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RE: [Tracing_Pugh_Origins] RE: further info on Elijah Pugh and the Chapman family.

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  • sibbert@charter.net
    Vivian: The Pugh cemetery is located on Alabama St. Rd # 84 EXACTLY 3 miles(by odometer) west of the new St Rd #43 bypass around Grove Hill, Alabama. It lies
    Message 1 of 2 , Jul 31, 2007
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      Vivian:
       
      The Pugh cemetery is located on Alabama St. Rd # 84 EXACTLY 3 miles(by odometer) west of the new St Rd #43 bypass around Grove Hill, Alabama. It lies on the south side of the road behind a 12 ft wide cattle gate and 30-40 yards up a dirt lane.  It has not been taken care of and the "ornamental tree' planted there in 1931 by the local D.A.R, was over 40 feet high in 2001 the last time I was there for a visit.
       
      Giles Chapman was married to Achsah Pugh,  the daughter of Elijah and Ruth Julien Pugh and he and some his descendants are buried in the Pugh Cemetery near Grove Hill, Alabama.
       
      This was copied from the: "—Birmingham News, February 8, 1931.

      "Last week a number of the members of the Elijah Pugh chapter, D.A.R., of Jackson, visited the tomb of Elijah Pugh, Revolutionary soldier, about four miles west of Grove Hill, where they planted an ornamental tree as a living memorial to the patriot from whom the chapter takes its name. The grave is located in the family burial ground just in front of the former home of Elijah Pugh, which is still occupied by lineal descendants of the Revolutionary hero in the persons of Isaac Pugh and his sister, Miss Cora Pugh. Near this home passed the war trail of the friendly Choctaws under Pushmatahah when they joined Gen. Jackson in his war upon the Creeks, and in this home the great Chief visited his friend, the first Elijah Pugh. The family burial ground, which is neatly kept, contains not only the grave Elijah Pugh, but that of his wife, Ruth St. Julina, one of the French Huguenots exiled from France and settling in South Carolina and Georgia; and that of—DUBOUT, another Revolutionary soldier, whose first name has been lost with the passing of the years, though some of the older families of the county are known to bear relation to him. Besides these graves of pioneers there are others of those who came after them, and were related to them in various degrees of consanguinity. It is the purpose of the Pugh family to deed this cemetery to the National Society, D.A.R., who in turn will see that this shrine of patriotism receives perpetual care."

      Information on this family was taken from the book by Minnie May Pugh, "Chapman and Pugh Family History and Allied Lines." Published in 1963 and reprinted in 1976 by Commercial Printing County, P. O. Box 10302, Birmingham, Alabama.

      Elijah and Ruth were Quakers. Members of the Wrightsboro Georgia. Monthly Meeting. He was a Revolutionary War Soldier. Reference DAR record # 250410 Moved from NORTH CAROLINA in 1773 then to the Bigby Territory, Washington County, Georgia. In 1810. In 1810 he had (tax records 1810) in Jackson County, Georgia.. Moved to Clark County, Alabama. In 1810  Elijah Pugh had land in Capt. McCormack's dist (#48), had 300 a in what is now Taliffaerro County, Georgia in 1790.

      An adopted Indiana Pugh who has lived in Alabama for over 30 years

      James Pugh

      -------Original Message-------

       
      Date: 7/30/2007 10:12:17 PM
      Subject: RE: [Tracing_Pugh_Origins] RE: Clarification of names
       

      No, I meant Elijah Stewart married Mary Ann Julien (granddaughter of Peter Jr. And Ruth).  My Elijah Stewart 1804 married Mary Ann 1804 Julien  daughter of Elihu Julien 1774. And Rhoda Coppock.  Elihu 1774 is the son Peter Jr. 1740 and Ruth Pugh 1746             daughter of Azariah Pugh 1721 and Hannah Beals 1729. And there is the Elijah Pugh 1760 son of Jesse Pugh 1732 and Elizabeth Stewart 1736  who married Mary Ann Julien sister to Peter Jr. Above.  It is crazy to try to keep them straight. I added the dates as it helps to put them into perspective. 

       

       

      I first tried to keep the Julien spellings exactly as I found them in the record where I found them but it became impossible to deal with for me. ( I still see that I have Ruth married to Elijah Stewart entered twice in my database, once as Julien and also as Julian, so I really need to go through these people again)  I tend to just use the Julien because it became the most prevalent spelling that I found and the spelling does not keep the lines straight because this was the era that the records were often spelled at the discretion of the recorder of the document.  When I first started doing research I used the de ST. Julian spelling because that was what was used in this area by earlier researchers but have been attacked too often to use it anymore.  There are some researchers that are vicious that there are two completely different families and I hope the DNA research will clear up this mystery.  I do not have a dedicated opinion on it or the spellings as I feel there is not enough solid evidence to prove or disprove either option.  I would love to know where you may have seen de St. Julian spelling on tombstones.  Where is the Pugh cemetery that you are referring to?

       

      I was just trying to verify Elijah Pugh’s Ruth Julien and I see in the 1850 Census she is living in the household of Giles Chapman.  I think we were finding Chapmans with the Stewarts in Bush River when I was down there.  I will have to hunt up those documents.

       

      Vivian

       


      From: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com [mailto: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com ] On Behalf Of sibbert@charter. net
      Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 3:04 PM
      To: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com
      Subject: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] RE: Clarification of names

       

      Vivian:

       

      When you stated:

       

      My Elijah Stewart who married Ruth Julien (Peter Jr./Ruth Pugh) is most likely from Bush River also, although I have not been able to document it.

       

      Did you mean to type "My Elijah Pugh who married Ruth Julien...."

       

       And, did you mean "My Elijah Stewart who married Mary Ann Julien...." 

       

      When the tombstone's in the Pugh cemetery read "de St Julian", you refer to the "Juliens".  Which is the correct spelling of the "de St Julian names?

       

      James D Pugh

       

       

      -------Original Message----- --

       

      Date: 7/30/2007 2:19:48 PM

      Subject: RE: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] New file uploaded to Tracing_Pugh_ Origins

       

      Hi Mark,

       

      Small world.  My sister in law and her husband live in Portland .  Mike and Marilyn Lawson .  He is an optometrist and she was head of the Chemistry Department at the High School.  She is now retired and teaches a few classes at the college.  I will have to look you up the next time we are down there. 

       

      My Pugh line is still rather mysterious for me.  My ggggrandfather Elijah Stewart married Mary Ann Julien.  She is the daughter of Elihu Julien and Rhoda Coppock of Bush River .  Elihu is the son of Peter Julien Jr. and Ruth Pugh.  Ruth is the daughter of Azariah Pugh, who we believe traces back to Ellis.  I guess there have not been any Ellis descendents take the DNA test yet.  I do not personally know of any myself.

       

      What is intriguing is that your Elijah Pugh married the sister (Ruth) to my Peter Julien Jr., so the Julien had to be in close contact with two different lines of Pugh or they may be related.  That is one of the things I would like to figure out.

       

      My Elijah Stewart who married Ruth Julien (Peter Jr./Ruth Pugh) is most likely from Bush River also, although I have not been able to document it.  I went to Bush River this past spring and met with a Stewart research group from all over the United States and one gal from Canada .  She and I looked so much alike people could not keep us straight.  Another gal proven from her line looked like my Aunt Ida and it is a completely different features, straight nose, red hair.  They know there Stewart line was in Shelby Co Ohio at the same time that my family was there and there is one cemetery that has my Stewarts, the Juliens and McClures (know their line) all buried there. 

      They have not proven their Stewart line further back than Joseph Stewart of Bush River late 1700.  I am sure that my Elijah is a cousin or brother and most likely the son of Joseph’s son John.

       

      Another intriguing coincidence is that Isaac/Hannah Baskin names one of his children Elijah Stewart Pugh, most likely for his brother and mother’s maiden name.

       

      I have always wondered if Elizabeth Stewart might be tied to our Stewarts.  We are talking all the same geographical area and Quaker background that seemed to fall by the wayside by 1800.  It also appears that some of your Pughs did come north.  The John that is in Shelby Co has not been tied to any Pugh family and little is know about him.  Do you know how far back your line can actually be documented?

       

      If you do not mind, may I ask what denomination you are affiliated with?  I was raised in the Church of the Brethren and a lot of the Quakers that came to the Miami Valley married into the Church of the Brethren as they had some similar beliefs.  My son is a pastor of the Pathway Church in Dowagiac , Michigan .  It is a very small church and they are part of the Missionary Church . http://www.pathwayc hurch.com/  They moved there from South Bend (he and his wife are graduates of Bethel College in South Bend ) and there was a huge pole barn on the property that they have remodeled into a church.

       

      Thank you for responding.  Even if our Pugh’s are not related we are still cousins on the Julien side for sure.

       

      Vivian Markley

      Springfield Ohio

       

       

       


      From: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com [mailto: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com ] On Behalf Of Mark Pugh
      Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 11:08 AM
      To: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com
      Subject: Re: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] New file uploaded to Tracing_Pugh_ Origins

       

      Hi Vivian,

       

      I am catching up on my email. I am in the Elijah Pugh & Ruth Julien line. They are my ggg great grandparents. I have been twice to the Pugh Cemetery just west of Grove Hill , AL , where their graves are located. I have pics of the gravestones, if you have never seen them. I would be glad to email them to you. I have lots of cemetery pics from south Alabama and old family photos, going back to my g great grandfather, Stephen Pugh, the grandson of Elijah and Ruth Julien. My wife and I live in south Texas , where I am a preacher in Corpus Christi .

       

      God bless,

      Mark Pugh

       

      On 7/20/07, Vivian Markley <vmarkley@woh. rr.com> wrote:

      I was checking out the chart and I see that there is a participant from Isaac Pugh and Hannah Baskin.  I am assuming that is as far back as this person can document.  I think that Isaac may be a son of Elijah Pugh and Ruth Julien.  I would love to share information with anyone from this line.  Ruth Julien who married Elijah Pugh may be the daughter of Peter Julien and Mary Beals.  I descend from their son Peter Jr. who married Ruth Pugh, daughter of Azariah Pugh and Hannah Beals.  I am hoping that the DNA project will eventually help verify my Pugh relationships with the Juliens.  To further confuse things, my Mary Ann Julien married into the Stewarts and all of these people lived in Randolph Co NC or Bush River SC.

       

      Are there any participants for Ellis Pugh?  My Azariah descends from him but I know of no males still living as my line comes from his daughter who married Elijah Stewart.

       Vivian

       

       

       

       

       

       

       

       
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    • Vivian Markley
      I need to spend some time looking over the Wrightboro bunch again. Some of my family either by marriage or direct line would be the Buffingtons, Coppock,
      Message 2 of 2 , Jul 31, 2007
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        I need to spend some time looking over the Wrightboro bunch again.  Some of my family either by marriage or direct line would be the Buffingtons, Coppock, Greathouse (mine are from West Virginia so do not know if there is a connection), Evans, Green, Hollingsworth, Richardson, Pugh.  The names that  surprised me are the Stubbs and Mattox’s.  They came to Ohio and settled in Preble Co.  I have a distant connection to them but I would have to go through some papers to be sure what it is.  I went to a conference in Wilmington Ohio last spring on the Quakers and the Underground Railroad and there was a gal there who wrote a book on West Elkton Quaker Church .  The author was one of the speakers and we spent a lot of the weekend together.  I have her book and there are two diaries in the Appendix writer by two of the Mattox men, but I did not realize they were also from Wrightsboro.

         

        Also see that Giles Chapman was in Hopewell Va as was my Pughs.  Is there a younger and elder Giles Chapman?  I found this site http://www.fdu.com/family/chapmansummerscem.htm

        Prosperity is just outside of Bush River .  My cousin whom I had not seen in 40 years found me on the internet which was amazing.  His mother and mine were the two middle girls out of 11 children and very close.  He was transferred to the south and his mother died in the 1960’s so we lost track of him.  Of course, I am married and he would not have known my married name but found my site when he retired and got interested in genealogy.  I stayed with them when I went to Bush River this past spring and he had no idea that he was living in the exact area that several of our ggggrandfathers had lived over 200 years ago and to top it off, he is one of the few members of the family that is a Quaker.

         

        Vivian

         


        From: Tracing_Pugh_Origins@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Tracing_Pugh_Origins@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of sibbert@...
        Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:51 PM
        To: Tracing_Pugh_Origins@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [Tracing_Pugh_Origins] RE: further info on Elijah Pugh and the Chapman family.

         

        Vivian:

         

        The Pugh cemetery is located on Alabama St. Rd # 84 EXACTLY 3 miles(by odometer) west of the new St Rd #43 bypass around Grove Hill , Alabama . It lies on the south side of the road behind a 12 ft wide cattle gate and 30-40 yards up a dirt lane.  It has not been taken care of and the "ornamental tree' planted there in 1931 by the local D.A.R, was over 40 feet high in 2001 the last time I was there for a visit.

         

        Giles Chapman was married to Achsah Pugh,  the daughter of Elijah and Ruth Julien Pugh and he and some his descendants are buried in the Pugh Cemetery near Grove Hill , Alabama .

         

        This was copied from the: "—Birmingham News, February 8, 1931.

        "Last week a number of the members of the Elijah Pugh chapter, D.A.R., of Jackson, visited the tomb of Elijah Pugh, Revolutionary soldier, about four miles west of Grove Hill, where they planted an ornamental tree as a living memorial to the patriot from whom the chapter takes its name. The grave is located in the family burial ground just in front of the former home of Elijah Pugh, which is still occupied by lineal descendants of the Revolutionary hero in the persons of Isaac Pugh and his sister, Miss Cora Pugh. Near this home passed the war trail of the friendly Choctaws under Pushmatahah when they joined Gen. Jackson in his war upon the Creeks, and in this home the great Chief visited his friend, the first Elijah Pugh. The family burial ground, which is neatly kept, contains not only the grave Elijah Pugh, but that of his wife, Ruth St. Julina, one of the French Huguenots exiled from France and settling in South Carolina and Georgia; and that of—DUBOUT, another Revolutionary soldier, whose first name has been lost with the passing of the years, though some of the older families of the county are known to bear relation to him. Besides these graves of pioneers there are others of those who came after them, and were related to them in various degrees of consanguinity. It is the purpose of the Pugh family to deed this cemetery to the National Society, D.A.R., who in turn will see that this shrine of patriotism receives perpetual care."

        Information on this family was taken from the book by Minnie May Pugh, "Chapman and Pugh Family History and Allied Lines." Published in 1963 and reprinted in 1976 by Commercial Printing County , P. O. Box 10302 , Birmingham , Alabama .

        Elijah and Ruth were Quakers. Members of the Wrightsboro Georgia. Monthly Meeting. He was a Revolutionary War Soldier. Reference DAR record # 250410 Moved from NORTH CAROLINA in 1773 then to the Bigby Territory , Washington County , Georgia . In 1810. In 1810 he had (tax records 1810) in Jackson County , Georgia .. Moved to Clark County , Alabama . In 1810  Elijah Pugh had land in Capt. McCormack's dist (#48), had 300 a in what is now Taliffaerro County , Georgia in 1790.

        An adopted Indiana Pugh who has lived in Alabama for over 30 years

        James Pugh

        -------Original Message----- --

         

        Date: 7/30/2007 10:12:17 PM

        Subject: RE: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] RE: Clarification of names

         

        No, I meant Elijah Stewart married Mary Ann Julien (granddaughter of Peter Jr. And Ruth).  My Elijah Stewart 1804 married Mary Ann 1804 Julien  daughter of Elihu Julien 1774. And Rhoda Coppock.  Elihu 1774 is the son Peter Jr. 1740 and Ruth Pugh 1746             daughter of Azariah Pugh 1721 and Hannah Beals 1729. And there is the Elijah Pugh 1760 son of Jesse Pugh 1732 and Elizabeth Stewart 1736  who married Mary Ann Julien sister to Peter Jr. Above.  It is crazy to try to keep them straight. I added the dates as it helps to put them into perspective. 

         

         

        I first tried to keep the Julien spellings exactly as I found them in the record where I found them but it became impossible to deal with for me. ( I still see that I have Ruth married to Elijah Stewart entered twice in my database, once as Julien and also as Julian, so I really need to go through these people again)  I tend to just use the Julien because it became the most prevalent spelling that I found and the spelling does not keep the lines straight because this was the era that the records were often spelled at the discretion of the recorder of the document.  When I first started doing research I used the de ST. Julian spelling because that was what was used in this area by earlier researchers but have been attacked too often to use it anymore.  There are some researchers that are vicious that there are two completely different families and I hope the DNA research will clear up this mystery.  I do not have a dedicated opinion on it or the spellings as I feel there is not enough solid evidence to prove or disprove either option.  I would love to know where you may have seen de St. Julian spelling on tombstones.  Where is the Pugh cemetery that you are referring to?

         

        I was just trying to verify Elijah Pugh’s Ruth Julien and I see in the 1850 Census she is living in the household of Giles Chapman.  I think we were finding Chapmans with the Stewarts in Bush River when I was down there.  I will have to hunt up those documents.

         

        Vivian

         


        From: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com [mailto: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com ] On Behalf Of sibbert@charter. net
        Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 3:04 PM
        To: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com
        Subject: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] RE: Clarification of names

         

        Vivian:

         

        When you stated:

         

        My Elijah Stewart who married Ruth Julien (Peter Jr./Ruth Pugh) is most likely from Bush River also, although I have not been able to document it.

         

        Did you mean to type "My Elijah Pugh who married Ruth Julien...."

         

         And, did you mean "My Elijah Stewart who married Mary Ann Julien...." 

         

        When the tombstone's in the Pugh cemetery read "de St Julian", you refer to the "Juliens".  Which is the correct spelling of the "de St Julian names?

         

        James D Pugh

         

         

        -------Original Message----- --

         

        Date: 7/30/2007 2:19:48 PM

        Subject: RE: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] New file uploaded to Tracing_Pugh_ Origins

         

        Hi Mark,

         

        Small world.  My sister in law and her husband live in Portland .  Mike and Marilyn Lawson .  He is an optometrist and she was head of the Chemistry Department at the High School.  She is now retired and teaches a few classes at the college.  I will have to look you up the next time we are down there. 

         

        My Pugh line is still rather mysterious for me.  My ggggrandfather Elijah Stewart married Mary Ann Julien.  She is the daughter of Elihu Julien and Rhoda Coppock of Bush River .  Elihu is the son of Peter Julien Jr. and Ruth Pugh.  Ruth is the daughter of Azariah Pugh, who we believe traces back to Ellis.  I guess there have not been any Ellis descendents take the DNA test yet.  I do not personally know of any myself.

         

        What is intriguing is that your Elijah Pugh married the sister (Ruth) to my Peter Julien Jr., so the Julien had to be in close contact with two different lines of Pugh or they may be related.  That is one of the things I would like to figure out.

         

        My Elijah Stewart who married Ruth Julien (Peter Jr./Ruth Pugh) is most likely from Bush River also, although I have not been able to document it.  I went to Bush River this past spring and met with a Stewart research group from all over the United States and one gal from Canada .  She and I looked so much alike people could not keep us straight.  Another gal proven from her line looked like my Aunt Ida and it is a completely different features, straight nose, red hair.  They know there Stewart line was in Shelby Co Ohio at the same time that my family was there and there is one cemetery that has my Stewarts, the Juliens and McClures (know their line) all buried there. 

        They have not proven their Stewart line further back than Joseph Stewart of Bush River late 1700.  I am sure that my Elijah is a cousin or brother and most likely the son of Joseph’s son John.

         

        Another intriguing coincidence is that Isaac/Hannah Baskin names one of his children Elijah Stewart Pugh, most likely for his brother and mother’s maiden name.

         

        I have always wondered if Elizabeth Stewart might be tied to our Stewarts.  We are talking all the same geographical area and Quaker background that seemed to fall by the wayside by 1800.  It also appears that some of your Pughs did come north.  The John that is in Shelby Co has not been tied to any Pugh family and little is know about him.  Do you know how far back your line can actually be documented?

         

        If you do not mind, may I ask what denomination you are affiliated with?  I was raised in the Church of the Brethren and a lot of the Quakers that came to the Miami Valley married into the Church of the Brethren as they had some similar beliefs.  My son is a pastor of the Pathway Church in Dowagiac , Michigan .  It is a very small church and they are part of the Missionary Church . http://www.pathwayc hurch.com/  They moved there from South Bend (he and his wife are graduates of Bethel College in South Bend ) and there was a huge pole barn on the property that they have remodeled into a church.

         

        Thank you for responding.  Even if our Pugh’s are not related we are still cousins on the Julien side for sure.

         

        Vivian Markley

        Springfield Ohio

         

         

         


        From: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com [mailto: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com ] On Behalf Of Mark Pugh
        Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 11:08 AM
        To: Tracing_Pugh_ Origins@yahoogro ups.com
        Subject: Re: [Tracing_Pugh_ Origins] New file uploaded to Tracing_Pugh_ Origins

         

        Hi Vivian,

      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.