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Lucia gown design advice

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  • The Christiansens
    I am making a St. Lucia gown for a 9 YO girl to wear. I know what I want it to look like, but could not find a Big Three pattern that fit the image in my
    Message 1 of 14 , Dec 7, 2005
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      I am making a St. Lucia gown for a 9 YO girl to wear. I know what I
      want it to look like, but could not find a Big Three pattern that fit
      the image in my head, so I am stepping outside my comfort zone and
      going from scratch.

      I want it to be somewhat like a ren high-neck shirt. I am using the
      following sites to help me out:

      http://www.reddawn.net/costume/shirt.htm

      http://www.vertetsable.com/demos_shirt.htm

      Of course, these make a front-opening shirt. I am looking at making
      this with the opening slit in the back, and closing it with hooks and
      eyes. I would also like to skip gussets if at all possible. I have
      the sleeves trimmed, and the collar made, but have not yet cut the neck
      opening in the body piece. The sleeves will be gathered at the top of
      the shoulder.

      Any advice on gathering into the collar, since this is backwards to the
      usual way? Does it even make a difference? Are the sleeve gussets
      necessary for a slim girl, wearing it simply to serve cookies?

      Denise
    • Judith Cataldo
      ... I ve made many shirts of this style and also adapted the pattern for other designs. I don t think it matters how you gather the collar in. Sleeve
      Message 2 of 14 , Dec 7, 2005
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        > Any advice on gathering into the collar, since this is backwards to the
        > usual way? Does it even make a difference? Are the sleeve gussets
        > necessary for a slim girl, wearing it simply to serve cookies?
        >

        I've made many shirts of this style and also adapted the pattern for other
        designs. I don't think it matters how you gather the collar in. Sleeve
        gussets aren't necessary for short term wear or for children. If you use
        this pattern again you don't want to fuss with the gussets you can make that
        end of the sleeve curve out and set it into the body a little lower. This
        will accomplish much the same thing as the gusset.

        Judy
        judycat@...
        St Distaff Day in Westford 1/8/06
        http://home.earthlink.net/~judycat/index.html
        Colonial Spinning Bee 5/21/06
        A mingling of modern and historic spinning
        http://home.earthlink.net/~judycat/id2.html
      • tjchatham
        ... I ... fit ... the ... making ... and ... have ... neck ... top of ... to the ... gussets ... The usual St. Lucy costume is just any white dress or blouse
        Message 3 of 14 , Dec 8, 2005
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          --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, The Christiansens
          <rtc@a...> wrote:
          >
          > I am making a St. Lucia gown for a 9 YO girl to wear. I know what
          I
          > want it to look like, but could not find a Big Three pattern that
          fit
          > the image in my head, so I am stepping outside my comfort zone and
          > going from scratch.
          >
          > I want it to be somewhat like a ren high-neck shirt. I am using
          the
          > following sites to help me out:
          >
          > http://www.reddawn.net/costume/shirt.htm
          >
          > http://www.vertetsable.com/demos_shirt.htm
          >
          > Of course, these make a front-opening shirt. I am looking at
          making
          > this with the opening slit in the back, and closing it with hooks
          and
          > eyes. I would also like to skip gussets if at all possible. I
          have
          > the sleeves trimmed, and the collar made, but have not yet cut the
          neck
          > opening in the body piece. The sleeves will be gathered at the
          top of
          > the shoulder.
          >
          > Any advice on gathering into the collar, since this is backwards
          to the
          > usual way? Does it even make a difference? Are the sleeve
          gussets
          > necessary for a slim girl, wearing it simply to serve cookies?
          >
          > Denise
          >

          The usual St. Lucy costume is just any white dress or blouse and
          skirt of white wrapped with a bright red sash and worn with
          a "crown" of greenery (lingonberry twigs) with candles (today it's
          battery operated ones!). So it depends how "authentic" you want to
          get. I grew up surrounded by Scandinavians who celebrated this feast
          every year. Everyone... Swedes or Norwegians, etc. does it up a bit
          differently, but all wear white and have the head wreath of candles
          and pass out buns and sweets.

          Of course the "real" St. Lucy was a young Greek Christian girl
          living in Syracuse, Sicily in the late 3rd and early 4th Century, so
          a simple white tunic of some kind would be appropriate.

          Here are some websites that might help.
          http://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=75
          St. Lucy in art: http://www.catholic-forum.com/saints/stl01002.htm
          Swedish customs: http://www.americanswedishinst.org/special.htm
          scroll down about 1/4 of the way.
          or this one... it has the "crown" for sale.
          http://www.hemslojd.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?
          page=HEM/CTGY/xmas_lucia

          Or: http://www.eurochristmas.com/geninfo/luciaday.htm

          Of course, St. Lucy's Day is Dec. 13th, so you don't have much time
          to think about it!
          Tess
        • Anne Redish
          I am looking for inspiration or advice while I am comtemplating my seasonal (August) overhaul / cleanup of our storage and costume shop. We have too much
          Message 4 of 14 , Jul 6 9:31 AM
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            I am looking for inspiration or advice while I am comtemplating my
            seasonal (August) overhaul / cleanup of our storage and costume shop.
            We have too much stuff. Yes, just sort it out! I know! Easier
            said than done! Despite a diverse collection and 15 years in the
            same shop, it seems I never have in stock what we need, yet we have 2
            quite full spaces. I wish I could predict better what to keep and
            what to trash/donate. I am considering boxing more "sets" of stuff.
            And of course eliminating the stuff that never seems to get repaired,
            fits nobody, is stained etc!
            Certainly reply OFF GROUP if you have any suggestions, to spare the others!



            Anne Redish
            Department of Drama,
            Queen's University,
            Kingston, Ontario
            613-533-6000 x75359
            483-3245 cell
            ar11@...
          • Alexadbw@aol.com
            In a message dated 7/6/2007 9:49:52 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, ar11@queensu.ca writes: Certainly reply OFF GROUP if you have any suggestions, to spare the
            Message 5 of 14 , Jul 6 11:15 AM
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              In a message dated 7/6/2007 9:49:52 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
              ar11@... writes:

              Certainly reply OFF GROUP if you have any suggestions, to spare the others!




              NO! NO! It seems that this subject comes up with regularity! You never know
              when one suggestion will be just what someone needs! Those of us who deal
              with smaller groups probably need more help/suggestions that those whose
              resources are not so meager....and there seem to be plenty of us on this list! LOL

              Alexa



              ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Hope Wright
              Well, my only experience in storage isn t how you want to handle it. I spent weeks and too many hours just getting things hung up and semi- organized at one
              Message 6 of 14 , Jul 6 1:26 PM
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                Well, my only experience in storage isn't how you want to handle it.
                I spent weeks and too many hours just getting things hung up and semi-
                organized at one site, the biggest problem I faced was that too many
                others had access. Unless you can restrict access, I eventually
                decided it was a lost cause to stay organized, but of course getting
                rid of stuff that isn't usable under any circumstances did help. So
                my main suggestion is that you figure out a way to restrict access a
                bit, not that you want to prevent others from using the costumes but
                just to keep people from pawing through the storage area and messing
                up your system. If you can't do that, don't worry too much about a
                system as you won't even finish before it gets messed up again :-(

                Then, everything was resolved in my case but not in a good way when
                the entire storage area was flooded and they didn't get it pumped out
                quickly so everything molded. Filled up several dumpsters.
              • Susan Cassidy
                How awful to go through all that effort and lose everything to mold! _____ From: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                Message 7 of 14 , Jul 6 3:23 PM
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                  How awful to go through all that effort and lose everything to mold!



                  _____

                  From: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Hope Wright
                  Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 4:26 PM
                  To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Re: Storage



                  Well, my only experience in storage isn't how you want to handle it.
                  I spent weeks and too many hours just getting things hung up and semi-
                  organized at one site, the biggest problem I faced was that too many
                  others had access. Unless you can restrict access, I eventually
                  decided it was a lost cause to stay organized, but of course getting
                  rid of stuff that isn't usable under any circumstances did help. So
                  my main suggestion is that you figure out a way to restrict access a
                  bit, not that you want to prevent others from using the costumes but
                  just to keep people from pawing through the storage area and messing
                  up your system. If you can't do that, don't worry too much about a
                  system as you won't even finish before it gets messed up again :-(

                  Then, everything was resolved in my case but not in a good way when
                  the entire storage area was flooded and they didn't get it pumped out
                  quickly so everything molded. Filled up several dumpsters.





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Curtis
                  ... Heh...there are so many things I would like to do with our storage area. Unfortunately, it s in an insulated part of the building, and the two times of
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jul 7 8:49 AM
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                    --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Anne Redish <ar11@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > I am looking for inspiration or advice while I am comtemplating my
                    > seasonal (August) overhaul / cleanup of our storage and costume shop.
                    > We have too much stuff. Yes, just sort it out! I know! Easier
                    > said than done!

                    Heh...there are so many things I would like to do with our storage
                    area. Unfortunately, it's in an insulated part of the building, and
                    the two times of year when the temperature in there isn't either
                    broiling hot or meat-storage-locker cold are when I'm in the middle of
                    dress rehearsals for either our summer shows or Halloween shows.

                    What I have done thus far--

                    I broke things up into categories. I've got a section for
                    period-specific costumes (mostly Old West, some 20's, 40's, 50's, and
                    60's); specific characters (Prince, Madonna, Shania Twain, Janet
                    Jackson (pre-'wardrobe malfunction', of course), etc etc; multiple
                    matching sets of outfits for specific shows (we've had a few small
                    jazz bands over the years); mens formal wear; women's dresses (by
                    type--formal sleeveless, with short sleeves, with long sleeves,
                    less-formal dresses); blouses (sorted with the same basic system);
                    suits and blazers; uniforms; vests; sweaters and sweatshirts;
                    'clubwear'; so on and so forth.

                    Shoes that we use a lot of are stored in plastic tubs (mens and womens
                    character shoes, etc), while others that are more specific are kept in
                    boxes with labels indicating which show they were in, who wore them,
                    and what size they are.

                    Wigs and most hats are in a separate room. This area is still under
                    revision. Wigs are left styled, stored on wig-heads on the shelf.
                    Hats are sorted by style (bowlers, tophats, fedoras, etc).

                    Ties and suspenders are on a rack, similar to the displays they use
                    for posters in the stores (I got sick of digging through boxes to find
                    the tie I wanted, and made something where I could look and see
                    exactly what tie I wanted)...sorted by style, then color/pattern.

                    Most accessories are sorted in boxes--dance trunks, bloomers, military
                    miscellaneous, etc etc.

                    Jewelry is sorted in a small closet off one of the storage rooms. The
                    back of the door has a cloth panel on it, and a few lengths of hanger
                    wire stretched across the door, so that earrings and brooches can be
                    displayed...makes it much easier for our designers to glance and see
                    if we've got something that will work for them or if we have to go
                    shopping again. Matched jewelry sets, elaborate necklaces, etc are
                    kept in labelled boxes. Casual stuff, like plastic beaded necklaces
                    and the like, are in plastic boxes, labelled by general category.

                    What I'm still planning to do--

                    Adapt the tie-rack idea to display belts...I'll probably use a hanger
                    rack for this, but will hang up belts in matching groups, within
                    larger categories (black dress belts, western-style belts, brown
                    belts, metal belts, etc)

                    Sometime when I'm feeling REALLY ambitious (ha ha ha!!!!), sort stuff
                    that's already broken into categories by size and label it, so I don't
                    have to spend half an hour looking for a pair of 34w tux pants...

                    Sort through all of our dance sneakers and get rid of the ones that
                    are beyond hope, or in desperate need of total reconstructive surgery
                    (change of directors meant a change in the policy regarding how often
                    we'd try and recycle shoes for shows...since we're getting new
                    sneakers on a fairly regular basis, now, there's no urgency to hang
                    onto the old ones).

                    Build more stands for the wig heads so I can fit more of them on the
                    shelves effectively. I've tried just using the heads, without a
                    stand...the wigs make them way too top-heavy (not that they were
                    particularly stable in the first place).

                    --------------------------------------------------------------------

                    Every time I walk into the storage area, I think of another "I should
                    do this sometime" project, but these are the ones that have stuck. I
                    agree with the comment already made about needing to restrict
                    access...I've had several items disappear out of stock, and while I'm
                    relatively certain I know who took them, I've got no evidence of it,
                    so I can't really start making accusations (especially when a couple
                    of the cases in question happen to be former directors). I've also
                    got the aggravating circumstance of having designers come in, pull
                    50-75 items out of stock, and then decide they aren't going to use
                    them at all, which leaves me having to sort them all out (when that
                    happens for three shows at the same time, it leaves a lot of chaos
                    behind)--and that's just when they ask me to pull stuff. Sometimes
                    they'll come in and pull stuff without telling me (those of you who
                    design, but do not manage the wardrobe section for whom you're
                    designing, PLEASE don't ever do that...I realize it's a pain to
                    coordinate schedules, but you're putting your wardrobe manager through
                    hell every time something like that happens, especially when they walk
                    into a storage area and see a lot of stuff has been disturbed but have
                    no idea who did it--instant anxiety attack!!!)

                    My system would not be effective for some people...before I started
                    here, they tried storing stuff by the show it had been used in
                    before...which caused problems whenever they pulled something from a
                    past show to use in a new one. The producer finally reluctantly
                    agreed to me re-organizing storage...but didn't actually finally
                    accept the new system until she asked me to pull some dresses from a
                    show I'd never seen...I asked her to describe what the dresses looked
                    like, and returned from storage in just a couple of minutes with
                    exactly what she was asking about.

                    We also keep a photo archive of the costumes we've used in each
                    show...which is another thing I need to update (I need to go through
                    and note, in the archive, which items we still have in stock, which
                    items have been altered, and for which show, so they can see the
                    current state of it), and which items we've given away/sold/which ones
                    grew legs and wandered off...also, which items are so severely
                    distressed that they wouldn't make it through another season (because
                    we're getting to the point where we've got a few of those!) I hang
                    onto some of the most distinctive of those items to use as a guide if
                    we end up needing to build something similar. I HIGHLY recommend
                    this, it makes it much easier for you and the designers to sit down at
                    a book and look through it, instead of trying to guess at what this
                    item on the hanger will actually look like on a body (it also give
                    directors a place to skim through for inspiration when they can't
                    figure out how to describe what they want to a designer). Keep these
                    under careful supervision, as well...we lost several of ours (I
                    suspect they were loaned out to designers and never made it back to
                    us). I'd eventually like to get pictures of everything in stock,
                    sorted into a database, but that's a project for an off-season when
                    I'm not freelancing anything else (including projects for other
                    departments on the park!)

                    Probably a lot more than anyone wanted to hear...but I figure it will
                    give ideas to some, and if anyone's got suggestions for improvement,
                    I'm all ears (doesn't necessarily mean they'll get implemented right
                    away, but I don't expect to be here forever, and I'd like to leave
                    behind an area that's as easy as possible for my replacement to find
                    stuff).
                  • bonnie carter
                    The mention of ties made me want to share a quick idea for ties. We keep ours on those wooden suit hangers that have a wood dowel/metal wire section for the
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jul 8 7:05 AM
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                      The mention of ties made me want to share a quick idea
                      for ties. We keep ours on those wooden suit hangers
                      that have a wood dowel/metal wire section for the
                      pants. Each hanger is for a color and width (blue
                      narrow, blue med, blue wide, etc) and then we hang
                      them over the pants bar and clip them down. Then I
                      wrote with a marker on the edge that faces out what
                      the category was. They hang on the racks with all the
                      other costumes, take up very little room. And when
                      you need a tie, you can grab the whole hanger and hold
                      it up to the suit you're matching to find one you
                      like. The lengths are obvious too, because they're
                      all hung hanging.



                      ____________________________________________________________________________________
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                    • Anne Redish
                      CURTIS: (and all) Thanks for your comments so far. The long winded the better as far as I am concerned since all ideas are food for thought! Keep them coming!
                      Message 10 of 14 , Jul 8 9:00 AM
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                        CURTIS: (and all)
                        Thanks for your comments so far. The long winded the better as far as
                        I am concerned since all ideas are food for thought! Keep them coming!

                        The access one I am REALLY going to work on! Tough in our situation
                        though. It will take a re-work of our 'mission' of "access to all"
                        which has really encouraged students to work costuming concepts into
                        their dramatic scene work! It makes them better at thinking through
                        the big picture and later better designers / directors / costumers.

                        I will try to come up with a "Access to all for this area only! "
                        Then there will be messy area not a messy whole! Formerly we had a
                        room that was exactly that -- a dress up 'box' for scene work.
                        Unfortunately that room had to be reallocated. I will think about
                        assigning a small dressing room again for that purpose when not in
                        use by a show. The racks could go elsewhere when we are using all the
                        dressing rooms. Keep it locked, for acess via one of our work study
                        students for certain hours. Mainly for use by the hoards of 100 and
                        200 students? ??? Other / Special items possibly available by request
                        ahead of time? 300 and 400's can use main storage stock ? A
                        priviledge of seniority? That would pull some stock out of the main
                        storage room too! Hmmmmm????? We'd have to label all these
                        reassigned items so we knew where to put them back !!! ???
                        Has anybody else done this?


                        Anne Redish
                        Department of Drama,
                        Queen's University,
                        Kingston, Ontario
                        613-533-6000 x75359
                        483-3245 cell
                        ar11@...
                      • ~lisa.s
                        Anne, Access doesn t necessarily mean to all, all the time . Think about your storage as a costume rental business--because that s what it is. Do you track
                        Message 11 of 14 , Jul 8 11:42 AM
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                          Anne,

                          "Access" doesn't necessarily mean "to all, all the time". Think about
                          your storage as a costume rental business--because that's what it is. Do
                          you track who's got what piece(s), when they were taken, when they will
                          returned? What if the piece(s) are/were NOT returned? What are the
                          repercussions?

                          Your University has a library, doesn't it? Do they allow students total
                          access, at all times? Probably not. What happens when books are over
                          due, not returned? Books have a value, so do costumes. The policies
                          could be very similar.

                          You should also have an area that is totally off limits where
                          irreplaceable and/or very expensive to replace things are kept,
                          accessible only under cretin circumstances.

                          Tightening up your policy is going to mean more work--someone
                          responsible will have to open storage and approve what the student(s)
                          want to borrow; but the alternative is a messed up space, or worse, you
                          going down to pull a specific item only to find it missing or destroyed,
                          are worse.

                          Good luck!

                          ~lisa.s, who's been there, and just finished doing that: turning out
                          costume storage so it's spick, span and organized...somewhat...

                          ---

                          > I will try to come up with a "Access to all for this area only! "
                          > Then there will be messy area not a messy whole! Formerly we had a
                          > room that was exactly that -- a dress up 'box' for scene work.
                          > Unfortunately that room had to be reallocated. I will think about
                          > assigning a small dressing room again for that purpose when not in
                          > use by a show. The racks could go elsewhere when we are using all the
                          > dressing rooms. Keep it locked, for acess via one of our work study
                          > students for certain hours. Mainly for use by the hoards of 100 and
                          > 200 students? ??? Other / Special items possibly available by request
                          > ahead of time? 300 and 400's can use main storage stock ? A
                          > priviledge of seniority? That would pull some stock out of the main
                          > storage room too! Hmmmmm????? We'd have to label all these
                          > reassigned items so we knew where to put them back !!! ???
                          > Has anybody else done this?


                          --
                          ~lisa.s * llsturts@...
                        • Loretta Armstrong
                          On the flip side of this, or to make this work....... When I cleaned out my costume storage, I put aside a bunch of generic costumes, retro threads, grandma
                          Message 12 of 14 , Jul 8 2:20 PM
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                            On the flip side of this, or to make this work.......
                            When I cleaned out my costume storage, I put aside a bunch of 'generic' costumes, retro threads, grandma clothes, coats, hats, etc, and GAVE them to the drama department. They were theirs, they didn't have to come check them out, and almost more importantly, they stopped bothering me for clothes for class. It freed up some time. Frequently when donations came in, I would briefly go through them and the rest would go to the actors.
                            Loretta

                            "~lisa.s" <llsturts@...> wrote: Anne,

                            "Access" doesn't necessarily mean "to all, all the time". Think about
                            your storage as a costume rental business--because that's what it is. Do
                            you track who's got what piece(s), when they were taken, when they will
                            returned? What if the piece(s) are/were NOT returned? What are the
                            repercussions?








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