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Re: Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres

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  • red.gold@sympatico.ca
    ... sounded on ... inscribed on ... nearby ... the web ... the only ... actual print ... As you will note, thia item was a product of The Canadian Press. It
    Message 1 of 12 , Nov 2, 2001
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      --- In WarOf1812@y..., HQ93rd@a... wrote:
      > I have stood at the Menin Gate in "Wipers" and heard Last Post
      sounded on
      > bugles by the local Belgian constabulary.
      > Combined with the sight of all those tens of thousands of names
      inscribed on
      > the massive walls of the memorial Gate (along with just as many at
      nearby
      > Tyne Cot cemetery), it is something one never forgets....
      >
      > B
      >
      > In a message dated 1/11/01 3:25:58 PM, gam1947@d... writes:
      >
      > << Ladies and Gentlemen,
      >
      > The clipping below is from Canada, in the electronic newspapers on
      the web
      > there is nothing about it from Australia, Britain, NZ, and this is
      the only
      > one in the Canadian media. One would hope that it was in the
      actual print
      > copies!
      >
      > Quite sad.
      >
      > Yours,
      > G/.
      >
      > Thursday, November 1, 2001 The Halifax Herald Limited
      > --------------------------------------------------------------------
      --------
      > Commonwealth soldiers honoured in Ypres
      > Nova Scotia Highlanders among those to pay tribute to fallen
      >
      > Virginia Mayo / The Associated Press
      > By Roberta Cowan / The Canadian Press
      >
      >
      As you will note, thia item was a product of The Canadian Press. It
      actually passed through my ink-stained paws in my capacity as an
      editor on the World Desk there.
      CP always makes an effort to cover Remembrance Day activities to as
      full an extent as our limited resources allow.
      It was relayed to all of the major newspapers in Canada who are our
      clients, as well as databases and Internet newspages who buy our
      content We have no control over who chooses to actually publish the
      material but I suspect it would have been given wide play.
      Canada's sacrifice in both world wars was disproportionately large
      for our population and most families of the time were scarred by the
      loss or serious injury of at least one member.
      Both of my grandfathers were wounded in the First War and my dad
      survived a bomb blast in Naples in the Second.
      T.Avery.
    • PEGGY MATHEWS
      Thanks Peter, I understand better now. Michael ... From: Peter Catley Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 3:37 AM To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE:
      Message 2 of 12 , Nov 2, 2001
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        Thanks Peter, I understand better now.

        Michael

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Peter Catley
        Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 3:37 AM
        To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [WarOf1812] Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres

        Michael,

        In the UK the last post is played at the burial of a soldier to signify the
        passing over from the earthly world to the heavenly. It has become normal
        for it to be played at remembrance services to signify the start of the
        respectful silence.

        It is a most haunting tune and played well it can be extremely emotional.
        Your response was the appropriate one, one stands to attention faces the
        front. If in uniform you salute.

        As for the history I don't know when the tradition started but I would guess
        that it was probably early Victorian but Tim or Benton may know more about
        it.

        It is perhaps one of our better and simpler ceremonies.

        I am slightly surprised that it is not a feature in Canada.

        Peter Catley

        -----Original Message-----
        From: PEGGY MATHEWS [mailto:ciefranche21e@...]
        Sent: 02 November 2001 04:10
        To: 1812elist
        Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres

        Someone please educate the uninformed about the history, significance and
        protocol for the Last Post. At the last Mississinewa one night we heard it
        played and some of the honorable gentlemen around me came to attention
        and/or saluted, remaining so till the last note drifted away. I stood there
        like an ignorant clod not knowing how to behave, just adopting a hopefully
        respectful silence.

        Kindly enlighten me.

        Thanks,
        Michael

        I have stood at the Menin Gate in "Wipers" and heard Last Post sounded on
        bugles by the local Belgian constabulary.
        (big snip)


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


        The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of
        square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of
        square miles...

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




        The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of square miles...

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • colsjtjones2000@yahoo.ca
        I cannot understand why someone in our activity did not appreciate the significance of the Last Post. Of course it didn t exist in the 1812 period, but it is
        Message 3 of 12 , Nov 2, 2001
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          I cannot understand why someone in our activity did not appreciate
          the significance of the Last Post. Of course it didn't exist in the
          1812 period, but it is used in all memorials which we conduct now,
          regardless of period. Perhaps more informed people than me could
          advise what would have been similarly appropriate in our 1812
          period. Doug


          --- In WarOf1812@y..., "PEGGY MATHEWS" <ciefranche21e@m...> wrote:
          > Thanks Peter, I understand better now.
          >
          > Michael
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Peter Catley
          > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 3:37 AM
          > To: WarOf1812@y...
          > Subject: RE: [WarOf1812] Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres
          >
          > Michael,
          >
          > In the UK the last post is played at the burial of a soldier to
          signify the
          > passing over from the earthly world to the heavenly. It has become
          normal
          > for it to be played at remembrance services to signify the start of
          the
          > respectful silence.
          >
          > It is a most haunting tune and played well it can be extremely
          emotional.
          > Your response was the appropriate one, one stands to attention
          faces the
          > front. If in uniform you salute.
          >
          > As for the history I don't know when the tradition started but I
          would guess
          > that it was probably early Victorian but Tim or Benton may know
          more about
          > it.
          >
          > It is perhaps one of our better and simpler ceremonies.
          >
          > I am slightly surprised that it is not a feature in Canada.
          >
          > Peter Catley
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: PEGGY MATHEWS [mailto:ciefranche21e@m...]
          > Sent: 02 November 2001 04:10
          > To: 1812elist
          > Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres
          >
          > Someone please educate the uninformed about the history,
          significance and
          > protocol for the Last Post. At the last Mississinewa one night we
          heard it
          > played and some of the honorable gentlemen around me came to
          attention
          > and/or saluted, remaining so till the last note drifted away. I
          stood there
          > like an ignorant clod not knowing how to behave, just adopting a
          hopefully
          > respectful silence.
          >
          > Kindly enlighten me.
          >
          > Thanks,
          > Michael
          >
          > I have stood at the Menin Gate in "Wipers" and heard Last Post
          sounded on
          > bugles by the local Belgian constabulary.
          > (big snip)
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of
          hundreds of
          > square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
          THOUSANDS of
          > square miles...
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of
          hundreds of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the
          fate of THOUSANDS of square miles...
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • colsjtjones2000@yahoo.ca
          Peter - whatever you might assume from some postings, I can assure you that in Canada the Last Post is revered. It was most recently observed in a memorial
          Message 4 of 12 , Nov 2, 2001
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            Peter - whatever you might assume from some postings, I can assure
            you that in Canada the Last Post is revered. It was most recently
            observed in a memorial for Sept 11th when I was in a Walmart store
            and you could have heard a pin drop. At the same time there were
            100,000 people on Parliament Hill observing the same silence - and
            the same post.

            In Canada our Memorial Day (Remembrance Day) is Nov 11th. The 11th
            day of the 11th month. The Royal Canadian Legion "sells" poppies -
            from Flanders Fields, although now they are plastic. In Canada at
            this time of year one would be hard pressed to find a person not
            wearing a poppy. On Nov 11th, there is always an impressive
            remembrance ceremony at the National War Memorial, which is usually
            televised on CPAC and NW, and which I would encourage everyone to
            watch.

            Doug






            --- In WarOf1812@y..., "Peter Catley" <peter.catley@b...> wrote:
            > Michael,
            >
            > In the UK the last post is played at the burial of a soldier to
            signify the
            > passing over from the earthly world to the heavenly. It has become
            normal
            > for it to be played at remembrance services to signify the start of
            the
            > respectful silence.
            >
            > It is a most haunting tune and played well it can be extremely
            emotional.
            > Your response was the appropriate one, one stands to attention
            faces the
            > front. If in uniform you salute.
            >
            > As for the history I don't know when the tradition started but I
            would guess
            > that it was probably early Victorian but Tim or Benton may know
            more about
            > it.
            >
            > It is perhaps one of our better and simpler ceremonies.
            >
            > I am slightly surprised that it is not a feature in Canada.
            >
            > Peter Catley
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: PEGGY MATHEWS [mailto:ciefranche21e@m...]
            > Sent: 02 November 2001 04:10
            > To: 1812elist
            > Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres
            >
            > Someone please educate the uninformed about the history,
            significance and
            > protocol for the Last Post. At the last Mississinewa one night we
            heard it
            > played and some of the honorable gentlemen around me came to
            attention
            > and/or saluted, remaining so till the last note drifted away. I
            stood there
            > like an ignorant clod not knowing how to behave, just adopting a
            hopefully
            > respectful silence.
            >
            > Kindly enlighten me.
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Michael
            >
            > I have stood at the Menin Gate in "Wipers" and heard Last Post
            sounded on
            > bugles by the local Belgian constabulary.
            > (big snip)
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            > The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of
            hundreds of
            > square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of
            THOUSANDS of
            > square miles...
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          • John-Paul Johnson
            ... Are you sure that The Last Post didn t exist then? I got this from the ANZAC day website: Last Post The bugle call Last Post is inextricably part of the
            Message 5 of 12 , Nov 2, 2001
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              olsjtjones2000@... wrote:
              >
              > I cannot understand why someone in our activity did not appreciate
              > the significance of the Last Post. Of course it didn't exist in the
              > 1812 period, but it is used in all memorials which we conduct now,
              > regardless of period. Perhaps more informed people than me could
              > advise what would have been similarly appropriate in our 1812
              > period. Doug
              >

              Are you sure that "The Last Post" didn't exist then?

              I got this from the ANZAC day website:

              Last Post

              The bugle call Last Post is inextricably part of the end of day
              traditions which include Beating the Retreat and Tattoo.
              Retreat is the older custom dating back to the 16th Century and
              consisting of prolonged drum beating at sunset to warn the night guard
              to mount and also to give notice that the gates of the town walls were
              about to close. This custom was also part of the end of day battle
              procedure when volleys were fired and a hymn played in honour of those
              who had fallen during the day. At this time of evening the colour would
              be trooped. Today this latter activity is replaced by the lowering of
              the National Flag.

              There is some confusion over the ‘post’ calls. It seems that the ‘First
              Post’ and 'Last Post' came into being in the early part of the 19th
              Century. The ‘First Post’ was sounded as the orderly officer, the
              orderly sergeant and a drummer (with a bugle) started the Tattoo. They
              then marched from post to post with the drummer beating his drum. Upon
              reaching the final post the drummer would sound the Last Post. (This is
              why drummers carry a bugle.)

              The Last Post was really the end of the day (a hard day’s fighting and a
              hard night’s drinking).

              This bugle call has been passed down through the centuries in many
              countries of the world as an accompaniment to the impressive rites of a
              soldier’s farewell - the closing bars wail out their sad valediction to
              the departing warrior.
              ----------------

              This matches well with what I was taught during my Basic Officer Course
              lo these many years ago.

              J-P Johnson
              Royal Nfld Reg't
              --------------
              J-P's Homepage: http://members.home.net/jpjohnsn/
            • Chewie
              While at RHS the first post was played by bugler in morning and the colours were taken down with calls upon the Bosun s Call at the end of the day . Obviously
              Message 6 of 12 , Nov 3, 2001
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                While at RHS the first post was played by bugler in morning and the colours were taken down with calls upon the Bosun's Call at the end of the day . Obviously the Bowfin's call cannot play the last post , so the bugle should have been there . It was a Naval establishment .

                Chewie
                unit commander
                50th West Kent Regiment Re Enactment Unit
                " not a good looking bunch , but devilish steady"
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: John-Paul Johnson
                To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 9:40 PM
                Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Re: Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres


                olsjtjones2000@... wrote:
                >
                > I cannot understand why someone in our activity did not appreciate
                > the significance of the Last Post. Of course it didn't exist in the
                > 1812 period, but it is used in all memorials which we conduct now,
                > regardless of period. Perhaps more informed people than me could
                > advise what would have been similarly appropriate in our 1812
                > period. Doug
                >

                Are you sure that "The Last Post" didn't exist then?

                I got this from the ANZAC day website:

                Last Post

                The bugle call Last Post is inextricably part of the end of day
                traditions which include Beating the Retreat and Tattoo.
                Retreat is the older custom dating back to the 16th Century and
                consisting of prolonged drum beating at sunset to warn the night guard
                to mount and also to give notice that the gates of the town walls were
                about to close. This custom was also part of the end of day battle
                procedure when volleys were fired and a hymn played in honour of those
                who had fallen during the day. At this time of evening the colour would
                be trooped. Today this latter activity is replaced by the lowering of
                the National Flag.

                There is some confusion over the 'post' calls. It seems that the 'First
                Post' and 'Last Post' came into being in the early part of the 19th
                Century. The 'First Post' was sounded as the orderly officer, the
                orderly sergeant and a drummer (with a bugle) started the Tattoo. They
                then marched from post to post with the drummer beating his drum. Upon
                reaching the final post the drummer would sound the Last Post. (This is
                why drummers carry a bugle.)

                The Last Post was really the end of the day (a hard day's fighting and a
                hard night's drinking).

                This bugle call has been passed down through the centuries in many
                countries of the world as an accompaniment to the impressive rites of a
                soldier's farewell - the closing bars wail out their sad valediction to
                the departing warrior.
                ----------------

                This matches well with what I was taught during my Basic Officer Course
                lo these many years ago.

                J-P Johnson
                Royal Nfld Reg't
                --------------
                J-P's Homepage: http://members.home.net/jpjohnsn/

                Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                ADVERTISEMENT




                The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of square miles...

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Chewie
                Sorry My memory is slipping . during evening ceremony bugler was there . The sequence was Bosun s Call played Still , then bugler played last post , Followed
                Message 7 of 12 , Nov 3, 2001
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                  Sorry
                  My memory is slipping . during evening ceremony bugler was there . The sequence was Bosun's Call played Still , then bugler played last post , Followed by Call again playing Carry On .
                  Again apologies for this Fau Parr . Brain approaching 40 .

                  Chewie
                  unit commander
                  50th West Kent Regiment Re Enactment Unit
                  " not a good looking bunch , but devilish steady"
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Chewie
                  To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2001 4:44 PM
                  Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Re: Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres


                  While at RHS the first post was played by bugler in morning and the colours were taken down with calls upon the Bosun's Call at the end of the day . Obviously the Bowfin's call cannot play the last post , so the bugle should have been there . It was a Naval establishment .

                  Chewie
                  unit commander
                  50th West Kent Regiment Re Enactment Unit
                  " not a good looking bunch , but devilish steady"
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: John-Paul Johnson
                  To: WarOf1812@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 9:40 PM
                  Subject: Re: [WarOf1812] Re: Fwd: [britregiments] Ypres


                  olsjtjones2000@... wrote:
                  >
                  > I cannot understand why someone in our activity did not appreciate
                  > the significance of the Last Post. Of course it didn't exist in the
                  > 1812 period, but it is used in all memorials which we conduct now,
                  > regardless of period. Perhaps more informed people than me could
                  > advise what would have been similarly appropriate in our 1812
                  > period. Doug
                  >

                  Are you sure that "The Last Post" didn't exist then?

                  I got this from the ANZAC day website:

                  Last Post

                  The bugle call Last Post is inextricably part of the end of day
                  traditions which include Beating the Retreat and Tattoo.
                  Retreat is the older custom dating back to the 16th Century and
                  consisting of prolonged drum beating at sunset to warn the night guard
                  to mount and also to give notice that the gates of the town walls were
                  about to close. This custom was also part of the end of day battle
                  procedure when volleys were fired and a hymn played in honour of those
                  who had fallen during the day. At this time of evening the colour would
                  be trooped. Today this latter activity is replaced by the lowering of
                  the National Flag.

                  There is some confusion over the 'post' calls. It seems that the 'First
                  Post' and 'Last Post' came into being in the early part of the 19th
                  Century. The 'First Post' was sounded as the orderly officer, the
                  orderly sergeant and a drummer (with a bugle) started the Tattoo. They
                  then marched from post to post with the drummer beating his drum. Upon
                  reaching the final post the drummer would sound the Last Post. (This is
                  why drummers carry a bugle.)

                  The Last Post was really the end of the day (a hard day's fighting and a
                  hard night's drinking).

                  This bugle call has been passed down through the centuries in many
                  countries of the world as an accompaniment to the impressive rites of a
                  soldier's farewell - the closing bars wail out their sad valediction to
                  the departing warrior.
                  ----------------

                  This matches well with what I was taught during my Basic Officer Course
                  lo these many years ago.

                  J-P Johnson
                  Royal Nfld Reg't
                  --------------
                  J-P's Homepage: http://members.home.net/jpjohnsn/

                  Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  ADVERTISEMENT




                  The War of 1812: In Europe, thousands fought over the fate of hundreds of square miles: in North America, hundreds determined the fate of THOUSANDS of square miles...

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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