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Re: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's

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  • George Murphy
    Ned (EI5DS), I certainly enjoyed connecting with you last night via V4 CHAT. I was truly pleased with how well the ARQ Mode worked between our stations
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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      Ned (EI5DS),
       
      I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT."  I was truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our stations even though the signals were rather week at times.  I look forward to further testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations worldwide in the coming months.
       
      Cheers for now and I  look forward to connecting  with  you again via "V4 CHAT" in the near future.
       
      73,
      George Murphy, K3RQ
      Milford, New Hampshire
        
       
      -------Original Message-------
       
      From: ei5ds
      Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
      Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
       
       

      A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
      First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
      Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor systems we have used over the years.
      ]
      After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David on ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.

      The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam.

      Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.

      73 de Ned/EI5DS

       
    • Bob Thornton
      George, I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The second
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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        George,
        I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2 frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.

        Bob

        G3WKW

        --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...> wrote:
        >
        > Ned (EI5DS),
        >
        > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT." I was
        > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our stations even
        > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
        > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations worldwide
        > in the coming months.
        >
        > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
        > CHAT" in the near future.
        >
        > 73,
        > George Murphy, K3RQ
        > Milford, New Hampshire
        >
        >
        > -------Original Message-------
        >
        > From: ei5ds
        > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
        > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
        >
        >
        > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
        > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
        > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ
        > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
        > systems we have used over the years.
        > ]
        > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David on
        > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
        >
        > The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
        > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam.
        >
        > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
        >
        > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
        >
      • Ed Woods WD9DVA
        Hi Ned, pleased tell me about your USB sound interface built into the computer. Any brand name, what is the computer brand? When you say USB sound interface
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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          Hi Ned, pleased tell me about your USB sound interface built into the computer. Any brand name, what is the computer brand? When you say USB sound interface that is the only unit tied to the computer?
          FB Ned on getting ARQ to run. We got the FEC going but no dice on the ARQ. 73 Ed WD9DVA Greenwood, IN. 
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: ei5ds
          Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2011 07:59
          Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's

           

          A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
          First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
          Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor systems we have used over the years.
          ]
          After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David on ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.

          The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam.

          Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.

          73 de Ned/EI5DS

        • George Murphy
          Bob (G3WKW): Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat s ARQ Mode. I think the initial problems I was having switching to the Information Sending
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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            Bob (G3WKW):
             
            Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode."   I think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error."  I was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station (ISS)" to IRS.  The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very helpful and allowed me to unload my  "Send State Buffer."  Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ Mode.  I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
             
            Bob, it was nice to meet you last night.  I am now heading to lunch but will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for about 30 minutes.  If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.  I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is good.  Cheers for now and have a great day.
             
            73,
            George Murphy, K3RQ
            Milford, New Hampshire
             
             
            -------Original Message-------
             
            Date: 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
            Subject: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
             
             

            George,
            I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2 frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.

            Bob

            G3WKW

            --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...> wrote:
            >
            > Ned (EI5DS),
            >
            > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT." I was
            > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our stations even
            > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
            > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations worldwide
            > in the coming months.
            >
            > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
            > CHAT" in the near future.
            >
            > 73,
            > George Murphy, K3RQ
            > Milford, New Hampshire
            >
            >
            > -------Original Message-------
            >
            > From: ei5ds
            > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
            > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
            >
            >
            > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
            > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
            > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ
            > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
            > systems we have used over the years.
            > ]
            > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David on
            > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
            >
            > The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
            > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam.
            >
            > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
            >
            > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
            >

             
          • George Murphy
            Bob (G3WKW), In the attached memo, I meant to say .....how to switch from the Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station (ISS)
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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              Bob (G3WKW),
               
              In the attached memo, I meant to say ".....how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station (ISS) state/mode."  The V4 Chat's "Help file" has been very useful in my attempt to better understand the internals and how to proper operate this new digital mode.
               
              - George Murphy (K3RQ) sends...
              #NNNN  
               
               
               
               
              -------Original Message-------
               
              Date: 8/3/2011 12:39:42 PM
              Subject: Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
               
              Bob (G3WKW):
               
              Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode."   I think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error."  I was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station (ISS)" to IRS.  The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very helpful and allowed me to unload my  "Send State Buffer."  Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ Mode.  I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
               
              Bob, it was nice to meet you last night.  I am now heading to lunch but will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for about 30 minutes.  If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.  I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is good.  Cheers for now and have a great day.
               
              73,
              George Murphy, K3RQ
              Milford, New Hampshire
               
               
              -------Original Message-------
               
              Date: 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
              Subject: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
               
               

              George,
              I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2 frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.

              Bob

              G3WKW

              --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...> wrote:
              >
              > Ned (EI5DS),
              >
              > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT." I was
              > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our stations even
              > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
              > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations worldwide
              > in the coming months.
              >
              > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
              > CHAT" in the near future.
              >
              > 73,
              > George Murphy, K3RQ
              > Milford, New Hampshire
              >
              >
              > -------Original Message-------
              >
              > From: ei5ds
              > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
              > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
              >
              >
              > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
              > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
              > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ
              > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
              > systems we have used over the years.
              > ]
              > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David on
              > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
              >
              > The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
              > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam.
              >
              > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
              >
              > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
              >

               
               
            • Bob Thornton
              I did wonder if it was just finger trouble! The Control+Enter isn t intuitive, you just have to Read The Fine Manual. We all expect to be able to use it first
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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                I did wonder if it was just finger trouble! The Control+Enter isn't intuitive, you just have to Read The Fine Manual. We all expect to be able to use it first and read the detail later. It was only 2 days ago that I found the "End" button for the first time. I had read the manual from cover to cover that day so new it existed but had never seen it (or had a QSO successful enough to need it) They usually ended themselves as ours did.

                Bob

                G3WKW


                --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...> wrote:
                >
                > Bob (G3WKW):
                >
                > Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode." I think
                > the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information Sending
                > Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error." I was not clear
                > on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station (ISS)" to IRS. The
                > "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very helpful and allowed me
                > to unload my "Send State Buffer." Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost
                > propagation between our stations just as I was learning to properly command
                > the V4 Chat's ARQ Mode. I guess this was just another occurrence of our
                > Family Law (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
                >
                > Bob, it was nice to meet you last night. I am now heading to lunch but will
                > return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for about 30
                > minutes. If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation and the
                > frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ. I'll be
                > delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency is clear/not
                > being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is good. Cheers for now
                > and have a great day.
                >
                > 73,
                > George Murphy, K3RQ
                > Milford, New Hampshire
                >
                >
                > -------Original Message-------
                >
                > From: Bob Thornton
                > Date: 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
                > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                >
                >
                > George,
                > I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied me OK
                > but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The second
                > connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2 frames from you
                > before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions were not quite up to
                > it. I later heard you working an EI station but I could not hear them. Wrong
                > band for that distance. Now there are more Europeans around we ought to try
                > 40 metres a bit more.
                >
                > Bob
                >
                > G3WKW
                >
                > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, "George Murphy" <murphyga@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Ned (EI5DS),
                > >
                > > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT." I was
                > > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our stations
                > even
                > > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
                > > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations
                > worldwide
                > > in the coming months.
                > >
                > > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
                > > CHAT" in the near future.
                > >
                > > 73,
                > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                > > Milford, New Hampshire
                > >
                > >
                > > -------Original Message-------
                > >
                > > From: ei5ds
                > > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
                > > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
                > >
                > >
                > > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
                > > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
                > > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC and ARQ
                > > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
                > > systems we have used over the years.
                > > ]
                > > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with David
                > on
                > > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
                > >
                > > The setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
                > > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM mini beam
                >
                > >
                > > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
                > >
                > > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
                > >
                >
              • Curt Nixon
                GM Sir: As you have no doubt seen in the help files and the state diagrams, the operator cannot actually change the state from IRS to ISS. THe only thing you
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
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                  GM Sir:

                  As you have no doubt seen in the help files and the state diagrams, the
                  operator cannot actually change the state from IRS to ISS. THe only
                  thing you can do is to move the typed text from the input window to the
                  rich-text action window by using CTRL +CR(ENTER). Once that is done, it
                  is then up to the ISS station to complete sending its Queue and when
                  that happens, your waiting QUEUE will signal the ISS for a transfer.
                  Without solid ACK/NAK and Synch of frames, etc, the transfer will not
                  take place. From what I have seen so far, it all works like a charm as
                  long as the link quality is high enough.

                  While the documentation indicates that FEC mode is less robust than ARQ,
                  it is referring, I think to the ability to transfer a file w/o errors.
                  If you can copy FEC frames, the brain is great at filling in blanks.

                  In order for ARQ to work, the link must stay solid over a greater period
                  of time to ensure the the transfer and ACK of all the frames in the
                  Queue , transfers, etc before it times out. QSB, QRN, QRM, etc APPEAR to
                  disrupt ARQ more than FEC but it is the same. Its just that ARQ is ALL
                  PERFECT exchanges or nothing (TIMEOUT)

                  Cheers

                  Curt
                  KU8L

                  George Murphy wrote:
                  >
                  > Bob (G3WKW),
                  > In the attached memo, I meant to say ".....how to switch from the
                  > "Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station
                  > (ISS) state/mode." The V4 Chat's "Help file" has been very useful in
                  > my attempt to better understand the internals and how to proper
                  > operate this new digital mode.
                  > - George Murphy (K3RQ) sends...
                  > #NNNN
                  > /-------Original Message-------/
                  > /*From:*/ George Murphy <mailto:murphyga@...>
                  > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 12:39:42 PM
                  > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com>
                  > /*Subject:*/ Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                  > Bob (G3WKW):
                  > Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode." I
                  > think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information
                  > Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error." I
                  > was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station
                  > (ISS)" to IRS. The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very
                  > helpful and allowed me to unload my "Send State Buffer."
                  > Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our
                  > stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ
                  > Mode. I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law
                  > (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
                  > Bob, it was nice to meet you last night. I am now heading to lunch but
                  > will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for
                  > about 30 minutes. If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation
                  > and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.
                  > I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency
                  > is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is
                  > good. Cheers for now and have a great day.
                  > 73,
                  > George Murphy, K3RQ
                  > Milford, New Hampshire
                  > /-------Original Message-------/
                  > /*From:*/ Bob Thornton <mailto:bob.thornton@...>
                  > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
                  > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com>
                  > /*Subject:*/ [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                  >
                  > George,
                  > I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied
                  > me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The
                  > second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2
                  > frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions
                  > were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I
                  > could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more
                  > Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.
                  >
                  > Bob
                  >
                  > G3WKW
                  >
                  > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                  > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...>
                  > wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Ned (EI5DS),
                  > >
                  > > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT."
                  > I was
                  > > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our
                  > stations even
                  > > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
                  > > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations
                  > worldwide
                  > > in the coming months.
                  > >
                  > > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
                  > > CHAT" in the near future.
                  > >
                  > > 73,
                  > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                  > > Milford, New Hampshire
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > -------Original Message-------
                  > >
                  > > From: ei5ds
                  > > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
                  > > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                  > > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
                  > > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
                  > > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC
                  > and ARQ
                  > > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
                  > > systems we have used over the years.
                  > > ]
                  > > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with
                  > David on
                  > > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
                  > >
                  > > T! he setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
                  > > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM
                  > mini beam.
                  > >
                  > > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
                  > >
                  > > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • Bob Thornton
                  Yes, you can t make it change IRS ISS but you can certainly stop it by not having any data to send. Rick has said several times that it is called V4 Chat for
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Yes, you can't make it change IRS>ISS but you can certainly stop it by not having any data to send. Rick has said several times that it is called V4 Chat for a reason! You need to have something in the buffer ready for when the other guy runs out of things to say. No need to wait to become ISS before you start typing a response. I don't believe your outgoing buffer size is updated until you become the ISS. I guess that is because the buffer size is shown on the TNC panel and perhaps the text is held in the Chat program until you become ISS.

                    We had been connected for several minutes with a lot of IDLE being sent. I had sent an extra BTU and KK to keep the link from timing out then I sent "CTRL+ENTER" and George responded. But then I think propagation probably got the better of us. Now I know it was George's first ARQ QSO I feel better about the program's reliability.

                    Bob

                    G3WKW


                    --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, Curt Nixon <captcurt@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > GM Sir:
                    >
                    > As you have no doubt seen in the help files and the state diagrams, the
                    > operator cannot actually change the state from IRS to ISS. THe only
                    > thing you can do is to move the typed text from the input window to the
                    > rich-text action window by using CTRL +CR(ENTER). Once that is done, it
                    > is then up to the ISS station to complete sending its Queue and when
                    > that happens, your waiting QUEUE will signal the ISS for a transfer.
                    > Without solid ACK/NAK and Synch of frames, etc, the transfer will not
                    > take place. From what I have seen so far, it all works like a charm as
                    > long as the link quality is high enough.
                    >
                    > While the documentation indicates that FEC mode is less robust than ARQ,
                    > it is referring, I think to the ability to transfer a file w/o errors.
                    > If you can copy FEC frames, the brain is great at filling in blanks.
                    >
                    > In order for ARQ to work, the link must stay solid over a greater period
                    > of time to ensure the the transfer and ACK of all the frames in the
                    > Queue , transfers, etc before it times out. QSB, QRN, QRM, etc APPEAR to
                    > disrupt ARQ more than FEC but it is the same. Its just that ARQ is ALL
                    > PERFECT exchanges or nothing (TIMEOUT)
                    >
                    > Cheers
                    >
                    > Curt
                    > KU8L
                    >
                    > George Murphy wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Bob (G3WKW),
                    > > In the attached memo, I meant to say ".....how to switch from the
                    > > "Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station
                    > > (ISS) state/mode." The V4 Chat's "Help file" has been very useful in
                    > > my attempt to better understand the internals and how to proper
                    > > operate this new digital mode.
                    > > - George Murphy (K3RQ) sends...
                    > > #NNNN
                    > > /-------Original Message-------/
                    > > /*From:*/ George Murphy <mailto:murphyga@...>
                    > > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 12:39:42 PM
                    > > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > /*Subject:*/ Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                    > > Bob (G3WKW):
                    > > Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode." I
                    > > think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information
                    > > Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error." I
                    > > was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station
                    > > (ISS)" to IRS. The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very
                    > > helpful and allowed me to unload my "Send State Buffer."
                    > > Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our
                    > > stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ
                    > > Mode. I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law
                    > > (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
                    > > Bob, it was nice to meet you last night. I am now heading to lunch but
                    > > will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for
                    > > about 30 minutes. If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation
                    > > and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.
                    > > I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency
                    > > is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is
                    > > good. Cheers for now and have a great day.
                    > > 73,
                    > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                    > > Milford, New Hampshire
                    > > /-------Original Message-------/
                    > > /*From:*/ Bob Thornton <mailto:bob.thornton@...>
                    > > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
                    > > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com>
                    > > /*Subject:*/ [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                    > >
                    > > George,
                    > > I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied
                    > > me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The
                    > > second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2
                    > > frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions
                    > > were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I
                    > > could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more
                    > > Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.
                    > >
                    > > Bob
                    > >
                    > > G3WKW
                    > >
                    > > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                    > > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>, "George Murphy" <murphyga@>
                    > > wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Ned (EI5DS),
                    > > >
                    > > > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT."
                    > > I was
                    > > > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our
                    > > stations even
                    > > > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
                    > > > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations
                    > > worldwide
                    > > > in the coming months.
                    > > >
                    > > > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
                    > > > CHAT" in the near future.
                    > > >
                    > > > 73,
                    > > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                    > > > Milford, New Hampshire
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > -------Original Message-------
                    > > >
                    > > > From: ei5ds
                    > > > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
                    > > > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
                    > > > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
                    > > > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC
                    > > and ARQ
                    > > > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
                    > > > systems we have used over the years.
                    > > > ]
                    > > > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with
                    > > David on
                    > > > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
                    > > >
                    > > > T! he setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
                    > > > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM
                    > > mini beam.
                    > > >
                    > > > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
                    > > >
                    > > > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • Curt Nixon
                    Hi Bob: Yes..that is what I observed regarding the OB Queue..it seems it doesn t update the OB Queue until you become the ISS even though there may be test
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hi Bob:

                      Yes..that is what I observed regarding the OB Queue..it seems it doesn't
                      update the OB Queue until you become the ISS even though there may be
                      test there in Chat waiting to go.

                      I also had the CTRL +CR problem for a while when I started..its right
                      there in the doc's but it isn't intuitive for a old fart like me!

                      Cheers and keep having fun. Perhaps condx will improve soon and we can
                      do some transatlantic chat.

                      CUL

                      73

                      Curt
                      KU8L

                      Bob Thornton wrote:
                      >
                      > Yes, you can't make it change IRS>ISS but you can certainly stop it by
                      > not having any data to send. Rick has said several times that it is
                      > called V4 Chat for a reason! You need to have something in the buffer
                      > ready for when the other guy runs out of things to say. No need to
                      > wait to become ISS before you start typing a response. I don't believe
                      > your outgoing buffer size is updated until you become the ISS. I guess
                      > that is because the buffer size is shown on the TNC panel and perhaps
                      > the text is held in the Chat program until you become ISS.
                      >
                      > We had been connected for several minutes with a lot of IDLE being
                      > sent. I had sent an extra BTU and KK to keep the link from timing out
                      > then I sent "CTRL+ENTER" and George responded. But then I think
                      > propagation probably got the better of us. Now I know it was George's
                      > first ARQ QSO I feel better about the program's reliability.
                      >
                      > Bob
                      >
                      > G3WKW
                      >
                      > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>, Curt Nixon <captcurt@...> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > GM Sir:
                      > >
                      > > As you have no doubt seen in the help files and the state diagrams, the
                      > > operator cannot actually change the state from IRS to ISS. THe only
                      > > thing you can do is to move the typed text from the input window to the
                      > > rich-text action window by using CTRL +CR(ENTER). Once that is done, it
                      > > is then up to the ISS station to complete sending its Queue and when
                      > > that happens, your waiting QUEUE will signal the ISS for a transfer.
                      > > Without solid ACK/NAK and Synch of frames, etc, the transfer will not
                      > > take place. From what I have seen so far, it all works like a charm as
                      > > long as the link quality is high enough.
                      > >
                      > > While the documentation indicates that FEC mode is less robust than
                      > ARQ,
                      > > it is referring, I think to the ability to transfer a file w/o errors.
                      > > If you can copy FEC frames, the brain is great at filling in blanks.
                      > >
                      > > In order for ARQ to work, the link must stay solid over a greater
                      > period
                      > > of time to ensure the the transfer and ACK of all the frames in the
                      > > Queue , transfers, etc before it times out. QSB, QRN, QRM, etc
                      > APPEAR to
                      > > disrupt ARQ more than FEC but it is the same. Its just that ARQ is ALL
                      > > PERFECT exchanges or nothing (TIMEOUT)
                      > >
                      > > Cheers
                      > >
                      > > Curt
                      > > KU8L
                      > >
                      > > George Murphy wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > Bob (G3WKW),
                      > > > In the attached memo, I meant to say ".....how to switch from the
                      > > > "Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station
                      > > > (ISS) state/mode." The V4 Chat's "Help file" has been very useful in
                      > > > my attempt to better understand the internals and how to proper
                      > > > operate this new digital mode.
                      > > > - George Murphy (K3RQ) sends...
                      > > > #NNNN
                      > > > /-------Original Message-------/
                      > > > /*From:*/ George Murphy <mailto:murphyga@...>
                      > > > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 12:39:42 PM
                      > > > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>>
                      > > > /*Subject:*/ Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                      > > > Bob (G3WKW):
                      > > > Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode." I
                      > > > think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information
                      > > > Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error." I
                      > > > was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving
                      > Station
                      > > > (ISS)" to IRS. The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was
                      > very
                      > > > helpful and allowed me to unload my "Send State Buffer."
                      > > > Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our
                      > > > stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ
                      > > > Mode. I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law
                      > > > (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
                      > > > Bob, it was nice to meet you last night. I am now heading to lunch
                      > but
                      > > > will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for
                      > > > about 30 minutes. If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation
                      > > > and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.
                      > > > I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency
                      > > > is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is
                      > > > good. Cheers for now and have a great day.
                      > > > 73,
                      > > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                      > > > Milford, New Hampshire
                      > > > /-------Original Message-------/
                      > > > /*From:*/ Bob Thornton <mailto:bob.thornton@...>
                      > > > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
                      > > > /*To:*/ V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>>
                      > > > /*Subject:*/ [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                      > > >
                      > > > George,
                      > > > I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied
                      > > > me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The
                      > > > second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2
                      > > > frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal
                      > conditions
                      > > > were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station
                      > but I
                      > > > could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more
                      > > > Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.
                      > > >
                      > > > Bob
                      > > >
                      > > > G3WKW
                      > > >
                      > > > --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > > > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>, "George Murphy" <murphyga@>
                      > > > wrote:
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Ned (EI5DS),
                      > > > >
                      > > > > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT."
                      > > > I was
                      > > > > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our
                      > > > stations even
                      > > > > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to
                      > further
                      > > > > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations
                      > > > worldwide
                      > > > > in the coming months.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again
                      > via "V4
                      > > > > CHAT" in the near future.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > 73,
                      > > > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                      > > > > Milford, New Hampshire
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > -------Original Message-------
                      > > > >
                      > > > > From: ei5ds
                      > > > > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
                      > > > > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > > > > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
                      > > > > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
                      > > > > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC
                      > > > and ARQ
                      > > > > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the
                      > Amtor/Pactor
                      > > > > systems we have used over the years.
                      > > > > ]
                      > > > > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with
                      > > > David on
                      > > > > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > T! he setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface.
                      > The CAT
                      > > > > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM
                      > > > mini beam.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                    • George Murphy
                      Curt (KU8L): Thanks for your attached feedback explaining how the ISS and ISR switch-over/handshaking function is executed in the V4 Chat ARQ Mode. I am
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 3, 2011
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Curt (KU8L): 
                         
                        Thanks for your attached feedback explaining how the ISS and ISR "switch-over/handshaking" function is executed in the V4 Chat ARQ Mode.  I am hoping to make a few additional contacts this evening using V4 Chat's ARQ Mode to ensure that I've properly learned how to use both the V4 Chat FEC and ARQ Modes.  Look for me on 14073 KHz around 2230z later this evening (8/3).
                         
                        Cheers for now and thanks for the feedback.  I'm sure your corrective technical V4 Chat User-based comments are appreciated by the entire worldwide community of Hams interested in learning more about the present and emerging digital communication modes.
                         
                        73,
                        George Murphy, K3RQ
                         
                         
                         
                         
                        -------Original Message-------
                         
                        Date: 8/3/2011 1:29:42 PM
                        Subject: Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                         
                        GM Sir:
                         
                        As you have no doubt seen in the help files and the state diagrams, the
                        operator cannot actually change the state from IRS to ISS. THe only
                        thing you can do is to move the typed text from the input window to the
                        rich-text action window by using CTRL +CR(ENTER). Once that is done, it
                        is then up to the ISS station to complete sending its Queue and when
                        that happens, your waiting QUEUE will signal the ISS for a transfer.
                        Without solid ACK/NAK and Synch of frames, etc, the transfer will not
                        take place. From what I have seen so far, it all works like a charm as
                        long as the link quality is high enough.
                         
                        While the documentation indicates that FEC mode is less robust than ARQ,
                        it is referring, I think to the ability to transfer a file w/o errors.
                        If you can copy FEC frames, the brain is great at filling in blanks.
                         
                        In order for ARQ to work, the link must stay solid over a greater period
                        of time to ensure the the transfer and ACK of all the frames in the
                        Queue , transfers, etc before it times out. QSB, QRN, QRM, etc APPEAR to
                        disrupt ARQ more than FEC but it is the same. Its just that ARQ is ALL
                        PERFECT exchanges or nothing (TIMEOUT)
                         
                        Cheers
                         
                        Curt
                        KU8L
                         
                        George Murphy wrote:
                        >
                        > Bob (G3WKW),
                        > In the attached memo, I meant to say ".....how to switch from the
                        > "Information Receiving Station (IRS) to Information Sending Station
                        > (ISS) state/mode." The V4 Chat's "Help file" has been very useful in
                        > my attempt to better understand the internals and how to proper
                        > operate this new digital mode.
                        > - George Murphy (K3RQ) sends...
                        > #NNNN
                        > /-------Original Message-------/
                        > /*From:*/ George Murphy <mailto:murphyga@...>
                        > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 12:39:42 PM
                        > /*Subject:*/ Re: [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                        > Bob (G3WKW):
                        > Yes, we did briefly connect last night via V4 Chat's "ARQ Mode." I
                        > think the initial problems I was having switching to the "Information
                        > Sending Station (ISS)" state was due to a personal "cockpit error." I
                        > was not clear on how to switch from the "Information Receiving Station
                        > (ISS)" to IRS. The "Ctrl & Enter" command suggestion you sent was very
                        > helpful and allowed me to unload my "Send State Buffer."
                        > Unfortunately, it seemed as if we lost propagation between our
                        > stations just as I was learning to properly command the V4 Chat's ARQ
                        > Mode. I guess this was just another occurrence of our "Family Law
                        > (.i.e., Murphy's Law)!" Hi.
                        > Bob, it was nice to meet you last night. I am now heading to lunch but
                        > will return to the "shack" briefly @1700L this afternoon (8/3) for
                        > about 30 minutes. If you are around 14073 KHz and we have propagation
                        > and the frequency is not in use, look for my V4 Chat ARQ-based CQ.
                        > I'll be delighted to QSO with you again providing that the frequency
                        > is clear/not being used and the "prop-path" between our stations is
                        > good. Cheers for now and have a great day.
                        > 73,
                        > George Murphy, K3RQ
                        > Milford, New Hampshire
                        > /-------Original Message-------/
                        > /*From:*/ Bob Thornton <mailto:bob.thornton@...>
                        > /*Date:*/ 8/3/2011 10:00:54 AM
                        > /*Subject:*/ [V4Protocol] Re: V4 QSO's
                        >
                        > George,
                        > I think we connected twice last night on 14073, I believe you copied
                        > me OK but then we failed to change states instead timing out. The
                        > second connection eventualy did change state and I received about 2
                        > frames from you before timeout occurred. I guess the signal conditions
                        > were not quite up to it. I later heard you working an EI station but I
                        > could not hear them. Wrong band for that distance. Now there are more
                        > Europeans around we ought to try 40 metres a bit more.
                        >
                        > Bob
                        >
                        > G3WKW
                        >
                        > <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>, "George Murphy" <murphyga@...>
                        > wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Ned (EI5DS),
                        > >
                        > > I certainly enjoyed "connecting" with you last night via "V4 CHAT."
                        > I was
                        > > truly pleased with how well the "ARQ Mode" worked between our
                        > stations even
                        > > though the signals were rather week at times. I look forward to further
                        > > testing of the V4 CHAT app with other digital mode-based stations
                        > worldwide
                        > > in the coming months.
                        > >
                        > > Cheers for now and I look forward to connecting with you again via "V4
                        > > CHAT" in the near future.
                        > >
                        > > 73,
                        > > George Murphy, K3RQ
                        > > Milford, New Hampshire
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > -------Original Message-------
                        > >
                        > > From: ei5ds
                        > > Date: 08/03/11 03:59:57
                        > > To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com <mailto:V4Protocol%40yahoogroups.com>
                        > > Subject: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > A note to say I had my first local and then DX QSO on V4 last night.
                        > > First QSO was with local station and neighbour Gerry/EI9FV on 14073.
                        > > Using low power we figgered out how the system worked on both FEC
                        > and ARQ
                        > > modes. Noted the data rate exchange slow compared to the Amtor/Pactor
                        > > systems we have used over the years.
                        > > ]
                        > > After the test copied David/K3RQ. A successful QSO established with
                        > David on
                        > > ARQ and then pleasant chat over about 15 minutes.
                        > >
                        > > T! he setup is a TS590 using it's built in USB sound interface. The CAT
                        > > interface (also on USB) used for PTT. The antenna is a 3 ele TGM
                        > mini beam.
                        > >
                        > > Do hope this will encourage more stations to try the mode.
                        > >
                        > > 73 de Ned/EI5DS
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                         
                         
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                      • Paul Whitaker
                        Hi all, I am looking for some contacts on 40 mtr. Like 20 mtr has 14073, is there a frequency to sit on for contacts on 40, and 80 for that matter ? Getting
                        Message 11 of 16 , Aug 5, 2011
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi all,
                          I am looking for some contacts on 40 mtr.
                          Like 20 mtr has 14073, is there a frequency to sit on for contacts on 40,
                          and 80 for that matter ?
                          Getting some very good openings on 40 early in the morning Melbourne time -
                          so good chance Ill hear someone.

                          Thanks

                          Paul Whitaker.
                          VK3DPW
                        • Ed Woods WD9DVA
                          7073 is very good late afternoon into early evening. 73 Ed WD9DVA ... From: Paul Whitaker To: V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 14:48
                          Message 12 of 16 , Aug 5, 2011
                          • 0 Attachment
                            7073 is very good late afternoon into early evening. 73 Ed WD9DVA
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            Sent: Friday, August 05, 2011 14:48
                            Subject: Re: [V4Protocol] V4 QSO's

                             

                            Hi all,
                            I am looking for some contacts on 40 mtr.
                            Like 20 mtr has 14073, is there a frequency to sit on for contacts on 40,
                            and 80 for that matter ?
                            Getting some very good openings on 40 early in the morning Melbourne time -
                            so good chance Ill hear someone.

                            Thanks

                            Paul Whitaker.
                            VK3DPW

                          • Curt Nixon
                            Hi Paul: I usually monitor 7073. It sometimes get QRMafter 0000Z with SSB but can also QSY just above the JT65 Guys at 7076 Seems I have seen 3573 mentioned
                            Message 13 of 16 , Aug 5, 2011
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Hi Paul:

                              I usually monitor 7073. It sometimes get QRMafter 0000Z with SSB but can
                              also QSY just above the JT65 Guys at 7076

                              Seems I have seen 3573 mentioned also but not sure on that one.

                              Give me a Zulu time frame and I can listen for you.

                              I also use the K3UK digital sked page mentioned earlier here to
                              establish QSY etc.

                              Cheers

                              Curt
                              KU8L

                              Paul Whitaker wrote:
                              >
                              > Hi all,
                              > I am looking for some contacts on 40 mtr.
                              > Like 20 mtr has 14073, is there a frequency to sit on for contacts on 40,
                              > and 80 for that matter ?
                              > Getting some very good openings on 40 early in the morning Melbourne
                              > time -
                              > so good chance Ill hear someone.
                              >
                              > Thanks
                              >
                              > Paul Whitaker.
                              > VK3DPW
                              >
                              >
                            • Bob Thornton
                              Here is a list I posted back in June when this question was asked, that didn t seem to get too much argument. 7073 is outside our European bandplan though it
                              Message 14 of 16 , Aug 5, 2011
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Here is a list I posted back in June when this question was asked, that didn't seem to get too much argument. 7073 is outside our European bandplan though it probably won't stop us responding if we hear a call on a clear channel! WSPR is certainly open on 40mtr between Europe and Australia in our late evenings.

                                Quote from Message 1162:
                                I once(February??) found a page from a US state digital group which had a good list but I lost the link! What I noted down was :

                                Europe
                                3590 7040 10136

                                USA
                                3583 7073 10131

                                Worldwide
                                14073 18085 21073

                                hopefully others will add to this or correct any errors, as it is pure hearsay.

                                Bob

                                G3WKW

                                --- In V4Protocol@yahoogroups.com, Paul Whitaker <dromana@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Hi all,
                                > I am looking for some contacts on 40 mtr.
                                > Like 20 mtr has 14073, is there a frequency to sit on for contacts on 40,
                                > and 80 for that matter ?
                                > Getting some very good openings on 40 early in the morning Melbourne time -
                                > so good chance Ill hear someone.
                                >
                                > Thanks
                                >
                                > Paul Whitaker.
                                > VK3DPW
                                >
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