Elaine Fletcher
      Jerusalem


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Eric Britton <eric.britton@...>
      To: alt-transp@... <alt-transp@...>; sustran-discuss@...
      <sustran-discuss@...>; transport-partnerships@...
      <transport-partnerships@...>; WTP&P List
      <WorldTransport@yahoogroups.com>
      Date: éåí ùéùé 12 àå÷èåáø 2001 17:56
      Subject: [WorldTransport] TransMilenio/Metro comarisons/benchmarks


      >In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest TransMilenio ridership
      >results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now carrying on onto
      something
      >on the order of 600k people a day on 38 kms of busway. Hmm.
      >
      >Now suppose they had instead decided two years back to build a metro.
      Where
      >would they be today? How much would they have spent? How many passengers
      >would they have already transported? What positive impact on the env would
      >that choice have had on the city.
      >
      >Which brings up a suggested little project for anyone who has the wit, time
      >and desire to give this a whack. Namely, the construction of a "time line"
      >and a series of order of magnitude benchmarks which would compare say their
      >TransMilenio project with a recently completed metro in a Third World city.
      >Year by year comparisons of what happens and what impacts are achieved.
      And
      >$ by $. This could be very trenchant and useful indeed.
      >
      >For more on the TM side, you can contact Oscar at diazoe@... or
      >(212) 629-80001.
      >
      >I am sure that we would all be very eager to see how this works out. And
      >grateful.
      >
      >With all good wishes,
      >Eric Britton
      >
      >The @New Mobility Forum is permanently at http://newmobility.org
      >The Commons __ technology, economy, society__
      >Le Frene, 8/10 rue Joseph Bara, 75006 Paris, France
      >Day phone: +331 4326 1323 Mobile: +336 80 96 78 79
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      >
      >
      >The Journal of World Transport Policy & Practice
      >For more information: http://ecoplan.org/wtpp
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    • Eric Britton
      In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest TransMilenio ridership results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now carrying on onto something on the
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 12, 2001
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        In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest TransMilenio ridership
        results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now carrying on onto something
        on the order of 600k people a day on 38 kms of busway. Hmm.

        Now suppose they had instead decided two years back to build a metro. Where
        would they be today? How much would they have spent? How many passengers
        would they have already transported? What positive impact on the env would
        that choice have had on the city.

        Which brings up a suggested little project for anyone who has the wit, time
        and desire to give this a whack. Namely, the construction of a "time line"
        and a series of order of magnitude benchmarks which would compare say their
        TransMilenio project with a recently completed metro in a Third World city.
        Year by year comparisons of what happens and what impacts are achieved. And
        $ by $. This could be very trenchant and useful indeed.

        For more on the TM side, you can contact Oscar at diazoe@... or
        (212) 629-80001.

        I am sure that we would all be very eager to see how this works out. And
        grateful.

        With all good wishes,
        Eric Britton

        The @New Mobility Forum is permanently at http://newmobility.org
        The Commons __ technology, economy, society__
        Le Frene, 8/10 rue Joseph Bara, 75006 Paris, France
        Day phone: +331 4326 1323 Mobile: +336 80 96 78 79
        24 hour Fax/Voicemail hotline: +331 5301 2896
        IP Videoconference: Ils.austin.polycom.com The Commons
        Email: ecoplan.adsl@... URL www.ecoplan.org
      • J.H. Crawford
        Good morning, One thing I would like to see in such an assessment would be the long-term externalized costs of both systems. I d prefer not to lose sight of
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 14, 2001
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          Good morning,

          One thing I would like to see in such an assessment would be
          the long-term externalized costs of both systems. I'd prefer
          not to lose sight of the fact that the externalized costs of
          a metro system are almost certainly going to be lower than for
          a metro. A densely-exploited metro system does not impose as
          large a noise, danger, and pollution burden as an on-street BRT
          system. In cases where you're moving upwards of 30,000 of riders
          per hour, you're in the realm in which a metro really starts
          to make sense, even if you can't afford it right now.

          Regards,

          J.H. Crawford

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Eric Britton <eric.britton@...>
          To: alt-transp@... <alt-transp@...>; sustran-discuss@...
          <sustran-discuss@...>; transport-partnerships@...
          <transport-partnerships@...>; WTP&P List
          <WorldTransport@yahoogroups.com>
          Date: éåí ùéùé 12 àå÷èåáø 2001 17:56
          Subject: [WorldTransport] TransMilenio/Metro comarisons/benchmarks


          >In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest TransMilenio ridership
          >results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now carrying on onto
          something
          >on the order of 600k people a day on 38 kms of busway. Hmm.
          >
          >Now suppose they had instead decided two years back to build a metro.
          Where
          >would they be today? How much would they have spent? How many passengers
          >would they have already transported? What positive impact on the env would
          >that choice have had on the city.
          >
          >Which brings up a suggested little project for anyone who has the wit, time
          >and desire to give this a whack. Namely, the construction of a "time line"
          >and a series of order of magnitude benchmarks which would compare say their
          >TransMilenio project with a recently completed metro in a Third World city.
          >Year by year comparisons of what happens and what impacts are achieved.
          And
          >$ by $. This could be very trenchant and useful indeed.
          >
          >For more on the TM side, you can contact Oscar at diazoe@... or
          >(212) 629-80001.
          >
          >I am sure that we would all be very eager to see how this works out. And
          >grateful.
          >
          >With all good wishes,
          >Eric Britton


          -- ### --

          J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
          postmaster@... Carfree.com
        • Oscar Edmundo Diaz
          I would like to share this numbers with you Metro Madrid Passengers/Kilometer 9,918 Metro Santiago Passengers/Kilometer 16,320 Metro Paris Passengers/Kilometer
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 14, 2001
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            I would like to share this numbers with you

            Metro Madrid Passengers/Kilometer 9,918
            Metro Santiago Passengers/Kilometer 16,320
            Metro Paris Passengers/Kilometer 16,564
            TransMilenio Bogotá Passengers/Kilometer 16,575

            Best,

            Oscar Edmundo Diaz
            diazoe@...
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Eric Britton
            To: alt-transp@... ; sustran-discuss@... ;
            transport-partnerships@... ; WTP&P List
            Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 11:31 AM
            Subject: [WorldTransport] TransMilenio/Metro comarisons/benchmarks


            In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest TransMilenio ridership
            results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now carrying on onto something
            on the order of 600k people a day on 38 kms of busway. Hmm.

            Now suppose they had instead decided two years back to build a metro. Where
            would they be today? How much would they have spent? How many passengers
            would they have already transported? What positive impact on the env would
            that choice have had on the city.

            Which brings up a suggested little project for anyone who has the wit, time
            and desire to give this a whack. Namely, the construction of a "time line"
            and a series of order of magnitude benchmarks which would compare say their
            TransMilenio project with a recently completed metro in a Third World city.
            Year by year comparisons of what happens and what impacts are achieved. And
            $ by $. This could be very trenchant and useful indeed.

            For more on the TM side, you can contact Oscar at diazoe@... or
            (212) 629-80001.

            I am sure that we would all be very eager to see how this works out. And
            grateful.

            With all good wishes,
            Eric Britton

            The @New Mobility Forum is permanently at http://newmobility.org
            The Commons __ technology, economy, society__
            Le Frene, 8/10 rue Joseph Bara, 75006 Paris, France
            Day phone: +331 4326 1323 Mobile: +336 80 96 78 79
            24 hour Fax/Voicemail hotline: +331 5301 2896
            IP Videoconference: Ils.austin.polycom.com The Commons
            Email: ecoplan.adsl@... URL www.ecoplan.org



            The Journal of World Transport Policy & Practice
            For more information: http://ecoplan.org/wtpp
            To post a message to group: wtpp@egroups.com
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          • Andrew Offenbacher
            Dear Friends, Greetings from Almaty, Kazakhstan! Although I m currently engaged in work outside the realm of transportation, someone may wish to undertake a
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 14, 2001
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              Dear Friends,

              Greetings from Almaty, Kazakhstan! Although I'm
              currently engaged in work outside the realm of
              transportation, someone may wish to undertake a study
              of the metro here at some time in the future. The
              construction of the (as-yet inoperative) metro here
              was begun before the collapse of the Soviet Union and
              was frozen due to lack of funding. It seems that
              there is a renewed interest in completing the project,
              and hopefully the project will be completed in the
              not-so-distant future. In the meantime, the air
              quality in the city leaves much to be desired as the
              number of private vehicles skyrockets. Fortunately,
              the nearby Tian-Shan mountains have plenty of fresh
              air and provide a much-needed refuge for the city
              dwellers.

              Best wishes to all,
              Andy




              --- Eric Britton <eric.britton@...> wrote:
              > In speaking with Oscar Diaz today about the latest
              > TransMilenio ridership
              > results in Bogota, he mentioned that they are now
              > carrying on onto something
              > on the order of 600k people a day on 38 kms of
              > busway. Hmm.
              >
              > Now suppose they had instead decided two years back
              > to build a metro. Where
              > would they be today? How much would they have
              > spent? How many passengers
              > would they have already transported? What positive
              > impact on the env would
              > that choice have had on the city.
              >
              > Which brings up a suggested little project for
              > anyone who has the wit, time
              > and desire to give this a whack. Namely, the
              > construction of a "time line"
              > and a series of order of magnitude benchmarks which
              > would compare say their
              > TransMilenio project with a recently completed metro
              > in a Third World city.
              > Year by year comparisons of what happens and what
              > impacts are achieved. And
              > $ by $. This could be very trenchant and useful
              > indeed.
              >


              =====
              Andrew Offenbacher
              Argonne National Laboratory
              Nonproliferation Graduate Program Representative
              Nuclear Technology Safety Center (Almaty, Kazakhstan)
              Office/Fax: 7(3272) 646803
              E-mail: aoffenbacher@...

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