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Re: [WarOf1812] Request: Pension Information

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  • Anne Woodley
    jeverett@sympatico.ca wrote; ... Do you mean this from Edward Costello about Tom Plunkett - I have quoted teh the anecdote direct from Costello;
    Message 1 of 5 , Jul 3, 2000
      jeverett@... wrote;

      > Second, a Question. Someone asked me what I knew about Pensions
      > granted to soldiers for wounds received, which left them incapable of
      > working. I have material on the Officers ("General Regulations and
      > Orders for the Army" [1811]), and a few references to Chelsea.
      > However, I have not seen a set of Regulations, or a table of rates,
      > for Privates and NCOs who were Out-Pensioners (I believe that is the
      > correct term). Now, I'm quite curious about this myself. I seem to
      > recall someone (Rifleman Harris?) getting a 6d pension. Can anyone
      > help?
      Do you mean this from Edward Costello about Tom Plunkett - I have quoted teh
      the anecdote direct from Costello;

      ===========BEGINS HERE==================
      While wearing a red coat, [Tom Plunkett] had a singular meeting with his
      former Colonel, then General Sir Sidney Beckwith, which I have often heard
      him relate. It is customary, as the reader may probably be aware, to have
      half-yearly inspections of our regiments at home. Shortly after Tom's having
      enlisted, it so happened, on one of the above occasions, when his regiment
      was formed for inspection that the duty devolved upon his old commander, Sir
      Sidney, who was in command of the district.
      In walking down the front rank scrutinising the appearance of the men, the
      General suddenly came to Tom, distinguished as he was by two medals on his
      breast.
      'Do my eyes deceive me?' said Sir Sidney. 'Surely you are Tom Plunket,
      formerly of my own regiment.
      'What's left of me, Sir,' replied Tom, who was seldom deficient in a prompt
      reply.
      'And what has again brought you into the service?' inquired Sir Sidney. 'I
      thought you had passed the board at Chelsea?'
      'So I did,' said Tom; 'but they only allowed me sixpence a day, Sir, so I
      told them to keep it for the young soldiers, as it wasn't enough for the
      old,. who had seen all the tough work out.'
      'Ha! the old thing, Tom, I perceive,' observed Sir Sidney, shaking his head
      and remarked to the Colonel of the regiment, as be proceeded down the
      ranks-'One of my bravest soldiers.
      The same day the General dined at the officers' mess, when Tom was sent for
      after dinner.
      Here Plunket, I have sent for you to give us a toast,' observed Sir Sidney,
      as he handed him a glass of wine.
      'Then, Sir, here's to the immortal memory of the poor fellows who fell in
      the Peninsula, Sir,' said Tom.
      The toast was drunk by all with much solemnity, when Tom was dismissed with
      a present from Sir Sidney. The following day Tom was made a corporal, and
      shortly afterwards, through the medium, I believe, of Sir Sidney, went up
      and passed the pension board at Kilmainham, which granted him a shilling a
      day.
      ==========ENDS HERE===========================

      Anne
    • Jason Everett
      ... Harris?) getting a 6d pension. Can anyone help? ... quoted the anecdote direct from Costello...[snip] Thanks Anne, although I m sure the 6d memory is from
      Message 2 of 5 , Jul 4, 2000
        --- In WarOf1812@egroups.com, Anne Woodley <awoodley@i...> wrote:
        > jeverett@s... wrote;
        >
        > [Question re Privates Pensions] I seem to recall someone (Rifleman
        Harris?) getting a 6d pension. Can anyone help?
        > Do you mean this from Edward Costello about Tom Plunkett - I have
        quoted the anecdote direct from Costello...[snip]

        Thanks Anne, although I'm sure the 6d memory is from a book on my
        shelf, which does not (yet) include Costello. If I find the time,
        I'll go through the various recollections in my library, but I'm
        pretty certain it was Harris. Even so, once I find it, this gives me
        two examples to back up the 6d supposition. I'd still like to see a
        summary of the Regulations, plus the rates for Sergeants, Corporals,
        Drummers, etc.

        R. Jason Everett,
        (Capt.), Incorporated Militia
      • IX Regiment
        Jason, I m always nervous about venturing information on this forum since everyone seems to know so much more about the regulations of the British Army than I
        Message 3 of 5 , Jul 4, 2000
          Jason,

          I'm always nervous about venturing information on this forum since
          everyone seems to know so much more about the regulations of the British
          Army than I do and are very quick to point out the errors of one's ways
          :-)

          However I have investigated the cases of James and Richard Hale, two
          brothers who were discharged from service in the IX Regiment of Foot
          (which is the reason for my interest!) serving from 1806 to 1814, after
          appearing before the Pensions Board of the Royal Military Hospital at
          Chelsea, the records are in the Public Records Office at Kew, London (GB
          not Canada).

          They were discharged on 23rd August 1814 and I have seen the entries in
          the ledgers, James was awarded 9d and Richard 1/-d, the difference
          appears to me to stem from the nature of their wounds. James lost the
          lower left forearm in front of San Sebastian on 31 August 1813 and
          Richard lost his right arm above the elbow in an action around Bayonne
          on 11 December 1813.

          I can only conclude that the pensions were based on the severity of the
          wounds assessed by the medical board, James had greater service and rank
          than his brother and a citation from his Company Captain but got a
          lesser pension.

          Most of the details are set down in "The Journal of James Hale Late
          Serjeant in the ninth Regiment of Foot" which I transcribed and
          republished in 1998.

          I have a supplementary question, does anyone know how the British Army
          in our period paid out the pensions?

          Cheers

          P**

          >> [Question re Privates Pensions] I seem to recall someone (Rifleman
          >Harris?) getting a 6d pension. Can anyone help?
          >> Do you mean this from Edward Costello about Tom Plunkett - I have
          >quoted the anecdote direct from Costello...[snip]
          >
          >Thanks Anne, although I'm sure the 6d memory is from a book on my
          >shelf, which does not (yet) include Costello. If I find the time,
          >I'll go through the various recollections in my library, but I'm
          >pretty certain it was Harris. Even so, once I find it, this gives me
          >two examples to back up the 6d supposition. I'd still like to see a
          >summary of the Regulations, plus the rates for Sergeants, Corporals,
          >Drummers, etc.
          >
          >R. Jason Everett,
          >(Capt.), Incorporated Militia
          --
          IX Regiment
        • BritcomHMP@aol.com
          In a message dated 7/3/2000 8:20:45 PM Central Daylight Time, jeverett@sympatico.ca writes:
          Message 4 of 5 , Jul 5, 2000
            In a message dated 7/3/2000 8:20:45 PM Central Daylight Time,
            jeverett@... writes:

            << Someone asked me what I knew about Pensions
            granted to soldiers for wounds received, which left them incapable of
            working. I have material on the Officers ("General Regulations and
            Orders for the Army" [1811]), and a few references to Chelsea.
            However, I have not seen a set of Regulations, or a table of rates,
            for Privates and NCOs who were Out-Pensioners (I believe that is the
            correct term). Now, I'm quite curious about this myself. I seem to
            recall someone (Rifleman Harris?) getting a 6d pension. Can anyone
            help?
            >>

            Dear Jason,

            I have the complete pension warrant for 1829, however there were previous
            ones 1806, 12, 14, 16(25th March), 16(19th December), 18, 22, 23(28th July),
            23(19th August), and 1826.
            The 29 supercedes all of the above.

            There is a table for rates of pension related to wounds, viz:
            First Degree.
            Men losing two limbs or both eyes from wound or being so severely wounded as
            to be totally incapable of earning a livelihood, and to require the
            assistance and care of some other person.

            from to
            s d s d
            Sergeant 2 6 3 6
            Corporal 2 0 3 0
            Private 1 6 2 0

            Second Degree
            Men rendered incapable of earning a livelihood, but not requiring the care of
            another person.
            from to
            s d s d
            Sergeant 2 0 3 0
            Corporal 1 6 2 0
            Private 1 0 1 6

            Third Degree
            Men able to contribute in a small degree towards a livelihood

            from to
            s d s d
            Sergeant 1 6 2 0
            Corporal 1 0 1 6
            Private 0 9 1 0

            Fourth Degree
            Men able to contribute materially towards a livelihood, although unfit for
            the ordinary duties of the service.

            from to
            s d s d
            Sergeant 1 0 1 6
            Corporal 0 9 1 0
            Private 0 6 0 9

            Hope the above is of help.

            Cheers

            Tim
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