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Re: [TriumphTrophy] Fork oil drain holes

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  • Ed Johnson
    Good Job Greg! Another one of those little things that Triumph shoulda/coulda/woulda/ done to make life easier for us like giving us access to the radiator cap
    Message 1 of 14 , Dec 30, 2012
    Good Job Greg! Another one of those little things that Triumph shoulda/coulda/woulda/ done to make life easier for us like giving us access to the radiator cap for example. (;-)
    Ed J. 2001Triumph Trophy BBBB
    On 12/30/2012 4:22 PM, Greg wrote:
    Hi All, I finally got around to putting drain holes in the fork tubes. As many of you know, changing the oil in the fork tubes is not an easy job. Why didn't Triumph put a drain hole at the bottom of each fork tube?
    
    I drilled and tapped in a small pipe thread plug near the bottom of the fork leg. I also added a small brass plug in the top of the fork cap.  
    
    I sent Ed Johnson three pictures, maybe he can down load the pictures on to this post.
    
    Greg Andrews
    '96 900 BRG       Green Bike
    '98 Sprint Sport  Gray Bike
    
    
    
    
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  • Ed Johnson
    Good Info Glenn however it s pretty useless on a Trophy because BGA [Before Greg Andrews] there ARE no drain holes. One must disassemble the bike in order to
    Message 2 of 14 , Dec 30, 2012
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      Good Info Glenn however it's  pretty useless on a Trophy because BGA [Before Greg Andrews] there ARE no drain holes. One must disassemble the bike in order to do what should be a simple routine maintenance job. :-(
      Ed J. 2001Triumph Trophy BBBB
      On 12/30/2012 4:53 PM, slovcan wrote:
      Perfect timing! Changing fork oil is on my short list as I have no idea what and how much is in the forks or how old it is. My 29 year old Honda Sabre has drain plugs so I assumed all bikes did.
      
      If you haven't done the job, yet, 2 pails that you can set at an angle leaning the tops toward the forks will help cut down on the mess. Ideally, at this lean angle the inner lip of the pail will be low enough to catch the old oil at full compression. That oil shoots a LONG way out the drain holes.
      
      I'm looking forward to the pictures.
      
      Thanks,
      Glenn
      
      
      
       
    • slovcan
      Thanks Ed. Yes, I was referring to doing the job AGA (After Greg Andrews) ;-)
      Message 3 of 14 , Dec 30, 2012
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        Thanks Ed. Yes, I was referring to doing the job AGA (After Greg Andrews) ;-)>

        --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, Ed Johnson <edljohnson2@...> wrote:
        >
        > Good Info Glenn however it's pretty useless on a Trophy because BGA
        > [Before Greg Andrews] there ARE no drain holes. One must disassemble the
        > bike in order to do what should be a simple routine maintenance job. :-(
        > *Ed J. *2001Triumph Trophy BBBB**
        > On 12/30/2012 4:53 PM, slovcan wrote:
        > > Perfect timing! Changing fork oil is on my short list as I have no idea what and how much is in the forks or how old it is. My 29 year old Honda Sabre has drain plugs so I assumed all bikes did.
        > >
        > > If you haven't done the job, yet, 2 pails that you can set at an angle leaning the tops toward the forks will help cut down on the mess. Ideally, at this lean angle the inner lip of the pail will be low enough to catch the old oil at full compression. That oil shoots a LONG way out the drain holes.
        > >
        > > I'm looking forward to the pictures.
        > >
        > > Thanks,
        > > Glenn
        > >
        > >
        >
      • Greg
        Hi Glenn and Ed, You guys are funny. But I ll take it as a compliment. Glenn, thanks about the post on penetrating oil, I went out and bought some ATF &
        Message 4 of 14 , Dec 30, 2012
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          Hi Glenn and Ed, You guys are funny. But I'll take it as a compliment.
          Glenn, thanks about the post on penetrating oil, I went out and bought some ATF & acetone. Next time it happens I'll be prepared.

          The plugs are 1/8-27 pipe thread. It requires a tear down of the bottom fork. I had some old fork legs to practice on.
          Greg Andrews

          "slovcan" wrote:
          Thanks Ed. Yes, I was referring to doing the job AGA (After Greg Andrews) ;-)>
          Ed Johnson wrote:
          Good Info Glenn however it's pretty useless on a Trophy because BGA
          [Before Greg Andrews] there ARE no drain holes.
        • Greg
          Hi All, I was thinking, if someone wants to do the drain hole job on their bike. I can send one of the old fork bottoms that I practiced on. I ll give it to
          Message 5 of 14 , Dec 30, 2012
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            Hi All, I was thinking, if someone wants to do the drain hole job on their bike. I can send one of the old fork bottoms that I practiced on. I'll give it to you and you pay for the shipping. Let me know if you are interested.
            Greg

            "Greg" wrote:
            The plugs are 1/8-27 pipe thread. It requires a tear down of the bottom fork. I had some old fork legs to practice on.
          • gordon2xbbb
            Hi Greg, Another brilliant idea that is well worth considering next time I tear down the forks for a service....but what is the purpose of the brass coloured
            Message 6 of 14 , Dec 31, 2012
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              Hi Greg,

              Another brilliant idea that is well worth considering next time I tear down the forks for a service....but what is the purpose of the brass coloured fastening in the fork leg cap nut (picture #2)...some sort of pressurisation input/vent or just another easy-fill idea from you.

              Thanks as ever for your input,

              Happy New Year to you and yours

              Cheers

              Gordon
              2xBBB
              Stroud, Gloucestershire, UK

              --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi All, I was thinking, if someone wants to do the drain hole job on their bike. I can send one of the old fork bottoms that I practiced on. I'll give it to you and you pay for the shipping. Let me know if you are interested.
              > Greg
              >
              > "Greg" wrote:
              > The plugs are 1/8-27 pipe thread. It requires a tear down of the bottom fork. I had some old fork legs to practice on.
              >
            • gluman3
              There is a reason why there are no oil drain holes in modern suspension systems. The forks use cartridges that have small orifices and stacked washers to
              Message 7 of 14 , Dec 31, 2012
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                There is a reason why there are no oil drain holes in modern suspension systems. The forks use cartridges that have small orifices and stacked washers to regulate oil flow. Merely draining what ever oil you can from the fork tubes will not empty the cartridges completely and will leave a lot of dirt in the forks which will contaminate any new oil you add. You will also have no way to determine the correct oil volume to add to the forks. The best method is to remove, disassemble, wash the components in kerosene, replace the fork seals and bushings as necessary. Refill the forks with the proper oil at the recommended level being careful to make sure both are the same. It is a good idea to replace the crush washer on the bottom bolt and fit new O-rings to the caps while in there. Do it properly or have it done. Don't cut corners when it comes to your safety.

                Happy New Year, Steve

                --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hi All, I finally got around to putting drain holes in the fork tubes. As many of you know, changing the oil in the fork tubes is not an easy job. Why didn't Triumph put a drain hole at the bottom of each fork tube?
                >
                > I drilled and tapped in a small pipe thread plug near the bottom of the fork leg. I also added a small brass plug in the top of the fork cap.
                >
                > I sent Ed Johnson three pictures, maybe he can down load the pictures on to this post.
                >
                > Greg Andrews
                > '96 900 BRG Green Bike
                > '98 Sprint Sport Gray Bike
                >
              • Greg
                Hi Gordon, I was thinking it would work as a vent while draining. Easy fill? Probably not. The threaded hole is about .330 inch. It would take a very small
                Message 8 of 14 , Dec 31, 2012
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                  Hi Gordon, I was thinking it would work as a vent while draining. Easy fill? Probably not. The threaded hole is about .330 inch. It would take a very small hose and syringe to add the oil. Some ideas don't work out.
                  I see you are working on the swing arm. I was into it last Spring. I wanted to add some grease fittings. I couldn't figure out how to do it.
                  Greg


                  "gordon2xbbb" wrote:
                  what is the purpose of the brass coloured fastening in the fork leg cap nut (picture #2)...some sort of pressurisation input/vent or just another easy-fill idea from you.
                  Thanks as ever for your input,
                  Happy New Year to you and yours
                  Gordon
                • Greg
                  Hi Steve, I have been into the fork tubes many times, about once a year for 9 years. The Green Bike has 93,000 miles and will get the bushings replaced next
                  Message 9 of 14 , Dec 31, 2012
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                    Hi Steve, I have been into the fork tubes many times, about once a year for 9 years. The Green Bike has 93,000 miles and will get the bushings replaced next time.
                    The correct volume is 17 oz. in each fork leg when it is measured. Here in the US the fork oil is sold in 32 oz. containers. I did that the first few times, but I didn't like buying that extra container for 1 more oz.
                    The Trophy cartridge is fairly simple, no washers or small orifices. Yes, I used kerosene to washer the parts. I don't routinely replace o-rings, gaskets, and washers like a dealer would do. I do all my own work and if it leaks I fix it. I understand why a dealer will replace both both fork seals even if only one side leaks. I understand not cutting corners and the safety factor. If I were having the work done each time by the dealer I'm afraid I couldn't afford to maintain it.
                    Greg Andrews
                    '96 900 BRG

                    "gluman3" wrote:
                    The forks use cartridges that have small orifices and stacked washers to regulate oil flow. Merely draining what ever oil you can from the fork tubes will not empty the cartridges completely and will leave a lot of dirt in the forks which will contaminate any new oil you add. You will also have no way to determine the correct oil volume to add to the forks. The best method is to remove, disassemble, wash the components in kerosene, replace the fork seals and bushings as necessary. Refill the forks with the proper oil at the recommended level being careful to make sure both are the same. It is a good idea to replace the crush washer on the bottom bolt and fit new O-rings to the caps while in there. Do it properly or have it done. Don't cut corners when it comes to your safety.
                    Happy New Year,
                    Steve
                  • gordon2xbbb
                    Hi Greg, I m having a pause on the S/A work whilst I wait for more bits to arrive - can t think why I allowed myself to only order half the right amount of
                    Message 10 of 14 , Dec 31, 2012
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                      Hi Greg,

                      I'm having a pause on the S/A work whilst I wait for more bits to arrive - can't think why I allowed myself to only order half the right amount of everything.

                      I half suspect that the damage I found to all of the Thrust Washer Seal Lips happened during assembly more than 20 years ago and the lack of grease within the Thrust seals was because some eedjit has used a pressure washer or something similar in the past.

                      So, to while away the time I decided to have a play with the bits I'm throwing away to see if I could do something about keeping the grease in there.

                      Being a MkI I've drilled through Traceys' S/A Allen socket headed bolts to pump grease into the hollow spindle, then drilled up and down (perpendicular to centre-line) through the spindle at points midway along both the left and right-hand sections to get grease under the sleeves at either side (This area was particularly 'dry' if not rusty). I'm hoping the grease will also travel along and get into the Thrust Washers at either end of the Sleeves. Not overly bothered about the Central Spacer - it's ally so just grease will do on assembly as it doesn't turn or rotate just sits there keeping the engine mounting plates apart

                      I looked at it long and hard but couldn't bring myself to drill through the S/Arm itself. I'm hoping that packing everything with plenty of MDS grease during assembly will mean that the action of assembly doesn't wipe all of it away as I build it all back up again..
                      What fun.
                      Happy New Year

                      Cheers
                      Gordon
                      2xBBB
                      Stroud, Gloucestershire, UK

                      --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:

                      > I see you are working on the swing arm. I was into it last Spring. I wanted to add some grease fittings. I couldn't figure out how to do it.
                      > Greg
                      >
                      >
                      > "gordon2xbbb" wrote:
                      > what is the purpose of the brass coloured fastening in the fork leg cap nut (picture #2)...some sort of pressurisation input/vent or just another easy-fill idea from you.
                      > Thanks as ever for your input,
                      > Happy New Year to you and yours
                      > Gordon
                      >
                    • gluman3
                      Hi Gordon, If you are into your forks once a year, you are an exception to the normal rider. My post was directed to the folks that wait to change their fork
                      Message 11 of 14 , Jan 1, 2013
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                        Hi Gordon,

                        If you are into your forks once a year, you are an exception to the normal rider. My post was directed to the folks that wait to change their fork oil every 25,000 miles or so. If I were going in there once a year, I would likely not replace the bushes or o-rings every time either. I have found there is a lot of oil left in the cartridge even after draining the fork tubes and would be afraid that if I merely drained the forks from a fitting I added to the lower fork tubes and then put in 17 oz of fluid, I would end up putting in too much fluid.

                        Cheers,

                        Steve

                        --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi Steve, I have been into the fork tubes many times, about once a year for 9 years. The Green Bike has 93,000 miles and will get the bushings replaced next time.
                        > The correct volume is 17 oz. in each fork leg when it is measured. Here in the US the fork oil is sold in 32 oz. containers. I did that the first few times, but I didn't like buying that extra container for 1 more oz.
                        > The Trophy cartridge is fairly simple, no washers or small orifices. Yes, I used kerosene to washer the parts. I don't routinely replace o-rings, gaskets, and washers like a dealer would do. I do all my own work and if it leaks I fix it. I understand why a dealer will replace both both fork seals even if only one side leaks. I understand not cutting corners and the safety factor. If I were having the work done each time by the dealer I'm afraid I couldn't afford to maintain it.
                        > Greg Andrews
                        > '96 900 BRG
                        >
                        > "gluman3" wrote:
                        > The forks use cartridges that have small orifices and stacked washers to regulate oil flow. Merely draining what ever oil you can from the fork tubes will not empty the cartridges completely and will leave a lot of dirt in the forks which will contaminate any new oil you add. You will also have no way to determine the correct oil volume to add to the forks. The best method is to remove, disassemble, wash the components in kerosene, replace the fork seals and bushings as necessary. Refill the forks with the proper oil at the recommended level being careful to make sure both are the same. It is a good idea to replace the crush washer on the bottom bolt and fit new O-rings to the caps while in there. Do it properly or have it done. Don't cut corners when it comes to your safety.
                        > Happy New Year,
                        > Steve
                        >
                      • gordon2xbbb
                        Hi Steve, Not Guilty M Lud... It isn t ME who s into his forks every year, honest! Think you ll find it s the Postee of the pictures showing you how to do
                        Message 12 of 14 , Jan 1, 2013
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                          Hi Steve,

                          Not Guilty M'Lud...

                          It isn't ME who's into his forks every year, honest!

                          Think you'll find it's the Postee of the pictures showing you how to do it...Greg Andrews >see below<

                          Me ? I'm just the bloke who likes messing around with Fuel Tanks, Senders, Kill Switches and such..though currently fixated on greasing Swing Arm bearings.

                          Cheers
                          Gordon
                          2xBBB
                          Stroud, Gloucestershire, UK

                          --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "gluman3" <1triumphrider@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi Gordon,
                          >
                          > If you are into your forks once a year, you are an exception to the normal rider. My post was directed to the folks that wait to change their fork oil every 25,000 miles or so. If I were going in there once a year, I would likely not replace the bushes or o-rings every time either. I have found there is a lot of oil left in the cartridge even after draining the fork tubes and would be afraid that if I merely drained the forks from a fitting I added to the lower fork tubes and then put in 17 oz of fluid, I would end up putting in too much fluid.
                          >
                          > Cheers,
                          >
                          > Steve
                          >
                          > --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "Greg" <gandrews@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Hi Steve, I have been into the fork tubes many times, about once a year for 9 years. The Green Bike has 93,000 miles and will get the bushings replaced next time.
                          > > The correct volume is 17 oz. in each fork leg when it is measured. Here in the US the fork oil is sold in 32 oz. containers. I did that the first few times, but I didn't like buying that extra container for 1 more oz.
                          > > The Trophy cartridge is fairly simple, no washers or small orifices. Yes, I used kerosene to washer the parts. I don't routinely replace o-rings, gaskets, and washers like a dealer would do. I do all my own work and if it leaks I fix it. I understand why a dealer will replace both both fork seals even if only one side leaks. I understand not cutting corners and the safety factor. If I were having the work done each time by the dealer I'm afraid I couldn't afford to maintain it.
                          > > Greg Andrews
                          > > '96 900 BRG
                          > >
                          > > "gluman3" wrote:
                          > > The forks use cartridges that have small orifices and stacked washers to regulate oil flow. Merely draining what ever oil you can from the fork tubes will not empty the cartridges completely and will leave a lot of dirt in the forks which will contaminate any new oil you add. You will also have no way to determine the correct oil volume to add to the forks. The best method is to remove, disassemble, wash the components in kerosene, replace the fork seals and bushings as necessary. Refill the forks with the proper oil at the recommended level being careful to make sure both are the same. It is a good idea to replace the crush washer on the bottom bolt and fit new O-rings to the caps while in there. Do it properly or have it done. Don't cut corners when it comes to your safety.
                          > > Happy New Year,
                          > > Steve
                          > >
                          >
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