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RE: [VacuumX] Re: Lead gaskets?

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  • Thomas Janstrom
    Hi Rabid, For indium wire (0.5mm to 1.5mm diameter) try here: HYPERLINK http://www.proscitech.com.au/catalogue/V1.asp#V018 http://www.proscitec
    Message 1 of 17 , Apr 1, 2006
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      Hi Rabid,

       

      For indium wire (0.5mm to 1.5mm diameter) try here: http://www.proscitech.com.au/catalogue/V1.asp#V018 towards the top of the page prices are per half meter lengths (approx 20”), and in Australian dollars so you also have to take out the 10% GST if your having it sent out of the country…. So less 1/11th and then take of about 25% for the currency conversion, well you get the idea.

       

      Thomas.

       

      -----Original Message-----
      From: VacuumX@yahoogroups.com [mailto:VacuumX@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jim RabidWolf
      Sent: Saturday, 1 April 2006 7:43 AM
      To: VacuumX@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [VacuumX] Re: Lead gaskets?

       

      Where are you buying Indium that it's cheap?

       

      I have, some years ago, "soldered" Pyrex with Indium. We also used it to solder silicon in fabrication dies for MOSFET's we made using vacuum deposit and etching.

       

      Rabid

       

      ----- Original Message -----

      From: t_janstrom

      Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2006 8:47 PM

      Subject: [VacuumX] Re: Lead gaskets?

       

      Rabid,

      Seems that this did not make it to the list….



      But further to this, indium is the only metal AFAIK that wets glass,
      oh yeah it's also non toxic;)



      -----Original Message-----
      From: Thomas Janstrom [mailto:t_janstrom@...]
      Sent: Thursday, 30 March 2006 9:19 PM
      To: 'VacuumX@yahoogroups.com'
      Subject: RE: [VacuumX] Lead gaskets?



      May I suggest Indium? Rather cheap, similar MP and it IS vacuum
      rated.



      Thomas.



      --- In VacuumX@yahoogroups.com, "Jim RabidWolf" <unclerabid@...>
      wrote:
      >
      > Since I have complete shop, I am considering making quite a number
      of my own fittings and using cast lead gaskets (machined to finish) -
      with as little lead exposed to the vacuum as possible - any one
      have a list of the outgassing and other characteristics of metals,
      especially comparing lead to copper? I imagine it would be much
      better than rubber, perhaps viton, but of course you can't bake it
      out (but that happens during the melt. I am planning on making two
      piece molds, rather like bullet molds in various sizes.
      >
      > Especially on very large flanges, I think this would be worth my
      while.
      >
      > I haven't really run across anything with definitive numbers of
      permiability.
      >
      > Rabid
      >







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    • william rowland
      First of all I need to state I have not seen the rest of these posts. Lead is somewhat the latest topic on other lists and the new EU Laws which are rather
      Message 2 of 17 , Apr 1, 2006
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        First of all I need to state I have not seen the rest of these posts. Lead is somewhat the latest topic on other lists and the new EU Laws which are rather stricter than US Laws. Aside from Astronomy; I am into Pipe Organs and on those lists there is much discussion about lead usage, health defects and the need to use lead for particular purposes. The best Organ Pipes are made of an alloy of  a high percentage of  tin and a lower percentage of  lead. Because Tin is expensive; in the past organ pipe makers have tended to use higher percentages of lead in the alloy than tin which makes the Organ cheaper.and easier to sell to cash strapped  clients. The downside is that lead is affected by atmospheric conditions and soon is affected by Lead disease. Which is an oxidation process in which anything made of lead  suddenly turns to powder. The exception in Organ pipes are pipes that contain more than 65% Tin.. Lead is a necessary element in the alloy of sheet metal because it gives strenght to the pipes when combined with them.
          However, for the safety of folks on this list ---it would behoove you to consider the health and environmental hazards of lead.  Not only can you damage your health with lead but all your loved ones and if these items ever end up in the dump the EPA might come after you for polluting the water supply. Lead is a very toxic element. If you have kids  or a pregnant wife you should not allow them anywhere around it. It can mental retardation as well as result in your kids failing at school not to mention some suspected links to ADD (attention deficit disorder) and behavioral problems.  Lead is a particular deadly neurotoxin (toxic to the nerves). While you may not notice any symptoms at first in time they will come on.  If you are working with lead you need to have your serum lead levels checked and if they are high enough take the medication that will rid your body of the lead.
        For those on this list who might be in  Europe the  EU has just enacted some rather strict laws about lead (chemical symbol Pb) and this particularly applies to anything electric.
        I would be the first to agree that for some purposes there are no substitutes for lead. IF you do not have to have it for one of those purposes that can not be done without use copper instead. It is safer than lead although  copper has it's bad sides but steel probably is the best substitute.  Yes I know lead has a low melting point and is easy to work with.






        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Ken Hunter"
        To: VacuumX@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [VacuumX] Re: Lead gaskets?
        Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2006 15:19:23 -0000

        Rabid,

        Run a ring of solder (60/40 electronic type) around the fitting, tack
        solder the 2 ends and assemble it. There is no reason to go to all the
        trouble of casting the lead.

        Ken Hunter

        --- In VacuumX@yahoogroups.com, "Jim RabidWolf" wrote:
        >
        > Since I have complete shop, I am considering making quite a number of
        my own fittings and using cast lead gaskets (machined to finish) - with
        as little lead exposed to the vacuum as possible - any one have a list
        of the outgassing and other characteristics of metals, especially
        comparing lead to copper? I imagine it would be much better than
        rubber, perhaps viton, but of course you can't bake it out (but that
        happens during the melt. I am planning on making two piece molds,
        rather like bullet molds in various sizes.
        >
        > Especially on very large flanges, I think this would be worth my
        while.
        >
        > I haven't really run across anything with definitive numbers of
        permiability.
        >
        > Rabid
        >







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      • Ken Hunter
        ... posts. Lead is somewhat the latest topic on other lists and the new EU Laws which are rather stricter than US Laws. The sky is falling! I have been using
        Message 3 of 17 , Apr 1, 2006
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          --- In VacuumX@yahoogroups.com, "william rowland" <prof@...> wrote:
          >
          > First of all I need to state I have not seen the rest of these
          posts. Lead is somewhat the latest topic on other lists and the new
          EU Laws which are rather stricter than US Laws.

          The sky is falling!

          I have been using lead "as in solder" since 1955 at least... I grew
          up holding lead solder in my mouth since the good Lord deemed that 2
          hands was enough for humans to have. I don't think that there has
          been a period of time longer than a few weeks in the last 50+ years
          that I have not had direct exposure to lead via handling, soldering
          (without protective hoods) etc and I still hold solder between my
          teeth when I run out of hands. My children grew up normally and my
          grandchildren do not have any obvious defects either. Only a few of
          my friends are bothered by the strange noises in my head.

          I do not discount that lead may be hazardous to your health under
          extreme conditions but I think that some folks are getting pretty
          overboard on these laws after all, lead comes from the ground in
          it's natural state, and no matter how hard we try, we can't place
          more of it back into the ground than we take out.

          It they want to really make an impact, they should start by
          outlawing asphalt roadways... That's a much greater polluter of the
          ground than any amount of lead we might bury.

          Ken Hunter
        • Jim RabidWolf
          Well said, Ken ... FWIW - I ve worked with things far more poisoinous than lead - Like Plutonium... I m still here - mostly because I pay attention to what I m
          Message 4 of 17 , Apr 2, 2006
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            Well said, Ken ... FWIW - I've worked with things far more poisoinous than lead - Like Plutonium... I'm still here - mostly because I pay attention to what I'm doing. I've worked with everything from radioactives to virii that make Ebola look like measles - it's a matter of paying attention to what your doing every second you're doing it. Everything can be safely handled, as long as you follow the rules.
             
            Lead is on the bottom of my list of worries - my lathes and mills are far more dangerous to my well being than lead is ever going to be. Plus, I not going to flush it down the drain, eat it, or throw it in the trash - I recylce even scrap solder.
             
            Rabid
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 2:25 PM
            Subject: [VacuumX] Re: Lead gaskets?

            --- In VacuumX@yahoogroups.com, "william rowland" <prof@...> wrote:
            >
            > First of all I need to state I have not seen the rest of these
            posts. Lead is somewhat the latest topic on other lists and the new
            EU Laws which are rather stricter than US Laws.

            The sky is falling!

            I have been using lead "as in solder" since 1955 at least... I grew
            up holding lead solder in my mouth since the good Lord deemed that 2
            hands was enough for humans to have. I don't think that there has
            been a period of time longer than a few weeks in the last 50+ years
            that I have not had direct exposure to lead via handling, soldering
            (without protective hoods) etc and I still hold solder between my
            teeth when I run out of hands. My children grew up normally and my
            grandchildren do not have any obvious defects either. Only a few of
            my friends are bothered by the strange noises in my head.

            I do not discount that lead may be hazardous to your health under
            extreme conditions but I think that some folks are getting pretty
            overboard on these laws after all, lead comes from the ground in
            it's natural state, and no matter how hard we try, we can't place
            more of it back into the ground than we take out.

            It they want to really make an impact, they should start by
            outlawing asphalt roadways... That's a much greater polluter of the
            ground than any amount of lead we might bury.

            Ken Hunter



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