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The year of V4

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  • Paul Whitaker
    Hi Rick, Thanks for that re-cap on the year of V4 ! Yes, its been a very interesting and rewarding process, thank you for all your effort and patience ! My
    Message 1 of 23 , Dec 11, 2011
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      Hi Rick,

      Thanks for that re-cap on the year of V4 !
      Yes, its been a very interesting and rewarding process, thank you for all your effort and patience !

      My only other comment would be that inclusion in RMS Express would round it off nicely - EMail and Chat in the one package.....

      Anyhow, all the very best to you & all the members of the group for the festive season from down under !

      Will be watching out for your tones....

      '73

      Paul Whitaker.
      VK3DPW

    • Paul
      In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency
      Message 2 of 23 , Dec 11, 2011
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        In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency Measure type groups is the ability to simply exchange a text file accurately as well as maintain communications point to point. I have yet to find something that "anyone" can figure out and that's what we are dealing with sometimes in an emergency. In a come as you are scenario if we had a program that we could just type and chat as well as send a text file you'd have my vote. Something that a person can load and use immediately without a huge amount of instruction and so far there is nothing I can find. I know there are programs out there that do just that but they aren't user friendly either.

        Anyway I am so happy I found V4... it's a lot of fun. And thanks for all your effort Rick.

        Paul
        VE9NC
      • Jack Swift
        maybe i missed something, but couldn t you use the user files and paste options to insert your text file? just precede and follow it with a line of
        Message 3 of 23 , Dec 11, 2011
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          maybe i missed something, but couldn't you use the "user files" and
          "paste" options to insert your text file? just precede and follow it
          with a line of "++++"??

          On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Paul <ve9nc@...> wrote:
          > In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency Measure type groups is the ability to simply exchange a text file accurately as well as maintain communications point to point. I have yet to find something that "anyone" can figure out and that's what we are dealing with sometimes in an emergency. In a come as you are scenario if we had a program that we could just type and chat as well as send a text file you'd have my vote. Something that a person can load and use immediately without a huge amount of instruction and so far there is nothing I can find. I know there are programs out there that do just that but they aren't user friendly either.
          >
          > Anyway I am so happy I found V4... it's a lot of fun. And thanks for all your effort Rick.
          >
          > Paul
          > VE9NC
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >



          --
          vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
          Jack Swift, N8WAV
          Houghton County ARES/RACES EC/RO
          105 E. Douglass Ave.
          Houghton, MI 49931
          906-281-5300
          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
        • Paul Leger
          Well there is a reason why a file transfer is required rather than cut and paste into the main body but I do see your point. Yes it can be done that way. In
          Message 4 of 23 , Dec 11, 2011
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            Well there is a reason why a file transfer is required rather than cut and paste into the main body but I do see your point. Yes it can be done that way. In the environment I am used to, we get handed a text file via a computer link and told send this. Multiply that by a hundred files and you can see why it is easier to just sending a file rather than adding several additional steps. Also, and I know this will sound kind of skirting the issue, but with the text file we are used to we prefer not to send them in a clear form... that the other operator cannot easily peruse. As a text file it's a bit more private...  I can't give you specifics because of some of the confidentiality of some of the groups we work with. It's a unique set of circumstances we work within.
             
            Paul
            VE9NC
             
            -----Original Message-----
            From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Jack Swift
            Sent: December 11, 2011 9:22 PM
            To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011

             

            maybe i missed something, but couldn't you use the "user files" and
            "paste" options to insert your text file? just precede and follow it
            with a line of "++++"??

            On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Paul <ve9nc@...> wrote:
            > In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency Measure type groups is the ability to simply exchange a text file accurately as well as maintain communications point to point. I have yet to find something that "anyone" can figure out and that's what we are dealing with sometimes in an emergency. In a come as you are scenario if we had a program that we could just type and chat as well as send a text file you'd have my vote. Something that a person can load and use immediately without a huge amount of instruction and so far there is nothing I can find. I know there are programs out there that do just that but they aren't user friendly either.
            >
            > Anyway I am so happy I found V4... it's a lot of fun. And thanks for all your effort Rick.
            >
            > Paul
            > VE9NC
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >

            --
            vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
            Jack Swift, N8WAV
            Houghton County ARES/RACES EC/RO
            105 E. Douglass Ave.
            Houghton, MI 49931
            906-281-5300
            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

          • Rick Muething
            Paul, Just to bring to your attention if you didn’t already know: 1) You can send any text file currently. Just go to “User Files, Paste and send...then
            Message 5 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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              Paul,
               
              Just to bring to your attention if you didn’t already know:
              1) You can send any text file currently. Just go to “User Files, Paste and send...then navigate to the file you wish to send.  It must be a text file (not a .doc or .pdf ...but you can easily change those to .txt).  Click on the file and it will paste it into the outbound queue and send.  If you are doing emergency work or special forms that file should probably have some preamble info that tells what it is, what it should be used for etc... so the receiver knows what to do with it.
               
              2) On Receive all received text is simply put into the main receive window (and logged to the V4Chat log). But you can currently Copy that text to the clipboard (highlight in the main receive window and right click) and then past that into any text editor and save as a file. A little cumbersome but useable.
               
              To be able to send and receive actual files would require developing a specially formatted file header and footer (so the receiving station would be able to detect the text that is the transmitted file, get the file name etc). That is certainly possible and I will put that on the list to look at later.
               
              Of course sending files should ALWAYS be via ARQ...there is no guarantee FEC transmission alone will arrive error free or complete.
               
              Rick KN6KB
               
            • Paul Leger
              Ok thanks for the explanation and thanks for the tips. I will try it out this week with one of the guys locally to see how she works. Paul VE9NC ... From:
              Message 6 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                Ok thanks for the explanation and thanks for the tips. I will try it out this week with one of the guys locally to see how she works.
                 
                Paul
                VE9NC
                 
                -----Original Message-----
                From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Rick Muething
                Sent: December 12, 2011 10:26 AM
                To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011

                 

                Paul,
                 
                Just to bring to your attention if you didn’t already know:
                1) You can send any text file currently. Just go to “User Files, Paste and send...then navigate to the file you wish to send.  It must be a text file (not a .doc or .pdf ...but you can easily change those to .txt).  Click on the file and it will paste it into the outbound queue and send.  If you are doing emergency work or special forms that file should probably have some preamble info that tells what it is, what it should be used for etc... so the receiver knows what to do with it.
                 
                2) On Receive all received text is simply put into the main receive window (and logged to the V4Chat log). But you can currently Copy that text to the clipboard (highlight in the main receive window and right click) and then past that into any text editor and save as a file. A little cumbersome but useable.
                 
                To be able to send and receive actual files would require developing a specially formatted file header and footer (so the receiving station would be able to detect the text that is the transmitted file, get the file name etc). That is certainly possible and I will put that on the list to look at later.
                 
                Of course sending files should ALWAYS be via ARQ...there is no guarantee FEC transmission alone will arrive error free or complete.
                 
                Rick KN6KB
                 

              • ON2AD
                Hello Rick, Many thanks for the nice program and also to a nice Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. 73 de Pat ON2AD To all the users of V4 Chat the same
                Message 7 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                  Hello Rick,

                  Many thanks for the nice program and also to a nice Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

                  73 de Pat ON2AD

                  To all the users of "V4 Chat" the same whishes.
                • John Wiseman
                  For the record, BPQ32 now has a V4 driver. It is possible to send messages to/from WL2K, altough only in text mode, as V4 isn t 8 bit transparent. This is more
                  Message 8 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                    For the record, BPQ32 now has a V4 driver. It is possible to send messages to/from WL2K, altough only in text mode, as V4 isn't 8 bit transparent. This is more a "proof of concept" than a useful faclility, as V4 is really too slow for messaging, but there could be occasions when a narrow band mode could be useful.It can also be used for Chat, but V4Chat is a much nicer interface for this.
                     
                    73,
                    John G8BPQ
                     
                     

                  • Rick Muething
                    Thanks John. Glad to hear you were able to integrate the V4 TNC. I hope to add the full 8 bit support later (including UTF-8 character sets). I agree for
                    Message 9 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                      Thanks John.  Glad to hear you were able to integrate the V4 TNC.  I hope to add the full 8 bit support later (including UTF-8 character sets). 
                       
                      I agree for most message applications WINMOR or other faster modes probably are best.
                       
                      Rick KN6KB
                       
                       
                       
                    • Rick Muething
                      Paul, If you want to send a file (text, .doc, .pdf, .jpg, .xls, etc.) and you want to do it efficiently then just use RMS Express or BPQ32 peer to peer
                      Message 10 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                        Paul,
                         
                        If you want to send a file (text, .doc, .pdf, .jpg, .xls,  etc.) and you want to do it efficiently then just use RMS Express or BPQ32 peer to peer (WINMOR, Pactor 1,2,3 or Packet) .  The file can be sent as an attachment and multiple files can be sent with the same message. The other benefit of using this method of sending a text file is that with plain text the compression algorithm used (B2F) compresses plain text about 2:1 (virtually doubling the speed).  It also make casual “reading the mail” by monitoring parties difficult...(if you miss any of the compressed file it is very difficult to decompress).  WINMOR and P1, P2 operate at 500 Hz BW and WINMOR 1600 or P3 use 1600-2100 Hz of bandwidth. Wideband is faster but requires a better signal to reach max speed.
                         
                        So my suggestion is if you want or need to send files, use  RMS Express or BPQ32 either peer to peer or peer to BBS.  If you want to chat in plain text at typical typing speed and use only 200 Hz of BW use V4.  Forcing V4 into sending specific files to me is a bit like fitting the square peg into the round hole...sort of like sending pictures with RTTY...possible but why not just send a jpeg?
                         
                        Rick KN6KB
                         
                        Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2011 8:44 PM
                        Subject: RE: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011
                         
                         

                        Well there is a reason why a file transfer is required rather than cut and paste into the main body but I do see your point. Yes it can be done that way. In the environment I am used to, we get handed a text file via a computer link and told send this. Multiply that by a hundred files and you can see why it is easier to just sending a file rather than adding several additional steps. Also, and I know this will sound kind of skirting the issue, but with the text file we are used to we prefer not to send them in a clear form... that the other operator cannot easily peruse. As a text file it's a bit more private...  I can't give you specifics because of some of the confidentiality of some of the groups we work with. It's a unique set of circumstances we work within.
                         
                        Paul
                        VE9NC
                         
                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Jack Swift
                        Sent: December 11, 2011 9:22 PM
                        To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011

                         

                        maybe i missed something, but couldn't you use the "user files" and
                        "paste" options to insert your text file? just precede and follow it
                        with a line of "++++"??

                        On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Paul <mailto:ve9nc%40rac.ca> wrote:
                        > In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency Measure type groups is the ability to simply exchange a text file accurately as well as maintain communications point to point. I have yet to find something that "anyone" can figure out and that's what we are dealing with sometimes in an emergency. In a come as you are scenario if we had a program that we could just type and chat as well as send a text file you'd have my vote. Something that a person can load and use immediately without a huge amount of instruction and so far there is nothing I can find. I know there are programs out there that do just that but they aren't user friendly either.
                        >
                        > Anyway I am so happy I found V4... it's a lot of fun. And thanks for all your effort Rick.
                        >
                        > Paul
                        > VE9NC
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >

                        --
                        vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
                        Jack Swift, N8WAV
                        Houghton County ARES/RACES EC/RO
                        105 E. Douglass Ave.
                        Houghton, MI 49931
                        906-281-5300
                        ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

                      • Paul Leger
                        Gotcha. Thanks for the explanation. Appreciate it. I will look into it further on this end. Hope you have a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. Paul VE9NC
                        Message 11 of 23 , Dec 12, 2011
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                          Gotcha. Thanks for the explanation. Appreciate it. I will look into it further on this end.
                           
                          Hope you have a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.
                           
                           
                          Paul
                          VE9NC
                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Rick Muething
                          Sent: December 12, 2011 5:00 PM
                          To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: {Some tags disabled} Re: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011

                           

                          Paul,
                           
                          If you want to send a file (text, .doc, .pdf, .jpg, .xls,  etc.) and you want to do it efficiently then just use RMS Express or BPQ32 peer to peer (WINMOR, Pactor 1,2,3 or Packet) .  The file can be sent as an attachment and multiple files can be sent with the same message. The other benefit of using this method of sending a text file is that with plain text the compression algorithm used (B2F) compresses plain text about 2:1 (virtually doubling the speed).  It also make casual “reading the mail” by monitoring parties difficult...(if you miss any of the compressed file it is very difficult to decompress).  WINMOR and P1, P2 operate at 500 Hz BW and WINMOR 1600 or P3 use 1600-2100 Hz of bandwidth. Wideband is faster but requires a better signal to reach max speed.
                           
                          So my suggestion is if you want or need to send files, use  RMS Express or BPQ32 either peer to peer or peer to BBS.  If you want to chat in plain text at typical typing speed and use only 200 Hz of BW use V4.  Forcing V4 into sending specific files to me is a bit like fitting the square peg into the round hole...sort of like sending pictures with RTTY...possible but why not just send a jpeg?
                           
                          Rick KN6KB
                           
                          Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2011 8:44 PM
                          Subject: RE: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011
                           
                           

                          Well there is a reason why a file transfer is required rather than cut and paste into the main body but I do see your point. Yes it can be done that way. In the environment I am used to, we get handed a text file via a computer link and told send this. Multiply that by a hundred files and you can see why it is easier to just sending a file rather than adding several additional steps. Also, and I know this will sound kind of skirting the issue, but with the text file we are used to we prefer not to send them in a clear form... that the other operator cannot easily peruse. As a text file it's a bit more private...  I can't give you specifics because of some of the confidentiality of some of the groups we work with. It's a unique set of circumstances we work within.
                           
                          Paul
                          VE9NC
                           
                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com [mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Jack Swift
                          Sent: December 11, 2011 9:22 PM
                          To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: {Some tags disabled} Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 and V4Chat in 2011

                           

                          maybe i missed something, but couldn't you use the "user files" and
                          "paste" options to insert your text file? just precede and follow it
                          with a line of "++++"??

                          On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Paul <mailto:ve9nc%40rac.ca> wrote:
                          > In regards to #4 would you entertain a simple file transfer as part of the chat process? The only reason I am asking is that what we need for some Emergency Measure type groups is the ability to simply exchange a text file accurately as well as maintain communications point to point. I have yet to find something that "anyone" can figure out and that's what we are dealing with sometimes in an emergency. In a come as you are scenario if we had a program that we could just type and chat as well as send a text file you'd have my vote. Something that a person can load and use immediately without a huge amount of instruction and so far there is nothing I can find. I know there are programs out there that do just that but they aren't user friendly either.
                          >
                          > Anyway I am so happy I found V4... it's a lot of fun. And thanks for all your effort Rick.
                          >
                          > Paul
                          > VE9NC
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >

                          --
                          vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
                          Jack Swift, N8WAV
                          Houghton County ARES/RACES EC/RO
                          105 E. Douglass Ave.
                          Houghton, MI 49931
                          906-281-5300
                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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