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Re: VES return loop wiring moving forward...NOT!

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  • Cliff Travis
    ... the ... Did you get the Dbl Slip switch to work. I wanted. noticed that you now have 2 of them and thea 1st one seems to have wortked ok right along. I
    Message 1 of 10 , Jan 1, 2005
      --- In VECRR@yahoogroups.com, "Jeffrey MacHan" <jmac_han@y...> wrote:
      >
      > Dear Fellow Valeasians,
      >
      > > As is usually the case, I did have to widen the gauge of the
      > converging rails of the curved turnout. The F7 was riding up over
      the
      > rail at that spot.
      >
      > Hi,
      Did you get the Dbl Slip switch to work. I wanted. noticed that you
      now have 2 of them and thea 1st one seems to have wortked ok right
      along. I wanted to use one on my new layout but because of many
      negative reports did not do so.
      I use a number of curved switches without problems but in case I do
      have problems I'd appreciate knowing more about your gauge widening
      technique.
      Thanks
      Cliff
    • Jeffrey MacHan
      Hi Cliff, I guess that you have two questions but I ll answer the double slip issue first. My advice is to avoid the double slip in your layout design. It is
      Message 2 of 10 , Jan 2, 2005
        Hi Cliff,

        I guess that you have two questions but I'll answer the double
        slip issue first.

        My advice is to avoid the double slip in your layout design. It is
        not reliable as I have learned both from personal experience and
        in talking with other highly regarded modellers. In fact Manfred
        Joerger, probably Germany's most accomplished Z-scaler, will
        not use them until he has modified them extensively. For more
        info on improving double slip operation, I recommend David
        Karp's web site (http://www.zscale.org).

        The VEC track plan now includes three double slips in total. One
        in VEE, one in CVE and now one in VEW. The VEE unit works
        reasonably well. The CVE unit has been giving me problems
        from day one and even now, after the Karp modification, it is
        often the site of derailments. My MTL F7s must be in perfect
        gauge and have no mechanical alignment problems with the
        trucks in order for them to consistently negociate the CVE double
        slip.

        As for the VES double slip, only time will tell if it will cause any
        problems. For the time being, I expect that it should operate
        reasonably well since I will only be running a single loco through
        it on the reversing wye.

        Why did I even use a double slip when constructing VES? Two
        reasons...first, I had one in my odds-n-ends drawer and second,
        it was the only way I found to provide two wye leads in the space
        available. Having a short storage track along side the wye lead
        gave the plan a little more interest.

        *****

        Now for the converging rail gauge problem, my solution is to
        gently spread the gauge using a pair of short-nosed hobby pliers
        and bending the outside curved rail end just a wee bit to
        straighten it very slightly. It doesn't take much to correct the
        problem and there is no visible "kink" in the rail. Be careful to
        polish off any tool marks that may be left on the rail by the jaws of
        the pliers. Note: it is easier to do the bending job with the switch
        in your hand than if it is already installed on the layout.

        I remember also using a pair of cutting hobby pliers that have the
        cutting jaws perpendicular to the handle (sorry I don't recall the
        true name for these pliers). The jaws can be placed just under
        the rail tops and the pliers twisted to straighten the rail slightly.
        This technique doesn't leave any tool marks on the rails if done
        carefully.

        Hope this helps. Happy railroading in 2005.
        Jeffrey

        --- In VECRR@yahoogroups.com, "Cliff Travis" <cliff@a...> wrote:

        > > Hi,
        > Did you get the Dbl Slip switch to work. I wanted. noticed that
        you
        > now have 2 of them and thea 1st one seems to have wortked
        ok right
        > along. I wanted to use one on my new layout but because of
        many
        > negative reports did not do so.
        > I use a number of curved switches without problems but in
        case I do
        > have problems I'd appreciate knowing more about your gauge
        widening
        > technique.
        > Thanks
        > Cliff
      • Glen Chenier
        ... Is it the trailing truck that derails on the curved route? If you haven t already tried this, check for a lump of plastic flash on the bottoms of the
        Message 3 of 10 , Jan 2, 2005
          --- In VECRR@yahoogroups.com, "Jeffrey MacHan" <jmac_han@y...> wrote:

          > The CVE unit has been giving me problems
          > from day one and even now, after the Karp modification, it is
          > often the site of derailments. My MTL F7s must be in perfect
          > gauge and have no mechanical alignment problems with the
          > trucks in order for them to consistently negociate the CVE double
          > slip.
          > is already installed on the layout.

          Is it the trailing truck that derails on the curved route? If you
          haven't already tried this, check for a lump of plastic flash on the
          bottoms of the trucks opposite the coupler. If large enough and
          especially if the truck tilts slightly, this flash can catch in the
          gap between the chassis halves at the fuel tank and interefere with
          free swivelling from straight and centered.

          Also test to see if the trucks remain in position when upside down
          and the trucks are twisted by hand. If they spring back to center
          look for molding flash on one or both sides of the small ridge on the
          truck tower that touches the chassis pickup contact whisker. In a
          twisted position this flash unbalances the pressure from the contact
          whiskers and the resulting twist bias interferes with free truck
          swivel. Again, a sharp hobby knife will remove this flash and
          eliminate swivel bias that could be the cause of mistracking.


          > I remember also using a pair of cutting hobby pliers that have the
          > cutting jaws perpendicular to the handle (sorry I don't recall the
          > true name for these pliers).

          End cutters (as opposed to side cutters or diagonal cutters). Also
          useful for prying up worn-out guitar frets without damaging the
          fingerboard.

          Interesting info on double slip problem and the HO scale cure at
          http://www.ida.net/users/tetonsl/railroad/dblslip.htm
          While it is probably not possible to modify an existing Marklin
          double slip in this way, this could be useful for anyone
          contemplating the challenge of a handlaid Z scale double slip.
        • ahellary
          hi all i have a single double slip on plisenwurst and i have no problems with it at all (bet i do now though) the slipi questuin is on the entery to some
          Message 4 of 10 , Jan 3, 2005
            hi all

            i have a single double slip on plisenwurst and i have no problems with it at
            all (bet i do now though)
            the slipi questuin is on the entery to some hidden loops on the the main
            line and also the reverse loopenters the hidden loops via this also

            im at the moment building a spiral that is going up around 340mm with 3 set
            of passing loops on it at the top there will be a reverse loop and also the
            new terminus of the railway the new staion is the "Anhalter Bahnof " the
            only isssue i would say with the kit is Marklin should have given an option
            for a clear roof as the coloured roof will cause opperating problems im
            having a clear one made #

            Tony the loony from the uk running z with DCC :)
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Jeffrey MacHan" <jmac_han@...>
            To: <VECRR@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Sunday, January 02, 2005 2:32 PM
            Subject: [VECRR] Re: Thoughts on Marklin double slip and correcting curved
            gauge


            >
            >
            > Hi Cliff,
            >
            > I guess that you have two questions but I'll answer the double
            > slip issue first.
            >
            > My advice is to avoid the double slip in your layout design. It is
            > not reliable as I have learned both from personal experience and
            > in talking with other highly regarded modellers. In fact Manfred
            > Joerger, probably Germany's most accomplished Z-scaler, will
            > not use them until he has modified them extensively. For more
            > info on improving double slip operation, I recommend David
            > Karp's web site (http://www.zscale.org).
            >
            > The VEC track plan now includes three double slips in total. One
            > in VEE, one in CVE and now one in VEW. The VEE unit works
            > reasonably well. The CVE unit has been giving me problems
            > from day one and even now, after the Karp modification, it is
            > often the site of derailments. My MTL F7s must be in perfect
            > gauge and have no mechanical alignment problems with the
            > trucks in order for them to consistently negociate the CVE double
            > slip.
            >
            > As for the VES double slip, only time will tell if it will cause any
            > problems. For the time being, I expect that it should operate
            > reasonably well since I will only be running a single loco through
            > it on the reversing wye.
            >
            > Why did I even use a double slip when constructing VES? Two
            > reasons...first, I had one in my odds-n-ends drawer and second,
            > it was the only way I found to provide two wye leads in the space
            > available. Having a short storage track along side the wye lead
            > gave the plan a little more interest.
            >
            > *****
            >
            > Now for the converging rail gauge problem, my solution is to
            > gently spread the gauge using a pair of short-nosed hobby pliers
            > and bending the outside curved rail end just a wee bit to
            > straighten it very slightly. It doesn't take much to correct the
            > problem and there is no visible "kink" in the rail. Be careful to
            > polish off any tool marks that may be left on the rail by the jaws of
            > the pliers. Note: it is easier to do the bending job with the switch
            > in your hand than if it is already installed on the layout.
            >
            > I remember also using a pair of cutting hobby pliers that have the
            > cutting jaws perpendicular to the handle (sorry I don't recall the
            > true name for these pliers). The jaws can be placed just under
            > the rail tops and the pliers twisted to straighten the rail slightly.
            > This technique doesn't leave any tool marks on the rails if done
            > carefully.
            >
            > Hope this helps. Happy railroading in 2005.
            > Jeffrey
            >
            > --- In VECRR@yahoogroups.com, "Cliff Travis" <cliff@a...> wrote:
            >
            >> > Hi,
            >> Did you get the Dbl Slip switch to work. I wanted. noticed that
            > you
            >> now have 2 of them and thea 1st one seems to have wortked
            > ok right
            >> along. I wanted to use one on my new layout but because of
            > many
            >> negative reports did not do so.
            >> I use a number of curved switches without problems but in
            > case I do
            >> have problems I'd appreciate knowing more about your gauge
            > widening
            >> technique.
            >> Thanks
            >> Cliff
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Small SiZe, BIG Enjoyment!
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
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