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Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition

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  • tomross1812
    Dear list. To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006 Crown Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is interested in
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 8, 2005
      Dear list.

      To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006 Crown
      Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is
      interested in having a drill competition. We are thinking about a
      competition that would last about 5 to 7 mins with groups consisting of
      a minimum of 6 men with muskets. Interested groups will be given the
      necessary drill scenario before hand and be required to fire their
      muskets. We would like know whether there are a number of groups that
      would be interested in a drill competition? Since we have not done this
      before, we are also interested in how we should set the competetion
      rules.

      Private Tom Ross
      Royal Scots
      Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society
    • LCpl_rm
      Tom, Maryland once had an event at Fort Frederick every year called the Firelock Match. The competition was open to any unit carrying smoothbore, flintlock
      Message 2 of 5 , Dec 8, 2005
        Tom,

        Maryland once had an event at Fort Frederick every year called the Firelock Match. The competition was open to any unit carrying smoothbore, flintlock muskets and comprised three parts: camp, live fire and drill. Awards were given for each part of the unit competition, individual competitions and the overall winner. Except for the live firing where modern glasses could be worn, the entire competition had to be done in kit.

        The competition was open to units from the F&I, RevWar and 1812 and theoretically, any unit from 1720s to 1840s.

        The drill competition consisted of four parts: assembly, manual of arms, marching and firing. There were 3-5 judges each standing at a specific spot so that all units would be judged from the individual judges angle and perspective.

        The unit consisted of 5 soldiers and an NCO. The NCO would assemble the section, dress the line and then announce his unit to the judges. Once acknowledged and judging forms duly marked, the NCO would then lead the men in the manual of arms which would consist of facings and the loading procedure done with blank cartridge. Loading would be done by the numbers. A course was laid out using pegs or plates or suitable markers. Once the manual of arms was complete, the NCO would march his section through the course and was required to do: left wheel, right about wheel, incline left, incline right, left about wheel and finally a right wheel. Suitable space was given between wheeling markers.

        After negotiating the course, the NCO would bring his unit to a halt and fire a volley. The unit then reloads, using Prime & Load, and fires two more vollies. At the end of the third volley, once the unit returns to the shoulder the drill is over and the unit is free to move out of the competition area making way for the next unit.

        Due to many periods represented, judges did not necessarily have to know the various drills. Generally the judges are looking at how the unit drills or works together, are the movements done in unison, stumbling or twitching in the ranks, speed and unisomn of vollies and general deportment. By having a set group of instructions to follow, units would not go off doing their own thing; any additional movements or drill not in the set could cost points. Common movements meant that all units performed the same gyrations.

        Hope this helps. If you need further information, email me off the list.

        Ed Seufert, Cpl
        1812 Royal Marines



        ----- Original Message -----
        From: tomross1812
        To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 12:32 PM
        Subject: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition


        Dear list.

        To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006 Crown
        Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is
        interested in having a drill competition. We are thinking about a
        competition that would last about 5 to 7 mins with groups consisting of
        a minimum of 6 men with muskets. Interested groups will be given the
        necessary drill scenario before hand and be required to fire their
        muskets. We would like know whether there are a number of groups that
        would be interested in a drill competition? Since we have not done this
        before, we are also interested in how we should set the competetion
        rules.

        Private Tom Ross
        Royal Scots
        Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society






        The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of square miles...

        Unit Contact information for North America:
        ---------------------------------
        Crown Forces Unit Listing:
        http://1812crownforces.tripod.com

        American Forces Unit Listing
        http://usforces1812.tripod.com



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      • Tommy
        Thank you for the info Ed. I will be setting up my schedule for next year very soon. Any info and contact for events down this way will be appreciated and
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 8, 2005
          Thank you for the info Ed. I will be setting up my schedule for next year
          very soon. Any info and contact for events down this way will be
          appreciated and hopefully one day soon I will get to meet some of you.
          At 10:48 PM 12/8/2005 -0500, you wrote:
          >Tom,
          >
          >Maryland once had an event at Fort Frederick every year called the
          >Firelock Match. The competition was open to any unit carrying smoothbore,
          >flintlock muskets and comprised three parts: camp, live fire and
          >drill. Awards were given for each part of the unit competition,
          >individual competitions and the overall winner. Except for the live
          >firing where modern glasses could be worn, the entire competition had to
          >be done in kit.
          >
          >The competition was open to units from the F&I, RevWar and 1812 and
          >theoretically, any unit from 1720s to 1840s.
          >
          >The drill competition consisted of four parts: assembly, manual of arms,
          >marching and firing. There were 3-5 judges each standing at a specific
          >spot so that all units would be judged from the individual judges angle
          >and perspective.
          >
          >The unit consisted of 5 soldiers and an NCO. The NCO would assemble the
          >section, dress the line and then announce his unit to the judges. Once
          >acknowledged and judging forms duly marked, the NCO would then lead the
          >men in the manual of arms which would consist of facings and the loading
          >procedure done with blank cartridge. Loading would be done by the
          >numbers. A course was laid out using pegs or plates or suitable
          >markers. Once the manual of arms was complete, the NCO would march his
          >section through the course and was required to do: left wheel, right about
          >wheel, incline left, incline right, left about wheel and finally a right
          >wheel. Suitable space was given between wheeling markers.
          >
          >After negotiating the course, the NCO would bring his unit to a halt and
          >fire a volley. The unit then reloads, using Prime & Load, and fires two
          >more vollies. At the end of the third volley, once the unit returns to
          >the shoulder the drill is over and the unit is free to move out of the
          >competition area making way for the next unit.
          >
          >Due to many periods represented, judges did not necessarily have to know
          >the various drills. Generally the judges are looking at how the unit
          >drills or works together, are the movements done in unison, stumbling or
          >twitching in the ranks, speed and unisomn of vollies and general
          >deportment. By having a set group of instructions to follow, units would
          >not go off doing their own thing; any additional movements or drill not in
          >the set could cost points. Common movements meant that all units
          >performed the same gyrations.
          >
          >Hope this helps. If you need further information, email me off the list.
          >
          >Ed Seufert, Cpl
          >1812 Royal Marines
          >
          >
          >
          >----- Original Message -----
          > From: tomross1812
          > To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 12:32 PM
          > Subject: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition
          >
          >
          > Dear list.
          >
          > To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006 Crown
          > Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is
          > interested in having a drill competition. We are thinking about a
          > competition that would last about 5 to 7 mins with groups consisting of
          > a minimum of 6 men with muskets. Interested groups will be given the
          > necessary drill scenario before hand and be required to fire their
          > muskets. We would like know whether there are a number of groups that
          > would be interested in a drill competition? Since we have not done this
          > before, we are also interested in how we should set the competetion
          > rules.
          >
          > Private Tom Ross
          > Royal Scots
          > Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds
          > of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
          > THOUSANDS of square miles...
          >
          > Unit Contact information for North America:
          > ---------------------------------
          > Crown Forces Unit Listing:
          > <http://1812crownforces.tripod.com>http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
          >
          > American Forces Unit Listing
          > <http://usforces1812.tripod.com>http://usforces1812.tripod.com
          >
          >
          >
          >------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
          >
          > a.. Visit your group "WarOf1812" on the web.
          >
          > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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          > Service.
          >
          >
          >------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >
          >
          >
          >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          >The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of
          >square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS
          >of square miles...
          >
          >Unit Contact information for North America:
          > ---------------------------------
          >Crown Forces Unit Listing:
          ><http://1812crownforces.tripod.com>http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
          >
          >American Forces Unit Listing
          ><http://usforces1812.tripod.com>http://usforces1812.tripod.com
          >
          >
          >
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        • suthren@magma.ca
          If I may comment from the unmilitary ranks of sailordom, the introduction of a Drill Competition would likely add fun to the hobby and also help improve the
          Message 4 of 5 , Dec 9, 2005
            If I may comment from the unmilitary ranks of sailordom, the introduction of
            a Drill Competition would likely add fun to the hobby and also help improve
            the performance of drill generally. One of the most glaring discrepancies
            between the actual look of trained troops in 1812-1814 and ourselves (other
            than heavily overweight or inappropriately bearded participants) is our
            generally poor level of smartness in drill. Few participants who portray
            regulars manage to achieve the absolute stillness between parts of a drill
            movement, married with the swift, sure and crisp execution of the movements
            themselves, that distinguished regulars, and produced the 'clouds of
            pipeclay' dust that writers mentioned in the slap and speed of drill---even
            drill punctuated by the long counts of stillness common then. Once you've
            seen the USMC Presidential Guard, the Trooping of the Colours by the Brigade
            of Guards, or the Infantry Drill Squad of the Fort Henry Guard (Kingston,
            Ontario) you see the surviving heritage of choreographed excellence that was
            the operational hallmark of trained regular infantry of the 18th and 19th
            Centuries. Anything that helps the hobbyist aspire to that degree of
            precision only helps our accurate depictions of those well-trained infantry
            of long ago. Our shambling, eyes-down portrayals often fail to do them
            justice.

            Vic Suthren
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "LCpl_rm" <LCpl_RM@...>
            To: <WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 10:48 PM
            Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition


            > Tom,
            >
            > Maryland once had an event at Fort Frederick every year called the
            Firelock Match. The competition was open to any unit carrying smoothbore,
            flintlock muskets and comprised three parts: camp, live fire and drill.
            Awards were given for each part of the unit competition, individual
            competitions and the overall winner. Except for the live firing where
            modern glasses could be worn, the entire competition had to be done in kit.
            >
            > The competition was open to units from the F&I, RevWar and 1812 and
            theoretically, any unit from 1720s to 1840s.
            >
            > The drill competition consisted of four parts: assembly, manual of arms,
            marching and firing. There were 3-5 judges each standing at a specific spot
            so that all units would be judged from the individual judges angle and
            perspective.
            >
            > The unit consisted of 5 soldiers and an NCO. The NCO would assemble the
            section, dress the line and then announce his unit to the judges. Once
            acknowledged and judging forms duly marked, the NCO would then lead the men
            in the manual of arms which would consist of facings and the loading
            procedure done with blank cartridge. Loading would be done by the numbers.
            A course was laid out using pegs or plates or suitable markers. Once the
            manual of arms was complete, the NCO would march his section through the
            course and was required to do: left wheel, right about wheel, incline left,
            incline right, left about wheel and finally a right wheel. Suitable space
            was given between wheeling markers.
            >
            > After negotiating the course, the NCO would bring his unit to a halt and
            fire a volley. The unit then reloads, using Prime & Load, and fires two
            more vollies. At the end of the third volley, once the unit returns to the
            shoulder the drill is over and the unit is free to move out of the
            competition area making way for the next unit.
            >
            > Due to many periods represented, judges did not necessarily have to know
            the various drills. Generally the judges are looking at how the unit drills
            or works together, are the movements done in unison, stumbling or twitching
            in the ranks, speed and unisomn of vollies and general deportment. By
            having a set group of instructions to follow, units would not go off doing
            their own thing; any additional movements or drill not in the set could cost
            points. Common movements meant that all units performed the same gyrations.
            >
            > Hope this helps. If you need further information, email me off the list.
            >
            > Ed Seufert, Cpl
            > 1812 Royal Marines
            >
            >
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: tomross1812
            > To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 12:32 PM
            > Subject: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition
            >
            >
            > Dear list.
            >
            > To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006 Crown
            > Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is
            > interested in having a drill competition. We are thinking about a
            > competition that would last about 5 to 7 mins with groups consisting of
            > a minimum of 6 men with muskets. Interested groups will be given the
            > necessary drill scenario before hand and be required to fire their
            > muskets. We would like know whether there are a number of groups that
            > would be interested in a drill competition? Since we have not done this
            > before, we are also interested in how we should set the competetion
            > rules.
            >
            > Private Tom Ross
            > Royal Scots
            > Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds
            of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS
            of square miles...
            >
            > Unit Contact information for North America:
            > ---------------------------------
            > Crown Forces Unit Listing:
            > http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
            >
            > American Forces Unit Listing
            > http://usforces1812.tripod.com
            >
            >
            >
            > --------------------------------------------------------------------------
            ----
            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
            >
            > a.. Visit your group "WarOf1812" on the web.
            >
            > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > WarOf1812-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
            Service.
            >
            >
            > --------------------------------------------------------------------------
            ----
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of
            square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of
            square miles...
            >
            > Unit Contact information for North America:
            > ---------------------------------
            > Crown Forces Unit Listing:
            > http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
            >
            > American Forces Unit Listing
            > http://usforces1812.tripod.com
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --
            > No virus found in this incoming message.
            > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
            > Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.12/194 - Release Date: 07/12/05
            >
            >
          • ray hobbs
            Well said, Sir: I have this quotation from Private George Ferguson in 1809: Having received my military dress, I was drilled to the manual exercise, and use of
            Message 5 of 5 , Dec 9, 2005
              Well said, Sir:
              I have this quotation from Private George Ferguson in 1809:

              Having received my military dress, I was drilled to the manual
              exercise, and use of arms six hours per day.12 This was hard for me
              so little used to labour,

              And this was before he joined the Regular Army (the 100th), and while
              he was still a recruit in the Londonderry Militia. I am also rereading
              Andrew Uffindell's Wellington's Armies, which is a compilation of
              primary sources, and published by the National Army Museum. One thing
              that strikes me is the many references to the silence of the British
              line during battles. Tended to creep out the enemy.
              Having said this, I am fully aware that our Regiment's (41st) schedule
              of winter drill - once per month - is far from adequate. But we try.
              Yrs etc.
              Ray Hobbs
              CO 41st Regt.
              Hamilton

              On Friday, December 9, 2005, at 08:39 AM, <suthren@...> wrote:

              > If I may comment from the unmilitary ranks of sailordom, the
              > introduction of
              > a Drill Competition would likely add fun to the hobby and also help
              > improve
              > the performance of drill generally. One of the most glaring
              > discrepancies
              > between the actual look of trained troops in 1812-1814 and ourselves
              > (other
              > than heavily overweight or inappropriately bearded participants) is our
              > generally poor level of smartness in drill. Few participants who
              > portray
              > regulars manage to achieve the absolute stillness between parts of a
              > drill
              > movement, married with the swift, sure and crisp execution of the
              > movements
              > themselves, that distinguished regulars, and produced the 'clouds of
              > pipeclay' dust that writers mentioned in the slap and speed of
              > drill---even
              > drill punctuated by the long counts of stillness common then. Once
              > you've
              > seen the USMC Presidential Guard, the Trooping of the Colours by the
              > Brigade
              > of Guards, or the Infantry Drill Squad of the Fort Henry Guard
              > (Kingston,
              > Ontario) you see the surviving heritage of choreographed excellence
              > that was
              > the operational hallmark of trained regular infantry of the 18th and
              > 19th
              > Centuries. Anything that helps the hobbyist aspire to that degree of
              > precision only helps our accurate depictions of those well-trained
              > infantry
              > of long ago. Our shambling, eyes-down portrayals often fail to do them
              > justice.
              >
              > Vic Suthren
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "LCpl_rm" <LCpl_RM@...>
              > To: <WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 10:48 PM
              > Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition
              >
              >
              > > Tom,
              > >
              > > Maryland once had an event at Fort Frederick every year called the
              > Firelock Match.  The competition was open to any unit carrying
              > smoothbore,
              > flintlock muskets and comprised three parts: camp, live fire and drill.
              > Awards were given for each part of the unit competition, individual
              > competitions and the overall winner.  Except for the live firing where
              > modern glasses could be worn, the entire competition had to be done in
              > kit.
              > >
              > > The competition was open to units from the F&I, RevWar and 1812 and
              > theoretically, any unit from 1720s to 1840s.
              > >
              > > The drill competition consisted of four parts: assembly, manual of
              > arms,
              > marching and firing.  There were 3-5 judges each standing at a
              > specific spot
              > so that all units would be judged from the individual judges angle and
              > perspective.
              > >
              > > The unit consisted of 5 soldiers and an NCO.  The NCO would assemble
              > the
              > section, dress the line and then announce his unit to the judges.  Once
              > acknowledged and judging forms duly marked, the NCO would then lead
              > the men
              > in the manual of arms which would consist of facings and the loading
              > procedure done with blank cartridge.  Loading would be done by the
              > numbers.
              > A course was laid out using pegs or plates or suitable markers.  Once
              > the
              > manual of arms was complete, the NCO would march his section through
              > the
              > course and was required to do: left wheel, right about wheel, incline
              > left,
              > incline right, left about wheel and finally a right wheel.  Suitable
              > space
              > was given between wheeling markers.
              > >
              > > After negotiating the course, the NCO would bring his unit to a halt
              > and
              > fire a volley.  The unit then reloads, using Prime & Load, and fires
              > two
              > more vollies.  At the end of the third volley, once the unit returns
              > to the
              > shoulder the drill is over and the unit is free to move out of the
              > competition area making way for the next unit.
              > >
              > > Due to many periods represented, judges did not necessarily have to
              > know
              > the various drills.  Generally the judges are looking at how the unit
              > drills
              > or works together, are the movements done in unison, stumbling or
              > twitching
              > in the ranks, speed and unisomn of vollies and general deportment.  By
              > having a set group of instructions to follow, units would not go off
              > doing
              > their own thing; any additional movements or drill not in the set
              > could cost
              > points.  Common movements meant that all units performed the same
              > gyrations.
              > >
              > > Hope this helps.  If you need further information, email me off the
              > list.
              > >
              > > Ed Seufert, Cpl
              > > 1812 Royal Marines
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ----- Original Message -----
              > >   From: tomross1812
              > >   To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
              > >   Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 12:32 PM
              > >   Subject: [WarOf1812] Battle of Longwoods Drill Competition
              > >
              > >
              > >   Dear list.
              > >
              > >   To help celebrate the fact that the Battle of Longwoods is a 2006
              > Crown
              > >   Forces Event, the Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society is
              > >   interested in having a drill competition. We are thinking about a
              > >   competition that would last about 5 to 7 mins with groups
              > consisting of
              > >   a minimum of 6 men with muskets. Interested groups will be given
              > the
              > >   necessary drill scenario before hand and be required to fire their
              > >   muskets. We would like know whether there are a number of groups
              > that
              > >   would be interested in a drill competition? Since we have not done
              > this
              > >   before, we are also interested in how we should set the competetion
              > >   rules.
              > >
              > >   Private Tom Ross
              > >   Royal Scots
              > >   Upper Thames Military Reenactment Society
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >   The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of
              > hundreds
              > of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
              > THOUSANDS
              > of square miles...
              > >
              > >   Unit Contact information for North America:
              > >      ---------------------------------
              > >   Crown Forces Unit Listing:
              > >   http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
              > >
              > >   American Forces Unit Listing
              > >   http://usforces1812.tripod.com
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
              > ---
              > ----
              > >   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              > >
              > >     a..  Visit your group "WarOf1812" on the web.
              > >
              > >     b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > >      WarOf1812-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > >
              > >     c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
              > Service.
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
              > ---
              > ----
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of
              > hundreds of
              > square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
              > THOUSANDS of
              > square miles...
              > >
              > > Unit Contact information for North America:
              > >    ---------------------------------
              > > Crown Forces Unit Listing:
              > > http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
              > >
              > > American Forces Unit Listing
              > > http://usforces1812.tripod.com
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > --
              > > No virus found in this incoming message.
              > > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
              > > Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.12/194 - Release Date:
              > 07/12/05
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds
              > of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
              > THOUSANDS of square miles...
              >
              > Unit Contact information for North America:
              >    ---------------------------------
              > Crown Forces Unit Listing:
              > http://1812crownforces.tripod.com
              >
              > American Forces Unit Listing
              > http://usforces1812.tripod.com
              >
              >
              <image.tiff>
              >
              > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              >
              > +  Visit your group "WarOf1812" on the web.
              >  
              > +  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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