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Re: [VillageZendoOccupyWall] Re: Occupy Faith Meeting 4/12/2012

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  • Robert Gunn
    Ten bows to all participants in this conversation! Kaku
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 14, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      Ten bows to all participants in this conversation!

      Kaku
      On Apr 14, 2012, at 1:19 PM, bokushu wrote:

       

      I so appreciate the comments of all who have responded to my posting. When KaKu suggested I post the meeting notes, I was relucant, but now feel that it has been helpful that those thoughts be shoved out into the light.

      It has to be said that my not voicing certain thoughts at the Occupy Faith meeting has more than one root. One important root is my own prior association with Wall Street, an association that was long and "successful" until the stupidity of Wall Street brought the world financial system to its knees. Though I never made loans or approved a single mortgage, somehow the dollars from many ill-fated decisions wended their way into my pockets, and they sustain me to this day. Those dollars also help in a modest way to sustain The Village Zendo, Pro Mujer, the ACLU, Planned Parenthood, Judson Church, and on and on...

      But there is a root of much greater consequence to be spoken of here. Freud famously defined neurosis as "the inability to tolerate ambiguity." I have spent my life recoiling in horror from ambiguity and devoutly craving the brightest and sharpest of lines. I wanted a predictable, orderly and secure life-program that moved along at a stately pace. So sitting amidst a group that, at least outwardly, unifies along bright lines of "right" and "wrong" I understand that impulse completely. If I can see a rounder picture of this monstrous system that enmeshes us all it is not by choice: I was forced to see it. So I have great compassion for the righteously indignant, the angry, on both "sides" of this debate. I am both sides.

      It is also enlivening to sit in a group where what is unsaid somehow strongly flavors the air surrounding what is said and felt. Sometimes what is not said is even more present and inescapable than what is voiced. People know without knowing, and if there is a "best" then perhaps this kind of nebulous knowing is the best we can hope for.

      What is being voiced right now is the scent of lilac resting in a vase on my window sill, and the brightness of a cityscape that is filled with sharp lines and contrast....a calm spring day, filled with craving and injustice, with people walking to and fro on the crisp and dusty sidewalk below...

      --- In VillageZendoOccupyWall@yahoogroups.com, Elena TaJo <tajopro@...> wrote:
      >
      > This is a very interesting thread. Bokushu's unease without 'clear bright
      > lines' among 'believers' makes me think of what kept Judy Clark blind for
      > so long. It's very easy for any frustrated movement to devolve into
      > certainty and paint itself as the authority on truth. I sympathize
      > entirely with the need for clarity and yet, as Joshin says, it was the
      > muddiness that was so inclusive about this movement.
      >
      > Yuuka
      >
      > On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 10:26 AM, David Solomon
      > <solomon.david151@...>wrote:
      >
      > > **
      > >
      > >
      > > Although "truth commissions" are established by the political power, they
      > > are comprised of eminent persons, i.e. those with the highest integrity and
      > > generally agreed to be above the issues being judged. By definition, an
      > > OWS "truth commission" staffed by OWS'ers would not fit the basic
      > > requirement for an attempt to approach the "truth."
      > >
      > > Rinsho
      > >
      > >
      > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 11:45 PM, bokushu <timtucker1000@...>wrote:
      > >
      > >> **
      > >>
      > >>
      > >> Today there was an Occupy Faith planning meeting which I attended,
      > >> representing the Village Zendo. Appearing below are my notes from the
      > >> meeting for those who might be interested.
      > >>
      > >> On a related note, some people in Occupy Faith are involved in organizing
      > >> singing "auction blockades" which are meant to prevent the auctioning of
      > >> homes seized in foreclosures. I will be attending one such auction blockade
      > >> next Thursday, 19 April at 1:00pm in Brooklyn. Anyone interested in
      > >> attending, please email me at timtucker1000@... to coordinate
      > >> the outing.
      > >>
      > >> --------------------------------
      > >> In attendance: 19, somewhat lower vs prior meetings... perhaps due to
      > >> limited advance notice. Statistic is cited that at height of civil rights
      > >> movement only 10% of black churches were involved in the movement. Seems
      > >> incredible....
      > >>
      > >> First, we are given a summary of the national Occupy Faith meeting in
      > >> Oakland, CA a month or so ago. 17 different localities represented there.
      > >> One takeaway was that other Occupy Faith groups elsewhere are more tightly
      > >> integrated part of OWS.
      > >>
      > >> Q: how can OWS be sustained post Zuccotti?
      > >>
      > >> A: considering possibility of national bus tour this summer connected to
      > >> publicizing and/or starting truth commission on economic injustice.
      > >> Thinking of having truth commission public hearings Jan 20/21st connected
      > >> to presidential inauguration and Dr. King's birthday. But nb public
      > >> hearings themselves are just a small part of what truth commissions do....
      > >> much of it is data collection, taking testimony... from "survivors of the
      > >> mass seizure of homes." Related issues: evictions, rent stabilization. Key
      > >> point we are told is dispelling lies... but I would ask...what is truth?
      > >> what is a lie? When someone defaults on a mortgage and is foreclosed upon,
      > >> whose "fault" is it? To me, this requires a very detailed examination on a
      > >> case-by-case basis.... I can't say there are just victims on one side and
      > >> oppressors on the other. My lack of clear bright lines, kept carefully to
      > >> myself at the meeting, feels like dissent unvoiced.....but with many
      > >> seemingly "true believers" here I feel cowed. With my iPhone in hand, I
      > >> could check right now on how the stock and bond markets are digesting
      > >> today's initial unemployment claims uptick. Would that be the ultimate
      > >> sacrilege?
      > >>
      > >> Many questions are raised and discussed: Should the truth commission be
      > >> local or national or both? What should be the focus? Much discussion of
      > >> what truth commissions do and possible approaches here. Fundraising an
      > >> issue....two planning meetings next week, one on Monday on fundraising,
      > >> another on Friday(?)
      > >>
      > >> Action on May 1st: Lots happening with staging areas in Madison Square,
      > >> Union Square, etc. culmination at 4pm in Union Square with a march
      > >> downtown. I voice the worry of violence, on both "sides," of people getting
      > >> hurt. I'm not alone in this concern... there is awareness of need to help
      > >> people who don't want to be arrested avoid the so-called red zone(s) where
      > >> civil disobedience will be undertaken. Someone says that having the actual
      > >> choice of whether or not to be exposed to police brutality is a privilege
      > >> since many people do not have that choice -- they are frequently,
      > >> involuntarily exposed.
      > >>
      > >> Next Occupy Faith meeting may be scheduled for evening of Thursday 4/26.
      > >> Evening meetings are being sought because of lack of people of color at
      > >> these Occupy Faith meetings. But 4/26 is Fusatsu so fyi I wouldn't attend
      > >> that meeting. I'll be at Fusatsu, perhaps ringing a bell or two.
      > >>
      > >> Respectfully submitted,
      > >> Bokushu
      > >>
      > >>
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      > --
      > Elena TaJo
      > http://OGReHome.com
      > Home of Outsider Grief Relief
      >


    • Elena TaJo
      Beautiful Bokushu. ... -- Elena TaJo http://OGReHome.com Home of Outsider Grief Relief
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 14, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        Beautiful Bokushu.

        On Sat, Apr 14, 2012 at 1:19 PM, bokushu <timtucker1000@...> wrote:
         

        I so appreciate the comments of all who have responded to my posting. When KaKu suggested I post the meeting notes, I was relucant, but now feel that it has been helpful that those thoughts be shoved out into the light.

        It has to be said that my not voicing certain thoughts at the Occupy Faith meeting has more than one root. One important root is my own prior association with Wall Street, an association that was long and "successful" until the stupidity of Wall Street brought the world financial system to its knees. Though I never made loans or approved a single mortgage, somehow the dollars from many ill-fated decisions wended their way into my pockets, and they sustain me to this day. Those dollars also help in a modest way to sustain The Village Zendo, Pro Mujer, the ACLU, Planned Parenthood, Judson Church, and on and on...

        But there is a root of much greater consequence to be spoken of here. Freud famously defined neurosis as "the inability to tolerate ambiguity." I have spent my life recoiling in horror from ambiguity and devoutly craving the brightest and sharpest of lines. I wanted a predictable, orderly and secure life-program that moved along at a stately pace. So sitting amidst a group that, at least outwardly, unifies along bright lines of "right" and "wrong" I understand that impulse completely. If I can see a rounder picture of this monstrous system that enmeshes us all it is not by choice: I was forced to see it. So I have great compassion for the righteously indignant, the angry, on both "sides" of this debate. I am both sides.

        It is also enlivening to sit in a group where what is unsaid somehow strongly flavors the air surrounding what is said and felt. Sometimes what is not said is even more present and inescapable than what is voiced. People know without knowing, and if there is a "best" then perhaps this kind of nebulous knowing is the best we can hope for.

        What is being voiced right now is the scent of lilac resting in a vase on my window sill, and the brightness of a cityscape that is filled with sharp lines and contrast....a calm spring day, filled with craving and injustice, with people walking to and fro on the crisp and dusty sidewalk below...



        --- In VillageZendoOccupyWall@yahoogroups.com, Elena TaJo <tajopro@...> wrote:
        >
        > This is a very interesting thread. Bokushu's unease without 'clear bright
        > lines' among 'believers' makes me think of what kept Judy Clark blind for
        > so long. It's very easy for any frustrated movement to devolve into
        > certainty and paint itself as the authority on truth. I sympathize
        > entirely with the need for clarity and yet, as Joshin says, it was the
        > muddiness that was so inclusive about this movement.
        >
        > Yuuka
        >
        > On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 10:26 AM, David Solomon
        > <solomon.david151@...>wrote:
        >
        > > **

        > >
        > >
        > > Although "truth commissions" are established by the political power, they
        > > are comprised of eminent persons, i.e. those with the highest integrity and
        > > generally agreed to be above the issues being judged. By definition, an
        > > OWS "truth commission" staffed by OWS'ers would not fit the basic
        > > requirement for an attempt to approach the "truth."
        > >
        > > Rinsho
        > >
        > >
        > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 11:45 PM, bokushu <timtucker1000@...>wrote:
        > >
        > >> **

        > >>
        > >>
        > >> Today there was an Occupy Faith planning meeting which I attended,
        > >> representing the Village Zendo. Appearing below are my notes from the
        > >> meeting for those who might be interested.
        > >>
        > >> On a related note, some people in Occupy Faith are involved in organizing
        > >> singing "auction blockades" which are meant to prevent the auctioning of
        > >> homes seized in foreclosures. I will be attending one such auction blockade
        > >> next Thursday, 19 April at 1:00pm in Brooklyn. Anyone interested in
        > >> attending, please email me at timtucker1000@... to coordinate

        > >> the outing.
        > >>
        > >> --------------------------------
        > >> In attendance: 19, somewhat lower vs prior meetings... perhaps due to
        > >> limited advance notice. Statistic is cited that at height of civil rights
        > >> movement only 10% of black churches were involved in the movement. Seems
        > >> incredible....
        > >>
        > >> First, we are given a summary of the national Occupy Faith meeting in
        > >> Oakland, CA a month or so ago. 17 different localities represented there.
        > >> One takeaway was that other Occupy Faith groups elsewhere are more tightly
        > >> integrated part of OWS.
        > >>
        > >> Q: how can OWS be sustained post Zuccotti?
        > >>
        > >> A: considering possibility of national bus tour this summer connected to
        > >> publicizing and/or starting truth commission on economic injustice.
        > >> Thinking of having truth commission public hearings Jan 20/21st connected
        > >> to presidential inauguration and Dr. King's birthday. But nb public
        > >> hearings themselves are just a small part of what truth commissions do....
        > >> much of it is data collection, taking testimony... from "survivors of the
        > >> mass seizure of homes." Related issues: evictions, rent stabilization. Key
        > >> point we are told is dispelling lies... but I would ask...what is truth?
        > >> what is a lie? When someone defaults on a mortgage and is foreclosed upon,
        > >> whose "fault" is it? To me, this requires a very detailed examination on a
        > >> case-by-case basis.... I can't say there are just victims on one side and
        > >> oppressors on the other. My lack of clear bright lines, kept carefully to
        > >> myself at the meeting, feels like dissent unvoiced.....but with many
        > >> seemingly "true believers" here I feel cowed. With my iPhone in hand, I
        > >> could check right now on how the stock and bond markets are digesting
        > >> today's initial unemployment claims uptick. Would that be the ultimate
        > >> sacrilege?
        > >>
        > >> Many questions are raised and discussed: Should the truth commission be
        > >> local or national or both? What should be the focus? Much discussion of
        > >> what truth commissions do and possible approaches here. Fundraising an
        > >> issue....two planning meetings next week, one on Monday on fundraising,
        > >> another on Friday(?)
        > >>
        > >> Action on May 1st: Lots happening with staging areas in Madison Square,
        > >> Union Square, etc. culmination at 4pm in Union Square with a march
        > >> downtown. I voice the worry of violence, on both "sides," of people getting
        > >> hurt. I'm not alone in this concern... there is awareness of need to help
        > >> people who don't want to be arrested avoid the so-called red zone(s) where
        > >> civil disobedience will be undertaken. Someone says that having the actual
        > >> choice of whether or not to be exposed to police brutality is a privilege
        > >> since many people do not have that choice -- they are frequently,
        > >> involuntarily exposed.
        > >>
        > >> Next Occupy Faith meeting may be scheduled for evening of Thursday 4/26.
        > >> Evening meetings are being sought because of lack of people of color at
        > >> these Occupy Faith meetings. But 4/26 is Fusatsu so fyi I wouldn't attend
        > >> that meeting. I'll be at Fusatsu, perhaps ringing a bell or two.
        > >>
        > >> Respectfully submitted,
        > >> Bokushu
        > >>
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        > --
        > Elena TaJo
        > http://OGReHome.com
        > Home of Outsider Grief Relief
        >




        --
        Elena TaJo
        http://OGReHome.com
        Home of Outsider Grief Relief

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