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Re: [TriumphTrophy] best rubber??

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  • Ed Walden
    The 020 front I had fitted to my Trophy began cupping at about 1500 miles. I looked at 3 other bikes with the 020 front fitted at TT America 2003 and found
    Message 1 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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      The 020 front I had fitted to my Trophy began cupping at about 1500
      miles. I looked at 3 other bikes with the 020 front fitted at TT America
      2003 and found that none of them exhibited the cupping that mine did. I
      made sure the air pressure was always OK (once a week) so it was not
      that. The OEM BT54 lasted 10K with no cupping at all, it was a great
      tire! So my riding style has not changed. Not sure why it cupped but I
      will not buy another one for the Trophy, I am trying the 010 now, I have
      about 1000 miles on it and it looks great.



      Gary


      Yeah that is what everyone else is saying about the 20 fronts. When I
      replace the front I think I am going to go with the 10's instead of the
      20's. Ed


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Steven Kirk
      ... Your wasting your money with the 010 s there more expensive to buy, wont last as long and you wont get them up to proper working temperature on the
      Message 2 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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        At 00:17 01/07/2003 -0700, you wrote:

        >The 020 front I had fitted to my Trophy began cupping at about 1500
        >miles. I looked at 3 other bikes with the 020 front fitted at TT America
        >2003 and found that none of them exhibited the cupping that mine did. I
        >made sure the air pressure was always OK (once a week) so it was not
        >that. The OEM BT54 lasted 10K with no cupping at all, it was a great
        >tire! So my riding style has not changed. Not sure why it cupped but I
        >will not buy another one for the Trophy, I am trying the 010 now, I have
        >about 1000 miles on it and it looks great.
        >
        >
        >
        >Gary
        >
        >
        >Yeah that is what everyone else is saying about the 20 fronts. When I
        >replace the front I think I am going to go with the 10's instead of the
        >20's. Ed


        Your wasting your money with the 010's there more expensive to buy, wont last as long and you wont get them up to proper working temperature on the road,............ but on a track ;p)

        ~Steve~
      • sixtysix
        Ed, I am now running the 010 front/020 rear combo on both the Trophy 1200 and my Suzuki Bandit 1200. The Trophy seems to square off the rear tire faster than
        Message 3 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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          Ed,



          I am now running the 010 front/020 rear combo on both the Trophy 1200
          and my Suzuki Bandit 1200. The Trophy seems to square off the rear tire
          faster than the B12, but I should have some real world numbers on how
          this combo works by the end of summer.



          Gary



          -----Original Message-----
          From: Ed Walden [mailto:wale@...]
          Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 3:18 AM
          To: TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [TriumphTrophy] best rubber??




          The 020 front I had fitted to my Trophy began cupping at about 1500
          miles. I looked at 3 other bikes with the 020 front fitted at TT America
          2003 and found that none of them exhibited the cupping that mine did. I
          made sure the air pressure was always OK (once a week) so it was not
          that. The OEM BT54 lasted 10K with no cupping at all, it was a great
          tire! So my riding style has not changed. Not sure why it cupped but I
          will not buy another one for the Trophy, I am trying the 010 now, I have
          about 1000 miles on it and it looks great.



          Gary


          Yeah that is what everyone else is saying about the 20 fronts. When I
          replace the front I think I am going to go with the 10's instead of the
          20's. Ed





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • sixtysix
          Your wasting your money with the 010 s there more expensive to buy, wont last as long and you wont get them up to proper working temperature on the
          Message 4 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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            Your wasting your money with the 010's there more expensive to buy, wont
            last as long and you wont get them up to proper working temperature on
            the road,............ but on a track ;p)

            ~Steve~



            Steve,



            010 and 020 are the same price, $80.97 for a 120/70 ZR 17 front. (
            http://www.chaparral-racing.com/ ) the 010 is a street tire, and the
            010/020 has been a favorite combo on the Bandit list for past couple
            years, a lot of guys run these tires together, I don't remember any
            temperature related problems being reported. I know it won't last as
            long..better grip is the pay off right? Like I said I will try the 010
            and give a real world report based on my experience. No since pulling it
            off now. Have you tried the 010 on the Trophy (or on other similar
            street bikes?) I looked for any write ups, but didn't find any. Thanks.



            Gary





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Steve Wassenich
            ... That combo was a favorite on the VFR list also. The front 020 s tendency to cup was well known. I put the 010 on the front of my 96 VFR as an experiment
            Message 5 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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              Steve said:

              > Your wasting your money with the 010's there more expensive to buy,
              > wont
              > last as long and you wont get them up to proper working temperature on
              > the road,............ but on a track ;p)

              sixtysix (Gary) replied:

              > 010/020 has been a favorite combo on the Bandit list for past couple
              > years, a lot of guys run these tires together

              That combo was a favorite on the VFR list also. The front 020's
              tendency to cup was well known. I put the 010 on the front of my '96
              VFR as an experiment and was impressed; it worked quite well even with
              the high-mile Michelin Macadam 100 on the back. My only objection, and
              it's a minor one, is that it doesn't seem to know or care where
              straight-ahead is. It's not unstable or even twitchy, mind you. It's
              just the tradeoff for a tire that steers instantly and accurately. The
              tire life story was that with 020s on both ends you'd go 3 for 2, three
              rears for two fronts, so the back tire would go about 50 percent longer
              than the front. With the 010/020 combo it was one for one; they wore
              out at about the same time. There was _no_ consensus on the actual
              mileage, since riding styles and pavement conditions vary so much, but
              the tire life pattern was consistent. Also, no one had a problem with
              the 010 front cupping. If it did, it was minimal and happened when the
              tire was just about due for replacement anyway.

              In the U.S. at least, the 010 and 020 cost the same. Bridgestone
              supposedly did this deliberately so people wouldn't choose between them
              solely on price. Rumor only, so don't take that to the bank or
              anything.

              Another data point: Some BMW K1200RS guys think the RS might be a
              little heavy for the 010; the RS apparently grinds the 010 into dust in
              short order. The last time I visited, they were hot on the Michelin
              Pilot Roads. Something to think about, since the Trophy is somewhere
              between the Bandit/VFR and the RS.

              Steve W.
            • Steven Kirk
              ... Latest write up in RiDE magazine (UK), on saving money, states that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal sports/touring tyres like the
              Message 6 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                At 05:44 01/07/2003 -0400, you wrote:
                >010 and 020 are the same price, $80.97 for a 120/70 ZR 17 front. (
                ><http://www.chaparral-racing.com/>http://www.chaparral-racing.com/ ) the 010 is a street tire, and the
                >010/020 has been a favorite combo on the Bandit list for past couple
                >years, a lot of guys run these tires together, I don't remember any
                >temperature related problems being reported. I know it won't last as
                >long..better grip is the pay off right? Like I said I will try the 010
                >and give a real world report based on my experience. No since pulling it
                >off now. Have you tried the 010 on the Trophy (or on other similar
                >street bikes?) I looked for any write ups, but didn't find any. Thanks.


                Latest write up in "RiDE" magazine (UK), on saving money, states that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal sports/touring tyres like the 020 have plenty of grip for on road use.

                Unless you ride like a maniac on the road the sports/touring tyre will give you more than enough grip. A classic example of this is Mark Peck running Michelin Macadams a tyre that the sports boys wouldn't touch, despatch riders only. But he had no grip problems keeping up with the rest of the bikes on the Scotland Raid, and that includes quite a few miles in heavy rain.

                Save your money buy the longer lasting 020 its got plenty of grip for road use, personally I prefer a tyre that has good wet weather characteristics, when did you last find a tyre that didnt stick in hot dry conditions. Tyres its all in the mind, someone tells you a tyre is the grippiest thing since grippy things were invented you'll ride faster and push harder on them.

                ~Steve~
              • taylorrguk
                ... Tyres its all in the mind, someone tells you a tyre is the grippiest thing since grippy things were invented you ll ride faster and push harder on them.
                Message 7 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                  --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, Steven Kirk <mail@t...> wrote:

                  Tyres its all in the mind, someone tells you a tyre is the grippiest
                  thing since grippy things were invented you'll ride faster and push
                  harder on them.

                  Amen to that! (Sounds like a quote from Blackadder?)

                  All we need to know now is why are we in the UK paying the same
                  figures for ours in £'s as our USA friends pay in $'s?

                  Richard T.
                • trumpettriple
                  ... that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal sports/touring tyres like the 020 have plenty of grip for on road use. ... I m running 020s
                  Message 8 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                    --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, Steven Kirk <mail@t...> wrote:
                    > Latest write up in "RiDE" magazine (UK), on saving money, states
                    that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal
                    sports/touring tyres like the 020 have plenty of grip for on road
                    use.>
                    > ~Steve~

                    I'm running 020s for this reason, and to make my tyre replacement
                    episodes less frequent. So far (3k) they seem to be wearing well. I
                    think I feel less traction than on faster-wearing Contis, but as
                    Steve says, 020s within requirements for (my) street riding.

                    I had big hopes for the Avon Azarros. Does anyone on this list have
                    a view on them? They are dual comund tyre, IIRC - with a hard-
                    wearing central band to resist squaring-off, and softer, grippier
                    compound on the side tread for traction while leaned over.

                    Brian
                  • Steve Wassenich
                    ... will give you more than enough grip. [snip] ... And personally, I agree. Shoot, I m thinking about the Metzeler ME880s, which are touring tires designed
                    Message 9 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                      Steven Kirk wrote:

                      > Unless you ride like a maniac on the road the sports/touring tyre
                      will give you more than enough grip.

                      [snip]

                      > personally I prefer a tyre that has good wet weather characteristics

                      And personally, I agree. Shoot, I'm thinking about the Metzeler
                      ME880s, which are "touring" tires designed for long life. I managed to
                      get the left footpeg down a couple of weeks ago and I think that was by
                      mistake. I don't ride particularly hard and I'm not brave. If the
                      880s work in the rain I'll get them when my originals wear out.

                      Steve W.
                    • markpeck2000
                      ... ... that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal sports/touring tyres like the 020 have plenty of grip for on road use. ...
                      Message 10 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                        --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, Steven Kirk <mail@t...> wrote:
                        > At 05:44 01/07/2003 -0400, you wrote:
                        > >010 and 020 are the same price, $80.97 for a 120/70 ZR 17 front.
                        <snip>>
                        >
                        > Latest write up in "RiDE" magazine (UK), on saving money, states
                        that the sticker road tyres are a waste of money the normal
                        sports/touring tyres like the 020 have plenty of grip for on road
                        use.
                        >

                        Could've told them that years ago. My first big bike (once I'd
                        actually passed me test) was an FZR400. Ran the super-sticky
                        Bridgestones (and they were almost as dear as sports rubber for 1
                        litre class). Got piddling milage out of them (something like 3k).
                        Mate was running on Macadams (did they do one prior to the 90x's?),
                        same bike and had no problems with grip and lasted for miles. So I
                        tried them (and loved them). As I climbed the rungs of sportsbike
                        ownership, I stayed with the Macadams (although in some cases they
                        had to be a 'special' fit). You have to be much better than the
                        average rider (and willing to take risks well beyond anything
                        approaching sensible) to need stickier tyres, imo. Although if you
                        read most of the sportbike mags, they still perpetuate the myth that
                        you need something stickier. I still laugh.


                        > Unless you ride like a maniac on the road the sports/touring tyre
                        will give you more than enough grip. A classic example of this is
                        Mark Peck running Michelin Macadams a tyre that the sports boys
                        wouldn't touch, despatch riders only. But he had no grip problems
                        keeping up with the rest of the bikes on the Scotland Raid, and that
                        includes quite a few miles in heavy rain.

                        And that was on stock suspension with pillion as well. I also think
                        that Mick was also running on Macadams??

                        >
                        > Save your money buy the longer lasting 020 its got plenty of grip
                        for road use, personally I prefer a tyre that has good wet weather
                        characteristics, when did you last find a tyre that didnt stick in
                        hot dry conditions. Tyres its all in the mind, someone tells you a
                        tyre is the grippiest thing since grippy things were invented you'll
                        ride faster and push harder on them.
                        >
                        > ~Steve~

                        However, I would say that a lot of it is down to 'feel' and some
                        people will want a tyre that provides a lot of feedback compared to
                        the normal 'touring' tyre. Personally, with the costs of rubber in
                        this country what they are, I think I would learn how to live
                        without it for the sake of saving some major money.

                        The one (theoretical) point about riding in high heat conditions is
                        that sports tyres are designed to get rid of heat that more quickly
                        than a touring tyre. Now, if you're riding in a very hot part of
                        the world, would a sports tyre actually last longer than a touring
                        tyre (or at least give better than 'we expect' mileage) because it
                        is a lot hotter than we would experience in the UK and therefore
                        actually doing its job more effeciently??

                        Regards,
                        Mark
                      • John
                        Well, thought as long as tires were on every one s mind, I might as well toss in my thoughts. The original rear Bridgstone on the Trophy has finally met it s
                        Message 11 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                          Well, thought as long as tires were on every one's mind, I might as well
                          toss in my thoughts. The original rear Bridgstone on the Trophy has finally
                          met it's near end with just under 10,000 miles on it. Nicely squared off.
                          I'm sure it iwll stand in the corner by itself when I get it off. I am
                          replacing it with a Metzler MEZ4 based on what I have read on the list.
                          Longer lasting, less tendancy to square off with harder rubber in the middle
                          and softer stuff on the edges for grip. Will have it in and put on by next
                          weekend.

                          And also speaking of accidents, our RAT pack just had one of our group go
                          down tonight. We were making through some suburban twisties, no massive
                          speed, and xxx was doing trail to keep an eye on every one else. The group
                          got to the restaurant, had finished ordering food and were quaffing a few,
                          when one commented that xxx should have been here by now. We weren't too
                          worried since xxx was not known to be a speedster on his Adventurer, but had
                          some one back track and check. After 10 minutes went by with no return, we
                          sent out a second rider (this is starting to sound like we were attacking
                          the Death Star), He finally called in about 15 minutes later to report that
                          the first rider had found xxx on the side of the road with a broken arm.
                          This definitely makes you feel like crap when you realize you were sitting
                          there enjoying yourself while your bud was down somewhere. Anytways, called
                          his wife to come get him, (who, by the way, was quite touched that we all
                          trouped into the emergency room one at a time to check on him and offer her
                          some supportive comments) got a volunteer to ride his bike home (yes, it was
                          still in riding condition) and trotted him off to the emergency room. His
                          comment was "Damn, I guess I didn't turn enough, ...but the little girl and
                          her kitten survived untouched." He says he will be riding with us in three
                          weeks to Savannah. The result of this is some changes in our group riding
                          order, especially at night.

                          Just remember when some one says motorcyclists are stupid, suicidal and
                          crazy. It is a hell of a lot easier to walk away when your bike breaks and
                          you go down, then it is if your parachute breaks or the piton connecting you
                          to the side of the mountain comes loose.

                          John of Jax 2002 1200SSC


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Ed Walden
                          Just remember when some one says motorcyclists are stupid, suicidal and crazy. It is a hell of a lot easier to walk away when your bike breaks and you go down,
                          Message 12 of 22 , Jul 1, 2003
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                            Just remember when some one says motorcyclists are stupid, suicidal and
                            crazy. It is a hell of a lot easier to walk away when your bike breaks and
                            you go down, then it is if your parachute breaks or the piton connecting you
                            to the side of the mountain comes loose.

                            John of Jax 2002 1200SSC

                            John do you have the local contact for the rat group in the US. My
                            membership expired 2 months ago and I have not been able to renew and I do
                            not want to deal with the UK stuff. Thanks. Ed


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • John
                            Right up front, this has no Trophy content. I just think people would like to see this. John of Jax 2002 1200SSC
                            Message 13 of 22 , Jul 2, 2003
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                              Right up front, this has no Trophy content. I just think people would like
                              to see this.

                              John of Jax 2002 1200SSC


                              http://bengal.missouri.edu/~leveronj/wesupportu/WeSupportU.htm


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • John
                              John do you have the local contact for the rat group in the US. My membership expired 2 months ago and I have not been able to renew and I do not want to deal
                              Message 14 of 22 , Jul 2, 2003
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                                John do you have the local contact for the rat group in the US. My
                                membership expired 2 months ago and I have not been able to renew and I do
                                not want to deal with the UK stuff. Thanks. Ed

                                I don't know about local contact for you, but the regional co-ordinator for
                                North America is Greg Casey, tel: 678-854-2010 x2039 email:
                                gcasey04@...

                                John of Jax 2002 1200SSC


                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • r.65.650
                                ... *only my opinion!* no trophy content.no triumph content. no bike content at all. ... no offence John - i DIDN T want to see this here at all. eM.
                                Message 15 of 22 , Jul 3, 2003
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                                  --- In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "John" <johntac@b...> wrote:
                                  > Right up front, this has no Trophy content.

                                  *only my opinion!*
                                  no trophy content.no triumph content. no bike content at all.

                                  >I just think people would like
                                  > to see this.

                                  no offence John - i DIDN'T want to see this here at all.
                                  eM.
                                • John
                                  no offence John - i DIDN T want to see this here at all. eM. ****************** No offense taken. I propbably shouldn t have put the link there as it really
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Jul 3, 2003
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                                    no offence John - i DIDN'T want to see this here at all.
                                    eM.

                                    ******************
                                    No offense taken. I propbably shouldn't have put the link there as it really
                                    did not have anything to do with bikes. I just thought with Independence Day
                                    coming up, we (Americans) might want to remember who paid the price. I knew
                                    some people wouldn't get it, so again, sorry.

                                    John of Jax 2002 1200SSC


                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • skijacket0
                                    ... it really ... Independence Day ... price. I knew
                                    Message 17 of 22 , Jul 25, 2003
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                                      --- Wrong time, wrong place.
                                      In TriumphTrophy@yahoogroups.com, "John" <johntac@b...> wrote:
                                      > no offence John - i DIDN'T want to see this here at all.
                                      > eM.
                                      >
                                      > ******************
                                      > No offense taken. I propbably shouldn't have put the link there as
                                      it really
                                      > did not have anything to do with bikes. I just thought with
                                      Independence Day
                                      > coming up, we (Americans) might want to remember who paid the
                                      price. I knew
                                      > some people wouldn't get it, so again, sorry.
                                      >
                                      > John of Jax 2002 1200SSC
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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