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Re: [WarOf1812] Pens and Histories

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  • Raymond Hobbs
    I have a copy of Noah Freer s requisition list for 1813. Freer was Military Secretary in the Canadas. Kevin is right - no metal nibs, just quills, hundreds
    Message 1 of 17 , Jun 2, 2002
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      I have a copy of Noah Freer's requisition list for 1813. Freer was
      Military Secretary in the Canadas. Kevin is right - no metal nibs, just
      quills, hundreds of them.
      Ray Hobbs
      41st Regt. of Foot

      Kevin Windsor wrote:

      > This was covered before. metal nibs were out, but someone posted (I
      > think king Larry)Napoleon's baggage list and no sign of metal nibs, so
      > if the "ruler of the free
      > world" didn't have them then no did. Especially lowly subalterns and
      > surgeons like us!
      > Lt Kevin
      > 89th
      >
      > "Ted Y." wrote:
      >
      > > This may have been covered in another thread some time
      > > ago, but were the wooden, metal tipped pens in use by
      > > the time of the war, or were they still using goose
      > > quills?
      > >
      > > Also, what's the best overall general history of the
      > > war?
      > >
      >
      >
      > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds
      > of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
      > THOUSANDS of square miles...
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Ted Y.
      ... Yes, That is another subject. I was just commenting to someone that 1812 reenacting reminded me in many ways of Rev. War in the late 60 s, about a decade
      Message 2 of 17 , Jun 2, 2002
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        > In the
        > past few years I've
        > seen sutlers attempting to sell steel nibbed pen
        > (often stuck into a
        > piece of broom corn as a handle. and feel this is
        > just an attempt to
        > sell their items. Mind you if people will sell
        > tricorn caps at 1812
        > events why not sell items which are well after our
        > period. OK, OK,
        > that's another subject.

        Yes, That is another subject. I was just commenting to
        someone that 1812 reenacting reminded me in many ways
        of Rev. War in the late 60's, about a decade before
        the bicentennial. Many people were using leftover gear
        and weaponry from the Civil War centennial, some of
        which was Spanish-American War surplus off
        Bannermann's Island. Only a few people weree turning
        out material for the Rev. War era and they weren't
        even making the correct muskets in a mass produced
        manner. Most of the flintlocks were either custom
        Besses or Belgian trade flintlocks, including some
        "Long Tom" guns that were taller than the folks
        carrying them. It seems like there's more that will go
        for 1812, but it's sometimes hard to tell what's
        correct if you are new to this. What are some good
        sutlers that offer period wares? I know that some seem
        to be catering to multi-period, meaning you could end
        up with something 1830's or 40's if you don't know.
        Some of the earlier material from the 18th century
        should work, but a number of things were on the way
        out
        by then, if not long gone, like the tricorns.

        Another point in question, what items do you think
        need to be reproduced that no one is making? For
        example; nobody thought to make a 3 band musket until
        AFTER the Civil War centennial ended. For Rev. War a
        mass produced 1st model Bess is still on the drawing
        board, but due perhaps next year, if India and
        Pakistan don't nuke each other. Palmetto Arms IS
        importing a North & Cheney pistol M1799, however.

        Y.H. & O.S.

        Ted Yeatman
        1st MD Rifle BN
        Fell's Point Rifles


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      • colsjtjones2000
        Heavens forbid that I would ever want to get involved in a dialogue re metal nibs again! Doug ... I ve ... a ... to ... softened ... than ... the ... 1840s
        Message 3 of 17 , Jun 3, 2002
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          Heavens forbid that I would ever want to get involved in a dialogue
          re metal nibs again! Doug



          --- In WarOf1812@y..., "lenthecooper" <lheidebrecht@L...> wrote:
          > Peter,
          > I don't think that this is quite correct. In the past few years
          I've
          > seen sutlers attempting to sell steel nibbed pen (often stuck into
          a
          > piece of broom corn as a handle. and feel this is just an attempt
          to
          > sell their items. Mind you if people will sell tricorn caps at 1812
          > events why not sell items which are well after our period. OK, OK,
          > that's another subject.
          >
          > Mell George, "Writing Antiques", Shire Publications LTD, 1996,UK
          >
          > Pg 5, Pens and Nibs
          > 'About 1823 some nibs were cut from horn and tortoiseshell,
          softened
          > and reinforced with chips of diamond, ruby and other gemstones for
          > greater durability. Thet made little impact for,in 1832, no less
          than
          > 33,668,000 quill pens were in use in Britian, most imported from
          the
          > continent.'...
          > '...quills almost disappeared when steel nibs were perfected..'
          > The book later goes onto speak toward the steel pen nibs of the
          1840s
          > and an 1849 glass pen and also about the reservoir systms for quill
          > pens (1819, the Penograghic Fountain Pen.)
          >
          > Cheers,
          >
          > Len
          >
          > --- In WarOf1812@y..., petemonahan@a... wrote:
          > > Ted
          > > The short answer is that there were steel pen nibs by 1812, but
          > they were
          > > probably not common.
          > >
          > > I did some research a couple of years ago on steel nibbed pens.
          > They were
          > > patented, or some version was, about 1818 or so, by a clever chap
          > in
          > > Birmingham (?). Or so says the pen collectors club in the U.K.
          > (Sorry, this
          > > is approximate, but I've not got the references in front of me,
          but
          > the
          > > essentials are accurate.) My guess, based on that, was that they
          > must have
          > > been in use before that, especially given that the Romans had
          > bronze nibs by
          > > 300 C.E. Sure enough, I have found two mentions of steel nibs by
          > 1800.
          > > (Again, no exact references, but I might be able to find them.)
          > >
          > > My guess would be that professional clerks -Bureaucrats ! Ugh!
          > Spit twice!
          > > :) - used them. So, army clerks and staff wallahs had them, I'd
          > guess, while
          > > ordinary citizens used the (cheaper) quills, probaly well into
          the
          > 1820's &
          > > '30''s. I hope this helps.
          > >
          > > Peter Monahan, Company Clerk,
          > > Royal Newfoundland Regiment
          > >
          > > petemonahan@a...
          > > 705-435-0953
          > >
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • petemonahan@aol.com
          Len Yes, I read (and have) the Shire series pens book and had concluded as you do that steel nibs were post-us, but I ve since seen a reference which says
          Message 4 of 17 , Jun 3, 2002
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            Len
            Yes, I read (and have) the Shire series pens book and had concluded as you do
            that steel nibs were post-us, but I've since seen a reference which says
            "earlier, by 1805". The key word in the book may be "perfected". I believe
            the earlist had no slit in the nib - simply a small steel blade, so likely
            very inefficient because only the ink. Anyway, I'll have to dig out my
            reference again. (By the by, I tend to agree with your assessment of the
            broom straw + nib sets, though to be fair the suttlers may have been told
            they were o.k. for 1812.)

            Peter Monahan
            petemonahan@...
            705-435-0953


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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