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New UCI Rules

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  • Adam Myerson
    All, The new UCI rules were officially published today: http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t ype=FILE&id=34593&
    Message 1 of 12 , Aug 13, 2008
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      All,

      The new UCI rules were officially published today:

      http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t
      ype=FILE&id=34593&

      Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
      everything in this document.

      If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
      rules, then cyclo-cross.

      Adam
      --
      Adam F. Myerson
      President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
      Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
      Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
      Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
      President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series

      32 Ditson St., #5
      Dorchester, MA 02122
      (413) 204-3202 Mobile
      (617) 288-1460 Office
      (512) 681-7043 Fax
      499 12 63 29 Belgium
      adam@...
      http://cycle-smart.com
      http://cycle-smart.com/blog
      http://timeprocycling.com
    • Alan Atwood
      The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an ambulance, 4 EMT s, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in Europe too???
      Message 2 of 12 , Aug 13, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site.  The lawyers getting to them in Europe too??? 
         
        Alan




        To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
        From: adam@...
        Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
        Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules


        All,

        The new UCI rules were officially published today:

        http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t
        ype=FILE&id= 34593&

        Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
        everything in this document.

        If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
        rules, then cyclo-cross.

        Adam
        --
        Adam F. Myerson
        President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
        Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
        Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
        Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
        President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series

        32 Ditson St., #5
        Dorchester, MA 02122
        (413) 204-3202 Mobile
        (617) 288-1460 Office
        (512) 681-7043 Fax
        499 12 63 29 Belgium
        adam@cycle-smart. com
        http://cycle- smart.com
        http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
        http://timeprocycli ng.com


      • Meehan, John
        The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion of the course that connects to another portion...perhaps in response in order to avoid
        Message 3 of 12 , Aug 13, 2008
        • 0 Attachment

          The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion of the course that connects to another portion…perhaps in response in order to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can’t simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.

           

          Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course construction costs and set up time considerably.

           

          John Meehan

          Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock

           


          From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Alan Atwood
          Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
          To: usaico@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

           

          The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site.  The lawyers getting to them in Europe too??? 
           
          Alan



          To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
          From: adam@cycle-smart. com
          Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
          Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

          All,

          The new UCI rules were officially published today:

          http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t
          ype=FILE&id= 34593&

          Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
          everything in this document.

          If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
          rules, then cyclo-cross.

          Adam
          --
          Adam F. Myerson
          President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
          Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
          Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
          Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
          President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series

          32 Ditson St., #5
          Dorchester , MA 02122
          (413) 204-3202 Mobile
          (617) 288-1460 Office
          (512) 681-7043 Fax
          499 12 63 29 Belgium
          adam@cycle-smart. com
          http://cycle- smart.com
          http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
          http://timeprocycli ng.com


          CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
        • Douglas Dobrozsi
          I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is not 1 cm or smaller square openings. Also - height is not specified for the fence.
          Message 4 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            I think this will have a big impact on cost / design.  The fencing I have is not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
            Also - height is not specified for the fence.  Surely there needs to be a minimum?
            High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
            Doug Dobrozsi

             
            On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@...> wrote:

            The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion of the course that connects to another portion…perhaps in response in order to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.

             

            Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course construction costs and set up time considerably.

             

            John Meehan

            Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock

             


            From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Alan Atwood
            Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
            To: usaico@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

             

            The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site.  The lawyers getting to them in Europe too??? 
             
            Alan



            To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
            From: adam@...
            Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
            Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

            All,

            The new UCI rules were officially published today:

            http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t
            ype=FILE&id=34593&

            Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
            everything in this document.

            If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
            rules, then cyclo-cross.

            Adam
            --
            Adam F. Myerson
            President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
            Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
            Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
            Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
            President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series

            32 Ditson St., #5
            Dorchester, MA 02122
            (413) 204-3202 Mobile
            (617) 288-1460 Office
            (512) 681-7043 Fax
            499 12 63 29 Belgium
            adam@...
            http://cycle-smart.com
            http://cycle-smart.com/blog
            http://timeprocycling.com


            CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.

          • Adam Myerson
            Think snow fence. That what s intended here, if you think in terms of spirit of the rules. You don t want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders
            Message 5 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
              spirit of the rules.

              You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
              brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
              I've done it.

              Adam


              on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@... wrote:

              > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is
              > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
              > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
              > minimum?
              > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
              > Doug Dobrozsi
              >
              >
              > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@...> wrote:
              >>
              >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion
              >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in order
              >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
              >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
              >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> John Meehan
              >>
              >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
              >>
              >>
              >> ------------------------------
              >>
              >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf
              >> Of *Alan Atwood
              >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
              >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups.com
              >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
              >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in
              >> Europe too???
              >>
              >> Alan
              >>
              >> ------------------------------
              >>
              >>
              >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
              >> From: adam@...
              >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
              >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
              >>
              >> All,
              >>
              >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
              >>
              >>
              >> http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t
              >> ype=FILE&id=34593&
              >>
              >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
              >> everything in this document.
              >>
              >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
              >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
              >>
              >> Adam
              >> --
              >> Adam F. Myerson
              >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
              >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
              >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
              >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
              >> President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
              >>
              >> 32 Ditson St., #5
              >> Dorchester, MA 02122
              >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
              >> (617) 288-1460 Office
              >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
              >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
              >> adam@...
              >> http://cycle-smart.com
              >> http://cycle-smart.com/blog
              >> http://timeprocycling.com
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
              >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential
              >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use,
              >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
              >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies
              >> of the original message.
              >>
            • Meehan, John
              If you look at the videos from Europe, they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that s probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be
              Message 6 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
              • 0 Attachment

                If you look at the videos from Europe , they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that’s probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                 

                John Meehan

                 


                From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                To: USAICO
                Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                 

                Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                spirit of the rules.

                You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                I've done it.

                Adam

                on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@cinci. rr.com wrote:

                > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have
                is
                > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                > minimum?
                > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                > Doug Dobrozsi
                >
                >
                > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <
                href="mailto:john.meehan%40seattlechildrens.org">john.meehan@ seattlechildrens .org> wrote:
                >>
                >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any
                portion
                >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in
                response in order
                >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> John Meehan
                >>
                >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                >>
                >>
                >> ------------ --------- ---------
                >>
                >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] *On Behalf
                >> Of *Alan Atwood
                >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups. com
                >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them
                in
                >> Europe too???
                >>
                >> Alan
                >>
                >> ------------ --------- ---------
                >>
                >>
                >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                >> From: adam@cycle-smart. com
                >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                >>
                >> All,
                >>
                >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                >>
                >>
                >>
                href="http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t">http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t
                >> ype=FILE&id= 34593&
                >>
                >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                >> everything in this document.
                >>
                >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                >>
                >> Adam
                >> --
                >> Adam F. Myerson
                >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                >> President, Verge New England
                Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                >>
                >> 32 Ditson St. , #5
                >> Dorchester ,
                w:st="on">MA 02122
                >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                >> adam@cycle-smart. com
                >> http://cycle- smart.com
                >> http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
                >> http://timeprocycli ng.com
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any
                attachments, is
                >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain
                confidential
                >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review,
                use,
                >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all
                copies
                >> of the original message.
                >>


                CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
              • Tom McDaniel
                I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard. . As a course marker or
                Message 7 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
                • 0 Attachment

                   

                  I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                   

                   The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                   

                  The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                   

                   At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼” poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                   

                  Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                   

                   

                  Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                   

                  It is a pain to store and move.

                   

                  To recap:

                  Snow fence = Bad

                   

                   

                  Tom  McDaniel

                  Granogue Cross

                   

                   

                   

                   

                   


                  From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto: USAICO@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                  Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                  To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                   

                  If you look at the videos from Europe , they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that’s probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                   

                  John Meehan

                   


                  From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto: USAICO@ yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                  Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                  To: USAICO
                  Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                   

                  Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                  spirit of the rules.

                  You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                  brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                  I've done it.

                  Adam

                  on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@cinci. rr.com wrote:

                  > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have
                  is
                  > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                  > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                  > minimum?
                  > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                  > Doug Dobrozsi
                  >
                  >
                  > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <
                  href="mailto:john.meehan%40seattlechildrens.org">john.meehan@ seattlechildrens .org> wrote:
                  >>
                  >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any
                  portion
                  >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in
                  order
                  >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                  >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                  >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> John Meehan
                  >>
                  >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> ------------ --------- ---------
                  >>
                  >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                  [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] *On Behalf
                  >> Of * Alan Atwood
                  >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                  >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups. com
                  >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                  >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them
                  in
                  >> Europe too???
                  >>
                  >> Alan
                  >>
                  >> ------------ --------- ---------
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                  >> From: adam@cycle-smart. com
                  >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                  >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                  >>
                  >> All,
                  >>
                  >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  href="http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t">http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t
                  >> ype=FILE&id= 34593&
                  >>
                  >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                  >> everything in this document.
                  >>
                  >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                  >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                  >>
                  >> Adam
                  >> --
                  >> Adam F. Myerson
                  >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                  >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                  >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                  >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                  >> President, Verge New England
                  Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                  >>
                  >> 32 Ditson St. , #5
                  >> Dorchester ,
                  MA 02122
                  >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                  >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                  >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                  >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                  >> adam@cycle-smart. com
                  >> http://cycle- smart.com
                  >> http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
                  >> http://timeprocycli ng.com
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any
                  attachments, is
                  >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain
                  confidential
                  >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review,
                  use,
                  >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                  >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all
                  copies
                  >> of the original message.
                  >>


                  CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.

                • Myles Romanow
                  Worlds didn t seem to use any of that stuff.. They had....2-3 wooden...dowels cut glat at the top, presumably nice and pointy below the surface. Guys were
                  Message 8 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Worlds didn't seem to use any of that stuff.. They had....2-3" wooden...dowels cut glat at the top, presumably nice and pointy  below the surface. 

                    Guys were using a gas powered auger (like whatyou would use for ice fishing..) to make a small hole, then whack them in.. definitely more effort.  Rent all places have those things. 
                    No tape used as far as I could see.
                    1/2" cotton rope was the order of the day clove hitched to each post.  Then banners tied to the rope/wood..
                     
                    I second the emotion about snow fencing being bad... that stuff is just not safe for this application and would likely cause more accidents than it would prevent.  carefull course setup may be the order of the day.
                     
                    M

                    2008/8/14 Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...>

                     

                    I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                     

                     The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                     

                    The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                     

                     At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼" poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                     

                    Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                     

                     

                    Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                     

                    It is a pain to store and move.

                     

                    To recap:

                    Snow fence = Bad

                     

                     

                    Tom  McDaniel

                    Granogue Cross

                     

                     

                     

                     

                     


                    From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                    Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                    To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com


                    Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                     

                    If you look at the videos from Europe, they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that's probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                     

                    John Meehan

                     


                    From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                    Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                    To: USAICO
                    Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                     

                    Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                    spirit of the rules.

                    You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                    brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                    I've done it.

                    Adam

                    on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@... wrote:

                    > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is
                    > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                    > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                    > minimum?
                    > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                    > Doug Dobrozsi
                    >
                    >
                    > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@...> wrote:
                    >>
                    >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion
                    >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in order
                    >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                    >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                    >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> John Meehan
                    >>
                    >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> ------------------------------
                    >>
                    >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf
                    >> Of *Alan Atwood
                    >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                    >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups.com
                    >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                    >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in
                    >> Europe too???
                    >>
                    >> Alan
                    >>
                    >> ------------------------------
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                    >> From: adam@...
                    >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                    >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                    >>
                    >> All,
                    >>
                    >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t
                    >> ype=FILE&id=34593&
                    >>
                    >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                    >> everything in this document.
                    >>
                    >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                    >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                    >>
                    >> Adam
                    >> --
                    >> Adam F. Myerson
                    >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                    >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                    >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                    >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                    >> President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                    >>
                    >> 32 Ditson St., #5
                    >> Dorchester, MA 02122
                    >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                    >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                    >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                    >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                    >> adam@...
                    >> http://cycle-smart.com
                    >> http://cycle-smart.com/blog
                    >> http://timeprocycling.com
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
                    >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential
                    >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use,
                    >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                    >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies
                    >> of the original message.
                    >>


                    CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.


                  • Tom McDaniel
                    The start banner shall be erected at least 2.5 m above the ground over the start line and shall cover the whole width of the start section. It looks like I
                    Message 9 of 12 , Aug 14, 2008
                    • 0 Attachment

                      The start banner shall be erected at least 2.5 m above the ground

                      over the start line and shall cover the whole width of the start section.

                       

                      It looks like I will get written up for no start banner again this year….

                       

                      Tom

                      Granogue Cross

                       

                       

                       


                      From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto: USAICO@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Myles Romanow
                      Sent: Friday, August 15, 2008 12:01 AM
                      To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                       

                      Worlds didn't seem to use any of that stuff.. They had....2-3" wooden...dowels cut glat at the top, presumably nice and pointy  below the surface. 


                      Guys were using a gas powered auger (like whatyou would use for ice fishing..) to make a small hole, then whack them in.. definitely more effort.  Rent all places have those things. 
                      No tape used as far as I could see.

                      1/2" cotton rope was the order of the day clove hitched to each post.  Then banners tied to the rope/wood..

                       

                      I second the emotion about snow fencing being bad... that stuff is just not safe for this application and would likely cause more accidents than it would prevent.  carefull course setup may be the order of the day.

                       

                      M

                      2008/8/14 Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@ verizon.net>

                       

                      I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                       

                       The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                       

                      The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                       

                       At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼" poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                       

                      Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                       

                       

                      Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                       

                      It is a pain to store and move.

                       

                      To recap:

                      Snow fence = Bad

                       

                       

                      Tom  McDaniel

                      Granogue Cross

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       


                      From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                      Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                      To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com


                      Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                       

                      If you look at the videos from Europe , they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that's probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                       

                      John Meehan

                       


                      From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                      Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                      To: USAICO
                      Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                       

                      Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                      spirit of the rules.

                      You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                      brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                      I've done it.

                      Adam

                      on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@cinci. rr.com wrote:

                      > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have
                      is
                      > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                      > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                      > minimum?
                      > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                      > Doug Dobrozsi
                      >
                      >
                      > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <
                      href="mailto:john.meehan%40seattlechildrens.org" target="_blank">john.meehan@ seattlechildrens .org> wrote:
                      >>
                      >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any
                      portion
                      >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in
                      order
                      >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                      >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                      >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> John Meehan
                      >>
                      >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> ------------ --------- ---------
                      >>
                      >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                      [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] *On Behalf
                      >> Of * Alan Atwood
                      >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                      >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups. com
                      >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                      >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them
                      in
                      >> Europe too???
                      >>
                      >> Alan
                      >>
                      >> ------------ --------- ---------
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                      >> From: adam@cycle-smart. com
                      >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                      >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                      >>
                      >> All,
                      >>
                      >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      href="http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t" target="_blank">http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode= FILE&t
                      >> ype=FILE&id=34593&
                      >>
                      >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                      >> everything in this document.
                      >>
                      >> If the link doesn't work, start at
                      target="_blank">www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                      >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                      >>
                      >> Adam
                      >> --
                      >> Adam F. Myerson
                      >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                      >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                      >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                      >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                      >> President, Verge New England
                      Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                      >>
                      >> 32 Ditson St. , #5
                      >> Dorchester ,
                      w:st="on">MA 02122
                      >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                      >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                      >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                      >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                      >> adam@cycle-smart. com
                      >> http://cycle- smart.com
                      >> http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
                      >> http://timeprocycli ng.com
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any
                      attachments, is
                      >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain
                      confidential
                      >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review,
                      use,
                      >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                      >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all
                      copies
                      >> of the original message.
                      >>


                      CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.

                       

                    • Douglas Dobrozsi
                      Tom, Thanks, your experience here is a great help. Please note that the new UCI rules very specifically say openings no bigger than 1 cm X 1 cm. So snow
                      Message 10 of 12 , Aug 15, 2008
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Tom,
                         
                        Thanks, your experience here is a great help.
                         
                        Please note that the new UCI rules very specifically say openings no bigger than 1 cm X 1 cm.  So snow fence, woven, whatever - needs to fall within that.  The construction fence I have use at a few places in the past is definitely OUT.
                         
                        The comments on worlds was helpful perspective for those who were not there.  I noticed that in the 07 worlds there were also TREES right in the middle of a very wide racing lane - and riders were choosing which way to go.
                         
                        Does anyone have any specific suppliers of woven stuff they can reco?  I have already talked to the folks at world cup supply.
                         
                        Doug Dobrozsi

                         
                        On 8/14/08, Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...> wrote:

                         

                        I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                         

                         The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                         

                        The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                         

                         At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼" poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                         

                        Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                         

                         

                        Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                         

                        It is a pain to store and move.

                         

                        To recap:

                        Snow fence = Bad

                         

                         

                        Tom  McDaniel

                        Granogue Cross

                         

                         

                         

                         

                         


                        From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                        Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                        To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com


                        Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                         

                        If you look at the videos from Europe, they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that's probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                         

                        John Meehan

                         


                        From: USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                        Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                        To: USAICO
                        Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                         

                        Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                        spirit of the rules.

                        You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                        brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                        I've done it.

                        Adam

                        on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@... wrote:

                        > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is
                        > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                        > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                        > minimum?
                        > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                        > Doug Dobrozsi
                        >
                        >
                        > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@...> wrote:
                        >>
                        >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion
                        >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in order
                        >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                        >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                        >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> John Meehan
                        >>
                        >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> ------------------------------
                        >>
                        >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups.com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf
                        >> Of *Alan Atwood
                        >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                        >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups.com
                        >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                        >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in
                        >> Europe too???
                        >>
                        >> Alan
                        >>
                        >> ------------------------------
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                        >> From: adam@...
                        >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                        >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                        >>
                        >> All,
                        >>
                        >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> http://uci.ch/Modules/BUILTIN/getObject.asp?MenuId=MTkzNg&ObjTypeCode=FILE&t
                        >> ype=FILE&id=34593&
                        >>
                        >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                        >> everything in this document.
                        >>
                        >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                        >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                        >>
                        >> Adam
                        >> --
                        >> Adam F. Myerson
                        >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                        >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                        >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                        >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                        >> President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                        >>
                        >> 32 Ditson St., #5
                        >> Dorchester, MA 02122
                        >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                        >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                        >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                        >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                        >> adam@...
                        >> http://cycle-smart.com
                        >> http://cycle-smart.com/blog
                        >> http://timeprocycling.com
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
                        >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential
                        >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use,
                        >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                        >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies
                        >> of the original message.
                        >>


                        CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.


                      • Mitch Graham
                        Anybody know a source for those big wood stakes they used to hold up banners with on the USGP courses? ... From: Tom McDaniel
                        Message 11 of 12 , Aug 15, 2008
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Anybody know a source for those big wood stakes they used to hold up banners with on the USGP courses?

                          --- On Thu, 8/14/08, Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...> wrote:
                          From: Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...>
                          Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                          To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                          Date: Thursday, August 14, 2008, 11:58 PM

                           

                          I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                           

                           The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                           

                          The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                           

                           At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼” poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                           

                          Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                           

                           

                          Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                           

                          It is a pain to store and move.

                           

                          To recap:

                          Snow fence = Bad

                           

                           

                          Tom  McDaniel

                          Granogue Cross

                           

                           

                           

                           

                           


                          From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto: USAICO@yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                          Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                          To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                          Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                           

                          If you look at the videos from Europe , they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that’s probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                           

                          John Meehan

                           


                          From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto: USAICO@ yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                          Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                          To: USAICO
                          Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                           

                          Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                          spirit of the rules.

                          You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                          brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                          I've done it.

                          Adam

                          on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@cinci. rr.com wrote:

                          > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is
                          > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                          > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                          > minimum?
                          > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                          > Doug Dobrozsi
                          >
                          >
                          > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@ seattlechildrens .org> wrote:
                          >>
                          >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion
                          >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in order
                          >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                          >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                          >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> John Meehan
                          >>
                          >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> ------------ --------- ---------
                          >>
                          >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] *On Behalf
                          >> Of * Alan Atwood
                          >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                          >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups. com
                          >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                          >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in
                          >> Europe too???
                          >>
                          >> Alan
                          >>
                          >> ------------ --------- ---------
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                          >> From: adam@cycle-smart. com
                          >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                          >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                          >>
                          >> All,
                          >>
                          >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t
                          >> ype=FILE&id= 34593&
                          >>
                          >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                          >> everything in this document.
                          >>
                          >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                          >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                          >>
                          >> Adam
                          >> --
                          >> Adam F. Myerson
                          >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                          >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                          >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                          >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                          >> President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                          >>
                          >> 32 Ditson St. , #5
                          >> Dorchester , MA 02122
                          >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                          >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                          >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                          >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                          >> adam@cycle-smart. com
                          >> http://cycle- smart.com
                          >> http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
                          >> http://timeprocycli ng.com
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
                          >> for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential
                          >> and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use,
                          >> disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended
                          >> recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies
                          >> of the original message.
                          >>


                          CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.


                        • Myles Romanow
                          If they were like the worlds course ones, I would say either local lumberyard or fencing company. The ones in treviso were un painted, unfinished, just
                          Message 12 of 12 , Aug 15, 2008
                          • 0 Attachment
                            If they were like the worlds course ones, I would say either local lumberyard or fencing company.  The ones in treviso were un painted, unfinished, just straight off the back of a truck..  With the powered auger it's a little faster to install, then they had a slide hammer to bash it in the rest of the way.  Still very time consuming.  But definitely sturdy.  I spent most of two days leaning on the ones uphill and they definitely weren't moving in a hurry. 
                             
                            Come to think of it.. not sure how uninstalling them would go... those things may have been much much longer than originally thought.
                             
                            M

                            On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 10:31 AM, Mitch Graham <mitch_biowheels@...> wrote:

                            Anybody know a source for those big wood stakes they used to hold up banners with on the USGP courses?

                            --- On Thu, 8/14/08, Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...> wrote:
                            From: Tom McDaniel <granoguecross@...>

                            Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                            To: USAICO@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Thursday, August 14, 2008, 11:58 PM

                             

                            I looked at using plastic snow fence a couple of years ago, since there is always a few rolls laying around our construction yard.  . As a course marker or  lane divider it is inherently dangerous,  It works like this: The holes in it are large enough to admit then trap a break hood, front skewer, finger etc, and strong enough to stop the bike instantly.  So if your racers brush against it they are jacked and so is the rider behind them.

                             

                             The woven polypropylene fencing tolerates momentary contact with the racers bike without catching on or trapping parts of the bike.

                             

                            The woven stuff is expensive and working out a safe and quick to set up post system is tricky, steel is prohibited and wood takes a dedicated post installer machine that everyone in Belgium seems to have. But is way outside our budgets.

                             

                             At Granogue we are using a cut down steel T post with a ABS sleeve and safety cap that holds the ¼" poly propylene rope that the fabric fence hangs from.  Then we used a couple thousand zip ties.

                             

                            Last year was the first time we had the fabric fencing from SRAM and the learning curve was bit steep.  It is a lot more time and effort then step in post and tape.

                             

                             

                            Anyhow the above installs relatively quickly in our local semi rocky soil and removes just as fast using hand tools.

                             

                            It is a pain to store and move.

                             

                            To recap:

                            Snow fence = Bad

                             

                             

                            Tom  McDaniel

                            Granogue Cross

                             

                             

                             

                             

                             


                            From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto: USAICO@yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Meehan, John
                            Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 12:05 PM
                            To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                            Subject: RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                             

                            If you look at the videos from Europe , they use that fencing that looks like mesh. But that's probably a big expense so I agree with Adam and this should be easy to remedy with snow fencing as that will be adequate for dealing with the intent of the rule.

                             

                            John Meehan

                             


                            From: USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto: USAICO@ yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Adam Myerson
                            Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:48 AM
                            To: USAICO
                            Subject: Re: [USAICO] New UCI Rules

                             

                            Think "snow fence." That what's intended here, if you think in terms of
                            spirit of the rules.

                            You don't want fence with really big, loose holes, because riders stick
                            brake hoods in them and get their bikes ripped out from under them. I know.
                            I've done it.

                            Adam

                            on 8/14/08 9:43 AM, Douglas Dobrozsi at ddobrozsi@cinci. rr.com wrote:

                            > I think this will have a big impact on cost / design. The fencing I have is
                            > not 1 cm or smaller square openings.
                            > Also - height is not specified for the fence. Surely there needs to be a
                            > minimum?
                            > High fences with little holes are bad for spectators.
                            > Doug Dobrozsi
                            >
                            >
                            > On 8/13/08, Meehan, John <john.meehan@ seattlechildrens .org> wrote:
                            >>
                            >> The other major change: fencing/netting is required between any portion
                            >> of the course that connects to another portionŠperhaps in response in order
                            >> to avoid the incident that took out Trebon at Nats last year. We can't
                            >> simply put the tape up between adjoining riding lanes.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Certainly important from a safety issue but could escalate course
                            >> construction costs and set up time considerably.
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> John Meehan
                            >>
                            >> Carousel Volkswagen Jingle Cross Rock
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> ------------ --------- ---------
                            >>
                            >> *From:* USAICO@yahoogroups. com [mailto:USAICO@yahoogroups. com] *On Behalf
                            >> Of * Alan Atwood
                            >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 13, 2008 11:04 AM
                            >> *To:* usaico@yahoogroups. com
                            >> *Subject:* RE: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> The one change that really stood out for me was the requirement on an
                            >> ambulance, 4 EMT's, and a doctor on site. The lawyers getting to them in
                            >> Europe too???
                            >>
                            >> Alan
                            >>
                            >> ------------ --------- ---------
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> To: USAICO@yahoogroups. com
                            >> From: adam@cycle-smart. com
                            >> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2008 12:21:37 -0400
                            >> Subject: [USAICO] New UCI Rules
                            >>
                            >> All,
                            >>
                            >> The new UCI rules were officially published today:
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> http://uci.ch/ Modules/BUILTIN/ getObject. asp?MenuId= MTkzNg&ObjTypeCo de=FILE&t

                            >> ype=FILE&id= 34593&
                            >>
                            >> Modifications are in red. Please read closely and be familiar with
                            >> everything in this document.
                            >>
                            >> If the link doesn't work, start at www.uci.ch and follow the links for
                            >> rules, then cyclo-cross.
                            >>
                            >> Adam
                            >> --
                            >> Adam F. Myerson
                            >> President, Cycle-Smart, Inc.: Solutions for Cycling
                            >> Member, UCI Cyclo-Cross Commission
                            >> Member, AIOC-Cross Management Committee
                            >> Organizer, Cycle-Smart International Cyclo-Cross
                            >> President, Verge New England Championship Cyclo-Cross Series
                            >>
                            >> 32 Ditson St. , #5
                            >> Dorchester , MA 02122
                            >> (413) 204-3202 Mobile
                            >> (617) 288-1460 Office
                            >> (512) 681-7043 Fax
                            >> 499 12 63 29 Belgium
                            >> adam@cycle-smart. com
                            >> http://cycle- smart.com
                            >> http://cycle- smart.com/ blog
                            >> http://timeprocycli ng.com

                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
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                            >> of the original message.
                            >>


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