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Re: [TheCostumersManifesto] Belle's Gold Gown

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  • K Murphy
    Hi Jennifer: You could create almost the same shape with petticoats (I d add a bum pad). However, petticoats might be heavier than the cage (depending on the
    Message 1 of 5 , Jun 10 10:00 PM
      Hi Jennifer:

      You could create almost the same shape with petticoats (I'd add a bum pad). However, petticoats might be heavier than the cage (depending on the fabrics you choose), and possibly more difficult for the actress to lift. Properly made, cage crinolines are extremely flexible and lightweight. The "ouch" is the labor involved with making one properly! On the plus side for petticoats -- easier and much faster to build (especially if you've got a good ruffler.) Probably cheaper, too. You might even start with a commercially made wedding petticoat and add to/adjust it. (check out mygowns.com, petticoatstore.com, etc. esp for the super bouffant shape -- honestly, these things ATTACK when you take them out of the bag....)

      Don't know of any patterns, but if you do create one, I would use a single, slightly flared CF panel, two widely flared SF panels over the hips, and two extremely wide CB panels gathered into the back waist. Cut the CB panels longer to run over the top of the bum pad before they drop. I would use power net to create overlapping layers of ruffles on a very stiff but lightweight base fabric (none of this is "period," of course) and then add a second layer of lining fabric over that so the skirt of the dress doesn't hitch up on the ruffles. (You could always use taffeta ruffles at the bottom).

      I've had good results with this method, which is quick but not quite as expansive in the back.

      Just my two cents worth.

      Good luck whatever you try!

      Kate

      senator_leia_solo <jennidryden@...> wrote:
      Thanks everyone for the links for feathers. My co-designer appreciates
      it much since Babette is her design.

      Ok, so another question. We are going in a bit of a different
      direction with Belle's gold dress. I'm thinking of using the following
      patterns as the base for her skirt and bodice:
      http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/247.html
      http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/442.html

      and I'd like to have the shape that the elliptical cage crinoline
      gives - flatter in front and big and poufy in back:
      http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/103.html

      however, I'm never made a cage crinoline before and while it does
      engineer the shape, I'm not sure how flexible, bendable and heavy it
      may be. Can I get the same shape with petticoats instead? If so,
      anyone point me to good patterns? We're trying to get Belle's dress
      done in time for a June 30 photoshoot?

      Advice and suggestions welcome. Thanks!
      Jennifer





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    • Jennifer Dryden
      Hello Kate, Thank you for your detailed reply. Your answers have confirmed what I surmised - that the cage crinoline would be lighter weight than a mass of
      Message 2 of 5 , Jun 11 8:05 AM
        Hello Kate,
        Thank you for your detailed reply. Your answers have confirmed what I
        surmised - that the cage crinoline would be lighter weight than a mass of
        petticoats under the dress. Not to mention I'd have stricter control over
        the shape. I will be building the dress in my home studio. We have no shop
        and no cutter/patternmaker or stitchers to speak of. This is local youth
        summer stage and the 'shop' consists of a side lobby in the performing arts
        facility at the high school, and five interns, most of whom barely sew a
        stitch. We do have volunteer sewers (parents) but they will be given easy
        things like breeches, pants, vests, aprons and skirts.

        I am using either a charmeuse satin and then an embellished netting overlay
        for the dress, in gold of course. I may choose to use a matte satin once I
        see how the netting looks on top of each option. I think those should be
        light enough. I have $500 to build Belle's gold gown so a cage crinoline is
        not an expensive option for us. Plus I'd like the experience of building
        one - one more thing to add to my resume.

        Thanks again,
        Jennifer

        -----Original Message-----
        From: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
        [mailto:TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of K Murphy
        Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 1:01 AM
        To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [TheCostumersManifesto] Belle's Gold Gown


        Hi Jennifer:

        You could create almost the same shape with petticoats (I'd add a bum
        pad). However, petticoats might be heavier than the cage (depending on the
        fabrics you choose), and possibly more difficult for the actress to lift.
        Properly made, cage crinolines are extremely flexible and lightweight. The
        "ouch" is the labor involved with making one properly! On the plus side for
        petticoats -- easier and much faster to build (especially if you've got a
        good ruffler.) Probably cheaper, too. You might even start with a
        commercially made wedding petticoat and add to/adjust it. (check out
        mygowns.com, petticoatstore.com, etc. esp for the super bouffant shape --
        honestly, these things ATTACK when you take them out of the bag....)

        Don't know of any patterns, but if you do create one, I would use a
        single, slightly flared CF panel, two widely flared SF panels over the hips,
        and two extremely wide CB panels gathered into the back waist. Cut the CB
        panels longer to run over the top of the bum pad before they drop. I would
        use power net to create overlapping layers of ruffles on a very stiff but
        lightweight base fabric (none of this is "period," of course) and then add a
        second layer of lining fabric over that so the skirt of the dress doesn't
        hitch up on the ruffles. (You could always use taffeta ruffles at the
        bottom).

        I've had good results with this method, which is quick but not quite as
        expansive in the back.

        Just my two cents worth.

        Good luck whatever you try!

        Kate

        senator_leia_solo <jennidryden@...> wrote:
        Thanks everyone for the links for feathers. My co-designer appreciates
        it much since Babette is her design.

        Ok, so another question. We are going in a bit of a different
        direction with Belle's gold dress. I'm thinking of using the following
        patterns as the base for her skirt and bodice:
        http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/247.html
        http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/442.html

        and I'd like to have the shape that the elliptical cage crinoline
        gives - flatter in front and big and poufy in back:
        http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/103.html

        however, I'm never made a cage crinoline before and while it does
        engineer the shape, I'm not sure how flexible, bendable and heavy it
        may be. Can I get the same shape with petticoats instead? If so,
        anyone point me to good patterns? We're trying to get Belle's dress
        done in time for a June 30 photoshoot?

        Advice and suggestions welcome. Thanks!
        Jennifer

        __________________________________________________
        Do You Yahoo!?
        Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
        http://mail.yahoo.com

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • thejoshuagoldberg
        Hey Jennifer, I just recently went on a road trip to Disney World and got some nice pictures of Belle during her dance in the Cinderellabration show. I have
        Message 3 of 5 , Jun 11 9:06 AM
          Hey Jennifer, I just recently went on a road trip to Disney World
          and got some nice pictures of Belle during her dance in the
          Cinderellabration show. I have one picture that indeed shows that
          she does have a cage crinolin under her dress and she does seem to
          be able to dance feely in it and it didn't seem to be very heavey.
          Feel free to e-mail me directly if you would like me to send you the
          pictures I have.

          Zayaz

          P.S. I actually also have a short video of if the performance if you
          would like it. I was getting pushed around by this mean little lady
          in front of me so it is very shaky but would be happy to pass it
          along.


          --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "senator_leia_solo"
          <jennidryden@...> wrote:
          >
          > Thanks everyone for the links for feathers. My co-designer
          appreciates
          > it much since Babette is her design.
          >
          > Ok, so another question. We are going in a bit of a different
          > direction with Belle's gold dress. I'm thinking of using the
          following
          > patterns as the base for her skirt and bodice:
          > http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/247.html
          > http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/442.html
          >
          > and I'd like to have the shape that the elliptical cage crinoline
          > gives - flatter in front and big and poufy in back:
          > http://trulyvictorian.netfirms.com/catalog/103.html
          >
          > however, I'm never made a cage crinoline before and while it does
          > engineer the shape, I'm not sure how flexible, bendable and heavy
          it
          > may be. Can I get the same shape with petticoats instead? If so,
          > anyone point me to good patterns? We're trying to get Belle's
          dress
          > done in time for a June 30 photoshoot?
          >
          > Advice and suggestions welcome. Thanks!
          > Jennifer
          >
        • serenpoly
          I haven t built the Truly Victorian cage crinoline, but I have heard good things about it, and every TV pattern I ve ever used has been excellent and easy.
          Message 4 of 5 , Jun 12 2:05 PM
            I haven't built the Truly Victorian cage crinoline, but I have heard
            good things about it, and every TV pattern I've ever used has been
            excellent and easy. Heather will gladly answer questions (email or
            even phone) if you need help, although she'll away be at Costume
            College in LA the last part of July...

            Do follow the fitting instructions that come with TV patterns. They
            are period, and (if your theater's like ours) fantasy shows don't
            necessarily have to be accurate. But the important thing is that
            they work, and they do. I've used TV patterns for several things
            (Mrs. Darling in Peter Pan, sweet young belles in Huck Finn, etc.),
            and never had a lick of trouble with anything. In fact, I have a
            couple of TV patterns that I'm saving for my own wedding outfit
            (since we're talking about fantasy...).

            Alternatively, Simplicity has a hoop petticoat pattern that came out
            slightly elliptical when I made it. And I've often thought their
            ballgown pattern would make a great Belle costume if done in
            yellow/gold. (It's shown in black and white with red trim in the
            picture.) I made it for Tom Sawyer's aunt - the Southern one, not
            Aunt Polly - for Huck Finn, in yellow stripe upholstery tapestry and
            just using commercial gathered lace and bias tape for the trim and
            leaving off the flowers, and it went together very simply and
            straightforwardly once I figured out which way the pleats on the
            bertha go (opening upward, IYWTK). I put some pictures in the Photos
            section of the group site, under the name Yellow_Simplicity_Ballgown.

            HTH. Good luck.

            -- Emc^2
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