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Megaray alternative

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  • yossarians_22
    Hi all, I have been using a 60W EB Megaray for 2.5 yrs now(iguana) and it currently reads 60 units @ 12 . I d like to replace it(60 is getting pretty low).
    Message 1 of 5 , Jul 26, 2011
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      Hi all,

      I have been using a 60W EB Megaray for 2.5 yrs now(iguana) and it currently reads 60 units @ 12". I'd like to replace it(60 is getting pretty low). Ideally I'd pick up a new copy for my ballast but it appears that Megaray has died(RIP).

      What would the group consider the new top MV UVB bulb? The most important qualifier would be safety and unfortunately I'd be going by the brand's record alone as I don't have a UVC or UV index meter (only have a 6.2). I've been hearing some good things about Arcadia's 100w bulb but they don't seem to be available outside of U.K.

      Thanks!
      Matthew
    • yossarians_22
      Upon further research into the reptile lighting situation in the U.S. it seems I should be content to praising a higher power that I still have a working
      Message 2 of 5 , Aug 1, 2011
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        Upon further research into the reptile lighting situation in the U.S. it seems I should be content to praising a higher power that I still have a working old-style Megaray. Would lowering it to say 10" produce any ill effects?

        Also, any insights into why Europe has seemingly far superior options for lighting? Is it simply access to better suppliers or is there something more to it?

        -Matthew

        --- In UVB_Meter_Owners@yahoogroups.com, "yossarians_22" <yossarians_22@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi all,
        >
        > I have been using a 60W EB Megaray for 2.5 yrs now(iguana) and it currently reads 60 units @ 12". I'd like to replace it(60 is getting pretty low). Ideally I'd pick up a new copy for my ballast but it appears that Megaray has died(RIP).
        >
        > What would the group consider the new top MV UVB bulb? The most important qualifier would be safety and unfortunately I'd be going by the brand's record alone as I don't have a UVC or UV index meter (only have a 6.2). I've been hearing some good things about Arcadia's 100w bulb but they don't seem to be available outside of U.K.
        >
        > Thanks!
        > Matthew
        >
      • Sarina Wunderlich
        Hello Matthew, ... I think the attitude towards reptile keeping is completely different in different countries. In Germany people are extremely focused on a
        Message 3 of 5 , Aug 2, 2011
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          Hello Matthew,
          >
          > Also, any insights into why Europe has seemingly far superior options
          > for lighting? Is it simply access to better suppliers or is there
          > something more to it?
          >
          I think the attitude towards reptile keeping is completely different in
          different countries. In Germany people are extremely focused on a
          "natural" environment. That means, that a "proper" terrarium is always
          equipped with live plants and soil and leaves taken from a forest with
          all the insects an microorganisms in it. The idea is, that the more
          different microorganisms you have in a terrarium, the more difficult it
          is for any single microorganism to spread and you keep the pathogenic
          bacteria low in number. An idea taken perhaps from aquaristics - if you
          remove the "dirt" in the filter and on the ground, the water quality
          will drop, because you remove the bacteria that are cleaning the water.
          And it looks nicer and people think, also reptiles feel more "at home"
          in a terrarium that is decorated with all natural material.
          As far as I know, in the US people tend to have there terrariums more
          "sterile" with tissue, towels or similar as substrate.

          This "natural" idea also holds for lighting: Terrariums have been
          lighted with metal halide lamps for more than a decade now. There were
          some people that started to measure lux levels below various lamps and
          found that only metal halide lamps will be able to provide the 100'000
          lux that natural sunlight has.
          http://www.turtle-technik.de/div/Lichtsession2003/licht.htm
          So people are familiar with these lamps and the ballasts needed for
          operation. Ebay is full of used metal halide lamps and the reptile
          keepers are eager to buy them. I once glanced into the ebay uk, and did
          not find a single lamp ballast there. However, you never had the change
          to buy these lamps in the normal pet shops. The ebay prices for ballasts
          and lamps were so low, that no company could have competed against that.
          I got my first metal halide lamp for 20EUR (including ballast and
          everything), the powersun costed 50EUR at that time.

          Tubes also have a rather low reputation here in Germany. They will not
          give 100'000 lux, therefore they are "bad". UV-tubes have always been
          considered to be useless. Only mercury vapour lamps were thought to give
          sufficient UV. I know that in the US uv tubes seem to work for various
          species, but here the general idea is, that a reptile will become ill
          within weeks, if you do not use a mercury vapour lamp.

          However, the first metal halide UV lamp, as far as I know, was the
          megaray. But people in Germany immediately also wanted to have this
          lamp, and I guess this was why Lucky Reptile thought of selling one.
          There was a big market for it, people already knew about metal halide
          lamps and were waiting for a uv version of it. The other companies
          simply followed.

          So I guess the markets are different, and this is why the companies
          offer different products. I can not believe, that it is because of the
          suppliers.

          (I hope, that I do not have a completely wrong impression from how
          reptiles are kept in the US, if so, please correct me!
          I also want to express, that I do think, that things are done
          differently, but not necessarily "better" in different countries!)

          Sarina



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Actiondisplay
          Hi Matt and Sarina, I constantly puzzle about this too. (and I am in the US) I will probably catch hell over this, but the overall population in the US has a
          Message 4 of 5 , Aug 2, 2011
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            Hi Matt and Sarina,

            I constantly puzzle about this too. (and I am in the US)

            I will probably catch hell over this, but the overall population in the US has a rather low understanding of the basic sciences.

            Many (-but not all, thankfully) herp hobbyists do not really comprehend anything as "heady" as the light spectrum or understand what UV rays, vitamin D etc is.

            With the Internet, everyone now has access to so much information.... you would think someone could sit down, surf, and in 30 min. be brought up to speed on any herp subject.
            Hmmm...this does not always seem to be the case.
            Because without a basic education & understanding on these scientific subjects, (you name it - light, pathogens, biological interdependency .. etc etc..), there is no frame of reference to build on. (No foundation to use to judge if what they are reading makes sense, is good husbandry or just plain garbage!)

            Therefore, it has been a slow process to reach the sophistication that hobbyists elsewhere in the world have come to see as the norm.

            This is why I suspect the herp hobby has remained in the dark ages in the US for so long.

            BTW, I have been around in both the herp and aquarium hobby for 30+ years. :). *phew*.... I could tell you stories... :)

            Anyway, some good news. It seems like things are shifting.

            In the past, the people most likely to keep contained pets that required more of a 'Biological IQ" had always gravitated towards the marine fish / reef tank end of things.
            And less towards reptiles and amphibians. Herps have been traditionall viewed in the US as pets for "kids" and teens. Juvenile pets. Fad/disposable pets. Heck, just look at the 6th grade level that Reptiles magazine is written at.

            People with scientific tendencies could create an enclosed ecosystem and enjoy the elements of biological diversity, technology and share it with other like minded folks in the marine fish/reef tank hobby.

            But now, the tide has turned and reef tanks are on the "out".
            Due probably in part to the large amounts of time, money and electricity needed to maintain them.
            They started the rise in the 80's and 90's and reached the zenith in the mid 00's.

            (Side note: In the dart frog hobby, it seem at least every other day someone posts about cleaning out a 100 - 150 gallon reef tank and converting it into a rainforest vivarium.)

            Don't get me wrong...I am not saying that you need to have tropical reef tank experience to be successful with herps.
            I am just saying that the large portion of the population that could have been driving advancements in the vivarium hobby in the US over the past 20 years were all growing corals and scraping algae.

            But now with the new core of folks coming into the vivarium/herp hobby in the US, that will help drive advancements that are long overdue.
            Maybe a renaissance if you will. :)

            Cheers.
            Todd
            LightYourReptiles.com


            -----Original Message-----
            From: Sarina Wunderlich <Sarina_Wunderlich@...>
            To: UVB_Meter_Owners <UVB_Meter_Owners@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Tue, Aug 2, 2011 3:34 am
            Subject: Re: [UVB_Meter_Owners] Europe vs. US




            Hello Matthew,
            >
            > Also, any insights into why Europe has seemingly far superior options
            > for lighting? Is it simply access to better suppliers or is there
            > something more to it?
            >
            I think the attitude towards reptile keeping is completely different in
            different countries. In Germany people are extremely focused on a
            "natural" environment. That means, that a "proper" terrarium is always
            equipped with live plants and soil and leaves taken from a forest with
            all the insects an microorganisms in it. The idea is, that the more
            different microorganisms you have in a terrarium, the more difficult it
            is for any single microorganism to spread and you keep the pathogenic
            bacteria low in number. An idea taken perhaps from aquaristics - if you
            remove the "dirt" in the filter and on the ground, the water quality
            will drop, because you remove the bacteria that are cleaning the water.
            And it looks nicer and people think, also reptiles feel more "at home"
            in a terrarium that is decorated with all natural material.
            As far as I know, in the US people tend to have there terrariums more
            "sterile" with tissue, towels or similar as substrate.

            This "natural" idea also holds for lighting: Terrariums have been
            lighted with metal halide lamps for more than a decade now. There were
            some people that started to measure lux levels below various lamps and
            found that only metal halide lamps will be able to provide the 100'000
            lux that natural sunlight has.
            http://www.turtle-technik.de/div/Lichtsession2003/licht.htm
            So people are familiar with these lamps and the ballasts needed for
            operation. Ebay is full of used metal halide lamps and the reptile
            keepers are eager to buy them. I once glanced into the ebay uk, and did
            not find a single lamp ballast there. However, you never had the change
            to buy these lamps in the normal pet shops. The ebay prices for ballasts
            and lamps were so low, that no company could have competed against that.
            I got my first metal halide lamp for 20EUR (including ballast and
            everything), the powersun costed 50EUR at that time.

            Tubes also have a rather low reputation here in Germany. They will not
            give 100'000 lux, therefore they are "bad". UV-tubes have always been
            considered to be useless. Only mercury vapour lamps were thought to give
            sufficient UV. I know that in the US uv tubes seem to work for various
            species, but here the general idea is, that a reptile will become ill
            within weeks, if you do not use a mercury vapour lamp.

            However, the first metal halide UV lamp, as far as I know, was the
            megaray. But people in Germany immediately also wanted to have this
            lamp, and I guess this was why Lucky Reptile thought of selling one.
            There was a big market for it, people already knew about metal halide
            lamps and were waiting for a uv version of it. The other companies
            simply followed.

            So I guess the markets are different, and this is why the companies
            offer different products. I can not believe, that it is because of the
            suppliers.

            (I hope, that I do not have a completely wrong impression from how
            reptiles are kept in the US, if so, please correct me!
            I also want to express, that I do think, that things are done
            differently, but not necessarily "better" in different countries!)

            Sarina

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • henrybrames
            yes sarina the defending flora (good and balanced bacteria from natural environment) is an important part of a reptiles defense strategy. there are ten times
            Message 5 of 5 , Aug 2, 2011
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              yes sarina

              the defending flora (good and balanced bacteria from natural
              environment) is an important part of a reptiles defense strategy.
              there are ten times more bacteria than body cells on and in each
              reptile. bacterias are our friends and vivarists are
              dompteurs of the vivaria microbial environment. and second:: 9/10 th of
              a reptile nutrition is proper radiation. metal halides
              with uvb contribute to optimal artificial radiation. in future we have
              to modulate the input to give our reptiles enrichment.
              the situation in vivarias is too steady and constant. there is weather
              and wind outside!


              gx henry




              fachtierarztpraxis für reptilien
              dr henry brames
              heimgarten33
              85221 dachau
              germany

              tel
              0049-8131-55131
              0049-171-8181848
              fax
              0049-8131-55132
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              henry.brames@...
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              henry brames;; reptilienpraxis;; sachkundezentrum muc




              Am 02.08.2011 09:34, schrieb Sarina Wunderlich:
              >
              > Hello Matthew,
              > >
              > > Also, any insights into why Europe has seemingly far superior options
              > > for lighting? Is it simply access to better suppliers or is there
              > > something more to it?
              > >
              > I think the attitude towards reptile keeping is completely different in
              > different countries. In Germany people are extremely focused on a
              > "natural" environment. That means, that a "proper" terrarium is always
              > equipped with live plants and soil and leaves taken from a forest with
              > all the insects an microorganisms in it. The idea is, that the more
              > different microorganisms you have in a terrarium, the more difficult it
              > is for any single microorganism to spread and you keep the pathogenic
              > bacteria low in number. An idea taken perhaps from aquaristics - if you
              > remove the "dirt" in the filter and on the ground, the water quality
              > will drop, because you remove the bacteria that are cleaning the water.
              > And it looks nicer and people think, also reptiles feel more "at home"
              > in a terrarium that is decorated with all natural material.
              > As far as I know, in the US people tend to have there terrariums more
              > "sterile" with tissue, towels or similar as substrate.
              >
              > This "natural" idea also holds for lighting: Terrariums have been
              > lighted with metal halide lamps for more than a decade now. There were
              > some people that started to measure lux levels below various lamps and
              > found that only metal halide lamps will be able to provide the 100'000
              > lux that natural sunlight has.
              > http://www.turtle-technik.de/div/Lichtsession2003/licht.htm
              > So people are familiar with these lamps and the ballasts needed for
              > operation. Ebay is full of used metal halide lamps and the reptile
              > keepers are eager to buy them. I once glanced into the ebay uk, and did
              > not find a single lamp ballast there. However, you never had the change
              > to buy these lamps in the normal pet shops. The ebay prices for ballasts
              > and lamps were so low, that no company could have competed against that.
              > I got my first metal halide lamp for 20EUR (including ballast and
              > everything), the powersun costed 50EUR at that time.
              >
              > Tubes also have a rather low reputation here in Germany. They will not
              > give 100'000 lux, therefore they are "bad". UV-tubes have always been
              > considered to be useless. Only mercury vapour lamps were thought to give
              > sufficient UV. I know that in the US uv tubes seem to work for various
              > species, but here the general idea is, that a reptile will become ill
              > within weeks, if you do not use a mercury vapour lamp.
              >
              > However, the first metal halide UV lamp, as far as I know, was the
              > megaray. But people in Germany immediately also wanted to have this
              > lamp, and I guess this was why Lucky Reptile thought of selling one.
              > There was a big market for it, people already knew about metal halide
              > lamps and were waiting for a uv version of it. The other companies
              > simply followed.
              >
              > So I guess the markets are different, and this is why the companies
              > offer different products. I can not believe, that it is because of the
              > suppliers.
              >
              > (I hope, that I do not have a completely wrong impression from how
              > reptiles are kept in the US, if so, please correct me!
              > I also want to express, that I do think, that things are done
              > differently, but not necessarily "better" in different countries!)
              >
              > Sarina
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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