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Re: Echo! (The word actually echo's...)

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  • third_realm_guardian
    Hidy hidy, I can see changing minor things from Canon before an author s starting place, but depending on the situation of the story, I can see changing a lot
    Message 1 of 24 , Jan 31, 2009
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      Hidy hidy,

      I can see changing minor things from Canon before an author's
      starting place, but depending on the situation of the story, I can
      see changing a lot of bigger things, really. I mean, in my "Darkened
      Paths" story, I'm not planning on changing a whole lot, but I
      theorize that Harry and Luna talked after DA meetings and spent a
      little more time having actual conversations than what was shown to
      happen in Canon. I would consider that to be one of those larger
      things, but that doesn't matter so much, even starting at the end of
      the year instead of earlier.

      Also, if we're changing from Canon, but it isn't something integral
      to the plot development of major events, then I can see people not
      going further back, really. As readers and authors, we don't want to
      read or write something that's already been written hundreds of
      times. Too much of a repeat of Canon that way. Or just simply other
      stories. Even if all of the major events happen the same (DA
      meetings, the DoM, Voldemort, Sirius dying, Hermione getting whacked
      with a spell, Ginny breaking her ankle, etc,) then all of the stuff
      in between is basically frivolous information. It may be new, but
      wholly unoriginal and tame.

      I think that, as long as it is explained pretty well up front and the
      author doesn't go back and say "I forgot to mention, THIS happened
      before THIS, and THAT happened, so now I can do THIS with the plot,
      so Harry gets THIS ability and now suspects THAT person to be evil
      and is on to something! Just so you know..." As long as they remain
      consistent and explain things without having to repeat it all, then
      good on them. Coherency, consistency and clarity will make starting
      mid-change with a few major events changed or altered would be okay.
      I suppose it would be easiest to say that it would be okay so long as
      they didn't change a whole heck of a lot. The entire fourth year,
      like Harry going with Hermione and Luna with Krum while Ron got
      pommelled by the Patil sisters for groping or something would be too
      much change to start after that.

      Unless it's a time-travel fic, at which point, it could be merely an
      observation.

      I haven't checked your new story yet, Vern, so I may have to. I'm
      still looking out for your II fic (I can't remember the name, sorry.)

      Anyway, adieu. Back to work like the peon I am... *Le sigh*

      Kevin
      Paladeus

      --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, Vern Trumbly <vertru@...>
      wrote:
      >
      > On 1/31/09, third_realm_guardian <third_realm_guardian@...> wrote:
      > >
      > > Hidy hidy, Vern.
      > >
      > > One thing you can expand upon with your comment about Harry's
      lack of
      > > desire to be the Golden Boy is, why does everyone think that, just
      > > because he killed the original Voldemort, would he be good? He
      grew
      > > up just like T Riddle. Let him be evil, but tempered with a little
      > > good so he isn't totally depraved. Maybe more like Moody, but
      > > without the paranoia.
      > >
      > > Kittens are too cute to eat!
      > >
      > > Most of the time... *Shifty eyes*
      > >
      > > Kevin
      > >
      > > I found it interesting. Almost everyone on Seel'vor's Yahoo! Group
      > > that replied to my review theory also has an account and
      membership
      > > here, but hadn't mentioned it... TRAITORS! What would Brian say?
      > > SHAME ON YOU!
      > >
      > > o.O'
      > >
      > > I am SO bored.... MAKE THE DAY END! *Twitch*
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > There are a lot of grey Harry stories out there, and it is possible
      to twist
      > events just slightly at some critical juncture to turn him that
      way. I can't
      > make that happen very well in Walk, but it is possible to give him
      some
      > leanings that way, especially with how the Ministry has always
      tried to use
      > him for propaganda. He didn't grow up exactly like Tom, but it was
      very
      > similar. The major difference I can see would be that he spent time
      with
      > Arabella, and probably there were a few teachers who were kind to
      him. It's
      > hard to say with Riddle, because we have so little of his back
      story, but
      > it's a fair assumption that few adults paid much positive attention
      to him.
      > Harry did have 15 months with a loving family, where Tom didn't
      even have
      > that. In Harry's case the girls would keep him from going even a
      little
      > dark, but I'm sure most would see the advantage of being "grey",
      especially
      > if some Slytherins enter the mix.
      >
      > Since Walk takes off after HBP it has to mostly follow canon up to
      that
      > point, at least that is my preference. I dislike stories that begin
      in the
      > middle and more or less totally ignore canon and just do their own
      thing
      > changing things will nilly from previous books to make them fit
      their ideas.
      > I realize that is what a lot of us do with the series, changing
      things from
      > where we start, but at least we don't change the basics that
      happened prior
      > to our starting point. So anyway, again just some rambling and
      thoughts on
      > one of my stories that more or less fits Brian's criteria here,
      except that
      > this story will include at least Susan in addition to Hermi and
      Luna.
      >
      >
      > --
      > Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed
      >
      > Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible
      to get
      > at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
      >
    • Brian
      Hey Kevin, I do have a couple of ideas for one shots.. One is a little post DH short with Harry & Hermione sitting in an airport lounge. They ve decided to fly
      Message 2 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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        Hey Kevin,

        I do have a couple of ideas for one shots..

        One is a little post DH short with Harry & Hermione sitting in an
        airport lounge. They've decided to fly off to Australia to collect
        her parents, but their plane keeps breaking down and they end up
        back in the lounge along with the other passengers. Enter a
        flustered Arthur (& maybe Kingsley) who explains to the two of them
        that magic and electronics don't mix...

        (Hey, if you gotta turn off a mobile phone, it stands to reason that
        the magic coming off two magicals is going to cause more problems)

        The second idea is a final battle scene. Lots of Harry/Voldy
        fighting, etc, Voldy getting ahead a bit and crowing about how Harry
        could never have defeated him, yada yada yada. Queue Harry staring
        over Voldy's shoulder with a comment along the lines of "Maybe not,
        but he will..". Voldy falls for the oldest trick in the book and
        looks around, turns back just in time for Harry's silent Reducto to
        take off his head. The power he knows not - Muggle dirty tricks
        learned from surviving Dudder's Harry Hunting.

        This has probably already been done. I know there's a story out
        there that is just full of Voldy-killing - the thousand and one
        deaths of Lord Voldemort I think it's called, so it's gotta be in
        there somewhere.


        Anyway.. Rant time.

        I've been reading a story on ficwad with a surprisingly rapid update
        rate. Listed as HP/Many and the summary reads like a Harmony harem
        story - yet the author *insists* that there is going to be
        Ron/Hermione before eventual H/Hr..

        Now, while I find the recent chapters involving H + G + Hr nudity
        and similar smuttiness during occlumecy training overly contrived,
        it's still a bit of fun while it's still /kinda/ H/G/Hr.

        However, I find the rationale the author uses that Hermione would
        date Ron because Harry isn't asking to be the most frustrating load
        of bollocks I've seen.

        I'm actually at the point where I'm not sure I even want to read any
        more chapters, as I fully expect the author to have some scene where
        Hermione ends up shagging Ron because she's so randy from her
        activities with Harry.

        Thoughts?

        Brian



        --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, "third_realm_guardian"
        <third_realm_guardian@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hidy hidy,
        >
        > Has the group gone completely dead or something? No random or idle
        > chatter, no snarky comments or story commends/recommendations.
        >
        > How about one-shot ideas? Anyone got one-shots that they would
        like
        > to see? Any concepts or abilities you'd like to see in a story?
        > Favorite methods of Weasley or Malfoy destruction?
        >
        > o.O'
        >
        > You have to answer, or God will kill a kitten. You don't....
        hate...
        > kittens, do you?
        >
        > Kevin
        > Paladeus
        >
      • J B
        You mentioned Weasley destruction, and while I d love to expound on that, I have a more pressing issue. In my Torchwood fic, I m planning to make Draco do
        Message 3 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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          You mentioned Weasley destruction, and while I'd love to expound on that, I have a more pressing issue. In my Torchwood fic, I'm planning to make Draco do something horrible, so horrible that there are only two punishments that will fit his crime.

          1st. Slow Torture, slow like "Death by a thousand cuts" slow. Then maybe a bath in some nice lemon juice and a couple of pounds of salt. For as long as it takes before he either A) Dies horribly or B) Loses his mind. Or both.

          2nd. Permanent transfiguration into a Ferret. Not only a ferret, A Female ferret. One that is constantly in  heat. And Crabbe and Goyle you ask? Permanent transfiguration into male ferrets. And then charm the three of them so that they are always kept together, and can't be separated. Then dropped off in a pet store somewhere.

          2nd A. Combining the two. Remove Draco's consciousness and putting it into a female ferret. Not so he can take over, but so he feels everything she does, but can't influence her at all. And the female ferret has no idea he's there. Transfiguring Crabbe and Goyle into boy ferrets and putting the three together. Then, stringing up Draco's mutilated corpse up somewhere nice and public.


          So, which one should I go with? Or if anyone has a better idea, lemme know. When I first thought about it, I was just gonna kill Draky horribly and leave his dead body somewhere, but then I got this idea and now I don't know which one to pick. Thanks, and hopefully it'll ellevate the bordom some.
        • J B
          One of the small things I m changing in my story is, in his fifth year, Harry s closer with Luna, like you said Kevin, having them talk after DA meetings and
          Message 4 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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            One of the small things I'm changing in my story is, in his fifth
            year, Harry's closer with Luna, like you said Kevin, having them talk
            after DA meetings and outside of it. Also, I want Harry and Hermione
            to take the Muggle Studies O.W.L., because, it really is no excuse
            that they don't, it's probably the easiest damn O.W.L. either of them
            would ever take, not withstanding Harry just making crap up for his
            Divination O.W.L.

            Now, I am doing a recap of the Ministry Attack. It's mainly for
            Hermione's benefit, since she got taken out at the beginning and my
            Harry decides it's easier to take her inside a Pensive memory of it
            than just telling the story. It also gives the reader to experience
            Harry's second going over of the attack, his reactions to certain
            things, like seeing Hermione get cursed again, Sirius dying, and the
            possession by Riddle. Also, it lets the reader see Hermione's reaction
            to those things. So, it kind of is a rewrite, but from two different
            perspectives.


            --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, "third_realm_guardian"
            <third_realm_guardian@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hidy hidy,
            >
            > I can see changing minor things from Canon before an author's
            > starting place, but depending on the situation of the story, I can
            > see changing a lot of bigger things, really. I mean, in my "Darkened
            > Paths" story, I'm not planning on changing a whole lot, but I
            > theorize that Harry and Luna talked after DA meetings and spent a
            > little more time having actual conversations than what was shown to
            > happen in Canon. I would consider that to be one of those larger
            > things, but that doesn't matter so much, even starting at the end of
            > the year instead of earlier.
            >
            > Also, if we're changing from Canon, but it isn't something integral
            > to the plot development of major events, then I can see people not
            > going further back, really. As readers and authors, we don't want to
            > read or write something that's already been written hundreds of
            > times. Too much of a repeat of Canon that way. Or just simply other
            > stories. Even if all of the major events happen the same (DA
            > meetings, the DoM, Voldemort, Sirius dying, Hermione getting whacked
            > with a spell, Ginny breaking her ankle, etc,) then all of the stuff
            > in between is basically frivolous information. It may be new, but
            > wholly unoriginal and tame.
            >
            > I think that, as long as it is explained pretty well up front and the
            > author doesn't go back and say "I forgot to mention, THIS happened
            > before THIS, and THAT happened, so now I can do THIS with the plot,
            > so Harry gets THIS ability and now suspects THAT person to be evil
            > and is on to something! Just so you know..." As long as they remain
            > consistent and explain things without having to repeat it all, then
            > good on them. Coherency, consistency and clarity will make starting
            > mid-change with a few major events changed or altered would be okay.
            > I suppose it would be easiest to say that it would be okay so long as
            > they didn't change a whole heck of a lot. The entire fourth year,
            > like Harry going with Hermione and Luna with Krum while Ron got
            > pommelled by the Patil sisters for groping or something would be too
            > much change to start after that.
            >
            > Unless it's a time-travel fic, at which point, it could be merely an
            > observation.
            >
            > I haven't checked your new story yet, Vern, so I may have to. I'm
            > still looking out for your II fic (I can't remember the name, sorry.)
            >
            > Anyway, adieu. Back to work like the peon I am... *Le sigh*
            >
            > Kevin
            > Paladeus
            >
            > --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, Vern Trumbly <vertru@>
            > wrote:
            > >
            > > On 1/31/09, third_realm_guardian <third_realm_guardian@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Hidy hidy, Vern.
            > > >
            > > > One thing you can expand upon with your comment about Harry's
            > lack of
            > > > desire to be the Golden Boy is, why does everyone think that, just
            > > > because he killed the original Voldemort, would he be good? He
            > grew
            > > > up just like T Riddle. Let him be evil, but tempered with a little
            > > > good so he isn't totally depraved. Maybe more like Moody, but
            > > > without the paranoia.
            > > >
            > > > Kittens are too cute to eat!
            > > >
            > > > Most of the time... *Shifty eyes*
            > > >
            > > > Kevin
            > > >
            > > > I found it interesting. Almost everyone on Seel'vor's Yahoo! Group
            > > > that replied to my review theory also has an account and
            > membership
            > > > here, but hadn't mentioned it... TRAITORS! What would Brian say?
            > > > SHAME ON YOU!
            > > >
            > > > o.O'
            > > >
            > > > I am SO bored.... MAKE THE DAY END! *Twitch*
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > > There are a lot of grey Harry stories out there, and it is possible
            > to twist
            > > events just slightly at some critical juncture to turn him that
            > way. I can't
            > > make that happen very well in Walk, but it is possible to give him
            > some
            > > leanings that way, especially with how the Ministry has always
            > tried to use
            > > him for propaganda. He didn't grow up exactly like Tom, but it was
            > very
            > > similar. The major difference I can see would be that he spent time
            > with
            > > Arabella, and probably there were a few teachers who were kind to
            > him. It's
            > > hard to say with Riddle, because we have so little of his back
            > story, but
            > > it's a fair assumption that few adults paid much positive attention
            > to him.
            > > Harry did have 15 months with a loving family, where Tom didn't
            > even have
            > > that. In Harry's case the girls would keep him from going even a
            > little
            > > dark, but I'm sure most would see the advantage of being "grey",
            > especially
            > > if some Slytherins enter the mix.
            > >
            > > Since Walk takes off after HBP it has to mostly follow canon up to
            > that
            > > point, at least that is my preference. I dislike stories that begin
            > in the
            > > middle and more or less totally ignore canon and just do their own
            > thing
            > > changing things will nilly from previous books to make them fit
            > their ideas.
            > > I realize that is what a lot of us do with the series, changing
            > things from
            > > where we start, but at least we don't change the basics that
            > happened prior
            > > to our starting point. So anyway, again just some rambling and
            > thoughts on
            > > one of my stories that more or less fits Brian's criteria here,
            > except that
            > > this story will include at least Susan in addition to Hermi and
            > Luna.
            > >
            > >
            > > --
            > > Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed
            > >
            > > Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible
            > to get
            > > at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
            > >
            >
          • J B
            ... I really hate fics like that. Apparently lots of authors have some kind of insane compulsion to get Hermione and Ron together, carnally, even if they are
            Message 5 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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              > Anyway.. Rant time.
              >
              > I've been reading a story on ficwad with a surprisingly rapid update
              > rate. Listed as HP/Many and the summary reads like a Harmony harem
              > story - yet the author *insists* that there is going to be
              > Ron/Hermione before eventual H/Hr..
              >
              > Now, while I find the recent chapters involving H + G + Hr nudity
              > and similar smuttiness during occlumecy training overly contrived,
              > it's still a bit of fun while it's still /kinda/ H/G/Hr.
              >
              > However, I find the rationale the author uses that Hermione would
              > date Ron because Harry isn't asking to be the most frustrating load
              > of bollocks I've seen.
              >
              > I'm actually at the point where I'm not sure I even want to read any
              > more chapters, as I fully expect the author to have some scene where
              > Hermione ends up shagging Ron because she's so randy from her
              > activities with Harry.
              >
              > Thoughts?
              >
              > Brian
              >

              I really hate fics like that. Apparently lots of authors have some kind
              of insane compulsion to get Hermione and Ron together, carnally, even if
              they are gonna end up H/HR.

              My problem is that the very idea of Hermione having sex with that inbred
              Malfoy wannabe fucktard turns my stomach. Anytime a fic does that, puts
              Hermione together with Ron, I immediately hit the red X button. I can't
              stomach that crap, it would be like trying to read a Hermione/Draco or
              Hermione/Snape fic, which are magnitudes of horrifying.

              I will freely admit, I enjoy a good Affair fic, except the ones where,
              when Harry is confronted by either Ron or Ginny, he turns into a
              snivviling wussy and begs for their forgiveness. I can understand him
              feeling bad, but not so bad that he completely capitulates to the two
              people who drove them away.

              I will also freely admit that I have personally written two fics where
              Hermione is dating Ron, but manages to come to her senses before they
              sleep together. I have a fondness for the "Harry rescuing Hermione from
              the horrible relationship that is Ron" story. But I make for damn sure
              that Ron is obliviated of any memories that he might have of seeing
              Hermione naked.

              Simply because I'm evil that way. Hee Hee.
            • Vern Trumbly
              ... I agree. If they are only changing minor things, that makes me no never mind, as they say around here. But as you say, when they go changing the big things
              Message 6 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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                On 2/1/09, third_realm_guardian <third_realm_guardian@...> wrote:

                Hidy hidy,

                I can see changing minor things from Canon before an author's
                starting place, but depending on the situation of the story, I can
                see changing a lot of bigger things, really. I mean, in my "Darkened
                Paths" story, I'm not planning on changing a whole lot, but I
                theorize that Harry and Luna talked after DA meetings and spent a
                little more time having actual conversations than what was shown to
                happen in Canon. I would consider that to be one of those larger
                things, but that doesn't matter so much, even starting at the end of
                the year instead of earlier.

                Also, if we're changing from Canon, but it isn't something integral
                to the plot development of major events, then I can see people not
                going further back, really. As readers and authors, we don't want to
                read or write something that's already been written hundreds of
                times. Too much of a repeat of Canon that way. Or just simply other
                stories. Even if all of the major events happen the same (DA
                meetings, the DoM, Voldemort, Sirius dying, Hermione getting whacked
                with a spell, Ginny breaking her ankle, etc,) then all of the stuff
                in between is basically frivolous information. It may be new, but
                wholly unoriginal and tame.

                I think that, as long as it is explained pretty well up front and the
                author doesn't go back and say "I forgot to mention, THIS happened
                before THIS, and THAT happened, so now I can do THIS with the plot,
                so Harry gets THIS ability and now suspects THAT person to be evil
                and is on to something! Just so you know..." As long as they remain
                consistent and explain things without having to repeat it all, then
                good on them. Coherency, consistency and clarity will make starting
                mid-change with a few major events changed or altered would be okay.
                I suppose it would be easiest to say that it would be okay so long as
                they didn't change a whole heck of a lot. The entire fourth year,
                like Harry going with Hermione and Luna with Krum while Ron got
                pommelled by the Patil sisters for groping or something would be too
                much change to start after that.

                Unless it's a time-travel fic, at which point, it could be merely an
                observation.

                I haven't checked your new story yet, Vern, so I may have to. I'm
                still looking out for your II fic (I can't remember the name, sorry.)

                Anyway, adieu. Back to work like the peon I am... *Le sigh*

                Kevin
                Paladeus

                .


                I agree. If they are only changing minor things, that makes me no never mind, as they say around here. But as you say, when they go changing the big things just so it fits the plot or storyline, or "Oh yeah, Dd died in fourth year and now McGonagalls dying too and Snape will be Headmaster in fifth year"... I hit the red x and go on to something else. I'm no canon nazi, that would make me a huge hypocrite since Merlin knows all of my stories diverge greatly from canon. It is just keeping the basic facts the same up to the point of divergence that I prefer to see. It also helps if the character and spell names are spelled correctly.

                You are right in saying we do get tired of reading the same old thing, and stories that largely retell canon with only minor changes are a waste of my reading time, except that the writer might be learning valuable writing skills. There are too many good and challenging stories to read and write to get bogged down in that stuff.

                By its very nature, as has been said many times, fanfiction is AU. That means that no matter how closely you follow canon, change one thing and it isn't canon any longer. The point of fanfiction is to write alternate views of how the story went, how it could go, or how we'd like to see it go or have gone.

                In the case of people like jbern, Kinsfire, JB (gphoenix) I believe, and me we use it to sharpen our skills so we can eventually get our original works published. A lot of people write fanfiction just because they enjoy it, it is fun, and/or a big stress relief from real life. Whatever the reason, it should be taken seriously and I dislike people who can't even take time to proofread their work, let alone get a beta, read the books, check facts on the Lexicon, or buy a dictionary (there are several free on-line).

                I am reading one now, that the author tells a vey good story, but obviously can't be bothered to even proof read each chapter, just throws it up there to see what happens... oh and demands review at the end of each. I've quit reading a few times already, but keep reopening it because it is a good story, and different. It's a Dark Harry story, and starts the summer before SS/PS. It follows a logical path to Harry hating Muggles, and Tonks hating pretty much everybody not Harry or Draco. Harry's in Slytherin, best friends with Draco, and Tonks is one year older in Gryffindor. She was teased badly and treated horribly by her housemates, especially the Weasley Twins.  http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3464303/1/Dark_Lord_Potter_Part_1

                I try to review, normally, most everything I read. The exceptions are people who are as lazy as I mentioned, demand reviews, whine and leave tremendously long author notes about why it took so long to get the current chapter out, and people who only saw the movies but couldn't be bothered to crack a book. The few I've gotten replies from on those types generally go along the lines of "I'm not a professional writer, and I'm doing this for fun, and my life is so busy I don't have time for that, and..." well, you get the picture. I figure why bother. I'm not going to try to stroke the ego of someone who writes a good story, but is too lazy to get the details right. If I'm going to get a whiny review, or a snotty one telling me if I don't like it read somewhere else, why bother.There are too many of us who do the very best we can to write things that are done as correctly as we and our betas can manage.

                Oh, and now that the rants are done, the story you are thinking of, Kevin, is The Inimitably Inspired, Indubitably Irreverent Harry Potter Do-Over, just so you know. <GRIN> And for the record I have 11 stories currently posted on ff.n, more on my group.

                --
                Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed

                Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible to get at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
              • Vern Trumbly
                ... I like this idea, Brian. I think the twist there should be that a normal witch or wizard could fly on an airplane, but Harry and Hermione are both too
                Message 7 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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                  On 2/1/09, Brian <bjdibbins@...> wrote:

                  Hey Kevin,

                  I do have a couple of ideas for one shots..

                  One is a little post DH short with Harry & Hermione sitting in an
                  airport lounge. They've decided to fly off to Australia to collect
                  her parents, but their plane keeps breaking down and they end up
                  back in the lounge along with the other passengers. Enter a
                  flustered Arthur (& maybe Kingsley) who explains to the two of them
                  that magic and electronics don't mix...

                  (Hey, if you gotta turn off a mobile phone, it stands to reason that
                  the magic coming off two magicals is going to cause more problems)























                  I like this idea, Brian. I think the twist there should be that a normal witch or wizard could fly on an airplane, but Harry and Hermione are both too powerful to do so. Together it'll never leave the gate.
                   

                  The second idea is a final battle scene. Lots of Harry/Voldy
                  fighting, etc, Voldy getting ahead a bit and crowing about how Harry
                  could never have defeated him, yada yada yada. Queue Harry staring
                  over Voldy's shoulder with a comment along the lines of "Maybe not,
                  but he will..". Voldy falls for the oldest trick in the book and
                  looks around, turns back just in time for Harry's silent Reducto to
                  take off his head. The power he knows not - Muggle dirty tricks
                  learned from surviving Dudder's Harry Hunting.

                  This has probably already been done. I know there's a story out
                  there that is just full of Voldy-killing - the thousand and one
                  deaths of Lord Voldemort I think it's called, so it's gotta be in
                  there somewhere.


























                  That is Crys on FFA and I believe on ff.n with his "1001 Ways to  Kill Voldemort". Last I recall he was up to around 350 or so. And believe me there is some funny stuff in there.

                  Anyway.. Rant time.

                  I've been reading a story on ficwad with a surprisingly rapid update
                  rate. Listed as HP/Many and the summary reads like a Harmony harem
                  story - yet the author *insists* that there is going to be
                  Ron/Hermione before eventual H/Hr..

                  Now, while I find the recent chapters involving H + G + Hr nudity
                  and similar smuttiness during occlumecy training overly contrived,
                  it's still a bit of fun while it's still /kinda/ H/G/Hr.

                  However, I find the rationale the author uses that Hermione would
                  date Ron because Harry isn't asking to be the most frustrating load
                  of bollocks I've seen.

                  I'm actually at the point where I'm not sure I even want to read any
                  more chapters, as I fully expect the author to have some scene where
                  Hermione ends up shagging Ron because she's so randy from her
                  activities with Harry.

                  Thoughts?

                  Brian

                  .

                  No more to say on the last one, see my other post. But I will say I'd probably not get far with that story, from what you described. Am I getting to be a snooty old fart? Yep, and proud of it. There are just too many well done stories out there to bother with rest.

                  --
                  Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed

                  Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible to get at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                • J B
                  ... and me ... works ... it, it ... reason, it ... time to ... facts on ... Yeah, I would say it s a combination of both for me. I have had this original story
                  Message 8 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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                    > In the case of people like jbern, Kinsfire, JB (gphoenix) I believe,
                    and me
                    > we use it to sharpen our skills so we can eventually get our original
                    works
                    > published. A lot of people write fanfiction just because they enjoy
                    it, it
                    > is fun, and/or a big stress relief from real life. Whatever the
                    reason, it
                    > should be taken seriously and I dislike people who can't even take
                    time to
                    > proofread their work, let alone get a beta, read the books, check
                    facts on
                    > the Lexicon, or buy a dictionary (there are several free on-line).

                    Yeah, I would say it's a combination of both for me. I have had this
                    original story cooking in my brain for years, one that has evovled so
                    much over the years, that the original story damn near has no relation
                    to the current version. And I'd love to get published one day. However,
                    I do like writing HP Fanfiction, because I want to see what the universe
                    would be like if I wrote it, or if certain characters had slightly (or
                    completely) different personalities. Or if they turned Left instead of
                    Right.

                    > I try to review, normally, most everything I read. The exceptions are
                    people
                    > who are as lazy as I mentioned, demand reviews, whine and leave
                    tremendously
                    > long author notes about why it took so long to get the current chapter
                    out,
                    > and people who only saw the movies but couldn't be bothered to crack a
                    book.
                    > The few I've gotten replies from on those types generally go along the
                    lines
                    > of "I'm not a professional writer, and I'm doing this for fun, and my
                    life
                    > is so busy I don't have time for that, and..." well, you get the
                    picture. I
                    > figure why bother. I'm not going to try to stroke the ego of someone
                    who
                    > writes a good story, but is too lazy to get the details right. If I'm
                    going
                    > to get a whiny review, or a snotty one telling me if I don't like it
                    read
                    > somewhere else, why bother.There are too many of us who do the very
                    best we
                    > can to write things that are done as correctly as we and our betas can
                    > manage.

                    I hate people who demand reviews. Not ask, DEMAND! Hate those buggers,
                    but I absolutely loathe those writers who demand reviews for shitty
                    stories. People like you mentioned Vern, who don't care about
                    proofreading, who don't get beta's, who just slap the keyboard a couple
                    times, throw it up and demand reviews. They remind me of Lockheart.

                    I don't demand reviews, I ask. Even then, I don't write these stories
                    for reviews or other people's enjoyment. Granted, I love it when I get a
                    good review, especially more engaging ones than "It's good, post more!"
                    I love reviews when people will mention things in the story they liked,
                    or what they want to see more of.

                    I even like reviews when people disagree with me, so long as they aren't
                    rude bastards about it. It gives me a chance to explain why I went such
                    a way and get different points of view.

                    I got this one review that I absolutely hated, because it was literaly
                    confusing as hell. It was "rm, meh"

                    That's the whole review. I had to email this twit to find out what it
                    was. He basically told me I violated all the sacred conventions of
                    writing, that I wasn't an author on the same level as Stephen King, TS
                    Elliot or any of the really big authors. And after my brain actually
                    froze for about 5 minutes, I was tempted to send him an email thanking
                    him for pointing out the obvious. If I was any of the greats, I wouldn't
                    be writing for a FanFic website, I'd be making millions for a publishing
                    house. He even gave me several links to read to prove how bad a writer I
                    am and how much of a failure I was. That one actually pissed me off.
                  • Vern Trumbly
                    ... I got so tired of seeing people ask for reviews, I usually don t even mention it anymore. Once in a while maybe, just something like: reviews feed the
                    Message 9 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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                      On 2/1/09, J B <gphoenix51@...> wrote:


                      I don't demand reviews, I ask. Even then, I don't write these stories
                      for reviews or other people's enjoyment. Granted, I love it when I get a
                      good review, especially more engaging ones than "It's good, post more!"
                      I love reviews when people will mention things in the story they liked,
                      or what they want to see more of.













                      I got so tired of seeing people ask for reviews, I usually don't even mention it anymore. Once in a while maybe, just something like: "reviews feed the muse, and the author's ego", or whatever. Like you I write because I enjoy it a lot, it makes me feel good when I turn out a story or chapter that I know is as well written as I can make it.

                      I even like reviews when people disagree with me, so long as they aren't
                      rude bastards about it. It gives me a chance to explain why I went such
                      a way and get different points of view.








                      I agree with you there. I love when people take time to rationally point out that this could be done differently, or that would work better, or I screwed up on a canon point. Like when I had a character starting Hoggy a year earlier than in canon. 

                      I got this one review that I absolutely hated, because it was literaly
                      confusing as hell. It was "rm, meh"

                      That's the whole review. I had to email this twit to find out what it
                      was. He basically told me I violated all the sacred conventions of
                      writing, that I wasn't an author on the same level as Stephen King, TS
                      Elliot or any of the really big authors. And after my brain actually
                      froze for about 5 minutes, I was tempted to send him an email thanking
                      him for pointing out the obvious. If I was any of the greats, I wouldn't
                      be writing for a FanFic website, I'd be making millions for a publishing
                      house. He even gave me several links to read to prove how bad a writer I
                      am and how much of a failure I was. That one actually pissed me off.


























                      I can't say I've had one quite that ridiculous, but a few that got under my normally pretty thick hide. And yes, there have been a few that told me I should go back to pounding on rocks instead of a keyboard. I have to wonder what these people use for brains, or just what kind of stories they like. I suppose if it doesn't have blood on every page it ain't worth shit to them. I often don't even answer them any longer, or if I do I am overly polite and reply in such a way as to very obliquely insult their intelligence. I usually don't get replies. <grin>

                      --
                      Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed

                      Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible to get at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                    • third_realm_guardian
                      Hidy hidy, Brian (and everyone else I respond to) I absolutely HATE stories where Harry s romantic interest is with another guy first, at least beyond more
                      Message 10 of 24 , Feb 1, 2009
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                        Hidy hidy, Brian (and everyone else I respond to)

                        I absolutely HATE stories where Harry's romantic interest is with
                        another guy first, at least beyond more than hugs and such, as it
                        means it isn't likely to be too big of a deal for her to break up with
                        him to go out with Harry.

                        Then again, I loathe any girl aside from perhaps an OC dating Ron...
                        He's going to be such an unfortunate bastard in my stories.... It may
                        take me a little time to get there, sadly, but it will happen....
                        *insert evil cackling here*

                        And yes. Choosing one guy, just because the guy you like isn't
                        asking, is royally screwed up. It's basically the equivalent to
                        saying, "I love you, but I don't love you enough to wait and decided
                        to get in a good shag while I wait."

                        Blegh!

                        I just read a one-shot Seel'vor had on his Yahoo! Group, something
                        about "Inactivity and not caring" or something doing more harm that
                        outright pain. It ends H/Hr, but has a naughty scene a few days after
                        Hermione talks with her parents where Harry told her and others the
                        prophecy and she thinks, "well, I guess that shows who I go for as
                        Harry isn't likely to live" and a few days after arriving at Number
                        12, she and Ron are masturbating each other. Harry walks in on them.
                        Nothing more than that, and it doesn't happen again, but BAH! I hate
                        that crap. Ron is such a... friggin' group rules... I'd tell you
                        exactly what I thought....

                        GPhoenix-

                        If you want suitably horrible, you should also tell us WHO is doing
                        the torturing and such, though I suspect Harry. I would say take his
                        wand and transfigure him into a girl. Portkey him somewhere with a
                        massive sex trade operation. If it's Central Africa, estimated
                        survival time is a year. There's a place (I can't recall the name)
                        just outside of Germany and they live as long as they're profitable.

                        I don't think Hermione would be the type to just sex someone up,
                        especially without plenty of history between them. And with Ron, I
                        think even an emotionally naive or hormonal Hermione would still put
                        thought into doing anything naughty.

                        To that end, I know teenagers and the ruling thoughts about sex, and I
                        don't think she would wait nerely as long with Harry or Ron, though I
                        DO think she'd give Ron a probationary period to be sure, just in
                        case. They ARE always arguing. And he's just simply a bad friend. I
                        truly believe she settled, knowing Harry was interested in Ginny and
                        that he went there because he felt he wouldn't get hurt and it was
                        Hermione's way of staying near him, always. We already know she's
                        self-sacrificing. If she's willing to skip off on her parents to be
                        with them during the summers, I think she'd do that, too.

                        I rather enjoy the obliviation idea. I'd prefer to modify the memory
                        to seeing Ginny instead, just because it would be funny, though.

                        Vern-

                        Well... *Shifty eyes* ... I haven't read the books either... *Nervous
                        laughter*

                        In my defense, I know the books are always (almost) superior to
                        movies. I like to enjoy the movies, so I refuse to read the books as
                        I know I won't like the movies. It happened for "Sphere" and most
                        recently "The Seeker" (Book: The Sword of Truth series,) and it would
                        happen for that. I know it.

                        I actually didn't read the books once they became so popular because I
                        refused to follow the fad it had become. So much hype and ... dare I
                        say cult-like following? After that, was my decision for the movies
                        and then finally, I decided on my pairing, and refused to read
                        something (or start it, at least) when I knew the shipping would be
                        something I literally cannot read.

                        I started Harry Potter through Fanfiction and, while starting with a
                        Harry/Ginny fic (soul-bonding fic,) I very, VERY quickly became a
                        Harmonian shipper. I will not read Hermione with Ron, simply put.

                        Random Chatter:

                        I'll admit I like reviews, but I don't write for them. I actually get
                        individual scenes in my head for things I read, watch or discuss with
                        others and build stories around it (or dream... a few
                        stories/one-shots came about thanks to dreams. My challenge of the
                        "Dreamworld" and a Naruto one-shot I'm writing was like that.)

                        Mostly, I'm curious about what others think of the concepts, to be
                        honest. I mean, my idea where Lilith, the Fairy Queen gives Santa,
                        her most powerful fae regarding manipulating the timestream to send
                        the H/Hr/L trio back is something I absolutely LOVE and plan on
                        starting once I finish a current story.

                        My problem, however, isn't getting bored with the story, but how to
                        write specific scenes to give the information I want, without giving
                        too much or making it come across the wrong way.

                        That's actually my second-biggest problem, I suppose. My first is
                        that I'm too chatty... *Looks up over previous bits fo the post.* My
                        "Death's Pride" fic is stalled because I've got a lot going on, but
                        it's all dry and boring. Not a whole lot of interesting stuff. While
                        it will become more interesting. It's boring right now.

                        I'm sadly not that funny. Aw well. I'll try to figure it out to make
                        it entertaining for you guys.

                        Kevin
                        Paladeus
                      • Vern Trumbly
                        ... I don t really have a problem with that Kevin, since you have read a lot of fanfiction. From reading your stories, one would hardly know you haven t read
                        Message 11 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                          On 2/2/09, third_realm_guardian <third_realm_guardian@...> wrote:

                          Hidy hidy, Brian (and everyone else I respond to)

                          <SNIP>
                          Vern-

                          Well... *Shifty eyes* ... I haven't read the books either... *Nervous
                          laughter*

                          In my defense, I know the books are always (almost) superior to
                          movies. I like to enjoy the movies, so I refuse to read the books as
                          I know I won't like the movies. It happened for "Sphere" and most
                          recently "The Seeker" (Book: The Sword of Truth series,) and it would
                          happen for that. I know it.

                          I actually didn't read the books once they became so popular because I
                          refused to follow the fad it had become. So much hype and ... dare I
                          say cult-like following? After that, was my decision for the movies
                          and then finally, I decided on my pairing, and refused to read
                          something (or start it, at least) when I knew the shipping would be
                          something I literally cannot read.

                          I started Harry Potter through Fanfiction and, while starting with a
                          Harry/Ginny fic (soul-bonding fic,) I very, VERY quickly became a
                          Harmonian shipper. I will not read Hermione with Ron, simply put.

                          .


                          I don't really have a problem with that Kevin, since you have read a lot of fanfiction. From reading your stories, one would hardly know you haven't read the books. I do hope you use the HP Lexicon as much as possible to check facts, spelling, etc, because the more "realism, ie canon facts" you include the better the story is for me. Including canon or realism in a story is what makes it easier for the reader to suspend disbelief.

                          While Mike (grenouille) and I were working on our new story he looked up some schools in the UK to see when they are in session. Turns out they have the same number of weeks off from school as kids here in the US, just at different times. Harry being out of school for the 9 or 10 weeks the books show is actually longer than the two schools/districts we looked at, whose school year ends the last week in July and starts the first week of Sept, usually the 2nd. So only 6 weeks off. The reason I'm saying this is that those kinds of details make a story more beleivable and the suspension of disbelief that is at the heart of fiction comes easier. If I am reading a book or story and the background details are just not reality, or at least the reality of that universe, then it is harder for me to get into that story; to suspend disbelief.

                          It is the same with the HP universe. There are certain facts we accept as "the reality" of Harry Potters world and the Wizarding World. If too many of those things are not right with canon, if they are not the reality we have come to expect then the story is harder for most HP readers to get into. There are a lot of other factors I could mention, but I'll leave it at that.

                          --
                          Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed

                          Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible to get at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                        • J B
                          ... accept as ... many of ... we have ... at that. ... That s one thing I ve been struggling with, with my fic. I want to portray Harry and some new friends
                          Message 12 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                            > It is the same with the HP universe. There are certain facts we
                            accept as
                            > "the reality" of Harry Potters world and the Wizarding World. If too
                            many of
                            > those things are not right with canon, if they are not the reality
                            we have
                            > come to expect then the story is harder for most HP readers to get into.
                            > There are a lot of other factors I could mention, but I'll leave it
                            at that.
                            >

                            That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                            portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                            teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                            friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                            mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                            Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                            one? Let's go see this action one."

                            That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                            stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                            use proper names for things.

                            "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                            gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."

                            Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                            terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                            a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                            I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                            reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                            little bit from every genre.

                            How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                            those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                            balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                            doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                            with the three Dementors in human skin.
                          • Vern Trumbly
                            ... It might be just me, but that is exactly the sort of realism I love to see in a story. He got a Coke, sounds a lot more realistic than he got a fizzy
                            Message 13 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                              On 2/2/09, J B <gphoenix51@...> wrote:



                              That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                              portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                              teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                              friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                              mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                              Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                              one? Let's go see this action one."

                              That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                              stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                              use proper names for things.

                              "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                              gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."

                              Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                              terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                              a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                              I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                              reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                              little bit from every genre.

                              How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                              those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                              balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                              doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                              with the three Dementors in human skin.

                              .


                              It might be just me, but that is exactly the sort of realism I love to see in a story. He got a Coke, sounds a lot more realistic than he got a fizzy drink. (Brit speak for what us heathens call soda pop, among other things) I've seen a lot of stories where Harry went to see his first ever film (Brit-speak) and saw, for instance, Independence Day, and they got Pepsis from the snack stand (or whatever the Brits call it). And that is another thing I like to see in a story is the author having a Brit-picker who can help them with the correct terminology for things like the cinema instead of theater, and such.

                              I also like to see the person using as many British idioms as they can dredge up. I've made myself a list of some word Brits use which we don't, and try to insert them where appropriate. I'm not nearly as good at it as a native, but I haven't had anyone complain so far. Well, there was the one guy complaining about using arse instead of ass, but I calmly explained to him that is what they good people of Britain use instead.

                              --
                              Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed

                              Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible to get at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                            • grenouille
                              The only thing that I would be concerned about is making sure the movie mentioned was actually playing in the theater during whatever time period you re using.
                              Message 14 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                The only thing that I would be concerned about is making sure the movie mentioned was actually playing in the theater during whatever time period you're using. For example, it would make me crazy if Harry suggested going to see "Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones" during the summer between 5th and 6th year as I know it didn't come out until 2002. The Internet Movie Database http://www.imdb.com/ is a great resource for such things. Also, I wouldn't worry about mentioning products such as Coke by name as they've almost become words in their own right rather than just Trade Names.

                                Mike

                                At 07:21 AM 2/2/2009, you wrote:

                                > It is the same with the HP universe. There are certain facts we
                                accept as
                                > "the reality" of Harry Potters world and the Wizarding World. If too
                                many of
                                > those things are not right with canon, if they are not the reality
                                we have
                                > come to expect then the story is harder for most HP readers to get into.
                                > There are a lot of other factors I could mention, but I'll leave it
                                at that.
                                >

                                That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                                portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                                teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                                friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                                mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                                Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                                one? Let's go see this action one."

                                That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                                stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                                use proper names for things.

                                "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                                gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."

                                Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                                terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                                a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                                I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                                reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                                little bit from every genre.

                                How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                                those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                                balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                                doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                                with the three Dementors in human skin.

                                Sex should be friendly. Otherwise stick to mechanical toys; it�s more sanitary. ~ Robert A. Heinlein

                              • Tommy King
                                If you are going to keep canon time-line you need to make sure that your Muggle technology and movies are correct or it jars, so no iPods, Mp3 players, CD s
                                Message 15 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                  If you are going to keep canon time-line you need to make sure that your Muggle technology and movies are correct or it jars, so no iPods, Mp3 players, CD's were around but still 'new' technology in the early 1990's, mobile phones were still the domain of 'Yuppies', satellite TV was around.
                                   
                                  Tommy

                                  British by birth, Scottish by the Grace of God



                                  From: J B <gphoenix51@...>
                                  To: Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Monday, 2 February, 2009 15:21:03
                                  Subject: [Thoughts_of_Pudding] Re: Echo! (The word actually echo's...)

                                  > It is the same with the HP universe. There are certain facts we

                                  accept as
                                  > "the reality" of Harry Potters world and the Wizarding World. If too
                                  many of
                                  > those things are not right with canon, if they are not the reality
                                  we have
                                  > come to expect then the story is harder for most HP readers to get into.
                                  > There are a lot of other factors I could mention, but I'll leave it
                                  at that.
                                  >

                                  That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                                  portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                                  teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                                  friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                                  mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                                  Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                                  one? Let's go see this action one."

                                  That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                                  stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                                  use proper names for things.

                                  "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                                  gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."

                                  Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                                  terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                                  a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                                  I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                                  reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                                  little bit from every genre.

                                  How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                                  those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                                  balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                                  doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                                  with the three Dementors in human skin.


                                • J B
                                  Well, I promise Vern, just for you. That I ll use good British terminology...except for arse. I m so sorry, but I just can t bring myself to actually use that
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                    Well, I promise Vern, just for you. That I'll use good British
                                    terminology...except for arse. I'm so sorry, but I just can't bring
                                    myself to actually use that in my fic. To be as polite as possible, I
                                    think it sounds weird, the rest I really like. Bloody, bum, shite, and
                                    all the others. I especially like Oi, though I've seen it spelled Oy,
                                    but I prefer spelling it with an i. But Arse? Gonna have to leave that
                                    out. It just sounds better in my mind, to call someone an asshole,
                                    instead of an arsehole. I dunno why, probably because I'm a dirty
                                    Yank, but it just doesn't sound as strong to me, it's like you want to
                                    call them a name, but not actually mean it.

                                    The only way I can think of to explain it is that in this one movie I
                                    saw, Formula 51, it had British people switching between Shite and
                                    Shit. And it seemed to me that they only used Shit when they really
                                    meant it. Shite was kinda like a half assed curse.

                                    I dunno, I guess I could publish a full Brit version, then keep a
                                    "Director's Cut" version for myself. I'll probably do that.

                                    --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, Vern Trumbly <vertru@...>
                                    wrote:
                                    >
                                    > On 2/2/09, J B <gphoenix51@...> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                                    > > portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                                    > > teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                                    > > friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                                    > > mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                                    > > Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                                    > > one? Let's go see this action one."
                                    > >
                                    > > That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                                    > > stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                                    > > use proper names for things.
                                    > >
                                    > > "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                                    > > gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."
                                    > >
                                    > > Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                                    > > terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                                    > > a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                                    > > I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                                    > > reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                                    > > little bit from every genre.
                                    > >
                                    > > How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                                    > > those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                                    > > balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                                    > > doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                                    > > with the three Dementors in human skin.
                                    > >
                                    > > .
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    > It might be just me, but that is exactly the sort of realism I love
                                    to see
                                    > in a story. He got a Coke, sounds a lot more realistic than he got a
                                    fizzy
                                    > drink. (Brit speak for what us heathens call soda pop, among other
                                    things)
                                    > I've seen a lot of stories where Harry went to see his first ever film
                                    > (Brit-speak) and saw, for instance, Independence Day, and they got
                                    Pepsis
                                    > from the snack stand (or whatever the Brits call it). And that is
                                    another
                                    > thing I like to see in a story is the author having a Brit-picker
                                    who can
                                    > help them with the correct terminology for things like the cinema
                                    instead of
                                    > theater, and such.
                                    >
                                    > I also like to see the person using as many British idioms as they can
                                    > dredge up. I've made myself a list of some word Brits use which we
                                    don't,
                                    > and try to insert them where appropriate. I'm not nearly as good at
                                    it as a
                                    > native, but I haven't had anyone complain so far. Well, there was
                                    the one
                                    > guy complaining about using arse instead of ass, but I calmly
                                    explained to
                                    > him that is what they good people of Britain use instead.
                                    >
                                    > --
                                    > Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed
                                    >
                                    > Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible
                                    to get
                                    > at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                                    >
                                  • J B
                                    Oh, I forgot to mention, I m making the time period current time. So the end of his 5th year and beginning of his 6th is 2008. So, I plan on having Harry go
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                      Oh, I forgot to mention, I'm making the time period current time. So
                                      the end of his 5th year and beginning of his 6th is 2008. So, I plan
                                      on having Harry go see Iron Man and a few other good movies in his summer.

                                      --- In Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com, grenouille
                                      <grenouille7777@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > The only thing that I would be concerned about is making sure the
                                      > movie mentioned was actually playing in the theater during whatever
                                      > time period you're using. For example, it would make me crazy if
                                      > Harry suggested going to see "Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the
                                      > Clones" during the summer between 5th and 6th year as I know it
                                      > didn't come out until 2002. The Internet Movie Database
                                      > http://www.imdb.com/ is a great resource for such things. Also, I
                                      > wouldn't worry about mentioning products such as Coke by name as
                                      > they've almost become words in their own right rather than just
                                      Trade Names.
                                      >
                                      > Mike
                                      >
                                      > At 07:21 AM 2/2/2009, you wrote:
                                      >
                                      > > > It is the same with the HP universe. There are certain facts we
                                      > >accept as
                                      > > > "the reality" of Harry Potters world and the Wizarding World. If too
                                      > >many of
                                      > > > those things are not right with canon, if they are not the reality
                                      > >we have
                                      > > > come to expect then the story is harder for most HP readers to
                                      get into.
                                      > > > There are a lot of other factors I could mention, but I'll leave it
                                      > >at that.
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > >That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                                      > >portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                                      > >teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                                      > >friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                                      > >mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                                      > >Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                                      > >one? Let's go see this action one."
                                      > >
                                      > >That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                                      > >stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                                      > >use proper names for things.
                                      > >
                                      > >"You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                                      > >gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."
                                      > >
                                      > >Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                                      > >terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                                      > >a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                                      > >I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                                      > >reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                                      > >little bit from every genre.
                                      > >
                                      > >How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                                      > >those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                                      > >balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                                      > >doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                                      > >with the three Dementors in human skin.
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > Sex should be friendly. Otherwise stick to mechanical toys; it's more
                                      > sanitary. ~ Robert A. Heinlein
                                      >
                                    • Tommy King
                                      I Britpick for Vern, and will be happy to help, asshole is coming into fashion over here due to the Americanisation of our language. Tommy British by birth,
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                        I Britpick for Vern, and will be happy to help, asshole is coming into fashion over here due to the Americanisation of our language.
                                         
                                        Tommy

                                        British by birth, Scottish by the Grace of God



                                        From: J B <gphoenix51@...>
                                        To: Thoughts_of_Pudding@yahoogroups.com
                                        Sent: Monday, 2 February, 2009 20:33:54
                                        Subject: [Thoughts_of_Pudding] Re: Echo! (The word actually echo's...)

                                        Well, I promise Vern, just for you. That I'll use good British
                                        terminology. ..except for arse. I'm so sorry, but I just can't bring
                                        myself to actually use that in my fic. To be as polite as possible, I
                                        think it sounds weird, the rest I really like. Bloody, bum, shite, and
                                        all the others. I especially like Oi, though I've seen it spelled Oy,
                                        but I prefer spelling it with an i. But Arse? Gonna have to leave that
                                        out. It just sounds better in my mind, to call someone an asshole,
                                        instead of an arsehole. I dunno why, probably because I'm a dirty
                                        Yank, but it just doesn't sound as strong to me, it's like you want to
                                        call them a name, but not actually mean it.

                                        The only way I can think of to explain it is that in this one movie I
                                        saw, Formula 51, it had British people switching between Shite and
                                        Shit. And it seemed to me that they only used Shit when they really
                                        meant it. Shite was kinda like a half assed curse.

                                        I dunno, I guess I could publish a full Brit version, then keep a
                                        "Director's Cut" version for myself. I'll probably do that.

                                        --- In Thoughts_of_ Pudding@yahoogro ups.com, Vern Trumbly <vertru@...>
                                        wrote:

                                        >
                                        > On 2/2/09, J B <gphoenix51@ ...> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > That's one thing I've been struggling with, with my fic. I want to
                                        > > portray Harry and some new friends I'm having him make as actual
                                        > > teenagers (these new friends are gonna be muggle girls). With my
                                        > > friends, when we talk about music, or movies or things like that, we
                                        > > mention those things by name, not just the general thing. For example,
                                        > > Harry would say something like, "You guys want to see a movie? Which
                                        > > one? Let's go see this action one."
                                        > >
                                        > > That's how it would happen in Cannon, because of copyright laws and
                                        > > stuff. Now, with the proper disclaimer, I'm gonna change it so they
                                        > > use proper names for things.
                                        > >
                                        > > "You guys want to see a movie? Which one? Let's go see Iron Man, I'm
                                        > > gonna go buy some Cokes for the show."
                                        > >
                                        > > Now, does that throw you out of the fic? Should it be left in general
                                        > > terms? What about music? I want to have Harry get introduced to things
                                        > > a normal Muggle Teenager would know, and Music is a big part of that.
                                        > > I plan on mentioning a lot of band names, and to keep myself from
                                        > > reflecting my taste in music on Harry, I'm gonna have him like a
                                        > > little bit from every genre.
                                        > >
                                        > > How does that sound? Is it too jarring? Should I try to gloss over
                                        > > those bits and just focus on his summer training? I want to try to
                                        > > balance the intensive training with him just being a normal kid, and
                                        > > doing the things he would have normally done had he not been saddled
                                        > > with the three Dementors in human skin.
                                        > >
                                        > > .
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                        > It might be just me, but that is exactly the sort of realism I love
                                        to see
                                        > in a story. He got a Coke, sounds a lot more realistic than he got a
                                        fizzy
                                        > drink. (Brit speak for what us heathens call soda pop, among other
                                        things)
                                        > I've seen a lot of stories where Harry went to see his first ever film
                                        > (Brit-speak) and saw, for instance, Independence Day, and they got
                                        Pepsis
                                        > from the snack stand (or whatever the Brits call it). And that is
                                        another
                                        > thing I like to see in a story is the author having a Brit-picker
                                        who can
                                        > help them with the correct terminology for things like the cinema
                                        instead of
                                        > theater, and such.
                                        >
                                        > I also like to see the person using as many British idioms as they can
                                        > dredge up. I've made myself a list of some word Brits use which we
                                        don't,
                                        > and try to insert them where appropriate. I'm not nearly as good at
                                        it as a
                                        > native, but I haven't had anyone complain so far. Well, there was
                                        the one
                                        > guy complaining about using arse instead of ass, but I calmly
                                        explained to
                                        > him that is what they good people of Britain use instead.
                                        >
                                        > --
                                        > Vern, aka Herman Tumbleweed
                                        >
                                        > Once you can honestly say, "I don't know", then it becomes possible
                                        to get
                                        > at the truth. - Robert Heinlein
                                        >


                                      • third_realm_guardian
                                        Hidy hidy, I fully agree, Vern. Realism within fanfiction is something that my friends and I have debated on for almost a week, once. Often, a reviewer will
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Feb 2, 2009
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                                          Hidy hidy,

                                          I fully agree, Vern. "Realism" within fanfiction is something that my
                                          friends and I have debated on for almost a week, once.

                                          Often, a reviewer will say something along the lines of, "You can't do
                                          that! It isn't realistic for~... yadda."

                                          Like you mentioned, there is a thing about "realism" and fiction that
                                          a lot of people don't seem to understand. Well, reviewers at least.

                                          Realistic should relate directly to the world in which the event is
                                          taking place. Anything in the magical world is not "realistic" in our
                                          reality. But in the Harry Potter universe, what is truly unrealistic?

                                          That is how I hope to write in my stories. Stay within the bounds of
                                          the reality I'm writing in and, if there is anything that I either
                                          limit or do that has either not been done before or done before, then
                                          I make sure to explain my version or variation of it, or explain my
                                          idea well enough to let people understand why it is works.

                                          This is one of my reasons for not being fond of crossover fics (with
                                          people and places, for the most part.) There have been a few
                                          exceptions, but not many. There's a Naruto/Halo crossover from
                                          Cybergades that he hasn't posted yet that he's shown me a few chapters
                                          for and I was rather impressed with. Beyond that, Naruto and Bleach.
                                          That's about it.

                                          I can forgive and actually appreciate being able to use
                                          techniques/spells/jutsu for those crossovers, though. I've got five
                                          chapters of a challenge I wrote for Witowsmp's "Dumbledore Answers
                                          Harry" challenge where Harry found some Naruto manga/comic books of
                                          "Naruto" and decided to use it for inspiration. That type of thing
                                          interests me, but using "chakara" instead of magic, while I can go
                                          with it, is something that I don't like because the rules are
                                          different. Chakara/life energy is manipulation of the energy of what
                                          exists, magic is manipulating the reality for things to happen. Or at
                                          least, in the most basic of terms. I like those things to remain
                                          separate.

                                          As for technological timeline, I can't remember what year movies came
                                          out from a year ago, I'm not going to be able to remember something
                                          from a decade and a half ago. Well, three decades now, from his first
                                          year. That's why I just say I'll advance the time line ^_^ I have no
                                          intentions of using movie titles, though. It seems superfluous to me.
                                          At least with my plots. The only one I can think of that I already
                                          know I would do is "Robin Hood", with Kevin Costner. Just so I can
                                          have Harry tell Malfoy (either) that he'll rip their hearts out with a
                                          spoon....

                                          Adieu

                                          Kevin
                                          Paladeus
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