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Re: [WardOneDC] Re:

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  • Timothy Prendergast
    I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the entire listserv. It s neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of adults.
    Message 1 of 15 , May 14, 2010
      I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of adults. Please keep it to yourselves.

      Respectfully,

      Tim Prendergast
      Resident
      Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.

      On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@...> wrote:
       

      am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does not apply to me. I

      --- On Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@...> wrote:
      Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM




      Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does apply. 

      Sent from Mobile S.A.M.

      202 / 716-7611

      On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@...> wrote:

       
      ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act, which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government employee; I am an elected government official.

      --- On Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@yahoo.com> wrote:

      From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@yahoo.com>
      Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
      To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
      Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
      Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM



      Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn. 

      Sent from Mobile S.A.M.

      202 / 716-7611

      On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@yahoo.com> wrote:

       
      Mr. Moore,
       
      I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night. (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)

      --- On Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@yahoo.com> wrote:

      From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@yahoo.com>
      Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
      To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
      Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <bbpair@...>, "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
      Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM



      Mr. Johnson,

      After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response. 

      Samuel Moore
      Resident 
      ANC SMD 1A09

      On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@yahoo.com> wrote:

       
      Betty,
       
      I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm not surprised by your response.

      --- On Thu, 5/13/10, bbpair@... <bbpair@...> wrote:

      From: bbpair@... <bbpair@...>
      Subject:
      To: lisakralovic@yahoo.com, slimwood145@yahoo.com, LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
      Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM

      It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.















    • squidpants
      Despite the childish behavior, I m curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there s someone neutral who could
      Message 2 of 15 , May 14, 2010
        Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.

        Thanks.

        --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@...> wrote:
        >
        > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
        > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
        > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
        >
        > Respectfully,
        >
        > Tim Prendergast
        > Resident
        > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
        >
        > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@...>wrote:
        >
        > >
        > >
        > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
        > > not apply to me. I
        > >
        > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@...>* wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@...>
        > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
        > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
        > > apply.
        > >
        > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
        > >
        > > 202 / 716-7611
        > > moore.samuel.a@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@...>
        > >
        > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@...>>
        > > wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
        > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
        > > employee; I am an elected government official.
        > >
        > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@...>* wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@...>
        > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
        > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
        > >
        > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
        > >
        > > 202 / 716-7611
        > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@...>
        > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
        > >
        > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@...>
        > > yahoo.com> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > Mr. Moore,
        > >
        > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
        > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
        > >
        > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
        > > >* wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
        > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
        > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
        > > ps.com>
        > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > bbpair@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>>,
        > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
        > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
        > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Mr. Johnson,
        > >
        > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
        > >
        > > Samuel Moore
        > > Resident
        > > ANC SMD 1A09
        > >
        > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@...><http://yahoo.com/>
        > > yahoo.com> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > Betty,
        > >
        > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
        > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
        > > not surprised by *your* response.
        > >
        > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
        > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > bbpair@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > bbpair@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > >* wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > bbpair@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > bbpair@...<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@...>
        > > >
        > > Subject:
        > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
        > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
        > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
        > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
        > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
        > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
        > >
        > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
        > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
        > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
      • Jack
        OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday
        Message 3 of 15 , May 16, 2010
          OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.

          The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.

          Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.

          What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.

          Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.

          Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491

          From: cliffvalenti@...
          To: emilyrc@...; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
          Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400

          Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.

          Thanks,
          Cliff


          -- Jack McKay
          ANC 1D03


          --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@...> wrote:
          >
          > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
          >
          > Thanks.
          >
          > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
          > >
          > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
          > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
          > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
          > >
          > > Respectfully,
          > >
          > > Tim Prendergast
          > > Resident
          > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
          > >
          > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
          > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
          > > > not apply to me. I
          > > >
          > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
          > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
          > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
          > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
          > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
          > > > apply.
          > > >
          > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
          > > >
          > > > 202 / 716-7611
          > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
          > > >
          > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
          > > > wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
          > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
          > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
          > > >
          > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
          > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
          > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
          > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
          > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
          > > >
          > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
          > > >
          > > > 202 / 716-7611
          > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
          > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
          > > >
          > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
          > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Mr. Moore,
          > > >
          > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
          > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
          > > >
          > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
          > > > >* wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
          > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
          > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
          > > > ps.com>
          > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
          > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
          > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
          > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Mr. Johnson,
          > > >
          > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
          > > >
          > > > Samuel Moore
          > > > Resident
          > > > ANC SMD 1A09
          > > >
          > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
          > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Betty,
          > > >
          > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
          > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
          > > > not surprised by *your* response.
          > > >
          > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
          > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > >* wrote:
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
          > > > >
          > > > Subject:
          > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
          > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
          > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
          > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
          > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
          > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
          > > >
          > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
          > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
          > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • whj@melanet.com
          Jack, We asked Cliff to step in and do a very challenging job and in very difficult political environment. Unfortunately his did not quite have the
          Message 4 of 15 , May 16, 2010
            Jack,
             
            We asked Cliff to step in and do a very challenging job and in very difficult political environment.  Unfortunately his did not quite have the temperament for the job, but he got us through a period which would have been very difficult.  While I don't agree with him on some things, I thank him for his services as chair.  ANC1A attempts to imultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth.  This is nearly impossible.
             
            ANC1A is probably one of the most important commissions to the future of this city.  We have accomplished more in the last year than most realize and we will accomplish much more.
             
            Abolishing ANCs is at best short-sighted.
             
            William Jordan, ANC 1A05 
             

            -----Original Message-----
            From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...>
            Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 11:06am
            To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation

            OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.

            The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.

            Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.

            What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.

            Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.

            Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491

            From: cliffvalenti@...
            To: emilyrc@...; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
            Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400

            Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think AN
            C's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.

            Thanks,
            Cliff


            -- Jack McKay
            ANC 1D03


            --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@...> wrote:
            >
            > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
            >
            > Thanks.
            >
            > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
            > >
            > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
            > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
            > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
            > >
            > > Respectfully,
            > >
            > > Tim Prendergast
            > > Resident
            > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
            > >
            > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
            > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
            > > > not apply to me. I
            > > >
            > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
            > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
            > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
            > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
            > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
            > > > apply.
            > > >
            > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
            > > >
            > > > 202 / 716-7611
            > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
            > > >
            > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
            > > > wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
            > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
            > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
            > > >
            > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
            > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
            > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
            > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
            > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
            > > >
            > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
            > > >
            > > > 202 / 716-7611
            > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
            > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
            > > >
            > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
            > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Mr. Moore,
            > > >
            > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
            > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
            > > >
            > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
            > > > >* wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
            > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
            > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
            > > > ps.com>
            > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
            > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
            > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
            > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Mr. Johnson,
            > > >
            > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
            > > >
            > > > Samuel Moore
            > > > Resident
            > > > ANC SMD 1A09
            > > >
            > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
            > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Betty,
            > > >
            > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
            > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
            > > > not surprised by *your* response.
            > > >
            > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
            > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > >* wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
            > > > >
            > > > Subject:
            > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
            > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
            > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
            > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
            > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
            > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
            > > >
            > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
            > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
            > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >




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          • Cliff
            Jack - I m afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove
            Message 5 of 15 , May 16, 2010
              Jack -

              I'm afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove the sticker. As chair, Bill asked me to address this before moving on. I handed the mike to Bill so he could express his concern. I probably should have just asked Bill to go over to Lenwood and ask him to remove the sticker, but I did not think of it at the time as his dismay was quite a shock to me. I consider that incident petty, but I do like your advice as to a better way to have handeled it, but again the sticket was not my concern. In no way do I think being chair is like being crowned king, but given the complicated personalities on the commission for a year and a half I think I handled it as good as anyone could. My resignation was prompted after some very disturbing things were said to me at that meeting without the commissioners support of using roberts rules. That, in combination with all the things listed in the email you posted. My statement about abolishing ANC's was made in hast, but something should be done to make members more accountable.

              Thanks,
              Cliff

              --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...> wrote:
              >
              > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
              >
              > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
              >
              > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
              >
              > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
              >
              > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
              >
              > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
              > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
              >
              > From: cliffvalenti@
              > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
              > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
              >
              > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
              >
              > Thanks,
              > Cliff
              >
              >
              > -- Jack McKay
              > ANC 1D03
              >
              >
              > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
              > >
              > > Thanks.
              > >
              > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
              > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
              > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
              > > >
              > > > Respectfully,
              > > >
              > > > Tim Prendergast
              > > > Resident
              > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
              > > >
              > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
              > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
              > > > > not apply to me. I
              > > > >
              > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
              > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
              > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
              > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
              > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
              > > > > apply.
              > > > >
              > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
              > > > >
              > > > > 202 / 716-7611
              > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
              > > > >
              > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
              > > > > wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
              > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
              > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
              > > > >
              > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
              > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
              > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
              > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
              > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
              > > > >
              > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
              > > > >
              > > > > 202 / 716-7611
              > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
              > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
              > > > >
              > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
              > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Mr. Moore,
              > > > >
              > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
              > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
              > > > >
              > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
              > > > > >* wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
              > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
              > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
              > > > > ps.com>
              > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
              > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
              > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
              > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Mr. Johnson,
              > > > >
              > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
              > > > >
              > > > > Samuel Moore
              > > > > Resident
              > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
              > > > >
              > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
              > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Betty,
              > > > >
              > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
              > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
              > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
              > > > >
              > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
              > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > >* wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
              > > > > >
              > > > > Subject:
              > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
              > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
              > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
              > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
              > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
              > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
              > > > >
              > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
              > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
              > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • whj@melanet.com
              Two meetings ago a gentleman observed that the rules were not being applied consistantly. A little too often this was the case, having the affect of
              Message 6 of 15 , May 17, 2010
                Two meetings ago a gentleman observed that the "rules" were not being applied consistantly.  A little too often this was the case, having the affect of silencing debate and input.  One of the purposes of an ANC meeting is to allow issues to come up and for the commissioners to debate and vote.  The public is there to be given the opportunity to observe this process of the commission handling this business.  There is really no time table on these deliberations, especially given that ANC1A meetings are one of the few forums where opposing views can be publically expressed in the Ward.  This is especially true during the townhall portion of the meeting which allows residents and others to express their views.  We the "rules" creep into being used to silence opposition there is going to be trouble. 
                 
                In terms of personalities, in my observations this has been one of the easiest most cooperative ANC1A groups to lead. 
                 
                William
                 

                -----Original Message-----
                From: "Cliff" <hiitsnino@...>
                Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 9:53pm
                To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation

                Jack -

                I'm afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove the sticker. As chair, Bill asked me to address this before moving on. I handed the mike to Bill so he could express his concern. I probably should have just asked Bill to go over to Lenwood and ask him to remove the sticker, but I did not think of it at the time as his dismay was quite a shock to me. I consider that incident petty, but I do like your advice as to a better way to have handeled it, but again the sticket was not my concern. In no way do I think being chair is like being crowned king, but given the complicated personalities on the commission for a year and a half I think I handled it as good as anyone could. My resignation was prompted after some very disturbing things were said to me at that meeting without the commissioners support of using roberts rules. That, in combination with all the things listed in th
                e email you posted. My statement about abolishing ANC's was made in hast, but something should be done to make members more accountable.

                Thanks,
                Cliff

                --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...> wrote:
                >
                > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                >
                > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                >
                > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                >
                > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                >
                > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                >
                > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                >
                > From: cliffvalenti@
                > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                >
                > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think
                ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                >
                > Thanks,
                > Cliff
                >
                >
                > -- Jack McKay
                > ANC 1D03
                >
                >
                > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                > >
                > > Thanks.
                > >
                > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                > > >
                > > > Respectfully,
                > > >
                > > > Tim Prendergast
                > > > Resident
                > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                > > >
                > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                > > > > not apply to me. I
                > > > >
                > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                > > > > apply.
                > > > >
                > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                > > > >
                > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                > > > >
                > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                > > > > wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                > > > >
                > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                > > > >
                > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                > > > >
                > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                > > > >
                > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Mr. Moore,
                > > > >
                > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                > > > >
                > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                > > > > >* wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                > > > > ps.com>
                > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                > > > >
                > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                > > > >
                > > > > Samuel Moore
                > > > > Resident
                > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                > > > >
                > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Betty,
                > > > >
                > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                > > > >
                > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > >* wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                > > > > >
                > > > > Subject:
                > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                > > > >
                > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >




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              • Jack
                William -- you wrote ANC1A attempts to simultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth.
                Message 7 of 15 , May 17, 2010
                  William -- you wrote "ANC1A attempts to simultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible." Yes, that observation is right on. As one attending your meetings on occasion, I find it very irritating to have to sit through speeches from residents in the audience, while ANC business waits. This makes for long and unproductive meetings.

                  We've addressed this problem by limiting audience participation to the "public discussion" period. We do *not* query the audience for "what do you think?" on every issue that comes up. If there's someone present with particular knowledge, that person may be called upon. But the discussion of ANC resolutions is, with that exception, limited to commissioners. This allows business to proceed at an efficient pace.

                  Then, to respond to complaints that people in the audience weren't allowed sufficient participation, we established "informal" ANC meetings, once a month, dedicated to ANC dialog with residents. Nobody likes having a second monthly meeting, but this gives residents an opportunity to be heard, at length, without making our business meetings bog down in endless talk.

                  Your commission is twice the size of ours, making it even more important to limit the time spent talking about resolutions. Take eleven commissioners, add fifty or sixty residents -- well, it's all too easy to spend an awful lot of time in interminable discussion.

                  -- Jack


                  --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, whj@... wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > Jack,
                  >
                  > We asked Cliff to step in and do a very challenging job and in very difficult political environment. Unfortunately his did not quite have the temperament for the job, but he got us through a period which would have been very difficult. While I don't agree with him on some things, I thank him for his services as chair. ANC1A attempts to imultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible.
                  >
                  > ANC1A is probably one of the most important commissions to the future of this city. We have accomplished more in the last year than most realize and we will accomplish much more.
                  >
                  > Abolishing ANCs is at best short-sighted.
                  >
                  > William Jordan, ANC 1A05
                  >
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...>
                  > Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 11:06am
                  > To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation
                  >
                  > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                  >
                  > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                  >
                  > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                  >
                  > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                  >
                  > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                  >
                  > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                  > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                  >
                  > From: cliffvalenti@
                  > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                  > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                  >
                  > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think AN
                  > C's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                  >
                  > Thanks,
                  > Cliff
                  >
                  >
                  > -- Jack McKay
                  > ANC 1D03
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                  > >
                  > > Thanks.
                  > >
                  > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                  > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                  > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                  > > >
                  > > > Respectfully,
                  > > >
                  > > > Tim Prendergast
                  > > > Resident
                  > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                  > > >
                  > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                  > > > > not apply to me. I
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                  > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                  > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                  > > > > apply.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                  > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                  > > > >
                  > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                  > > > > wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                  > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                  > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                  > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                  > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                  > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                  > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                  > > > >
                  > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                  > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Mr. Moore,
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                  > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                  > > > > >* wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                  > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                  > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                  > > > > ps.com>
                  > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                  > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                  > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                  > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                  > > > >
                  > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Samuel Moore
                  > > > > Resident
                  > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                  > > > >
                  > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                  > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Betty,
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                  > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                  > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                  > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > >* wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > Subject:
                  > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                  > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                  > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                  > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                  > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                  > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                  > > > >
                  > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                  > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                  > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
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                  >
                • Jack
                  OK, Cliff. If Bill Brown thought the Fenty sticker was improper, then he should have made a formal motion requesting that Lenwood remove the sticker, and then
                  Message 8 of 15 , May 17, 2010
                    OK, Cliff. If Bill Brown thought the Fenty sticker was improper, then he should have made a formal motion requesting that Lenwood remove the sticker, and then you could have handled it with regular parliamentary procedure. In the end, it would have been the commission's request, not yours, if the commission agreed that the sticker was improper.

                    The job of the chair is to determine the sense of the commission, and act accordingly. What's most important about a chairperson is that that person be recognized as fair and neutral. He's got to be seen as carrying out the commission's wishes, not his own.

                    Every ANC has aggressive personalities. Maybe that's a prerequisite for the job. Parliamentary procedure was invented to impose some discipline on meetings that could otherwise turn into shouting matches. I don't know what you mean by "without the commissioners support of using roberts rules", nor "make members more accountable".

                    -- Jack


                    --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Cliff" <hiitsnino@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Jack -
                    >
                    > I'm afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove the sticker. As chair, Bill asked me to address this before moving on. I handed the mike to Bill so he could express his concern. I probably should have just asked Bill to go over to Lenwood and ask him to remove the sticker, but I did not think of it at the time as his dismay was quite a shock to me. I consider that incident petty, but I do like your advice as to a better way to have handeled it, but again the sticket was not my concern. In no way do I think being chair is like being crowned king, but given the complicated personalities on the commission for a year and a half I think I handled it as good as anyone could. My resignation was prompted after some very disturbing things were said to me at that meeting without the commissioners support of using roberts rules. That, in combination with all the things listed in the email you posted. My statement about abolishing ANC's was made in hast, but something should be done to make members more accountable.
                    >
                    > Thanks,
                    > Cliff
                    >
                    > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Jack" <abuelo_jack@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                    > >
                    > > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                    > >
                    > > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                    > >
                    > > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                    > >
                    > > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                    > >
                    > > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                    > >
                    > > From: cliffvalenti@
                    > > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                    > > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                    > >
                    > > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                    > >
                    > > Thanks,
                    > > Cliff
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > -- Jack McKay
                    > > ANC 1D03
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                    > > >
                    > > > Thanks.
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                    > > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                    > > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Respectfully,
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Tim Prendergast
                    > > > > Resident
                    > > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                    > > > > > not apply to me. I
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                    > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                    > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                    > > > > > apply.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                    > > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                    > > > > > wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                    > > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                    > > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                    > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                    > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                    > > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                    > > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                    > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Mr. Moore,
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                    > > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                    > > > > > >* wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                    > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                    > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                    > > > > > ps.com>
                    > > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                    > > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                    > > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                    > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Samuel Moore
                    > > > > > Resident
                    > > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                    > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Betty,
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                    > > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                    > > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                    > > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > >* wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > Subject:
                    > > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                    > > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                    > > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                    > > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                    > > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                    > > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                    > > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                    > > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • cherita whiting
                    At-Large Councilmember Phil Mendelson, Chairperson of the Council’s Committee on Public Safety and the Judiciary, announces a Public Safety Community Meeting
                    Message 9 of 15 , May 17, 2010

                      At-Large Councilmember Phil Mendelson, Chairperson of the Council’s Committee on Public Safety and the Judiciary, announces a Public Safety Community Meeting to be held on Tuesday, June 1st at Covenant Baptist Church ( 3845 South Capitol Street, SW ) from 6:30 p.m. to 8:30 p.m.

                       

                      Joining Councilmember Mendelson at this meeting will be:

                       

                      Chief Cathy Lanier, Metropolitan Police Department

                       

                      Mr. Ron Machen, US Attorney for the District of Columbia

                       

                      Hon. Lee Satterfield, Chief Judge, Superior Court of the District of Columbia

                       

                      Mr. Robert Hildum, Deputy Attorney General for Public Safety

                       

                      Mr. David Muhammad, Chief of Committed Services at the Department of Youth Rehabilitation Services (DYRS)

                       

                      Representatives from Pretrial Services and Court Services & Offender Supervision Agency (CSOSA)

                       

                      The purpose of this meeting is to give the community an opportunity to demand answers from law enforcement about what they are doing to reduce violent crime.  Let your voice be heard at this important meeting!  For more information, please contact Ms. Deborah Kelly in Councilmember Mendelson’s office at (202)724-7808 or dkelly@....

                       

                       



                    • Timothy Prendergast
                      Please stop. I would like to stay on this listserv to receive pertinent information. I m tired of my inbox being filled with this incessant blather. If it
                      Message 10 of 15 , May 17, 2010
                        Please stop. I would like to stay on this listserv to receive pertinent information. I'm tired of my inbox being filled with this incessant blather. If it continues, I'll be inclined to unsubscribe and miss out on stuff actually intended for the community. If you are addressing messages to one another e.g. "Jack-" or, "Ok, Cliff" then please ensure that those messages go directly to the intended recipient. Please refrain from use of the "reply all" button, I would have done the same if I had both of your e-mail addresses. I'm sure you each have one anothers e-mail addresses.  Please help to preserve this forum as a place for pertinent community announcements and not personal squabbles.


                        Tim

                        On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:20 PM, Jack <abuelo_jack@...> wrote:
                         

                        OK, Cliff. If Bill Brown thought the Fenty sticker was improper, then he should have made a formal motion requesting that Lenwood remove the sticker, and then you could have handled it with regular parliamentary procedure. In the end, it would have been the commission's request, not yours, if the commission agreed that the sticker was improper.

                        The job of the chair is to determine the sense of the commission, and act accordingly. What's most important about a chairperson is that that person be recognized as fair and neutral. He's got to be seen as carrying out the commission's wishes, not his own.

                        Every ANC has aggressive personalities. Maybe that's a prerequisite for the job. Parliamentary procedure was invented to impose some discipline on meetings that could otherwise turn into shouting matches. I don't know what you mean by "without the commissioners support of using roberts rules", nor "make members more accountable".

                        -- Jack

                        --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Cliff" <hiitsnino@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Jack -
                        >
                        > I'm afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove the sticker. As chair, Bill asked me to address this before moving on. I handed the mike to Bill so he could express his concern. I probably should have just asked Bill to go over to Lenwood and ask him to remove the sticker, but I did not think of it at the time as his dismay was quite a shock to me. I consider that incident petty, but I do like your advice as to a better way to have handeled it, but again the sticket was not my concern. In no way do I think being chair is like being crowned king, but given the complicated personalities on the commission for a year and a half I think I handled it as good as anyone could. My resignation was prompted after some very disturbing things were said to me at that meeting without the commissioners support of using roberts rules. That, in combination with all the things listed in the email you posted. My statement about abolishing ANC's was made in hast, but something should be done to make members more accountable.
                        >
                        > Thanks,
                        > Cliff
                        >
                        > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "Jack" <abuelo_jack@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                        > >
                        > > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                        > >
                        > > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                        > >
                        > > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                        > >
                        > > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                        > >
                        > > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                        > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                        > >
                        > > From: cliffvalenti@
                        > > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                        > > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                        > > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                        > >
                        > > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                        > >
                        > > Thanks,
                        > > Cliff
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > -- Jack McKay
                        > > ANC 1D03
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                        > > >
                        > > > Thanks.
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                        > > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                        > > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Respectfully,
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Tim Prendergast
                        > > > > Resident
                        > > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                        > > > > > not apply to me. I
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                        > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                        > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                        > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                        > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                        > > > > > apply.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                        > > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                        > > > > > wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                        > > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                        > > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                        > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                        > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                        > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                        > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                        > > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                        > > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                        > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Mr. Moore,
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                        > > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                        > > > > > >* wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                        > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                        > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                        > > > > > ps.com>
                        > > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                        > > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                        > > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                        > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Samuel Moore
                        > > > > > Resident
                        > > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                        > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Betty,
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                        > > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                        > > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                        > > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > >* wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > Subject:
                        > > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                        > > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                        > > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                        > > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                        > > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                        > > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                        > > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                        > > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >


                      • whj@melanet.com
                        Jack, While the integration of Town Hall elements into the 1A meeting has its drawbacks, given our political environment it offers some checks and balances
                        Message 11 of 15 , May 19, 2010
                          Jack,
                           
                          While the integration of "Town Hall" elements into the 1A meeting has its drawbacks, given our political environment it offers some "checks and balances" and transparency where at times there would be very little. 
                           
                          William
                           


                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...>
                          Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:59am
                          To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation

                          William -- you wrote "ANC1A attempts to simultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible." Yes, that observation is right on. As one attending your meetings on occasion, I find it very irritating to have to sit through speeches from residents in the audience, while ANC business waits. This makes for long and unproductive meetings.

                          We've addressed this problem by limiting audience participation to the "public discussion" period. We do *not* query the audience for "what do you think?" on every issue that comes up. If there's someone present with particular knowledge, that person may be called upon. But the discussion of ANC resolutions is, with that exception, limited to commissioners. This allows business to proceed at an efficient pace.

                          Then, to respond to complaints that people in the audience weren't allowed sufficient participation, we established "informal" ANC meetings, once a month, dedicated to ANC dialog with residents. Nobody likes having a second monthly meeting, but this gives residents an opportunity to be heard, at length, without making our business meetings bog down in endless talk.

                          Your commission is twice the size of ours, making it even more important to limit the time spent talking about resolutions. Take eleven commissioners, add fifty or sixty residents -- well, it's all too easy to spend an awful lot of time in interminable discussion.

                          -- Jack


                          --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, whj@... wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > Jack,
                          >
                          > We asked Cliff to step in and do a very challenging job and in very difficult political environment. Unfortunately his did not quite have the temperament for the job, but he got us through a period which would have been very difficult. While I don't agree with him on some things, I thank him for his services as chair. ANC1A attempts to imultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible.
                          >
                          > ANC1A is probably one of the most important commissions to the future of this city. We have accomplished more in the last year than most realize and we will accomplish much more.
                          >
                          > Abolishing ANCs is at best short-sighted.
                          >
                          > William Jordan, ANC 1A05
                          >
                          >
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...>
                          > Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 11:06am
                          > To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation
                          >
                          > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                          >
                          > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                          >
                          > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                          >
                          > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                          >
                          > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                          >
                          > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                          >
                          > From: cliffvalenti@
                          > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                          > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                          >
                          > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think AN
                          > C's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                          >
                          > Thanks,
                          > Cliff
                          >
                          >
                          > -- Jack McKay
                          > ANC 1D03
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                          > >
                          > > Thanks.
                          > >
                          > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                          > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                          > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                          > > >
                          > > > Respectfully,
                          > > >
                          > > > Tim Prendergast
                          > > > Resident
                          > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                          > > >
                          > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                          > > > > not apply to me. I
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                          > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                          > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                          > > > > apply.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                          > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                          > > > >
                          > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                          > > > > wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                          > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                          > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                          > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                          > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                          > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                          > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                          > > > >
                          > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                          > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Mr. Moore,
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                          > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                          > > > > >* wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                          > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                          > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                          > > > > ps.com>
                          > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                          > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                          > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                          > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                          > > > >
                          > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Samuel Moore
                          > > > > Resident
                          > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                          > > > >
                          > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                          > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Betty,
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                          > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                          > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                          > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > >* wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > Subject:
                          > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                          > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                          > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                          > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                          > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                          > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                          > > > >
                          > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                          > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                          > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > >
                          > >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
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                          >
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                        • Jack
                          If you re not interested in this dialog, then delete the messages without reading them, just on the basis of the subject line. How hard is that? I do a lot of
                          Message 12 of 15 , May 19, 2010
                            If you're not interested in this dialog, then delete the messages without reading them, just on the basis of the subject line. How hard is that? I do a lot of that. A click of the mouse and poof, the uninteresting posting is gone. Time consumed, a fraction of a second.

                            Better for all than your proposed censorship, I think.

                            -- Jack McKay

                            --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Please stop. I would like to stay on this listserv to receive pertinent
                            > information. I'm tired of my inbox being filled with this incessant blather.
                            > If it continues, I'll be inclined to unsubscribe and miss out on stuff
                            > actually intended for the community. If you are addressing messages to one
                            > another e.g. "Jack-" or, "Ok, Cliff" then please ensure that those messages
                            > go directly to the intended recipient. Please refrain from use of the "reply
                            > all" button, I would have done the same if I had both of your e-mail
                            > addresses. I'm sure you each have one anothers e-mail addresses. Please
                            > help to preserve this forum as a place for pertinent community announcements
                            > and not personal squabbles.
                            >
                            >
                            > Tim
                            >
                            > On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:20 PM, Jack <abuelo_jack@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > OK, Cliff. If Bill Brown thought the Fenty sticker was improper, then he
                            > > should have made a formal motion requesting that Lenwood remove the sticker,
                            > > and then you could have handled it with regular parliamentary procedure. In
                            > > the end, it would have been the commission's request, not yours, if the
                            > > commission agreed that the sticker was improper.
                            > >
                            > > The job of the chair is to determine the sense of the commission, and act
                            > > accordingly. What's most important about a chairperson is that that person
                            > > be recognized as fair and neutral. He's got to be seen as carrying out the
                            > > commission's wishes, not his own.
                            > >
                            > > Every ANC has aggressive personalities. Maybe that's a prerequisite for the
                            > > job. Parliamentary procedure was invented to impose some discipline on
                            > > meetings that could otherwise turn into shouting matches. I don't know what
                            > > you mean by "without the commissioners support of using roberts rules", nor
                            > > "make members more accountable".
                            > >
                            > > -- Jack
                            > >
                            > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>, "Cliff"
                            > > <hiitsnino@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Jack -
                            > > >
                            > > > I'm afraid some of your information is incorrect. I could care less about
                            > > what sticker Lenwood Johnson wears. Bill Brown asked that Lenwood remove the
                            > > sticker. As chair, Bill asked me to address this before moving on. I handed
                            > > the mike to Bill so he could express his concern. I probably should have
                            > > just asked Bill to go over to Lenwood and ask him to remove the sticker, but
                            > > I did not think of it at the time as his dismay was quite a shock to me. I
                            > > consider that incident petty, but I do like your advice as to a better way
                            > > to have handeled it, but again the sticket was not my concern. In no way do
                            > > I think being chair is like being crowned king, but given the complicated
                            > > personalities on the commission for a year and a half I think I handled it
                            > > as good as anyone could. My resignation was prompted after some very
                            > > disturbing things were said to me at that meeting without the commissioners
                            > > support of using roberts rules. That, in combination with all the things
                            > > listed in the email you posted. My statement about abolishing ANC's was made
                            > > in hast, but something should be done to make members more accountable.
                            > > >
                            > > > Thanks,
                            > > > Cliff
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>, "Jack"
                            > > <abuelo_jack@> wrote:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my
                            > > eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what
                            > > happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice
                            > > of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on
                            > > his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood
                            > > defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've
                            > > been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this
                            > > act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation
                            > > of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to
                            > > enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing
                            > > orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no
                            > > more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how
                            > > to behave.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan.
                            > > Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty
                            > > sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening
                            > > consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation,
                            > > one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that
                            > > -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term
                            > > commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times,
                            > > when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been
                            > > crowned king.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow
                            > > commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                            > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                            > > > >
                            > > > > From: cliffvalenti@
                            > > > > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com<columbia_heights%40yahoogroups.com>
                            > > > > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                            > > > > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I
                            > > resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge
                            > > roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact,
                            > > our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that
                            > > the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for
                            > > the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some
                            > > commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills
                            > > without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this,
                            > > oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is
                            > > properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting
                            > > various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the
                            > > information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense
                            > > they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made
                            > > me think ANC's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this
                            > > area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be
                            > > expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community
                            > > instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Thanks,
                            > > > > Cliff
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > -- Jack McKay
                            > > > > ANC 1D03
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>,
                            > > "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did
                            > > Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone
                            > > neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Thanks.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>,
                            > > Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish
                            > > banter to the
                            > > > > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or
                            > > becoming of
                            > > > > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > Respectfully,
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > Tim Prendergast
                            > > > > > > Resident
                            > > > > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard
                            > > upgrade.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@
                            > > >wrote:
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch
                            > > Act does
                            > > > > > > > not apply to me. I
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                            > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                            > > > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>" <
                            > > WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>>
                            > > > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>" <
                            > > WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>>
                            > > > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act
                            > > does
                            > > > > > > > apply.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                            > > > > > > > moore.samuel.a@<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                            > > > > > > > wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the
                            > > Hatch Act,
                            > > > > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a
                            > > government
                            > > > > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                            > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                            > > > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>" <
                            > > WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>>
                            > > > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>" <
                            > > WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com <WardOneDC%40yahoogroups.com>>
                            > > > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                            > > > > > > > moore.samuel.<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                            > > > > > > > a@... <a%40gmail.com> <
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                            > > > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Mr. Moore,
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday
                            > > night.
                            > > > > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/
                            > > >yahoo.com
                            > > > > > > > >* wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                            > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                            > > > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com"
                            > > <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                            > > > > > > > ps.com>
                            > > > > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                            > > > > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com"
                            > > <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                            > > > > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                            > > > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your
                            > > response.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Samuel Moore
                            > > > > > > > Resident
                            > > > > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><
                            > > http://yahoo.com/>
                            > > > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Betty,
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I
                            > > would think
                            > > > > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action.
                            > > However, I'm
                            > > > > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                            > > > > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > >* wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><
                            > > http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Subject:
                            > > > > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>
                            > > yahoo.com,
                            > > > > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                            > > > > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us,
                            > > james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                            > > > > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us,
                            > > sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                            > > > > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                            > > > > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his
                            > > own
                            > > > > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission..
                            > > .and not
                            > > > > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                          • Jack
                            Yes, that could be so. Your proceedings might be more manageable if 1A were split into two ANCs, east (Georgia Avenue corridor) and west (14th Street
                            Message 13 of 15 , May 19, 2010
                              Yes, that could be so. Your proceedings might be more manageable if 1A were split into two ANCs, east (Georgia Avenue corridor) and west (14th Street corridor). I see that PSA 302 is doing just that. A six-person ANC is much easier to work with than an 11-member commission.

                              There will be redistricting in a couple of years, following the 2010 census, and that restructuring of 1A might be a real possibility.

                              -- Jack

                              --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, whj@... wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > Jack,
                              >
                              > While the integration of "Town Hall" elements into the 1A meeting has its drawbacks, given our political environment it offers some "checks and balances" and transparency where at times there would be very little.
                              >
                              > William
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > -----Original Message-----
                              > From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@...>
                              > Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:59am
                              > To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                              > Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation
                              >
                              > William -- you wrote "ANC1A attempts to simultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible." Yes, that observation is right on. As one attending your meetings on occasion, I find it very irritating to have to sit through speeches from residents in the audience, while ANC business waits. This makes for long and unproductive meetings.
                              >
                              > We've addressed this problem by limiting audience participation to the "public discussion" period. We do *not* query the audience for "what do you think?" on every issue that comes up. If there's someone present with particular knowledge, that person may be called upon. But the discussion of ANC resolutions is, with that exception, limited to commissioners. This allows business to proceed at an efficient pace.
                              >
                              > Then, to respond to complaints that people in the audience weren't allowed sufficient participation, we established "informal" ANC meetings, once a month, dedicated to ANC dialog with residents. Nobody likes having a second monthly meeting, but this gives residents an opportunity to be heard, at length, without making our business meetings bog down in endless talk.
                              >
                              > Your commission is twice the size of ours, making it even more important to limit the time spent talking about resolutions. Take eleven commissioners, add fifty or sixty residents -- well, it's all too easy to spend an awful lot of time in interminable discussion.
                              >
                              > -- Jack
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, whj@ wrote:
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Jack,
                              > >
                              > > We asked Cliff to step in and do a very challenging job and in very difficult political environment. Unfortunately his did not quite have the temperament for the job, but he got us through a period which would have been very difficult. While I don't agree with him on some things, I thank him for his services as chair. ANC1A attempts to imultaneously combine an ANC business meeting in public with an active townhall meeting switching back and forth. This is nearly impossible.
                              > >
                              > > ANC1A is probably one of the most important commissions to the future of this city. We have accomplished more in the last year than most realize and we will accomplish much more.
                              > >
                              > > Abolishing ANCs is at best short-sighted.
                              > >
                              > > William Jordan, ANC 1A05
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > -----Original Message-----
                              > > From: "Jack" <abuelo_jack@>
                              > > Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 11:06am
                              > > To: WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com
                              > > Subject: [WardOneDC] Re: ANC1A chair resignation
                              > >
                              > > OK, as a neutral observer with some experience in ANC matters (in my eighth year on the Mount Pleasant ANC), perhaps I can elucidate what happened Wednesday evening. Yes, I was there, just because I make a practice of visiting adjacent ANCs.
                              > >
                              > > The issue was Lenwood Johnson wearing a large green Fenty sticker on his shirt. Cliff Valenti demanded that he remove the sticker, and Lenwood defied Cliff's demand. Very unpleasant scene.
                              > >
                              > > Yes, we ANC commissioners are subject to the Hatch Act, something we've been trying to change. Cliff's attempt to enforce his interpretation of this act on Lenwood was, I think, a mistake. Whether the sticker was a violation of the Hatch Act or not is not for him to decide, nor is it his job to enforce the Hatch Act. Furthermore, ANC chairpersons should not be issuing orders to commissioners. It's their job to preside over the meeting, and no more. They're not boss commissioners, telling the lesser commissioners how to behave.
                              > >
                              > > What is pertinent is the law requiring ANCs to be strictly nonpartisan. Cliff could have asked the commissioners if they considered Lenwood's Fenty sticker a violation of the ANC's nonpartisan position, threatening consequences for the ANC as a whole. That would have resolved the situation, one way or the other, without precipitating an ugly confrontation.
                              > >
                              > > Being ANC chairperson is a difficult job -- I've been there, done that -- and it's a job that should never, in my opinion, be given to a first-term commissioner like Cliff. Our commission also went through some rough times, when a novice commissioner was elected chair, and thought he had been crowned king.
                              > >
                              > > Cliff has departed with an unfortunate blast at his fellow commissioners, which I excerpt from this posting:
                              > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/message/32491
                              > >
                              > > From: cliffvalenti@
                              > > To: emilyrc@; columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                              > > Subject: RE: your resignation as chair
                              > > Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:28:42 -0400
                              > >
                              > > Well thank you very much. Yes, I am still the ANC rep for 1A08 but I resigned as chair because the commission as a whole refuses to acknowledge roberts rules of order, bylaws, and standard operating procedures. In fact, our secretary does not keep proper minutes or proper records. I'd hoped that the secretary we elected in January would change that but its just par for the coarse and there isn't anything I can do about it. On finances some commissioners take $50.00 a month in petty cash or rev up cell phone bills without justifying what the expense is really for (our rules do allow this, oddly), they get grants on the agenda but never follow up to see it is properly spent or receipts get turned in, and letters opposing or supporting various issues are voted on without the public even being able to review the information. I try to stop this stuff from getting on the agenda but sense they ignore rules things just sail on. Personally, being on the ANC has made me think AN
                              > > C's should be abolished but on the other hand residents in this area don't pay enough attention to whats going on with the ANC so its to be expected. I feel more productive using my time to do things in my community instead of planning for a meeting that turns into a circus every month.
                              > >
                              > > Thanks,
                              > > Cliff
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > -- Jack McKay
                              > > ANC 1D03
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, "squidpants" <awiseman@> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Despite the childish behavior, I'm curious what the issue is? Why did Cliff resign, and what was the supposed illegal act? If there's someone neutral who could explain this, I'd be interested.
                              > > >
                              > > > Thanks.
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Prendergast <kidgumby@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > I hope you all realize that you are sending out your childish banter to the
                              > > > > entire listserv. It's neither appropriate for this forum or becoming of
                              > > > > adults. Please keep it to yourselves.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Respectfully,
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Tim Prendergast
                              > > > > Resident
                              > > > > Sent from from my Dell Optiplex GX 550 WITH Golden Keyboard upgrade.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 2:57 AM, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@>wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > am neither a federal nor local government employee, so the Hatch Act does
                              > > > > > not apply to me. I
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                              > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                              > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 2:04 AM
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Well, since it's a D.C. electeded position, the Federal Hatch Act does
                              > > > > > apply.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                              > > > > > moore.samuel.a@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:43, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>>
                              > > > > > wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > ...And I wish you would take the time to find understand the Hatch Act,
                              > > > > > which is applicable only to government employees. I am not a government
                              > > > > > employee; I am an elected government official.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@>* wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@>
                              > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                              > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > > > > Cc: "WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:21 AM
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Hatch Act, I wish you gave a damn.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Sent from Mobile S.A.M.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > 202 / 716-7611
                              > > > > > moore.samuel.<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=moore.samuel.a@>
                              > > > > > a@... <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=a@...>
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > On May 14, 2010, at 1:11, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@>
                              > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Mr. Moore,
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > I'm sorry that I parked too close to a fire hydrant Wednesday night.
                              > > > > > (Luckily, I didn't get a ticket.)
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- On *Fri, 5/14/10, Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com
                              > > > > > >* wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > From: Sam Moore <saverymoore@ <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com>
                              > > > > > Subject: Re: [WardOneDC] Re:
                              > > > > > To: "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                              > > > > > ps.com>
                              > > > > > Cc: "bbpair@aol. com" <<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>>,
                              > > > > > "WardOneDC@yahoogro <http://ups.com/>ups.com" <WardOneDC@yahoogrou<http://ps.com/>
                              > > > > > ps.com>, "anc1a@yahoogroups. com" <anc1a@yahoogroups. com>
                              > > > > > Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 12:41 AM
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Mr. Johnson,
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > After your illegal behavior last night, Im not surprised by your response.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Samuel Moore
                              > > > > > Resident
                              > > > > > ANC SMD 1A09
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > On May 13, 2010, at 22:06, Lenwood Johnson <slimwood145@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=slimwood145@><http://yahoo.com/>
                              > > > > > yahoo.com> wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Betty,
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > I simply forwarded Cliff's resignation note to the public. I would think
                              > > > > > any sensible person would find nothing wrong with my action. However, I'm
                              > > > > > not surprised by *your* response.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- On *Thu, 5/13/10,
                              > > > > > <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > < <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > >* wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > From: <http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@><http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > bbpair@<http://us.mc306.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=bbpair@>
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > Subject:
                              > > > > > To: lisakralovic@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                              > > > > > slimwood145@ <http://yahoo.com/> <http://yahoo.com/>yahoo.com,
                              > > > > > LGTHOMAS@att. blackberry. net, cwoodland@dccouncil .us, james.simcox@<http://gtsi.com/><http://gtsi.com/>
                              > > > > > gtsi.com, whj@melanet. com, wbrown@dccouncil. us, sandrascottland@<http://yahoo.com/><http://yahoo.com/>
                              > > > > > yahoo.com, moralmb@yahoo. com
                              > > > > > Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 8:07 PM
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > It seems to me that Cliff should have been allowed to make his own
                              > > > > > announcement about what he is or is not doing on the commission.. .and not
                              > > > > > to have been pre-empted by Lenwood Johnson.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
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                              > > > > >
                              > > > >
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                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
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