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Re: State Schools??: SELFISH CHRISTIANS

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  • Bob Wynman
    Randist Bo7b aka Bob Wynman WWP Email Member (bobalou@wynman.com) What is relevant, Dennis, is that we respect individual life/property and live by the
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 1, 2013
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      Randist Bo7b aka Bob Wynman WWP Email Member (bobalou@...) What is relevant, Dennis, is that we respect individual life/property and live by the Non-Aggression Principle. Reliance on the coercive State violates both those principles.

      --bob & lou

      Dennis Helbig WWP Member Baha'i investigator and carpenter (helbigdennis@...) Separation of church and state is irrelevant. What is relevant is how we deal with each other. Why can't we let each other live lives as we choose without paying a tax or attending a "preferred school"? It is because we are afraid of the dark in which we can not see in any direction. Cowards, all of you are cowards, afraid of the boogieman in the dark.

      Randist Bo7b aka Bob Wynman WWP Email Member (bobalou@...) Neil, while I don't see atheism vs. religion as an important issue, I do sorta wonder, hopefully, if you're being a bit pessimistic with your estimate of "THIRTY SOME MILLION AMERICANS WHO ARE NON-BELIEVERS".

      That would be less than 10% of Americans. Surely more than 10% have noticed the inconsistencies & irresolvable contradictions & relative impossibilities involved in religion ... & many of the little kids are still too young to have been indoctrinated with lots of irrational beliefs, no?

      And, RE: "... RELIGIOUS PROPAGANDA BELONGS IN OUR PLEDGE, ON OUR MONEY OR IN OUR TAX SUPPORTED SCHOOLS AND/OR ANY OTHER TAX SUPPORTED PROPERTY AND/OR FUNCTION"

      --It's the TAX SUPPORTED SCHOOLS AND/OR ANY OTHER TAX SUPPORTED PROPERTY AND/OR FUNCTION that doesn't belong. I'm fine with religious propaganda as long no one's forced to pay for it via tax theft.

      If our goal is peace, prosperity and freedom, we must have separation of education and State [http://www.schoolandstate.org/home.htm%5d, health care and State, child care and State, charity and State & economics and State, as we should have separation of church and State ... and for the same reasons.

      Let's replace our coercive State with the "Natural Republic", in which all humans have 100% control of their lives and property. To do that, there must be a group of humans who thoroughly understand the solution. Please help as many of your thinking friends as possible purchase and listen multiple times to at least the first four sessions of Jay Stuart Snelson's V-50 lectures ... and preferably, the whole course .. available at http://www.cdbaby.com/Artist/JaySnelson.

      Please make a great 2013, y'all!
    • Dennis Helbig
      Reliance upon any type of state violates that principle. The state only exists to maintain the atmosphere of live and let live in peace. The state must remain
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 1, 2013
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        Reliance upon any type of state violates that principle. The state only
        exists to maintain the atmosphere of live and let live in peace. The state
        must remain aloof and neutral in the matters of personal preferences. The
        only reason the state got involved is because some people were afraid that
        Christian values were slipping, allowing slavery to continue. Then, as now,
        industry was flowing toward the South where labor was plentiful and growth
        was encouraged. And they feared that money value would soon exceed
        religious value, which it did. That is, where religious value indicates
        lifestyle rather than worship of God exclusively. Consider the success of
        the Amish community in an hostile environment. You cannot build a perfect
        society with money of any form used as a prime mover. That mentality always
        leads to disaster.
      • Dennis Helbig
        Dennis Helbig WWP Member Baha i investigator and carpenter (helbigdennis@gmail.com) I was doing a little study work for another group and ran across a
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 1, 2013
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          Dennis Helbig WWP Member Baha'i investigator and carpenter (helbigdennis@...) I was doing a little study work for another group and ran across a reference to Horeb, sometimes confused with Sinai. Says they might either be two completely different places or that Horeb was the mount and Sinai was something other. Seems both are ripe with alternative meanings.

          In Matityahu Clark's *Etymological Dictionary of Biblical Hebrew*, the root for Horev, "*Chorev*", (Hebrew: חרב, *Chet*, *Reish*, *Beit*) is related to the Hebrew word for sword *Cherev* (Hebrew: חרב) (again *Chet*, *Reish*, * Beit*) showing the meaning of *Chorev* being "desolation as after a mighty battle", where the root for Sinai being *Sineh* (*Samech*, *Nun*, *Hey*) relating to both "bush" and the idea "to fend off an attack". The relationship between "fend off" and "bush" being that this bush has thorns
          to in fact "fend off" its enemies. Both of these words tend to paint a word
          picture of a very desolate place that defends itself by the very rough
          terrain and thorny bushes that surround it.[

          So maybe you can see where the Law of Moses just might be a thorny bush, consumed in fire. With another verse stating that all must walk through the fire (of law?), perhaps we can come to a better understanding of the intent of the Bible to not be the total Law but something of a definition of law in that it has many thorns. The bigger th bush gets, the harder it is to get through it. The scripture in question is this the final episode of Malachi.

          "4 ¶ Remember the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded to him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments. 5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD; 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children and the heart of the children to their fathers before I come and smite the earth to ruin."

          If "in Horeb" then *Chorev* being "desolation as after a mighty battle". The aftermath of killing an erstwhile innocent man who dared pick up sticks to keep warm. All hail the son of god who brings law. Then they fashioned the Golden Calf in his honor.

          Dennis Helbig WWP Member Baha'i investigator and carpenter (helbigdennis@...) Reliance upon any type of state violates that principle. The state only> exists to maintain the atmosphere of live and let live in peace. The state> must remain aloof and neutral in the matters of personal preferences. The> only reason the state got involved is because some people were afraid that> Christian values were slipping, allowing slavery to continue. Then, as now, > industry was flowing toward the South where labor was plentiful and growth > was encouraged. And they feared that money value would soon exceed > religious value, which it did. That is, where religious value indicates > lifestyle rather than worship of God exclusively. Consider the success of > the Amish community in an hostile environment. You cannot build a perfect> society with money of any form used as a prime mover. That mentality always> leads to disaster.
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