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SV: WorldTransport Forum Congestion charging - A special WTPP number discussing through a few well written, evidence based articles. And you?

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  • martin.strid@vv.se
    A cyclist we met in Linköping takes a 10 minute ride to his work every day along a river framed by trees. He said this trip is the time of the day when his
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 27, 2006
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      A cyclist we met in Linköping takes a 10 minute ride to his work every day along a river framed by trees. He said this trip is the time of the day when his mind is refreshigita by birdsong and meditative silence and his lungs by cool pure air.
      What is the economic profit of shortening his everyday bike trip by, say, 5 minutes?
      # :-)
       


      Från: WorldTransport@yahoogroups.com [mailto:WorldTransport@yahoogroups.com] För Eric Britton
      Skickat: den 26 november 2006 14:39
      Till: WorldTransport@yahoogroups.com
      Ämne: WorldTransport Forum Congestion charging - A special WTPP number discussing through a few well written, evidence based articles. And you?

      From: John Whitelegg [mailto:j.whitelegg @btinternet. com]
      Sent:
      Saturday, November 25, 2006 12:31 PM
      To: Eric.Britton@ ecoplan.org
       

      Hi,

       

      First of all I would welcome this discussion in WTPP, advanced through a few well written, evidence based articles.  I will take this idea a step further if someone let's me have names, possible subjects and e-mail contact details.

       

      The subject is indeed fascinating but we all have to be very open to questioning the metrics we use.  I remember teaching transport at Lancaster University for many years and focussing on cost benefit analysis.  I'm sure methodologies have now moved on but at that time (1979-1993) it was quite possible to demonstrate that building very destructive new roads was "good" because the time savings multiplied up across thousands of car trips produced a big number described as monetary benefits and there was no method of describing or quantifying the impact of that traffic on nature, environment, climate change, children, health or elderly people trying to cross the road or the that matter the loss of independent child mobility in navigating and negotiating life in a city (see Hillman, Adams and Whitelegg, Policy Studies Institute, London, 1990)

       

      Congestion charging in London has led to large increases in bus use, walking and cycling which has a direct positive impact on public health (obesity, cardiovascular disease and early onset diabetes).  Its also much more pleasant to walk and cycle around London than it used to be.

       

      The Swedish vision zero road safety policy is based on rejecting the "economic model" and substituting an ethical basis for road safety interventions. 

       

      Let's get the arguments clearly articulated and out in the open.

       

      very best wishes

       

      John Whitelegg

      Editor

      WTPP

      ----- Original Message -----

      Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2006 8:35 AM

      Subject: This is I think rather interesting for you, us

       

      From: "Andrew Curry" <andrew.nextwave@ googlemail. com>
      Date: Fri Nov 24, 2006 7:46 pm
      Subject: Stockholm Congestion Pricing Scheme (Prof. Prud'homme showing a net social economic loss for the scheme, while Eliasson shows a net gain. )

       

       

      My economics isn't good enough to go through the detailed analysis.

      But what is striking about both calcuations is that neither attempts to include a figure for the social benefits of having less traffic in the city area (other than the direct social benefits such as reduced accidents and health impacts of reduced emissions.

      (And Remy Prudhomme does acknowledge that he hasn't analysed distributional effects).

      Yet the 'social gradient' of traffic, even in Sweden, is that richer people drive and poorer people suffer the effects of traffic - in terms of noise, lower community cohesion, perceived risk, etc. The same social gradient can be seen for more vulnerable members of the community (young, old, etc).

      Of course, this may be a way of saying that cost benefit analysis is a poor tool for dealing with social equity. And it may be worse: both calculations depend heavily on calculations of time saved and time lost, and looking at Eliasson there's a time calculation for car travellers (in which business and distribution time is regarded as more valuable than private journey time, but there doesn't seem to be any calculation for the time gains to people using other modes, as a result of reduced congestion. Some time seems to be more equal than others.

      It would be interesting to see an analysis of both papers by someone who was able to cover the economics and the underlying assumptions with an appropriate degree of expertise, although I suspect we'd see a  more interesting paper from a political economist than from a transport economist :-). One for the WTPP?

      Best

      Andrew

       

    • On Behalf Of Mark Dorney
      On Behalf Of Mark Dorney I m interested to learn of any published reports on bicycle travel time surveys anywhere, but especially any where the reported time
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 28, 2006
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        On Behalf Of Mark Dorney

        I'm interested to learn of any published reports on bicycle travel time

        surveys anywhere, but especially any where the reported time is a good

        average of the cycling population, taking into account the variation

        between cyclists.

         

        The small number of surveys I've unearthed do not seem to have considered

        this. Some even seem to base their cycle speed on one cyclist travelling

        the route once!

         

        Background info......

        My unit at work has been involved in the collection of travel time data on

        major arterial routes in south-east queensland for the last three years.

         

        We do peak hour comparisons between bus, car and rail. We do five runs on

        each of five days over the two hour peak period to create our average

        travel times for each route.

         

        Next year (2007) we'd like to include bicycle travel times for comparison.

        In some cases the bicycle travel will be on-road, in others on parallel

        off-road facilities. We're currently doing a pilot survey.

         

        For the same cyclist on different days, we don't expect there to be as

        much variation as for car. The bigger issue is probably the variation

        between cyclists.

         

        Cheerful Regards

        Mark Dorney

      • Jan Gehl
        Try to contact Landscape Architect Niels Jensen of the City of Copenhagen, Road & Parks department. He is in charge of Bicycle research and data collection
        Message 3 of 3 , Nov 28, 2006
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          Try to contact Landscape Architect Niels Jensen of the City of Copenhagen, Road & Parks department.
          He is in charge of Bicycle research and data collection
          warm greetings
          yours
          Jan Gehl

          Den 28/11/2006 kl. 9.50 skrev On@..., Behalf@..., Of@..., Mark@..., Dorney@...:

           

          On Behalf Of Mark Dorney

          I'm interested to learn of any published reports on bicycle travel time

          surveys anywhere, but especially any where the reported time is a good

          average of the cycling population, taking into account the variation

          between cyclists.

           

          The small number of surveys I've unearthed do not seem to have considered

          this. Some even seem to base their cycle speed on one cyclist travelling

          the route once!

           

          Background info......

          My unit at work has been involved in the collection of travel time data on

          major arterial routes in south-east queensland for the last three years.

           

          We do peak hour comparisons between bus, car and rail. We do five runs on

          each of five days over the two hour peak period to create our average

          travel times for each route.

           

          Next year (2007) we'd like to include bicycle travel times for comparison.

          In some cases the bicycle travel will be on-road, in others on parallel

          off-road facilities. We're currently doing a pilot survey.

           

          For the same cyclist on different days, we don't expect there to be as

          much variation as for car. The bigger issue is probably the variation

          between cyclists.

           

          Cheerful Regards

          Mark Dorney


          Jan Gehl, Arkitekt.m.a.a., Professor, Dr.Litt.,

          Damstien 27

          Dk 2720, Vanløse

          Denmark


          Home:  +45 38 71 31 12

          Office:   +45 32 950 951

          www.gehlarchitects.dk


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