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Re: Overheating

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  • gordon2xbbb
    The Oil Pressure Light glowing at T/Over (950 to 1050rpm) could just be a knackered Oil Pressure Sensor. There s all sorts of contaminants floating around in
    Message 1 of 11 , Jul 18, 2013
      The Oil Pressure Light glowing at T/Over (950 to 1050rpm) could just be a knackered Oil Pressure Sensor. There's all sorts of contaminants floating around in Oil. If it doesn't get used and the Oil & filter changed on a regular basis then the Sensor can get rusted-up - happened to my MkII when I 'rescued' her from the slippery clutches of too many careless owners. Fairly cheap and easy to replace.
      That, and flushing out the engine with proper Engine Flushing stuff from WURTH did the job on My Lady Sharon

      Cheers
      Gordon
      2xBBB 1xTiger800
      Stroud, Gloucestershire, UK

      --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@...> wrote:
      >
      > Sounds like it could be as simple as a crankshaft position sensor "if" it rins fine cold.
      >
      > Bob
      >
      > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
      >
      > ----- Reply message -----
      > From: "a2" <adeux60@...>
      > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
      > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
      > Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 5:54 am
      > Could be as simple as water droplets in the fuel but requires a complete clean out and disturbs the fuel and vac lines which in my opinion is another can of worms..
      The dropping tickover isn't good for your bike as the oil pressure drops as does the charging voltage.
      If the symptoms persist and you find mayonnaise in the oil breather back to the airbox then it points to a head gasket which isn't that difficult to fix.


      Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
      > > Sam.
      >
      > >
      >
    • apsllp@bellsouth.net
      Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean. Bob Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone ... From: samthesidecar
      Message 2 of 11 , Jul 19, 2013
        Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.

        Bob

        Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone

        ----- Reply message -----
        From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
        To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
        Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
        Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm


         

        A bit more info:
        Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud & return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
        Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.

        Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.

        No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
        Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand & High beam.
        Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?

        Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!

        Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
        Running not improved!

        Dropped coolant (half onto legs & feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.

        So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper & points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)

        Any other pointers?

        Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.

        Thanks folks,
        Sam.

        -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:

        >
        > Hi Sam,
        > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
        > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
        > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
        >
        > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
        >
        > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
        >
        > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
        >
        > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
        >
        > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
        >
        > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
        >
        > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
        >
        > Hope this helps,
        > Greg Andrews
        > '96 900 BRG
        > 93,000 smiles
        >
        >
        > "samthesidecar" wrote:
        > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal & sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
        > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner & clean the carbs, then see what happens.
        > Anyone got any thoughts.
        > Thanks,
        > Sam.
        >

      • samthesidecar
        Bob, are they fuel feed? Sam.
        Message 3 of 11 , Jul 19, 2013
          Bob, are they fuel feed?
          Sam.

          --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@...> wrote:
          >
          > Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.
          >
          > Bob
          >
          > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
          >
          > ----- Reply message -----
          > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
          > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
          > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
          > Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm
          > A bit more info:
          >
          > Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud & return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
          >
          > Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.
          >
          >
          >
          > Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.
          >
          >
          >
          > No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
          >
          > Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand & High beam.
          >
          > Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?
          >
          >
          >
          > Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!
          >
          >
          >
          > Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
          >
          > Running not improved!
          >
          >
          >
          > Dropped coolant (half onto legs & feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.
          >
          >
          >
          > So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper & points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)
          >
          >
          >
          > Any other pointers?
          >
          >
          >
          > Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.
          >
          >
          >
          > Thanks folks,
          >
          > Sam.
          >
          >
          >
          > -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@> wrote:
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Hi Sam,
          >
          > > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
          >
          > > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
          >
          > > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Hope this helps,
          >
          > > Greg Andrews
          >
          > > '96 900 BRG
          >
          > > 93,000 smiles
          >
          > >
          >
          > >
          >
          > > "samthesidecar" wrote:
          >
          > > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal & sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
          >
          > > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner & clean the carbs, then see what happens.
          >
          > > Anyone got any thoughts.
          >
          > > Thanks,
          >
          > > Sam.
          >
          > >
          >
        • apsllp@bellsouth.net
          I just restored my fathers 96 tbird 900 which had been stored for 6 years. It never ran right till every thing was clean. I finally got to where i could pull
          Message 4 of 11 , Jul 20, 2013
            I just restored my fathers 96 tbird 900 which had been stored for 6 years.  It never ran right till every thing was clean.  I finally got to where i could pull and strip the carbs in 45 mins.  Yes they feed.  The only way i got everything clean and running right was to totally strip them.  Triumph does not sell all of the parts.  Are all the tiny holes in your emulsion tubes clean?  How worn are the slides and dod you remove the slide tracks?

            I had to flush the cooling system, fix the rad and replace temp sensors too. Drove me nuts.  Now the neutral light flickers in gear at every speed.

            Bob Clark
            01 Sunset Red Trophy 1200
            96 BRG Tbird 900

            Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone

            ----- Reply message -----
            From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
            To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
            Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
            Date: Fri, Jul 19, 2013 4:46 pm


             

            Bob, are they fuel feed?
            Sam.

            --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@...> wrote:
            >
            > Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.
            >
            > Bob
            >
            > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
            >
            > ----- Reply message -----
            > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
            > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
            > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
            > Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm
            > A bit more info:
            >
            > Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud & return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
            >
            > Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.
            >
            >
            >
            > Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.
            >
            >
            >
            > No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
            >
            > Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand & High beam.
            >
            > Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?
            >
            >
            >
            > Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!
            >
            >
            >
            > Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
            >
            > Running not improved!
            >
            >
            >
            > Dropped coolant (half onto legs & feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.
            >
            >
            >
            > So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper & points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)
            >
            >
            >
            > Any other pointers?
            >
            >
            >
            > Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.
            >
            >
            >
            > Thanks folks,
            >
            > Sam.
            >
            >
            >
            > -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@> wrote:
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Hi Sam,
            >
            > > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
            >
            > > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
            >
            > > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
            >
            > >
            >
            > > Hope this helps,
            >
            > > Greg Andrews
            >
            > > '96 900 BRG
            >
            > > 93,000 smiles
            >
            > >
            >
            > >
            >
            > > "samthesidecar" wrote:
            >
            > > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal & sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
            >
            > > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner & clean the carbs, then see what happens.
            >
            > > Anyone got any thoughts.
            >
            > > Thanks,
            >
            > > Sam.
            >
            > >
            >

          • samthesidecar
            Bob, the carbs looked worryingly clean for a bike that s stood that long! Wish I could get the carbs onto the stubs and airbox in 45 minutes!! Suspect I may
            Message 5 of 11 , Jul 20, 2013
              Bob, the carbs looked worryingly clean for a bike that's stood that long! Wish I could get the carbs onto the stubs and airbox in 45 minutes!!
              Suspect I may need to join you at replacing temp. senders.
              Sam.

              --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@...> wrote:
              >
              > I just restored my fathers 96 tbird 900 which had been stored for 6 years. It never ran right till every thing was clean. I finally got to where i could pull and strip the carbs in 45 mins. Yes they feed. The only way i got everything clean and running right was to totally strip them. Triumph does not sell all of the parts. Are all the tiny holes in your emulsion tubes clean? How worn are the slides and dod you remove the slide tracks?
              >
              > I had to flush the cooling system, fix the rad and replace temp sensors too. Drove me nuts. Now the neutral light flickers in gear at every speed.
              >
              > Bob Clark
              > 01 Sunset Red Trophy 1200
              > 96 BRG Tbird 900
              >
              > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
              >
              > ----- Reply message -----
              > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
              > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
              > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
              > Date: Fri, Jul 19, 2013 4:46 pm
              > Bob, are they fuel feed?
              >
              > Sam.
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@> wrote:
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Bob
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
              >
              > >
              >
              > > ----- Reply message -----
              >
              > > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@>
              >
              > > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
              >
              > > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
              >
              > > Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm
              >
              > > A bit more info:
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud & return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand & High beam.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Running not improved!
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Dropped coolant (half onto legs & feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper & points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Any other pointers?
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Thanks folks,
              >
              > >
              >
              > > Sam.
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@> wrote:
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Hi Sam,
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Hope this helps,
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Greg Andrews
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > '96 900 BRG
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > 93,000 smiles
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > "samthesidecar" wrote:
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal & sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner & clean the carbs, then see what happens.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Anyone got any thoughts.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Thanks,
              >
              > >
              >
              > > > Sam.
              >
              > >
              >
              > > >
              >
              > >
              >
            • apsllp@bellsouth.net
              My coils were all fubar also. Bob Clark Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone ... From: samthesidecar To:
              Message 6 of 11 , Jul 20, 2013
                My coils were all fubar also.

                Bob Clark

                Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone

                ----- Reply message -----
                From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
                To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
                Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
                Date: Sat, Jul 20, 2013 3:18 pm


                 

                Bob, the carbs looked worryingly clean for a bike that's stood that long! Wish I could get the carbs onto the stubs and airbox in 45 minutes!!
                Suspect I may need to join you at replacing temp. senders.
                Sam.

                --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@...> wrote:
                >
                > I just restored my fathers 96 tbird 900 which had been stored for 6 years. It never ran right till every thing was clean. I finally got to where i could pull and strip the carbs in 45 mins. Yes they feed. The only way i got everything clean and running right was to totally strip them. Triumph does not sell all of the parts. Are all the tiny holes in your emulsion tubes clean? How worn are the slides and dod you remove the slide tracks?
                >
                > I had to flush the cooling system, fix the rad and replace temp sensors too. Drove me nuts. Now the neutral light flickers in gear at every speed.
                >
                > Bob Clark
                > 01 Sunset Red Trophy 1200
                > 96 BRG Tbird 900
                >
                > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
                >
                > ----- Reply message -----
                > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
                > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
                > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
                > Date: Fri, Jul 19, 2013 4:46 pm
                > Bob, are they fuel feed?
                >
                > Sam.
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "apsllp@..." <apsllp@> wrote:
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Bob
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone
                >
                > >
                >
                > > ----- Reply message -----
                >
                > > From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@>
                >
                > > To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
                >
                > > Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
                >
                > > Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm
                >
                > > A bit more info:
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud & return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand & High beam.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Running not improved!
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Dropped coolant (half onto legs & feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper & points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Any other pointers?
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Thanks folks,
                >
                > >
                >
                > > Sam.
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@> wrote:
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Hi Sam,
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Hope this helps,
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Greg Andrews
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > '96 900 BRG
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > 93,000 smiles
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > "samthesidecar" wrote:
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal & sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner & clean the carbs, then see what happens.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Anyone got any thoughts.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Thanks,
                >
                > >
                >
                > > > Sam.
                >
                > >
                >
                > > >
                >
                > >
                >

              • Jack Byers
                Oh you said overHEATing, I thought you said overEATing. Yeah you ll want to talk to Bob or Greg about that one. Kindest regards, Poppa Jack
                Message 7 of 11 , Jul 28, 2013
                  Oh you said overHEATing, I thought you said overEATing. Yeah you'll want to talk to Bob or Greg about that one.
                   Kindest regards,
                     Poppa Jack
                  On Jul 19, 2013, at 3:54 AM, apsllp@... wrote:

                   

                  Remember,there are jets in each of the float assemblies to clean.

                  Bob

                  Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone

                  ----- Reply message -----
                  From: "samthesidecar" <sgtalbot57@...>
                  To: <TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com>
                  Subject: [TriumphTrophy] Re: Overheating
                  Date: Thu, Jul 18, 2013 4:13 pm


                   

                  A bit more info:
                  Clutch sorted - fluid resembled mud return hole in master cylinder blocked, replied to feller who guessed it right.
                  Fork seals sorted in full sun - bad move.

                  Bike is 1992 900. Was stored 7 years, previous to that has service history (serviced about 200 miles before I bought it.

                  No overtemp light that I can see in the block, I have (from top left):
                  Oil Press,Low fuel, Neutral, Stand High beam.
                  Temp gauge coming up about 1/3 of travel (about the same distance as the red sector covers at the other end) - normal?

                  Fan was cutting in, but then stopped (I thought), so now running on a manual switch - don't want to do head gasket!

                  Cleaned already clean carbs today, possibly 1 pilot jet blocked.
                  Running not improved!

                  Dropped coolant (half onto legs feet) - fairly clean, a wee bit of oil (washed off the case I think). Thermostat operates in a pan of boiling water.

                  So; Paranoid rider not used to hot engine, who should suspect coils or crank position sensor (what's one of those - cigarette paper points man I'd get the BSA out but that doesn't want to play either!)

                  Any other pointers?

                  Great forum with loads of helpful folks, I came from GPz305 forum which like my Kawasaki was dying a slow lingering death.

                  Thanks folks,
                  Sam.

                  -- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Sam,
                  > I was reading some of your previous posts about the clutch and forks. Buying a bike that has been sitting for some time can have its share of problems, but after you get it all sorted out you will be smiling and have learned a lot about your bike.
                  > This group is the right place to be while needing help.
                  > Is the clutch problem fixed? Changing oil was the best first step.
                  >
                  > The bike getting warm in the summer is nothing new, so do we. Looking at the radiator and seeing if there is debris is the first step, hose it off.
                  >
                  > Next does the radiator fan run? Hard to tell while the engine is running. The fan will continue to run when the engine is stopped until the engine cools down.
                  >
                  > There are two places to check for coolant when the bike is cold. Under the radiator cap, but getting to it is not so easy with the side fairing in place. So I first the check the coolant reservoir tank, it is under the seat behind the battery. If this level is good, there is no need to go after the radiator cap.
                  >
                  > Having the temp light glow at tick over is not out of the ordinary. Mine has done that for a number of years. If I know I'll be sitting a while waiting for a green I turn the engine off. These bikes weren't made to idle quietly.
                  >
                  > Now the misfiring and engine stop. You don't know what kind of maintenance your bike has received over the years, so assume the previous owner didn't do any, or he was a knucklehead and only did things to screw it up.
                  >
                  > Above the valve cover is what they call a heat shield. These heat shields also holds down a thick foam barrier. The foam barrier has notches for the engine harness and spark plug wires to pass thru. If the foam barrier is gone, engine heat will pass thru and cook those 3 coils and the family jewels. Ed Johnson can tell you all about it. Coils that are over 10 years old are living on borrowed time, and if they have been cooked, the time is less. My guess is your misfire is coming from the coils or spark plug wires. The Haynes manual tells how to check coils and wires, but then it is not all that accurate. Have you got a friend that will let you try out his coils and wires. Oh one other thing, I never pull the spark plug wire out of the coil. I don't want to break the wire, they are not cheap. eBay is my friend.
                  >
                  > The engine stop is most likely the crank shaft position sensor. Someone on the group said the tach needle while drop to zero when the sensor fails. I've been too busy looking how pull over to the shoulder of the road than watch the tach when it has happened to me. Turn the ignition off and wait 10 to 20 minutes. If it fires up, good. But go another 8 miles and it will probably shut down on you again, good now you know for curtain the sensor is going bad.
                  >
                  > Hope this helps,
                  > Greg Andrews
                  > '96 900 BRG
                  > 93,000 smiles
                  >
                  >
                  > "samthesidecar" wrote:
                  > Back again! 900 Trophy appears to be getting too warm... engine missfires worse than normal sometimes stops running. Worryingly, the oil pressure light glows at tickover.
                  > Propose removing the thermostat, cleaning the cooling system with a two part propriety cleaner clean the carbs, then see what happens.
                  > Anyone got any thoughts.
                  > Thanks,
                  > Sam.
                  >



                • triumphtrophy12
                  From what I ran into sorting out a 900 T-Bird which was stored for 6 years. Time without running regularly is not kind to these machines. The coolant will get
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jul 28, 2013
                    From what I ran into sorting out a 900 T-Bird which was stored for 6
                    years. Time without running regularly is not kind to these machines.

                    The coolant will get pushed out the overflow and past the cap when it
                    gets hot "IF" there is air in the system or any restrictions. Mine
                    looked VERY Clean also when it peed on me.

                    I was sure there were no leaks until I drained the system and flushed it
                    several times with Cooling system flush solution. After I flushed all
                    of the muddy looking crud out (It took four flushes). I refilled the
                    system, purged it of air and learned I had some pin hole leaks in the
                    aluminum radiator which let in air as the system cooled. Antifreeze came
                    out only in small amounts while riding. The nice part about using a
                    Green Antifreeze for aluminum systems is it is VERY easy to see on a
                    Black radiator.

                    I will end up pulling mine again as I found 2 more very tiny pin holes
                    which seep. The leak down pressure test did not identify them when the
                    radiator was initially repaired. Also, the coolant sensor was coated
                    with crud which insulated it from the antifreeze causing it to not
                    function properly. Removing it and cleaning helped, and had he fan
                    working better. The sensor does sit on top of the head, extreme left
                    side just inboard the coolant fitting I have a brand new coolant
                    temperature sensor from Triumph ready to install when I pull the
                    radiator to fix the 2 pin holes.

                    Right now I haven't the time to work on it as having a place to live etc
                    is more important. I'm not planning any trips in the near future and
                    it's too freaking hot and humid to work on it now. Especially since the
                    Trophy is running so well.

                    Draining and flushing the system is too easy and inexpensive (Less than
                    $30.00) not to do. You will need either an 8mm or 10mm socket wrench and
                    and an Allen wrench to get at the radiator. It will take about an hour
                    or 2 to do the job. In addition, the owners manual says the antifreeze
                    should be replaced every 2 calendar years. After seeing what came out of
                    the 900, I PROMPTLY drained flushed and replaced the antifreeze in the
                    1200 Trophy also. It looked OK but no where near as bad as the 900
                    which had not been changed since she left England.

                    Also, make sure the Radiator cap is NEW. They do get old and the
                    springs get weak. It will cause the system to dump coolant and draw in air.

                    What Brand and grade of OIL do you have in the machine? Has the service
                    bulletin for the fan switch and temp light earth been complied with?

                    Bob Clark
                    01 sunset Red Trophy 1200
                    96 BRG Thunderbird 900
                    Jacksonville, FL
                  • samthesidecar
                    Hi Bob, Mobil 1 5/30 oil, what service bulitin ( I would guess so as it was dealer serviced until it was laid up). Had a run out to Anglesey Circuit at the
                    Message 9 of 11 , Jul 29, 2013
                      Hi Bob,
                      Mobil 1 5/30 oil, what service bulitin ( I would guess so as it was dealer serviced until it was laid up).
                      Had a run out to Anglesey Circuit at the weekend, cooling system behaved perfectly - but I did mislay the rear light lens on the way home!!
                      Sam.

                      --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, apsllp@... wrote:
                      >
                      > From what I ran into sorting out a 900 T-Bird which was stored for 6
                      > years. Time without running regularly is not kind to these machines.
                      >
                      > The coolant will get pushed out the overflow and past the cap when it
                      > gets hot "IF" there is air in the system or any restrictions. Mine
                      > looked VERY Clean also when it peed on me.
                      >
                      > I was sure there were no leaks until I drained the system and flushed it
                      > several times with Cooling system flush solution. After I flushed all
                      > of the muddy looking crud out (It took four flushes). I refilled the
                      > system, purged it of air and learned I had some pin hole leaks in the
                      > aluminum radiator which let in air as the system cooled. Antifreeze came
                      > out only in small amounts while riding. The nice part about using a
                      > Green Antifreeze for aluminum systems is it is VERY easy to see on a
                      > Black radiator.
                      >
                      > I will end up pulling mine again as I found 2 more very tiny pin holes
                      > which seep. The leak down pressure test did not identify them when the
                      > radiator was initially repaired. Also, the coolant sensor was coated
                      > with crud which insulated it from the antifreeze causing it to not
                      > function properly. Removing it and cleaning helped, and had he fan
                      > working better. The sensor does sit on top of the head, extreme left
                      > side just inboard the coolant fitting I have a brand new coolant
                      > temperature sensor from Triumph ready to install when I pull the
                      > radiator to fix the 2 pin holes.
                      >
                      > Right now I haven't the time to work on it as having a place to live etc
                      > is more important. I'm not planning any trips in the near future and
                      > it's too freaking hot and humid to work on it now. Especially since the
                      > Trophy is running so well.
                      >
                      > Draining and flushing the system is too easy and inexpensive (Less than
                      > $30.00) not to do. You will need either an 8mm or 10mm socket wrench and
                      > and an Allen wrench to get at the radiator. It will take about an hour
                      > or 2 to do the job. In addition, the owners manual says the antifreeze
                      > should be replaced every 2 calendar years. After seeing what came out of
                      > the 900, I PROMPTLY drained flushed and replaced the antifreeze in the
                      > 1200 Trophy also. It looked OK but no where near as bad as the 900
                      > which had not been changed since she left England.
                      >
                      > Also, make sure the Radiator cap is NEW. They do get old and the
                      > springs get weak. It will cause the system to dump coolant and draw in air.
                      >
                      > What Brand and grade of OIL do you have in the machine? Has the service
                      > bulletin for the fan switch and temp light earth been complied with?
                      >
                      > Bob Clark
                      > 01 sunset Red Trophy 1200
                      > 96 BRG Thunderbird 900
                      > Jacksonville, FL
                      >
                    • apsllp@bellsouth.net
                      The service bullitin was issued in the early 2000 s. Many dealers were not aware of it. In addition, the bullitin called for using insulation displacement
                      Message 10 of 11 , Jul 30, 2013
                        The service bullitin was issued in the early 2000's.  Many dealers were not aware of it.  In addition, the bullitin called for using insulation displacement (cheap) splices, instead of designing the fix proper with solder and heat shrink.  

                        By now, the dis similar metals between the harness and splice would have initiated corrosion.  Mine had, and I took things appart, cut out the corroded wire and replaced it.

                        No more overtemplight false indications or fan not working issues.

                        The bullitin is listed in the FAQ's.
                        Bob

                        Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE smartphone

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