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  • Richard Horvitz
    If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 13 2:24 PM
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      If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?
    • Weasel Tracks
      ... Good question. What is it that does the suffering? This question -- paradox about the self as illusion -- pops up a lot. Many people seem to think it
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 13 3:05 PM
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        >If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?

        Good question. What is it that does the suffering?

        This question -- paradox about the self as illusion -- pops up a lot.
        Many people seem to think it implies the self is not real. Perhaps it
        is just better to say, "You are not what you think you are." That
        leaves the fact of suffering intact. Not that suffering needed much
        help to begin with . . .

        ---Weasel Tracks
      • Lee
        ... There is no what. There is just suffering. -- Lee in Minneapolis, Minnesota USA http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/ To affect the quality of the day,
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 13 4:52 PM
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          On 8/13/07, Weasel Tracks <weaseltrax@...> wrote:
          > >If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?
          >
          > Good question. What is it that does the suffering?

          There is no "what." There is just suffering.

          --
          Lee in Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
          http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/

          "To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
          Henry David Thoreau

          "Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
        • Richard Horvitz
          Nobody is suffering? Not one single person?! This is excellent news! :^)
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 13 5:00 PM
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            Nobody is suffering? Not one single person?! This is excellent news! :^)

            On Mon, 13 Aug 2007, Lee wrote:

            > On 8/13/07, Weasel Tracks <weaseltrax@...> wrote:
            >>> If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?
            >>
            >> Good question. What is it that does the suffering?
            >
            > There is no "what." There is just suffering.
            >
            > --
            > Lee in Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
            > http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
            >
            > "To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
            > Henry David Thoreau
            >
            > "Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
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            >
          • Lee
            ... Not nobody. When YOU suffer, there is just suffering. In Buddhism, there are no permanent objects. There is only a dance of processes. -- Lee in
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 13 5:03 PM
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              On 8/13/07, Richard Horvitz <rhorvitz@...> wrote:

              > Nobody is suffering? Not one single person?! This is excellent news! :^)

              Not nobody. When YOU suffer, there is just suffering. In
              Buddhism, there are no permanent objects. There is only a dance of
              processes.

              --
              Lee in Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
              http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/

              "To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
              Henry David Thoreau

              "Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
            • Jakub Jaroszewski
              I suppose self is illusory (empty, sunya) is a method. Heart Sutra says form [and self, too] is emptiness but it says also emptyness is form . Form is
              Message 6 of 6 , Aug 14 1:20 AM
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                I suppose "self is illusory (empty, sunya)" is a method. Heart Sutra
                says "form [and self, too] is emptiness" but it says also "emptyness is
                form". "Form is emptyness" means "self is illusory"; "emptyness is form"
                means "despite of it, suffering is perceived [perceives itself?] as
                real". That's why we need compassion. Sentient beings are empty, selves
                are empty, suffering is empty, but they (beings) suffer or perceive
                suffering anyway. So bodhisattvas must contitue anyway.

                Emptiness is the most profound method Buddha transmitted, I suppose.

                IMHO


                Richard Horvitz pisze:
                > If the self is illusory, what is it that does the suffering?
                >
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                > Yahoo! Groups Links
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