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Re: Why breed? The stork is a bird of war!

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  • Elizabeth
    No, sorry. I m having too much fun arguing with my husband of 3 years regarding the merits of having children... when his only child is now 23, and our
    Message 1 of 8 , Feb 28, 2010
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      No, sorry. I'm having too much fun arguing with my husband of 3 years regarding the merits of having children... when his only child is now 23, and our potential to even be faced with such a decision on having them is next to impossible, thanks to a decision I made many years ago. He seriously has had enough of *fatherhood*. I'm having too much fun arguing with him over whether it is even moral or ethical for ANYONE to have a baby with the world as it is - both socially and politically, as well as ecologically and with problems looming such as peak oil, peak coal, climate change, and so forth.

      I too said that I'd had enough of marriage for one lifetime to my lawyer when I filed for divorce 4 years ago. I had to eat those words. :)

      The "Stork" video is playing "Morning", from the Peer Gynt Suite by Grieg. A single stork with a package presumably carrying a baby. It flies over various natural areas in the world. This single stork is joined by another stork, then another, then another stork also carrying babies over natural areas. Then, they start dropping their packages (babies). The wild animals are shown as destroyed, and their forests and streams replaced with tract homes, SUVs, and Mommies with babies in prams. Eventually, we have a skyfull of storks dropping babies onto natural areas, which are transformed into tightly-built housing tracts with SUVs, babies and disposable diapers. The storks drop their package, it is initially displayed as a bomb going off, then there's a smiling baby, an SUV, diapers, toilets with dead fish underneath, and a tract home as the animals run away as from a forest fire. It zooms out from the housing tract to a city with a huge road network, to a state, nation, to a polluted world, to a dying world that blows up, becoming a baby's face. The ending credits are to the sound of a crying baby saying, "I don't want it."

      Anyhow, the global warming video shows the problem of global warming. The solution: Human extinction (with a video of human figures jumping off a cliff). A picture of a crowd with the label, "Save the Earth! Don't Procreate!" (and a link to fixtheearth.org). This site does not exist (anymore).

      Beth

      --- In Why_breed@yahoogroups.com, aditmore@... wrote:
      >
      > MARRY ME BETH!
      >
      > (technically, I've had enough of marriage for one lifetime, but it seems
      > the only adequate response.)
      > -Alan
      >
      > PS: also technically, my dialup is inadequate for youtube)
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------
      >
      > See the Youtube video at
      > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-0vnRmej0Q&feature=related
      >
      > While you're at it, there's a proposed solution to global warming video
      > at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOh9OxqF9lE&feature=related
      >
      > Or, if people continue to refuse to control their breeding habits, the
      > "Megaslums", like some in places like Mexico City and Lagos, Nigeria will
      > continue to expend. The one in Lagos is shown in this video:
      > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFgb1BdPBZo&feature=related Now, is THIS
      > the future that anyone wants to live in? This is more likely the sort of
      > "fucha" that people are sending their children, who are "the FUCHA" to.
      > Can they really hate their children this much???
      >
      > Beth
      > ____________________________________________________________
      > Medical Insurance
      > Click to get Medical Insurance options that meet your needs.
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      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • juan - k
      I think you should seriously reconsider staying on the voluntary human extinction spot since it s nearly impossible for everyone on this world to accept it and
      Message 2 of 8 , Feb 28, 2010
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        I think you should seriously reconsider staying on the voluntary human extinction spot since it's nearly impossible for everyone on this world to accept it and follow it.

        Why don't you think on something more feasible? I think you could get more followers if you change the subject.


        greetings

        Juank

        To: Why_breed@yahoogroups.com
        From: beth_h8@...
        Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 16:36:53 +0000
        Subject: Re: Why breed? The stork is a bird of war!




























        No, sorry. I'm having too much fun arguing with my husband of 3 years regarding the merits of having children... when his only child is now 23, and our potential to even be faced with such a decision on having them is next to impossible, thanks to a decision I made many years ago. He seriously has had enough of *fatherhood*. I'm having too much fun arguing with him over whether it is even moral or ethical for ANYONE to have a baby with the world as it is - both socially and politically, as well as ecologically and with problems looming such as peak oil, peak coal, climate change, and so forth.



        I too said that I'd had enough of marriage for one lifetime to my lawyer when I filed for divorce 4 years ago. I had to eat those words. :)



        The "Stork" video is playing "Morning", from the Peer Gynt Suite by Grieg. A single stork with a package presumably carrying a baby. It flies over various natural areas in the world. This single stork is joined by another stork, then another, then another stork also carrying babies over natural areas. Then, they start dropping their packages (babies). The wild animals are shown as destroyed, and their forests and streams replaced with tract homes, SUVs, and Mommies with babies in prams. Eventually, we have a skyfull of storks dropping babies onto natural areas, which are transformed into tightly-built housing tracts with SUVs, babies and disposable diapers. The storks drop their package, it is initially displayed as a bomb going off, then there's a smiling baby, an SUV, diapers, toilets with dead fish underneath, and a tract home as the animals run away as from a forest fire. It zooms out from the housing tract to a city with a huge road network, to a state, nation, to a polluted world, to a dying world that blows up, becoming a baby's face. The ending credits are to the sound of a crying baby saying, "I don't want it."



        Anyhow, the global warming video shows the problem of global warming. The solution: Human extinction (with a video of human figures jumping off a cliff). A picture of a crowd with the label, "Save the Earth! Don't Procreate!" (and a link to fixtheearth.org). This site does not exist (anymore).



        Beth



        --- In Why_breed@yahoogroups.com, aditmore@... wrote:

        >

        > MARRY ME BETH!

        >

        > (technically, I've had enough of marriage for one lifetime, but it seems

        > the only adequate response.)

        > -Alan

        >

        > PS: also technically, my dialup is inadequate for youtube)

        > ----------------------------------------------------------

        >

        > See the Youtube video at

        > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-0vnRmej0Q&feature=related

        >

        > While you're at it, there's a proposed solution to global warming video

        > at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOh9OxqF9lE&feature=related

        >

        > Or, if people continue to refuse to control their breeding habits, the

        > "Megaslums", like some in places like Mexico City and Lagos, Nigeria will

        > continue to expend. The one in Lagos is shown in this video:

        > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFgb1BdPBZo&feature=related Now, is THIS

        > the future that anyone wants to live in? This is more likely the sort of

        > "fucha" that people are sending their children, who are "the FUCHA" to.

        > Can they really hate their children this much???

        >

        > Beth

        > __________________________________________________________

        > Medical Insurance

        > Click to get Medical Insurance options that meet your needs.

        > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=y7T8O0E-lNXklNFEwQlXxgAAJ1BPrl7qK_-uCnvxnuQA90jNAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAQVgAAAAA=

        >

        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        >


















        _________________________________________________________________



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • aditmore@juno.com
        To me, it makes far more sense to find partners who share a philosophy than to argue philosophy within a partnership, which I never found fun. However our
        Message 3 of 8 , Feb 28, 2010
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          To me, it makes far more sense to find partners who share a philosophy
          than to argue philosophy within a partnership, which I never found fun.
          However our philosophy is very rare, and as far as I know nonexistant in
          my region, and if you add my municipal contraception focus, and
          opposition to zoning, my philosophy becomes unique as far as I know.
          -Al


          -------------------------------------------

          No, sorry. I'm having too much fun arguing with my husband of 3 years
          regarding the merits of having children... when his only child is now 23,
          and our potential to even be faced with such a decision on having them is
          next to impossible, thanks to a decision I made many years ago. He
          seriously has had enough of *fatherhood*. I'm having too much fun arguing
          with him over whether it is even moral or ethical for ANYONE to have a
          baby with the world as it is - both socially and politically, as well as
          ecologically and with problems looming such as peak oil, peak coal,
          climate change, and so forth.

          I too said that I'd had enough of marriage for one lifetime to my lawyer
          when I filed for divorce 4 years ago. I had to eat those words. :)

          The "Stork" video is playing "Morning", from the Peer Gynt Suite by
          Grieg. A single stork with a package presumably carrying a baby. It flies
          over various natural areas in the world. This single stork is joined by
          another stork, then another, then another stork also carrying babies over
          natural areas. Then, they start dropping their packages (babies). The
          wild animals are shown as destroyed, and their forests and streams
          replaced with tract homes, SUVs, and Mommies with babies in prams.
          Eventually, we have a skyfull of storks dropping babies onto natural
          areas, which are transformed into tightly-built housing tracts with SUVs,
          babies and disposable diapers. The storks drop their package, it is
          initially displayed as a bomb going off, then there's a smiling baby, an
          SUV, diapers, toilets with dead fish underneath, and a tract home as the
          animals run away as from a forest fire. It zooms out from the housing
          tract to a city with a huge road network, to a state, nation, to a
          polluted world, to a dying world that blows up, becoming a baby's face.
          The ending credits are to the sound of a crying baby saying, "I don't
          want it."

          Anyhow, the global warming video shows the problem of global warming. The
          solution: Human extinction (with a video of human figures jumping off a
          cliff). A picture of a crowd with the label, "Save the Earth! Don't
          Procreate!" (and a link to fixtheearth.org). This site does not exist
          (anymore).

          Beth

          --- In Why_breed@yahoogroups.com, aditmore@... wrote:
          >
          > MARRY ME BETH!
          >
          > (technically, I've had enough of marriage for one lifetime, but it
          seems
          > the only adequate response.)
          > -Alan
          >
          > PS: also technically, my dialup is inadequate for youtube)
          > ----------------------------------------------------------
          >
          > See the Youtube video at
          > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-0vnRmej0Q&feature=related
          >
          > While you're at it, there's a proposed solution to global warming video
          > at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOh9OxqF9lE&feature=related
          >
          > Or, if people continue to refuse to control their breeding habits, the
          > "Megaslums", like some in places like Mexico City and Lagos, Nigeria
          will
          > continue to expend. The one in Lagos is shown in this video:
          > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFgb1BdPBZo&feature=related Now, is THIS
          > the future that anyone wants to live in? This is more likely the sort
          of
          > "fucha" that people are sending their children, who are "the FUCHA" to.
          > Can they really hate their children this much???
          >
          > Beth
          ____________________________________________________________
          Diet Help
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        • Elizabeth
          Yeah, well... In my previous marriage, we agreed 100% about children - never had em, never will, and limit our contact with them. Don t like being around
          Message 4 of 8 , Feb 28, 2010
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            Yeah, well...

            In my previous marriage, we agreed 100% about children - never had 'em, never will, and limit our contact with them. Don't like being around them.

            Unfortunately, we did not agree on a lot of philosophies which made more difference in our day-to-day life.

            Now, I've got the reverse. I agree a good 95% with my current husband on things that effect our everyday life, including our spiritual beliefs. Again, I'd say we agree a good 95%.

            On matters that do not effect our lives or how we live, we have some disagreements.... fairly major ones. They're enough to keep us both in practice on arguing, but fairly. They'll effect how we vote or what we put in some of our letters to those in political office.

            There is a good bit of evidence that suggests that the best relationships are where partners do not agree with each other 100% of the time. That gets boring!

            Yeah, it's important to agree on having or not having children in a relationship. He really does not want to have MORE children. He feels he's spent enough years providing for a child now. I even think the world was salvagable - low chance, but POSSIBLE - back in 1987 when he had a child. That corner has been turned now. Even if humans cease to exist by some means that does not wipe everything else out - like some sort of lethal global pandemic - there has been too much damage done for the planet to heal itself in any reasonable period of time for another "intelligent" race to evolve from what's left. There's too much waste buried, too much nuclear containment that must be maintained, too much buried "until somebody in the future knows how to dispose of it".

            Heck, *I* don't agree with you on municipal contraception. It's not encompassing enough. What of people who do not live in a municipality? What of municipalities, counties, states, and countries which have dominant beliefs forbidding contraception? Also, it is good for a political entity to breed, grow, and take over its neighbors. Good for the political entity, bad for society and for the world as a whole.

            Beth
            --- In Why_breed@yahoogroups.com, aditmore@... wrote:
            >
            > To me, it makes far more sense to find partners who share a philosophy
            > than to argue philosophy within a partnership, which I never found fun.
            > However our philosophy is very rare, and as far as I know nonexistant in
            > my region, and if you add my municipal contraception focus, and
            > opposition to zoning, my philosophy becomes unique as far as I know.
            > -Al
            >
            >
            > -------------------------------------------
            >
            > No, sorry. I'm having too much fun arguing with my husband of 3 years
            > regarding the merits of having children... when his only child is now 23,
            > and our potential to even be faced with such a decision on having them is
            > next to impossible, thanks to a decision I made many years ago. He
            > seriously has had enough of *fatherhood*. I'm having too much fun arguing
            > with him over whether it is even moral or ethical for ANYONE to have a
            > baby with the world as it is - both socially and politically, as well as
            > ecologically and with problems looming such as peak oil, peak coal,
            > climate change, and so forth.
            >
            > I too said that I'd had enough of marriage for one lifetime to my lawyer
            > when I filed for divorce 4 years ago. I had to eat those words. :)
            >
            > The "Stork" video is playing "Morning", from the Peer Gynt Suite by
            > Grieg. A single stork with a package presumably carrying a baby. It flies
            > over various natural areas in the world. This single stork is joined by
            > another stork, then another, then another stork also carrying babies over
            > natural areas. Then, they start dropping their packages (babies). The
            > wild animals are shown as destroyed, and their forests and streams
            > replaced with tract homes, SUVs, and Mommies with babies in prams.
            > Eventually, we have a skyfull of storks dropping babies onto natural
            > areas, which are transformed into tightly-built housing tracts with SUVs,
            > babies and disposable diapers. The storks drop their package, it is
            > initially displayed as a bomb going off, then there's a smiling baby, an
            > SUV, diapers, toilets with dead fish underneath, and a tract home as the
            > animals run away as from a forest fire. It zooms out from the housing
            > tract to a city with a huge road network, to a state, nation, to a
            > polluted world, to a dying world that blows up, becoming a baby's face.
            > The ending credits are to the sound of a crying baby saying, "I don't
            > want it."
            >
            > Anyhow, the global warming video shows the problem of global warming. The
            > solution: Human extinction (with a video of human figures jumping off a
            > cliff). A picture of a crowd with the label, "Save the Earth! Don't
            > Procreate!" (and a link to fixtheearth.org). This site does not exist
            > (anymore).
            >
            > Beth
            >
            > --- In Why_breed@yahoogroups.com, aditmore@ wrote:
            > >
            > > MARRY ME BETH!
            > >
            > > (technically, I've had enough of marriage for one lifetime, but it
            > seems
            > > the only adequate response.)
            > > -Alan
            > >
            > > PS: also technically, my dialup is inadequate for youtube)
            > > ----------------------------------------------------------
            > >
            > > See the Youtube video at
            > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-0vnRmej0Q&feature=related
            > >
            > > While you're at it, there's a proposed solution to global warming video
            > > at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOh9OxqF9lE&feature=related
            > >
            > > Or, if people continue to refuse to control their breeding habits, the
            > > "Megaslums", like some in places like Mexico City and Lagos, Nigeria
            > will
            > > continue to expend. The one in Lagos is shown in this video:
            > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFgb1BdPBZo&feature=related Now, is THIS
            > > the future that anyone wants to live in? This is more likely the sort
            > of
            > > "fucha" that people are sending their children, who are "the FUCHA" to.
            > > Can they really hate their children this much???
            > >
            > > Beth
            > ____________________________________________________________
            > Diet Help
            > Cheap Diet Help Tips. Click here.
            > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=HciRyUcW4laZLjgPnzMgVgAAJ1BPrl7qK_-uCnvxnuQA90jNAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYQAAAAAA=
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            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Les Knight
            It s a whole lot easier to convince people they should do what they were going to to anyway. Zero Population Growth has been saying Stop at two for 40 years,
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 2, 2010
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              It's a whole lot easier to convince people they should do what they were going to to anyway. Zero Population Growth has been saying "Stop at two" for 40 years, and most people in the US have been doing that. In order to broaden their base of support, they abandoned the goal of ZPG and are now Population Connection.

              If we advocated a one-child fertility rate, more people would agree with us, but we would be saying that it's okay to breed a little bit. It's not okay.

              You're right, advocating extinction does lose a lot of people. It may not be feasible to convince everyone to stop breeding, but it's still the right thing to do.

              Les

              juan - k wrote:
              > I think you should seriously reconsider staying on the voluntary
              > human extinction spot since it's nearly impossible for everyone on
              > this world to accept it and follow it.
              >
              > Why don't you think on something more feasible? I think you could get
              > more followers if you change the subject.
              >
              >
              > greetings
              >
              > Juank
            • aditmore@juno.com
              We only need to convince about 100 people to control a small town or county, and that is all that needs doing to get the snowball rolling. After that it all
              Message 6 of 8 , Mar 2, 2010
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                We only need to convince about 100 people to control a small town or
                county, and that is all that needs doing to get the snowball rolling.
                After that it all gets easier because the second town is easier to win
                than the first and the third still easier etc. until we succeed in
                drastically reducing, or eliminating, population.
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/childfreetown/
                -Al

                There is no need to compromise positions in order to win more than 100
                people and 100 people is 0.000003%. Compomise only on territory, never
                on philosophy.

                ---------------------------------------

                It's a whole lot easier to convince people they should do what they were
                going to to anyway. Zero Population Growth has been saying "Stop at two"
                for 40 years, and most people in the US have been doing that. In order to
                broaden their base of support, they abandoned the goal of ZPG and are now
                Population Connection.

                If we advocated a one-child fertility rate, more people would agree with
                us, but we would be saying that it's okay to breed a little bit. It's not
                okay.

                You're right, advocating extinction does lose a lot of people. It may not
                be feasible to convince everyone to stop breeding, but it's still the
                right thing to do.

                Les

                juan - k wrote:
                > I think you should seriously reconsider staying on the voluntary
                > human extinction spot since it's nearly impossible for everyone on
                > this world to accept it and follow it.
                >
                > Why don't you think on something more feasible? I think you could get
                > more followers if you change the subject.
                >
                >
                > greetings
                >
                > Juank
                ____________________________________________________________
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