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Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family

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  • hypergut
    To All: Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more refractor APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater. Can anyone clearly
    Message 1 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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      To All:

      Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
      "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.

      Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the various
      members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
      e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
      properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
      advantages?

      The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
      The other members are apochromats, correct?

      What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
      80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the new
      80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red temptress).
      Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?

      Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to others,
      why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
      Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?

      Curious Minds Want to Know!

      Robert in Hershey

      P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big newt:
      18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
      8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
      5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
      4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
    • starsearcheffort3
      ... Robert, Good question. I asked it here a week or so ago, what are the differences between the Megrez family and the Zenithstar family? Answer: nobody
      Message 2 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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        --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...> wrote:
        >
        > To All:
        >
        > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
        > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
        >
        > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the various
        > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
        > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
        > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
        > advantages?
        >
        > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
        > The other members are apochromats, correct?
        >
        > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
        > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the new
        > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red temptress).
        > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?
        >
        > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to others,
        > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
        > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?
        >
        > Curious Minds Want to Know!
        >
        > Robert in Hershey
        >
        > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big newt:
        > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
        > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
        > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
        > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
        >


        Robert,
        Good question.

        I asked it here a week or so ago, what are the differences between the
        Megrez "family" and the Zenithstar "family?"

        Answer: nobody knows.

        A FAQ is being considered but until that time your guess is as good
        as mine.

        But why would a web site want to make clear the differences between
        its two main product lines?

        And who would expect a users' group to know a recodite thing like that?
        Clear skies,
        Bill Meyers
      • williamopticsmarketing
        ZenithStar FD and Megrez FD both share the same APO optics, only difference is the tube. ZS FD is in its second and last batch (this is the famour Anniversary
        Message 3 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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          ZenithStar FD and Megrez FD both share the same APO optics, only
          difference is the tube.
          ZS FD is in its second and last batch (this is the famour Anniversary
          scope), preordering before the end of 2005 guarantees the promotional
          price of US$ 799.
          If there is any left in Jan. (and I am being honest, I am beginning
          to doubt it) price will be US$ 848, same as the Megrez version.



          --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...> wrote:
          >
          > To All:
          >
          > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
          > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
          >
          > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the
          various
          > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
          > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
          > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
          > advantages?
          >
          > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
          > The other members are apochromats, correct?
          >
          > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
          > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the
          new
          > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red temptress).
          > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?
          >
          > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to
          others,
          > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
          > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?
          >
          > Curious Minds Want to Know!
          >
          > Robert in Hershey
          >
          > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big
          newt:
          > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
          > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
          > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
          > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
          >
        • Timm Bottoni
          Hi, My honest opinion is that the Megrez line is painted white with gold trim, only 80mm, has been around longer, and has 3 options - Doublet Flourite, same
          Message 4 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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            Hi,

            My honest opinion is that the Megrez line is painted white with gold
            trim, only 80mm, has been around longer, and has 3 options - Doublet
            Flourite, same optics as the Zenithstar Fluorite Doublet that was red
            and is out of stock, has an ED triple, and has a Fluorite Triplet.

            The ZenithStar line is newer, and seems like its the way WO is
            moving, but I have no inside knowledge of this, so its just my
            impression since WO has brought out a number of new ZS models this
            year. Its black (or red) anodized rather than painted, and has three
            sizes 66mm, 80mm, and 105mm. It also offers an 80mm semi-apo, an
            80mm short, and 66mm semi-apo Petzval 4 element lens design. In the
            APO line, they have a 80mm doublet fluorite (red anniv model), a 66
            SD doublet, a 66mm ED triplet, and a 105mm ED triplet.

            But this information is really all on the WO web site, and I am not
            anywhere near enough of an expert on optics (not even close!) to tell
            you which optical design you should go with, doublet, triplet, ED,
            SD, or Fluorite. There are lots of sites out there that will argue
            one way over the other, depending on whether you want it for visual
            vs. photo use.

            It looks to me like WO is moving all models towards a 2-speed
            microfocuser, and I honestly don't think that mechanics are the same
            between lines.

            I would say first choose your price point and aperture - 66, 80, 105
            (or 110 Fluoristar which is different design completely) and then see
            what you like.

            I don't think its any more complicated than that, so I would say just
            read the reviews that are out there, and base your decision on how
            much aperture you want, and how much you can spend.

            And I am working on the FAQs, but its honestly more about answering
            specific questions that keep poppig up, than a comparison grid,
            because that is just too hard to maintain by me.

            Its a good idea for the WO site though! I could build one thats a
            snapshot of the scopes that are offered today if its any help. All
            the specs are already there on the WO site, so if that would help I
            would be happy to create an Excel sheet that could be turned into an
            HTML page easily and posted. Anyone interested?

            Timm


            -- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "starsearcheffort3"
            <william001@f...> wrote:
            >
            > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...>
            wrote:
            > >
            > > To All:
            > >
            > > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
            > > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
            > >
            > > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the
            various
            > > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
            > > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
            > > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
            > > advantages?
            > >
            > > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
            > > The other members are apochromats, correct?
            > >
            > > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
            > > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the
            new
            > > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red
            temptress).
            > > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?
            > >
            > > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to
            others,
            > > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
            > > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?
            > >
            > > Curious Minds Want to Know!
            > >
            > > Robert in Hershey
            > >
            > > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big
            newt:
            > > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
            > > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
            > > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
            > > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
            > >
            >
            >
            > Robert,
            > Good question.
            >
            > I asked it here a week or so ago, what are the differences between
            the
            > Megrez "family" and the Zenithstar "family?"
            >
            > Answer: nobody knows.
            >
            > A FAQ is being considered but until that time your guess is as good
            > as mine.
            >
            > But why would a web site want to make clear the differences between
            > its two main product lines?
            >
            > And who would expect a users' group to know a recodite thing like
            that?
            > Clear skies,
            > Bill Meyers
            >
          • Timm Bottoni
            Oops - I meant to say that in my opinion I think the mechanics ARE the same quality in both lines. Dang, I wish you could edit posts when you say the wrong
            Message 5 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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              Oops - I meant to say that in my opinion I think the mechanics ARE
              the same quality in both lines. Dang, I wish you could edit posts
              when you say the wrong thing but don't catch it until you read it
              later.

              Timm


              --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
              <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi,
              >
              > My honest opinion is that the Megrez line is painted white with
              gold
              > trim, only 80mm, has been around longer, and has 3 options -
              Doublet
              > Flourite, same optics as the Zenithstar Fluorite Doublet that was
              red
              > and is out of stock, has an ED triple, and has a Fluorite Triplet.
              >
              > The ZenithStar line is newer, and seems like its the way WO is
              > moving, but I have no inside knowledge of this, so its just my
              > impression since WO has brought out a number of new ZS models this
              > year. Its black (or red) anodized rather than painted, and has
              three
              > sizes 66mm, 80mm, and 105mm. It also offers an 80mm semi-apo, an
              > 80mm short, and 66mm semi-apo Petzval 4 element lens design. In
              the
              > APO line, they have a 80mm doublet fluorite (red anniv model), a 66
              > SD doublet, a 66mm ED triplet, and a 105mm ED triplet.
              >
              > But this information is really all on the WO web site, and I am not
              > anywhere near enough of an expert on optics (not even close!) to
              tell
              > you which optical design you should go with, doublet, triplet, ED,
              > SD, or Fluorite. There are lots of sites out there that will argue
              > one way over the other, depending on whether you want it for visual
              > vs. photo use.
              >
              > It looks to me like WO is moving all models towards a 2-speed
              > microfocuser, and I honestly don't think that mechanics are the
              same
              > between lines.
              >
              > I would say first choose your price point and aperture - 66, 80,
              105
              > (or 110 Fluoristar which is different design completely) and then
              see
              > what you like.
              >
              > I don't think its any more complicated than that, so I would say
              just
              > read the reviews that are out there, and base your decision on how
              > much aperture you want, and how much you can spend.
              >
              > And I am working on the FAQs, but its honestly more about answering
              > specific questions that keep poppig up, than a comparison grid,
              > because that is just too hard to maintain by me.
              >
              > Its a good idea for the WO site though! I could build one thats a
              > snapshot of the scopes that are offered today if its any help. All
              > the specs are already there on the WO site, so if that would help I
              > would be happy to create an Excel sheet that could be turned into
              an
              > HTML page easily and posted. Anyone interested?
              >
              > Timm
              >
              >
            • williamopticsmarketing
              Hello Gentlemen, at the moment (I will stick to 80mm) we have 3 ZenithStar and 3 Megrez on the market. The ZenithStar are the achromat ZS80 and ZS80Short (only
              Message 6 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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                Hello Gentlemen,

                at the moment (I will stick to 80mm) we have 3 ZenithStar and 3
                Megrez on the market.

                The ZenithStar are the achromat ZS80 and ZS80Short (only shorter for
                binoviewing), and the ZenithStar Fluorite Doublet APO (the
                anniversary scope). The first two are a cemented doublet, the APO is
                an air spaced doublet designed by Thomas Back (TMB).

                The Megrez on the market right now are the Megrez Fluorite Doublet
                APO (same optics as the ZSFD), a Megrez Triplet ED APO, and the
                Megrez Triplet Fluorite APO (once more optics designed by TMB).

                For more info on each single scope, please refer to the following
                resurces:

                1/Other members in this group, also in the form of previous messages.
                You can use the search function to find what you are looking for.
                Most topics have been covered here already

                2/ Our website. You can see what people said about their scopes in
                the feedback section. Check also the links to external reviews. There
                are some photos taken with each scope, for some scopes we do not have
                many pics up yet. Remember that the pics represent first of all the
                photographer (we use our gallery to show our users' work not to show
                off only the best photos...)


                3/ Check out other online forums such as Cloudynights, Astromart,
                etc. You can find a full list here:
                http://www.william-optics.com/wowebs/links/discussion.htm


                I hope this helps for a start!

                4/ If you have specific questions which are still unaswered, please
                contact us at wo@... or support@...


                --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "starsearcheffort3"
                <william001@f...> wrote:
                >
                > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...>
                wrote:
                > >
                > > To All:
                > >
                > > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
                > > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
                > >
                > > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the
                various
                > > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
                > > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
                > > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
                > > advantages?
                > >
                > > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
                > > The other members are apochromats, correct?
                > >
                > > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
                > > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the
                new
                > > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red
                temptress).
                > > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?
                > >
                > > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to
                others,
                > > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
                > > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?
                > >
                > > Curious Minds Want to Know!
                > >
                > > Robert in Hershey
                > >
                > > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big
                newt:
                > > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
                > > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
                > > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
                > > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
                > >
                >
                >
                > Robert,
                > Good question.
                >
                > I asked it here a week or so ago, what are the differences between
                the
                > Megrez "family" and the Zenithstar "family?"
                >
                > Answer: nobody knows.
                >
                > A FAQ is being considered but until that time your guess is as good
                > as mine.
                >
                > But why would a web site want to make clear the differences between
                > its two main product lines?
                >
                > And who would expect a users' group to know a recodite thing like
                that?
                > Clear skies,
                > Bill Meyers
                >
              • Timm Bottoni
                Hi Daniel, Looks like you were replying while I was - good evening here, good morning for you :) Here is a simple listing... I would suggest you decide first
                Message 7 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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                  Hi Daniel,

                  Looks like you were replying while I was - good evening here, good
                  morning for you :)

                  Here is a simple listing...

                  I would suggest you decide first - do you want AP0 or not?
                  Second - how much do you have to spend?
                  Third - how much aperture do you want
                  Fourth - doublet, triplet, base your decision on feedback from users
                  who have tried both (Like Tom Trusak)

                  APO scopes
                  Price Model
                  $3295 Fluoristar 110
                  $1998 ZenithStar 105 package
                  $1698 ZenithStar 105 OTA
                  $798(sale) ZenithStar 80 Fluorite Doublet (Anniv special price)
                  $399 ZenithStar 80 SD Doublet APO
                  $548 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO 2-speed OTA
                  $498 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO OTA
                  $1595 Megrez 80 Triplet Fluorite APO
                  $928 Megrez 80 Triplet ED APO
                  $848 Megrez 80 Doublet Fluorite

                  NOT APO scopes
                  $399(sale) ZenithStar 80 2-speed OTA plus new year gift
                  $499.95 ZenithStar 80 Package
                  $399.95 ZenithStar 80 Short OTA
                  $499 ZenithStar 80 Short Package (astro or terra)
                  $699(sale) ZenithStar 80 Short BinoViewer package
                  $498 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed astro package
                  $414 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed terra package
                  $348 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed OTA

                  I know this is a quick breakdown, but this is how my overly
                  analytical mind can assemble it shortly so that its reasonably
                  straight forward.

                  Hope it helps!

                  Timm


                  --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "williamopticsmarketing"
                  <williamopticsmarketing@y...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hello Gentlemen,
                  >
                  > at the moment (I will stick to 80mm) we have 3 ZenithStar and 3
                  > Megrez on the market.
                  >
                  > The ZenithStar are the achromat ZS80 and ZS80Short (only shorter
                  for
                  > binoviewing), and the ZenithStar Fluorite Doublet APO (the
                  > anniversary scope). The first two are a cemented doublet, the APO
                  is
                  > an air spaced doublet designed by Thomas Back (TMB).
                  >
                  > The Megrez on the market right now are the Megrez Fluorite Doublet
                  > APO (same optics as the ZSFD), a Megrez Triplet ED APO, and the
                  > Megrez Triplet Fluorite APO (once more optics designed by TMB).
                  >
                  > For more info on each single scope, please refer to the following
                  > resurces:
                  >
                  > 1/Other members in this group, also in the form of previous
                  messages.
                  > You can use the search function to find what you are looking for.
                  > Most topics have been covered here already
                  >
                  > 2/ Our website. You can see what people said about their scopes in
                  > the feedback section. Check also the links to external reviews.
                  There
                  > are some photos taken with each scope, for some scopes we do not
                  have
                  > many pics up yet. Remember that the pics represent first of all the
                  > photographer (we use our gallery to show our users' work not to
                  show
                  > off only the best photos...)
                  >
                  >
                  > 3/ Check out other online forums such as Cloudynights, Astromart,
                  > etc. You can find a full list here:
                  > http://www.william-optics.com/wowebs/links/discussion.htm
                  >
                  >
                  > I hope this helps for a start!
                  >
                  > 4/ If you have specific questions which are still unaswered, please
                  > contact us at wo@w... or support@w...
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "starsearcheffort3"
                  > <william001@f...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > To All:
                  > > >
                  > > > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
                  > > > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
                  > > >
                  > > > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the
                  > various
                  > > > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar
                  Family,
                  > > > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use?
                  Physical
                  > > > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
                  > > > advantages?
                  > > >
                  > > > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
                  > > > The other members are apochromats, correct?
                  > > >
                  > > > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the
                  Megrez
                  > > > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over
                  the
                  > new
                  > > > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red
                  > temptress).
                  > > > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?
                  > > >
                  > > > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to
                  > others,
                  > > > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the
                  ZS66
                  > > > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?
                  > > >
                  > > > Curious Minds Want to Know!
                  > > >
                  > > > Robert in Hershey
                  > > >
                  > > > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a
                  big
                  > newt:
                  > > > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
                  > > > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
                  > > > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
                  > > > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Robert,
                  > > Good question.
                  > >
                  > > I asked it here a week or so ago, what are the differences
                  between
                  > the
                  > > Megrez "family" and the Zenithstar "family?"
                  > >
                  > > Answer: nobody knows.
                  > >
                  > > A FAQ is being considered but until that time your guess is as
                  good
                  > > as mine.
                  > >
                  > > But why would a web site want to make clear the differences
                  between
                  > > its two main product lines?
                  > >
                  > > And who would expect a users' group to know a recodite thing like
                  > that?
                  > > Clear skies,
                  > > Bill Meyers
                  > >
                  >
                • Chris Schroeder
                  ... Anniversary ... promotional ... So if I m reading this correctly, after the Anniv model is sold out, the only 80mm APO scopes will be the megrez line?
                  Message 8 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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                    --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "williamopticsmarketing"
                    <williamopticsmarketing@y...> wrote:
                    >
                    > ZenithStar FD and Megrez FD both share the same APO optics, only
                    > difference is the tube.
                    > ZS FD is in its second and last batch (this is the famour
                    Anniversary
                    > scope), preordering before the end of 2005 guarantees the
                    promotional
                    > price of US$ 799.
                    > If there is any left in Jan. (and I am being honest, I am beginning
                    > to doubt it) price will be US$ 848, same as the Megrez version.
                    >

                    So if I'm reading this correctly, after the Anniv model is sold out,
                    the only 80mm APO scopes will be the megrez line?

                    Chris
                  • Chris Schroeder
                    Let me take a stab at this, remember this is just my opinion and it s worth exactly what you paid for it ;^) My comments will be after each of your questions
                    Message 9 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Let me take a stab at this, remember this is just my opinion and
                      it's worth exactly what you paid for it ;^) My comments will be
                      after each of your questions below


                      --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, hypergut <no_reply@y...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > To All:
                      >
                      > Having been smitten with the ZSSD 66 APO, I am looking at more
                      > "refractor" APO aperture for my future, i.e., 80mm or greater.
                      >
                      > Can anyone clearly outline the advantages and qualities of the
                      various
                      > members of these two design groups, Megrez vs. ZenithStar Family,
                      > e.g., is one design better for imaging versus visual use? Physical
                      > properties (other than weight)? Mechanical differences? Optical
                      > advantages?

                      I believe they are just different styles with pretty much equal
                      performance mechanically

                      >
                      > The Megrez 80mm FD is it a fluorite achromat, semi-apo or apo?
                      > The other members are apochromats, correct?

                      APO

                      >
                      > What advantage has the Megrez fluorite Triplet Apo over the Megrez
                      > 80mm IIED Apo? What advantage has any 80mm Megrez design over the
                      new
                      > 80mm ZenithStar 80mm fluorite doublet (the so-called red
                      temptress).

                      Better color correction of the Flourite Triplet over both 80IIED and
                      80APO

                      > Is the 80mm ZSFD an apo?

                      Yes

                      >
                      > Unrelated to my past or future purchases, but maybe helpful to
                      others,
                      > why would someone choose the ZS66 Petzval Semi-Apo ED or the ZS66
                      > Triplet ED-Apo versions over the ZSSD 66 Apo?

                      Petzval is a semi-APO, but because of it's design, it has a very
                      flat field which is great for Astrophotography. The triplet should
                      have the best color correct of the three. The SD APO is a doublet,
                      which gives it a litter weight and quicker cooling over a triplet
                      but still have good color correction.

                      Clear as mud now? Hope this helps Robert, Chris

                      >
                      > Curious Minds Want to Know!
                      >
                      > Robert in Hershey
                      >
                      > P.S. as you can see, I now own cadioptrics, refractors and a big
                      newt:
                      > 18" f4.5 Obsession, Galaxy/AN (with ZSSD 66mm Apo superfinder)
                      > 8" f10 Meade LX90 SCT
                      > 5" f10 Intes-Micro Mak-Cas
                      > 4.7" f6 Orion Astroview 120ST Achro
                      >
                    • williamopticsmarketing
                      Chris, the future is beyond me!! ;-) Wait and see! ... beginning ... out,
                      Message 10 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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                        Chris, the future is beyond me!! ;-)

                        Wait and see!



                        --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Schroeder"
                        <chris_jsa@y...> wrote:
                        >
                        > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "williamopticsmarketing"
                        > <williamopticsmarketing@y...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > ZenithStar FD and Megrez FD both share the same APO optics, only
                        > > difference is the tube.
                        > > ZS FD is in its second and last batch (this is the famour
                        > Anniversary
                        > > scope), preordering before the end of 2005 guarantees the
                        > promotional
                        > > price of US$ 799.
                        > > If there is any left in Jan. (and I am being honest, I am
                        beginning
                        > > to doubt it) price will be US$ 848, same as the Megrez version.
                        > >
                        >
                        > So if I'm reading this correctly, after the Anniv model is sold
                        out,
                        > the only 80mm APO scopes will be the megrez line?
                        >
                        > Chris
                        >
                      • Timm Bottoni
                        Oops - another typo Should be $399 ZenithStar 66 SD Doublet APO And nice job of explaining the optics choices Chris! I am fine with the specs, but as
                        Message 11 of 16 , Dec 29, 2005
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                          Oops - another typo

                          Should be
                          $399 ZenithStar 66 SD Doublet APO

                          And nice job of explaining the optics choices Chris! I am fine with
                          the specs, but as to why one is better, I will leave that to you
                          folks who are more experienced.

                          Timm

                          --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
                          <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi Daniel,
                          >
                          > Looks like you were replying while I was - good evening here, good
                          > morning for you :)
                          >
                          > Here is a simple listing...
                          >
                          > I would suggest you decide first - do you want AP0 or not?
                          > Second - how much do you have to spend?
                          > Third - how much aperture do you want
                          > Fourth - doublet, triplet, base your decision on feedback from
                          users
                          > who have tried both (Like Tom Trusak)
                          >
                          > APO scopes
                          > Price Model
                          > $3295 Fluoristar 110
                          > $1998 ZenithStar 105 package
                          > $1698 ZenithStar 105 OTA
                          > $798(sale) ZenithStar 80 Fluorite Doublet (Anniv special price)
                          > $399 ZenithStar 80 SD Doublet APO
                          > $548 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO 2-speed OTA
                          > $498 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO OTA
                          > $1595 Megrez 80 Triplet Fluorite APO
                          > $928 Megrez 80 Triplet ED APO
                          > $848 Megrez 80 Doublet Fluorite
                          >
                          > NOT APO scopes
                          > $399(sale) ZenithStar 80 2-speed OTA plus new year gift
                          > $499.95 ZenithStar 80 Package
                          > $399.95 ZenithStar 80 Short OTA
                          > $499 ZenithStar 80 Short Package (astro or terra)
                          > $699(sale) ZenithStar 80 Short BinoViewer package
                          > $498 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed astro package
                          > $414 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed terra package
                          > $348 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed OTA
                          >
                          > I know this is a quick breakdown, but this is how my overly
                          > analytical mind can assemble it shortly so that its reasonably
                          > straight forward.
                          >
                          > Hope it helps!
                          >
                          > Timm
                          >
                          >
                        • michelderomme
                          Well What are we talking about ? SD APO, ED APO, fluorite APO, fluorite doublet ... CA F2, FPL53 or others ? are red and blue waves focused at the same point ?
                          Message 12 of 16 , Dec 30, 2005
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Well
                            What are we talking about ?
                            SD APO, ED APO, fluorite APO, fluorite doublet ...
                            CA F2, FPL53 or others ?
                            are red and blue waves focused at the same point ?
                            TMB use ED, TAk use fluorite, AP uses ED, Skywatcher use ED(FPL53
                            indeed), WO use DE, ED, fluorite, are some better than others ? why ?
                            Michel
                            Membre SAPL 87
                            http://www.astrosurf.com/deromme/accueil.htm
                            PROTEGEONS NOTRE ENVIRONNEMENT NOCTURNE !!!
                            ADHEREZ A L'ANPCN
                            Commandez les nouveaux autocollants ANPCN !
                            http://www.astrosurf.com/anpcn/

                            --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
                            <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Oops - another typo
                            >
                            > Should be
                            > $399 ZenithStar 66 SD Doublet APO
                            >
                            > And nice job of explaining the optics choices Chris! I am fine
                            with
                            > the specs, but as to why one is better, I will leave that to you
                            > folks who are more experienced.
                            >
                            > Timm
                            >
                            > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
                            > <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > Hi Daniel,
                            > >
                            > > Looks like you were replying while I was - good evening here,
                            good
                            > > morning for you :)
                            > >
                            > > Here is a simple listing...
                            > >
                            > > I would suggest you decide first - do you want AP0 or not?
                            > > Second - how much do you have to spend?
                            > > Third - how much aperture do you want
                            > > Fourth - doublet, triplet, base your decision on feedback from
                            > users
                            > > who have tried both (Like Tom Trusak)
                            > >
                            > > APO scopes
                            > > Price Model
                            > > $3295 Fluoristar 110
                            > > $1998 ZenithStar 105 package
                            > > $1698 ZenithStar 105 OTA
                            > > $798(sale) ZenithStar 80 Fluorite Doublet (Anniv special price)
                            > > $399 ZenithStar 80 SD Doublet APO
                            > > $548 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO 2-speed OTA
                            > > $498 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO OTA
                            > > $1595 Megrez 80 Triplet Fluorite APO
                            > > $928 Megrez 80 Triplet ED APO
                            > > $848 Megrez 80 Doublet Fluorite
                            > >
                            > > NOT APO scopes
                            > > $399(sale) ZenithStar 80 2-speed OTA plus new year gift
                            > > $499.95 ZenithStar 80 Package
                            > > $399.95 ZenithStar 80 Short OTA
                            > > $499 ZenithStar 80 Short Package (astro or terra)
                            > > $699(sale) ZenithStar 80 Short BinoViewer package
                            > > $498 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed astro package
                            > > $414 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed terra package
                            > > $348 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed OTA
                            > >
                            > > I know this is a quick breakdown, but this is how my overly
                            > > analytical mind can assemble it shortly so that its reasonably
                            > > straight forward.
                            > >
                            > > Hope it helps!
                            > >
                            > > Timm
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                          • Tom Trusock
                            Hi Michel, There have already been some wonderful comments in this thread - if you read back, they will probably go a long way towards answering some if not
                            Message 13 of 16 , Dec 30, 2005
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                              Hi Michel,

                              There have already been some wonderful comments in this thread - if
                              you read back, they will probably go a long way towards answering
                              some if not all of your questions, but I'll throw in my .02 cents
                              here as well.

                              ED and SD are generally considered to be two different names for the
                              same family of glasses. I think it was Nikon coined the term ED -
                              prompting Canon to counter with SD. Both were marketing terms that
                              described glasses with extra, special or supra dispersion properties
                              as measured by their abbe number. ED is more typically used today,
                              but there's nothing inherently incorrect about SD.

                              ED/SD glasses can cover a wide range, but for today's astronomical
                              applications usually consist of glasses with similar properties to
                              those found in Ohara's catalog under the designations s-fpl51, s-
                              fpl52 and s-fpl53 (more often referred to as FPL51, 52 and 53). For
                              the record, from it's abbe number there is minimal diffference
                              between fluorite and fpl53. I've been given to understand that pure
                              fluorite does have a small advantage in that it has a slightly
                              higher transmission and lower scatter in certain wavelengths than
                              fpl-53, but the advantages are mainly photographic, and not all that
                              great. Equally important to the choice of the ED/SD glass is the
                              choice of a good mate.

                              Everyone talks about color correction, but the sheer fact of the
                              matter is there really are other things that are just if not more
                              important depending on the application you have in mind. I suspect
                              everyone picks on color correction because it's easy to see.

                              In any case, the design of the lens and the glasses used are
                              paramount in determining correction, however, many other factors
                              come into play as well. Typically the best doublets are not as well
                              corrected as the best corrected triplets - however, doublets are
                              lighter, cool down faster, and have a few other advantages as well
                              (largely to the visual observer). Triplets, OTOH, are generally
                              preferred for photographic applications.

                              As I see it, the major difference between the ZenithStar and Megrez
                              family have more to do with the OTA than the lenses. Outside of the
                              FLT-100 (which is a different beast entirely) the Megrez scopes are
                              white with a painted or powercoated finish, and use a foam baffle
                              system. They have a more traditional look to them. The Zenithstars
                              tend to be anodized and use a cone baffle system. The anodizing
                              looks extremely sharp, but has a single drawback - it picks up
                              fingerprints like crazy.

                              I've seen samples of both lines, and both do their job well. Which
                              you prefer is entirely up to you.

                              As per the 66 doublet / triplet / petzval discussion - well, as a
                              visual observer, I tend to prefer doublets. In general, a good
                              ED/SD doublet is smaller, lighter (and thus easier to mount), and
                              still offers acceptable color correction. I haven't seen the 66 SD
                              doublet yet, but I'm lucky enough to have the fluorite version (a
                              very limited production). Assuming the SD version performs like the
                              fluorite version, I'd recommend the SD doublet for the visual
                              observer. The triplet generally offers better color correction for
                              those who are really picky about that or who are photographers.
                              Petzvals are an excellent choice for someone who is on a slightly
                              more restriced budget. The petzval gives about 30-35% less false
                              color than a similar size achro simply due to it's design. While I
                              wouldn't recommend it for typical photography due to it's color
                              correction, it would do very well for narrow band applications.

                              Hope something here helps.

                              Tom T.

                              --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "michelderomme"
                              <michel.deromme@f...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Well
                              > What are we talking about ?
                              > SD APO, ED APO, fluorite APO, fluorite doublet ...
                              > CA F2, FPL53 or others ?
                              > are red and blue waves focused at the same point ?
                              > TMB use ED, TAk use fluorite, AP uses ED, Skywatcher use ED(FPL53
                              > indeed), WO use DE, ED, fluorite, are some better than others ?
                              why ?
                              > Michel
                              > Membre SAPL 87
                              > http://www.astrosurf.com/deromme/accueil.htm
                              > PROTEGEONS NOTRE ENVIRONNEMENT NOCTURNE !!!
                              > ADHEREZ A L'ANPCN
                              > Commandez les nouveaux autocollants ANPCN !
                              > http://www.astrosurf.com/anpcn/
                              >
                              > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
                              > <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Oops - another typo
                              > >
                              > > Should be
                              > > $399 ZenithStar 66 SD Doublet APO
                              > >
                              > > And nice job of explaining the optics choices Chris! I am fine
                              > with
                              > > the specs, but as to why one is better, I will leave that to you
                              > > folks who are more experienced.
                              > >
                              > > Timm
                              > >
                              > > --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Timm Bottoni"
                              > > <t.bottoni@c...> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Hi Daniel,
                              > > >
                              > > > Looks like you were replying while I was - good evening here,
                              > good
                              > > > morning for you :)
                              > > >
                              > > > Here is a simple listing...
                              > > >
                              > > > I would suggest you decide first - do you want AP0 or not?
                              > > > Second - how much do you have to spend?
                              > > > Third - how much aperture do you want
                              > > > Fourth - doublet, triplet, base your decision on feedback from
                              > > users
                              > > > who have tried both (Like Tom Trusak)
                              > > >
                              > > > APO scopes
                              > > > Price Model
                              > > > $3295 Fluoristar 110
                              > > > $1998 ZenithStar 105 package
                              > > > $1698 ZenithStar 105 OTA
                              > > > $798(sale) ZenithStar 80 Fluorite Doublet (Anniv special
                              price)
                              > > > $399 ZenithStar 80 SD Doublet APO
                              > > > $548 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO 2-speed OTA
                              > > > $498 ZenithStar 66 ED Triplet APO OTA
                              > > > $1595 Megrez 80 Triplet Fluorite APO
                              > > > $928 Megrez 80 Triplet ED APO
                              > > > $848 Megrez 80 Doublet Fluorite
                              > > >
                              > > > NOT APO scopes
                              > > > $399(sale) ZenithStar 80 2-speed OTA plus new year gift
                              > > > $499.95 ZenithStar 80 Package
                              > > > $399.95 ZenithStar 80 Short OTA
                              > > > $499 ZenithStar 80 Short Package (astro or terra)
                              > > > $699(sale) ZenithStar 80 Short BinoViewer package
                              > > > $498 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed astro package
                              > > > $414 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed terra package
                              > > > $348 ZenithStar 66 Petzval 2-speed OTA
                              > > >
                              > > > I know this is a quick breakdown, but this is how my overly
                              > > > analytical mind can assemble it shortly so that its reasonably
                              > > > straight forward.
                              > > >
                              > > > Hope it helps!
                              > > >
                              > > > Timm
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Tom Trusock
                              Just so there s no confusion, I should make it clear that my comments about the petzval design were in reference to the 66 currently offered. Other petzvals
                              Message 14 of 16 , Dec 30, 2005
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Just so there's no confusion, I should make it clear that my comments
                                about the petzval design were in reference to the 66 currently
                                offered. Other petzvals (even perhaps those on tap at WO) can have
                                better color correction than nearly any other style of telescope.
                                (The NP101 is an excellent example of best of a breed apochromatic
                                petzval.) Like any other design however, they have their own benefits
                                and limitations.

                                T
                              • fccolosimo
                                Hi Tom, You mentioned it briefly as a whole different story but can you comment on the FLT 110 as the best choice for wide field astrophotography? I was
                                Message 15 of 16 , Jan 4, 2006
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Hi Tom,
                                  You mentioned it briefly as 'a whole different story' but can you
                                  comment on the FLT 110 as the best choice for wide field
                                  astrophotography? I was able to play around with an 102mm f/5 achro
                                  and found the wide field of view to be very exciting. The relatively
                                  poor color correction resulted in poor color results but the images
                                  shot through a green filter were great. I have decided to get a better
                                  scope largely for CCD work, and it seems that the Petval design
                                  produces nice wide views. However, I mainly want to make sure that I
                                  get good color correction and good resolution - small stars with
                                  no 'bloat' are important to me. The FLT 110, the Tak FSQ and and the
                                  TV NP101 are all candidates at present and somehow I have to get my
                                  choice down to the best one...

                                  Thanks!

                                  Frank




                                  --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Trusock" <tomt@c...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Just so there's no confusion, I should make it clear that my comments
                                  > about the petzval design were in reference to the 66 currently
                                  > offered. Other petzvals (even perhaps those on tap at WO) can have
                                  > better color correction than nearly any other style of telescope.
                                  > (The NP101 is an excellent example of best of a breed apochromatic
                                  > petzval.) Like any other design however, they have their own benefits
                                  > and limitations.
                                  >
                                  > T
                                  >
                                • Tom Trusock
                                  ... achro ... relatively ... images ... better ... that I ... the ... my ... Hi Frank, I really can t comment a whole lot on the astrophotography side. About
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Jan 4, 2006
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    --- In William-Optics@yahoogroups.com, "fccolosimo" <fcc0@h...>
                                    wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Hi Tom,
                                    > You mentioned it briefly as 'a whole different story' but can you
                                    > comment on the FLT 110 as the best choice for wide field
                                    > astrophotography? I was able to play around with an 102mm f/5
                                    achro
                                    > and found the wide field of view to be very exciting. The
                                    relatively
                                    > poor color correction resulted in poor color results but the
                                    images
                                    > shot through a green filter were great. I have decided to get a
                                    better
                                    > scope largely for CCD work, and it seems that the Petval design
                                    > produces nice wide views. However, I mainly want to make sure
                                    that I
                                    > get good color correction and good resolution - small stars with
                                    > no 'bloat' are important to me. The FLT 110, the Tak FSQ and and
                                    the
                                    > TV NP101 are all candidates at present and somehow I have to get
                                    my
                                    > choice down to the best one...
                                    >
                                    > Thanks!
                                    >
                                    > Frank
                                    >
                                    >

                                    Hi Frank, I really can't comment a whole lot on the astrophotography
                                    side. About all I can say is that take a look at images of all
                                    three with your camera of choice, and then talk to the
                                    photographers. An astrophotographically inclined friend purchased
                                    the FLT I had for review - about all I can tell you is that that
                                    last I knew, he was very happy with it.

                                    T
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