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Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 software test frequencies

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  • Andy obrien
    May I suggest that you consider use of the sked page to coordinate a frequency and chat while attempting you first few V4 QSOs. This worked well when Winmor
    Message 1 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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      May I suggest that you consider use of the "sked" page to coordinate a frequency and chat while attempting you first few V4 QSOs.  This worked well when Winmor was first born.


      http://www.obrienweb.com/sked   click on the digitalradio tab.

      Andy K3UK

      On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 9:17 AM, Kirk, K6KAR <kirk.harding@...> wrote:
       

      Keep in mind that JT-65 is operated at 14.076. 

      The V4 mode should fit nicely around 14.072 +-.5  I agree that “near the traditional keyboard operating areas” would work well.

       

      73

       

      Kirk, K6KAR

       

      From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Hirth
      Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 7:13 AM
      To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 software test frequencies

       

       

      For quite a few years new keyboard modes on 20m have been comfortable in
      the area above PSK-31 and below the old RTTY area. As long as we keep
      our dials between about 14.073 and 14.077 we should be OK.

      If we stay near the traditional keyboard operating areas we're more
      likely to drum up some interest from the curious who monitor that area.
      Keyboarders are used to tuning around, so there may not be a need for us
      to specify fixed operating frequencies, just a small area to search or
      call CQ.

      Sorry I can't really comment on the other bands, as 20 I where I spend
      most of my digital time.

      73, John W2KI


    • Andy obrien
      oops, a typo in the URL, should be http://www.obriensweb.com/sked ... oops, a typo in the URL, should be 
      Message 2 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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        oops, a typo in the URL, should be  http://www.obriensweb.com/sked


        On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 10:00 AM, Andy obrien <k3ukandy@...> wrote:
        May I suggest that you consider use of the "sked" page to coordinate a frequency and chat while attempting you first few V4 QSOs.  This worked well when Winmor was first born.


        http://www.obrienweb.com/sked   click on the digitalradio tab.

        Andy K3UK


        On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 9:17 AM, Kirk, K6KAR <kirk.harding@...> wrote:
         

        Keep in mind that JT-65 is operated at 14.076. 

        The V4 mode should fit nicely around 14.072 +-.5  I agree that “near the traditional keyboard operating areas” would work well.

         

        73

         

        Kirk, K6KAR

         

        From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Hirth
        Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 7:13 AM
        To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 software test frequencies

         

         

        For quite a few years new keyboard modes on 20m have been comfortable in
        the area above PSK-31 and below the old RTTY area. As long as we keep
        our dials between about 14.073 and 14.077 we should be OK.

        If we stay near the traditional keyboard operating areas we're more
        likely to drum up some interest from the curious who monitor that area.
        Keyboarders are used to tuning around, so there may not be a need for us
        to specify fixed operating frequencies, just a small area to search or
        call CQ.

        Sorry I can't really comment on the other bands, as 20 I where I spend
        most of my digital time.

        73, John W2KI



      • Charles Blackburn
        url doesn t work.. id be happy to host one if someone wants to Charlie Ai4ri
        Message 3 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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          url doesn't work..

          id be happy to host one if someone wants to

          Charlie
          Ai4ri
        • marc_pd4u
          How about skeds via K3UK s sked page, that worked very good during winmor beta-test: http://www.obriensweb.com/sked/ Marc, PD4U
          Message 4 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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            How about skeds via K3UK's sked page, that worked very good during winmor beta-test: http://www.obriensweb.com/sked/

            Marc, PD4U


            --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "kn6kb" <rmuething@...> wrote:
            >
            > Good Idea Dave,
            >
            > I would suggest at least two on each of the popular HF bands. Since the BW is only 200 Hz we should be able to find a place. I would suggest at least 500 Hz separation for now perhaps more.
            >
            > Also while V4 will work either USB or LSB I suggest we keep life simple and all work USB and use Dial frequencies. The actual center of the RF spectrum will be 1523 Hz above the USB dial. There is a simple mini Log feature that will allow you to easily enter/save/edit a dial freq and set the radio to that with one mouse click (if you are using radio control).
            >
            > Rick KN6KB
            >
            > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "David Bastress" <bastress@> wrote:
            > >
            > > GA,
            > >
            > > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around to test the V4 software when we get it??
            > >
            > > Dave K3GAU
            > >
            >
          • Steinar Aanesland
            Hi Dave What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq? By the way, take a look at this page:
            Message 5 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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              Hi Dave

              What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq?

              By the way, take a look at this page:
              http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
              It is not much playground left..

              73 de LA5VNA Steinar






              On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
              > GA,
              >
              > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around
              to test the V4 software when we get it??
              >
              > Dave K3GAU
              >
            • David Bastress
              GA Steiner, A couple of comments about the band plan as written. 1. I see it has not been updated to reflect the effects of the 80 meter refarming that was
              Message 6 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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                GA Steiner,
                 
                A couple of comments about the 'band plan' as written.
                 
                1. I see it has not been updated to reflect the effects of the 80 meter refarming that was done in this country a couple of years ago.  Now everything digital and cw must be done below 3600 KHz. so a lot of reshuffling has been done on that band!!
                 
                2. I see Bonnie / HFlink claim a lot of frequencies for their ALE operations.  More than their fair share.
                 
                3. The 40 meter band plan really highlights the problem we have here in the US.  Everything from 7043 to 7100 is used for SSB operations in most of the rest of the world and yet look at all the stuff we try to do in that same frequency range that isn't SSB.  And, not listed in the band plan, are all the Winlink and Winmor RMS stations!!  All the SSB operations by our neighbors to the north and south make using any of them practically impossible for a good part of our early evening / nighttime.  Personally, I don't think we could stuff all the different operations and modes into 43 KHz. if we tried. Then to, that also doesn't account for the fact that the bottom 25 KHz. are only accessible to extra class licensees making the total usable bandwidth for a lot of amateurs only 18 KHz. if we don't want to interfere with SSB operations above 7043!!  It's clearly a problem for everyone. 
                 
                I can't comment on the other bands as I don't use them enough to be aware of their problems. 
                 
                For now, I think the idea of operating at the high end of the PSK /digital mode areas should work for the V4 testing.
                 
                Dave K3GAU
                 
                P.S.: What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land??      
                 
                 
                >>> Steinar Aanesland <saanes@...> 12/3/2010 1:01 PM >>>
                 

                Hi Dave

                What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq?

                By the way, take a look at this page:
                http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
                It is not much playground left..

                73 de LA5VNA Steinar

                On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
                > GA,
                >
                > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around
                to test the V4 software when we get it??
                >
                > Dave K3GAU
                >

              • marc_pd4u
                Yep.. and hard coding these frequencies into the software. And an auto-spot function could also resolve the frequency issue ;-)) ROS delenda est! Marc
                Message 7 of 21 , Dec 3, 2010
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                  Yep.. and hard coding these frequencies into the software. And an auto-spot function could also resolve the frequency issue ;-))

                  ROS delenda est!

                  Marc

                  --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, Steinar Aanesland <saanes@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Dave
                  >
                  > What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq?
                  >
                  > By the way, take a look at this page:
                  > http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
                  > It is not much playground left..
                  >
                  > 73 de LA5VNA Steinar
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
                  > > GA,
                  > >
                  > > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around
                  > to test the V4 software when we get it??
                  > >
                  > > Dave K3GAU
                  > >
                  >
                • Steinar Aanesland
                  What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land? Hi David The only band that is regulated by government is 600m (493-510Khz). Only CW A1A
                  Message 8 of 21 , Dec 4, 2010
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                    "What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land?"

                    Hi David

                    The only band that is regulated by government is 600m (493-510Khz).
                    Only CW A1A is allowed.

                    The Norwegian regulation translated with google:

                    http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lovdata.no%2Ffor%2Fsf%2Fsd%2Ftd-20091105-1340-0.html


                    73 de la5vna

                    Steinar













                    On 03.12.2010 20:21, David Bastress wrote:
                    > GA Steiner,
                    > A couple of comments about the 'band plan' as written.
                    > 1. I see it has not been updated to reflect the effects of the 80 meter
                    > refarming that was done in this country a couple of years ago. Now everything
                    > digital and cw must be done below 3600 KHz. so a lot of reshuffling has been
                    > done on that band!!
                    > 2. I see Bonnie / HFlink claim a lot of frequencies for their ALE operations.
                    > More than their fair share.
                    > 3. The 40 meter band plan really highlights the problem we have here in the US.
                    > Everything from 7043 to 7100 is used for SSB operations in most of the rest of
                    > the world and yet look at all the stuff we try to do in that same frequency
                    > range that isn't SSB. And, not listed in the band plan, are all the Winlink and
                    > Winmor RMS stations!! All the SSB operations by our neighbors to the north and
                    > south make using any of them practically impossible for a good part of our early
                    > evening / nighttime. Personally, I don't think we could stuff all the different
                    > operations and modes into 43 KHz. if we tried. Then to, that also doesn't
                    > account for the fact that the bottom 25 KHz. are only accessible to extra class
                    > licensees making the total usable bandwidth for a lot of amateurs only 18 KHz.
                    > if we don't want to interfere with SSB operations above 7043!! It's clearly a
                    > problem for everyone.
                    > I can't comment on the other bands as I don't use them enough to be aware of
                    > their problems.
                    > For now, I think the idea of operating at the high end of the PSK /digital mode
                    > areas should work for the V4 testing.
                    > Dave K3GAU
                    > P.S.: What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land??
                    > >>> Steinar Aanesland <saanes@...> 12/3/2010 1:01 PM >>>
                    >
                    > Hi Dave
                    >
                    > What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq?
                    >
                    > By the way, take a look at this page:
                    > http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
                    > It is not much playground left..
                    >
                    > 73 de LA5VNA Steinar
                    >
                    > On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
                    > > GA,
                    > >
                    > > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around
                    > to test the V4 software when we get it??
                    > >
                    > > Dave K3GAU
                    > >
                    >
                  • David Bastress
                    GM Steiner, Thanks. Love the simplicity of your rules. I wonder how many of the bureaucrats we could fire in the FCC and our government in general if we had
                    Message 9 of 21 , Dec 4, 2010
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                      GM Steiner,
                       
                      Thanks.  Love the simplicity of your rules.  I wonder how many of the bureaucrats we could fire in the FCC and our government in general if we had such simple rules? :-)
                       
                      What I was really interested in was the number or percentage of LA hams that normally operate SSB vs those that normally operate the digital modes.
                       
                      Another question I would like to ask is, since your bands are wide open are there any "gentlemen's agreements", etc. as to where to operate SSB or where to operate digital modes, etc.??  The only 'open' HF band we have is 160 meters and by and large it works reasonably well.
                       
                      Dave K3GAU 


                       
                      >>> Steinar Aanesland 12/04/10 8:41 AM >>>
                       

                      "What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land?"

                      Hi David

                      The only band that is regulated by government is 600m (493-510Khz).
                      Only CW A1A is allowed.

                      The Norwegian regulation translated with google:

                      http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lovdata.no%2Ffor%2Fsf%2Fsd%2Ftd-20091105-1340-0.html

                      73 de la5vna

                      Steinar

                      On 03.12.2010 20:21, David Bastress wrote:
                      > GA Steiner,
                      > A couple of comments about the 'band plan' as written.
                      > 1. I see it has not been updated to reflect the effects of the 80 meter
                      > refarming that was done in this country a couple of years ago. Now everything
                      > digital and cw must be done below 3600 KHz. so a lot of reshuffling has been
                      > done on that band!!
                      > 2. I see Bonnie / HFlink claim a lot of frequencies for their ALE operations.
                      > More than their fair share.
                      > 3. The 40 meter band plan really highlights the problem we have here in the US.
                      > Everything from 7043 to 7100 is used for SSB operations in most of the rest of
                      > the world and yet look at all the stuff we try to do in that same frequency
                      > range that isn't SSB. And, not listed in the band plan, are all the Winlink and
                      > Winmor RMS stations!! All the SSB operations by our neighbors to the north and
                      > south make using any of them practically impossible for a good part of our early
                      > evening / nighttime. Personally, I don't think we could stuff all the different
                      > operations and modes into 43 KHz. if we tried. Then to, that also doesn't
                      > account for the fact that the bottom 25 KHz. are only accessible to extra class
                      > licensees making the total usable bandwidth for a lot of amateurs only 18 KHz.
                      > if we don't want to interfere with SSB operations above 7043!! It's clearly a
                      > problem for everyone.
                      > I can't comment on the other bands as I don't use them enough to be aware of
                      > their problems.
                      > For now, I think the idea of operating at the high end of the PSK /digital mode
                      > areas should work for the V4 testing.
                      > Dave K3GAU
                      > P.S.: What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land??
                      > >>> Steinar Aanesland <saanes@...> 12/3/2010 1:01 PM >>>
                      >
                      > Hi Dave
                      >
                      > What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS freq?
                      >
                      > By the way, take a look at this page:
                      > http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
                      > It is not much playground left..
                      >
                      > 73 de LA5VNA Steinar
                      >
                      > On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
                      > > GA,
                      > >
                      > > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate around
                      > to test the V4 software when we get it??
                      > >
                      > > Dave K3GAU
                      > >
                      >

                    • la7um
                      David. There is kind of gentlemans agreements. The NRRL do administer on behalf of NPT while looking at IARU reg 1 recommendations. Most of us, but not all
                      Message 10 of 21 , Dec 4, 2010
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                        David. There is kind of gentlemans agreements. The NRRL do administer "on behalf of NPT" while looking at IARU reg 1 recommendations.
                        Most of us, but not all do respect this recommendations.

                        We are "self-ruling ourselves". And traditionally there have for lots of years been a very good cooperation between the NRRL and NPT.

                        But my personal oppinion is that digital modes has been kind of a "stepchild". This gradually is getting better.
                        In reality we here of course are a part of EUROPE.

                        But NPT (in cooperaton with NRRL has given us VFO possibilites on 60m. Secondary Basis. That is quite something.)

                        CW, and SSB RULES. and during tests the beloved RTTY DOUBLE RULES THE WHOLE SPECTRUM running the 1000W.

                        Steinar is good at calculations...I leave the statistics to him, hi.


                        ;-/ 73 de la7um Finn

                        --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "David Bastress" <bastress@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > GM Steiner,
                        >
                        > Thanks. Love the simplicity of your rules. I wonder how many of the
                        > bureaucrats we could fire in the FCC and our government in general if we
                        > had such simple rules? :-)
                        >
                        > What I was really interested in was the number or percentage of LA hams
                        > that normally operate SSB vs those that normally operate the digital
                        > modes.
                        >
                        > Another question I would like to ask is, since your bands are wide open
                        > are there any "gentlemen's agreements", etc. as to where to operate SSB
                        > or where to operate digital modes, etc.?? The only 'open' HF band we
                        > have is 160 meters and by and large it works reasonably well.
                        >
                        > Dave K3GAU
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > >>> Steinar Aanesland 12/04/10 8:41 AM >>>
                        > "What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA land?"
                        >
                        > Hi David
                        >
                        > The only band that is regulated by government is 600m (493-510Khz).
                        > Only CW A1A is allowed.
                        >
                        > The Norwegian regulation translated with google:
                        >
                        > http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lovdata.no%2Ffor%2Fsf%2Fsd%2Ftd-20091105-1340-0.html
                        >
                        > 73 de la5vna
                        >
                        > Steinar
                        >
                        > On 03.12.2010 20:21, David Bastress wrote:
                        > > GA Steiner,
                        > > A couple of comments about the 'band plan' as written.
                        > > 1. I see it has not been updated to reflect the effects of the 80
                        > meter
                        > > refarming that was done in this country a couple of years ago. Now
                        > everything
                        > > digital and cw must be done below 3600 KHz. so a lot of reshuffling
                        > has been
                        > > done on that band!!
                        > > 2. I see Bonnie / HFlink claim a lot of frequencies for their ALE
                        > operations.
                        > > More than their fair share.
                        > > 3. The 40 meter band plan really highlights the problem we have here
                        > in the US.
                        > > Everything from 7043 to 7100 is used for SSB operations in most of the
                        > rest of
                        > > the world and yet look at all the stuff we try to do in that same
                        > frequency
                        > > range that isn't SSB. And, not listed in the band plan, are all the
                        > Winlink and
                        > > Winmor RMS stations!! All the SSB operations by our neighbors to the
                        > north and
                        > > south make using any of them practically impossible for a good part of
                        > our early
                        > > evening / nighttime. Personally, I don't think we could stuff all the
                        > different
                        > > operations and modes into 43 KHz. if we tried. Then to, that also
                        > doesn't
                        > > account for the fact that the bottom 25 KHz. are only accessible to
                        > extra class
                        > > licensees making the total usable bandwidth for a lot of amateurs only
                        > 18 KHz.
                        > > if we don't want to interfere with SSB operations above 7043!! It's
                        > clearly a
                        > > problem for everyone.
                        > > I can't comment on the other bands as I don't use them enough to be
                        > aware of
                        > > their problems.
                        > > For now, I think the idea of operating at the high end of the PSK
                        > /digital mode
                        > > areas should work for the V4 testing.
                        > > Dave K3GAU
                        > > P.S.: What the percentages of operation for SSB vs. digital/cw in LA
                        > land??
                        > > >>> Steinar Aanesland <saanes@...> 12/3/2010 1:01 PM >>>
                        > >
                        > > Hi Dave
                        > >
                        > > What about using 14.101, 14.103, 14.113, 14.115 and take back the ROS
                        > freq?
                        > >
                        > > By the way, take a look at this page:
                        > > http://www.bandplans.com/index.php?band=All
                        > > It is not much playground left..
                        > >
                        > > 73 de LA5VNA Steinar
                        > >
                        > > On 02.12.2010 22:40, David Bastress wrote:
                        > > > GA,
                        > > >
                        > > > Does anyone have any suggestions for frequencies to congregate
                        > around
                        > > to test the V4 software when we get it??
                        > > >
                        > > > Dave K3GAU
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
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