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Re: Shoe coloring...

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  • Deborah Borlase
    Do NOT use Rit dye. The results will be disappointing at best. I suggest you contact Dharma Trading & speak to someone there. They have fabulous dyes, and
    Message 1 of 25 , Feb 4, 2009
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      Do NOT use Rit dye. The results will be disappointing at best. I
      suggest you contact Dharma Trading & speak to someone there. They
      have fabulous dyes, and are experts in the field. I have used
      Porcion dyes on silk fabric and been very happy with the result, but
      you're using it on a completed product, so I think you need to
      discuss it with them.

      Their customer service number is 800-542-5227

      Good luck.

      Deborah



      --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Michelle Davidson
      <adastra33@...> wrote:
      >
      > A friend of mine who works for the San Jose Ballet tells me they
      use Evangeline Slipper Dye.  So far I have been able to find very few
      sources on the web, but maybe you will have better luck.  I will
      contact my friend again and see if I can find out where they purchase
      it.
      > Michelle
      > PS She also told me to mix Rit dye with rubbing alcohol until you
      get a thin liquid and then paint it on the shoes using a dauber.
      >
      >
      >
      > --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Curtis <gckidd@...> wrote:
      > From: Curtis <gckidd@...>
      > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Shoe coloring...
      > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
      > Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 12:30 PM
      >
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      > Any recommendations on the best technique to dye pointe
      shoes? I need
      >
      > to make a pair deep red for a show in a week and a half. The one
      show
      >
      > I've worked in the past where we did this, it was done with spray
      >
      > paint, but I was less that thrilled with the results (the number of
      >
      > coats of paint required to build up an even color also built up and
      >
      > obliterated the satiny finish of the shoes...)
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      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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    • Mary
      Regardless of what technique you use, make sure that you don t soak the fabric of the shoe. Most are made from layers of fabric & glue and you can weaken or
      Message 2 of 25 , Feb 5, 2009
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        Regardless of what technique you use, make sure that you don't soak
        the fabric of the shoe. Most are made from layers of fabric & glue
        and you can weaken or break the shoe by getting the glue too wet.

        ~mary
        "Ballet Mom"

        --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "geneiak"
        <retshopbuyer@...> wrote:
        >
        > i have used the rit and alcohol in spray bottles on satin shoes and
        > gotten good results-
        > i strained it after mixing-
        >
        > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Michelle Davidson
        > <adastra33@> wrote:
        > >
        > > A friend of mine who works for the San Jose Ballet tells me they
        > use Evangeline Slipper Dye.  So far I have been able to find very few
        > sources on the web, but maybe you will have better luck.  I will
        > contact my friend again and see if I can find out where they purchase
        > it.
        > > Michelle
        > > PS She also told me to mix Rit dye with rubbing alcohol until you
        > get a thin liquid and then paint it on the shoes using a dauber.
        > > --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Curtis <gckidd@> wrote:
        > > From: Curtis <gckidd@>
        > > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Shoe coloring...
        > > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
        > > Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 12:30 PM
        > >
        > > Any recommendations on the best technique to dye pointe
        > shoes? I need
      • Wendy Starn
        My daughter used Pebeo Setacolor paints to turn a pair of pointe shoes black.  They are waterbase, transparent, and do not affect the hand of fabric if not
        Message 3 of 25 , Feb 5, 2009
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          My daughter used Pebeo Setacolor paints to turn a pair of pointe shoes black.  They are waterbase, transparent, and do not affect the hand of fabric if not too thick. It did not stiffen or affect the fit of the shoes.  Use a small sponge to apply.  I use them all the time to paint quilt fabric, although I like to paint on wet fabric.  I got mine at Michael's, one bottle at a time with cupons.
           
          I was lucky enough to attend a performance by Dance Theatre of Harlem tonight.  They custom color all their shoes to each dancer's skin tone with makeup, and custom dye the tights also.  When leg and shoe are the same color, you get a really long line.

          Wendy L Starn
          Alexandria, Louisiana
          http://public.fotki.com/wlstarn/
          http://splendiferousfiber.blogspot.com/
          SplendiferousFiber.etsy.com




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • wendylstarn
          One more suggestion: try out your method on an old pair first to see if you like the result. Shouldn t be hard to find a worn out pair of pointe shoes....
          Message 4 of 25 , Feb 6, 2009
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            One more suggestion: try out your method on an old pair first to see
            if you like the result. Shouldn't be hard to find a worn out pair of
            pointe shoes.... :-)


            --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "Mary" <hanstar88@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Regardless of what technique you use, make sure that you don't soak
            > the fabric of the shoe. Most are made from layers of fabric & glue
            > and you can weaken or break the shoe by getting the glue too wet.
            >
            > ~mary
            > "Ballet Mom"
            >
            > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "geneiak"
            > <retshopbuyer@> wrote:
            > >
            > > i have used the rit and alcohol in spray bottles on satin shoes
            and
            > > gotten good results-
            > > i strained it after mixing-
            > >
            > > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Michelle Davidson
            > > <adastra33@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > A friend of mine who works for the San Jose Ballet tells me
            they
            > > use Evangeline Slipper Dye.  So far I have been able to find very
            few
            > > sources on the web, but maybe you will have better luck.  I will
            > > contact my friend again and see if I can find out where they
            purchase
            > > it.
            > > > Michelle
            > > > PS She also told me to mix Rit dye with rubbing alcohol until
            you
            > > get a thin liquid and then paint it on the shoes using a dauber.
            > > > --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Curtis <gckidd@> wrote:
            > > > From: Curtis <gckidd@>
            > > > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Shoe coloring...
            > > > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
            > > > Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 12:30 PM
            > > >
            > > > Any recommendations on the best technique to dye
            pointe
            > > shoes? I need
            >
          • caryneska
            Claudia Folts, owner of Tutu.com would be of great help on dancer costuming issues, too, and resources for all things dance. One can join Ballet Talk for
            Message 5 of 25 , Feb 7, 2009
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              Claudia Folts, owner of Tutu.com would be of great help on dancer
              costuming issues, too, and resources for all things dance. One can
              join Ballet Talk for dancers, a wonderful online community, and go
              under "Costume shop". There is great quantities of experienced tips
              there, and Claudia often is online there with helpful tips. Which
              reminds me, I better get going on a Don Q. tutu..
              Caryneska


              --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "wendylstarn"
              <wendylstarn@...> wrote:
              >
              > One more suggestion: try out your method on an old pair first to see
              > if you like the result. Shouldn't be hard to find a worn out pair of
              > pointe shoes.... :-)
              >
              >
              > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "Mary" <hanstar88@>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > Regardless of what technique you use, make sure that you don't soak
              > > the fabric of the shoe. Most are made from layers of fabric & glue
              > > and you can weaken or break the shoe by getting the glue too wet.
              > >
              > > ~mary
              > > "Ballet Mom"
              > >
              > > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, "geneiak"
              > > <retshopbuyer@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > i have used the rit and alcohol in spray bottles on satin shoes
              > and
              > > > gotten good results-
              > > > i strained it after mixing-
              > > >
              > > > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Michelle Davidson
              > > > <adastra33@> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > A friend of mine who works for the San Jose Ballet tells me
              > they
              > > > use Evangeline Slipper Dye.  So far I have been able to find very
              > few
              > > > sources on the web, but maybe you will have better luck.  I will
              > > > contact my friend again and see if I can find out where they
              > purchase
              > > > it.
              > > > > Michelle
              > > > > PS She also told me to mix Rit dye with rubbing alcohol until
              > you
              > > > get a thin liquid and then paint it on the shoes using a dauber.
              > > > > --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Curtis <gckidd@> wrote:
              > > > > From: Curtis <gckidd@>
              > > > > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Shoe coloring...
              > > > > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
              > > > > Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 12:30 PM
              > > > >
              > > > > Any recommendations on the best technique to dye
              > pointe
              > > > shoes? I need
              > >
              >
            • Paula McWhirter-Buck
              hey y all, i m costuming LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS, see... and this director wants the audience to literally get blood on their hands by having someone come up
              Message 6 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                hey y'all,

                i'm costuming LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS, see...
                and this director wants "the audience to literally get blood on their hands" by having someone come up and feed the dentist's body parts to the plant (and he insists they actually leave the stage with stage blood on them).
                now, my concern is getting the "blood" on an audience member's clothes.
                i dont have the budget to clean someone's vintage silk blouse, or good wool suit...or...or...

                i'm talking as fast as i can to talk him out of this little adventure.

                he's sent me some recipes for "washable" stage blood, but, i dont intend to wash some random person's clothes after each performance, nor ask them to.

                how realistic am i in my unwillingness to budge on this?
                how realistic is he to ask me to?

                he's sent me all kinds of "documentation" from stage blood manufacturers about how washable their product is. but, i've been in costuming for a pretty long time, and i've sold all the products he's told me about, and used most of them. and i have yet to see one that i'd be comfortable splashing on an unsuspecting audience member. and i'm very wary of trying a concoction of dish detergent and whatever...
                i'm freaked out, enough about having to get the stuff out of my own costumes every day, between performances....not to mention a rented plant...and how housekeeping reacts to this idea...well....

                i'd love to go to him with a list of "WHAT ARE YOU....CRAZY???" responses from costumers around the globe...or even the state...

                can you help me out?

                brightest of blessings,
                paula mcwhirter-buck
                costume designer/shop supervisor
                mars hill college theatre arts department
                &
                southern appalachian repertory theatre
                mars hill, nc
                828-689-1385


                "THE TIME HAS COME", THE WALRUS SAID,"TO TALK OF MANY THINGS.
                OF SHOES, AND SHIPS AND SEALING WAX, OF CABBAGES AND KINGS.
                AND WHY THE SEA IS BOILING HOT, AND WHETHER PIGS HAVE WINGS."
              • CStilwell
                give them a garbage bag or a raincoat to wear (worked for gallagher) charlie ... From: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                Message 7 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                  give them a garbage bag or a raincoat to wear
                  (worked for gallagher)

                  charlie
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Paula
                  McWhirter-Buck
                  Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 6:25 PM
                  To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] audience getting blood on their hands...



                  hey y'all,

                  i'm costuming LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS, see...
                  and this director wants "the audience to literally get blood on their
                  hands" by having someone come up and feed the dentist's body parts to the
                  plant (and he insists they actually leave the stage with stage blood on
                  them).
                  now, my concern is getting the "blood" on an audience member's clothes.
                  i dont have the budget to clean someone's vintage silk blouse, or good
                  wool suit...or...or...

                  i'm talking as fast as i can to talk him out of this little adventure.

                  he's sent me some recipes for "washable" stage blood, but, i dont intend
                  to wash some random person's clothes after each performance, nor ask them
                  to.

                  how realistic am i in my unwillingness to budge on this?
                  how realistic is he to ask me to?

                  he's sent me all kinds of "documentation" from stage blood manufacturers
                  about how washable their product is. but, i've been in costuming for a
                  pretty long time, and i've sold all the products he's told me about, and
                  used most of them. and i have yet to see one that i'd be comfortable
                  splashing on an unsuspecting audience member. and i'm very wary of trying a
                  concoction of dish detergent and whatever...
                  i'm freaked out, enough about having to get the stuff out of my own
                  costumes every day, between performances....not to mention a rented
                  plant...and how housekeeping reacts to this idea...well....

                  i'd love to go to him with a list of "WHAT ARE YOU....CRAZY???" responses
                  from costumers around the globe...or even the state...

                  can you help me out?

                  brightest of blessings,
                  paula mcwhirter-buck
                  costume designer/shop supervisor
                  mars hill college theatre arts department
                  &
                  southern appalachian repertory theatre
                  mars hill, nc
                  828-689-1385

                  "THE TIME HAS COME", THE WALRUS SAID,"TO TALK OF MANY THINGS.
                  OF SHOES, AND SHIPS AND SEALING WAX, OF CABBAGES AND KINGS.
                  AND WHY THE SEA IS BOILING HOT, AND WHETHER PIGS HAVE WINGS."





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Kate
                  I ll be happy to chime in with the What are you CRAZY?   part of this. The idea of people getting blood stained and them not throwing a fit...since they
                  Message 8 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                    I'll be happy to chime in with the "What are you CRAZY?"  part of this.
                    The idea of people getting "blood" stained and them not throwing a fit...since they won't KNOW if it is going to come out of their clothes.  And thinking that they might have to have it dry cleaned, which they didn't plan on.  AND, knowing people it won't really matter if it isn't a special vintage very expensive designer piece of clothing... I have seen people react badly when they get something unexpected on a Tshirt!

                    I would say you stick to your guns.  The director really need to think through the ramifications, even to the most extreme scenario of having someone walk out really angry because they were traumatized by getting "blood" on them from some dismembered manikin.

                    Kat
                    Massachusetts






















                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Sheryl Barrow
                    I ll second (or third or eightieth) that. I would probably flip out myself. As Kate said, people who go see a show a lot of times dress up - regardless of
                    Message 9 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                      I'll second (or third or eightieth) that. I would probably flip out
                      myself. As Kate said, people who go see a show a lot of times dress up -
                      regardless of whether or not stage blood is "supposed to" wash out, it might
                      not, and/or dry cleaning might set it. I can see people suing over this,
                      not to mention the horrible reviews.

                      And what about little kids? If something on stage is so real that they
                      actually get blood on them - nightmare city. And then the parents will sue
                      for resulting mental trauma.

                      No.. I think you should put your foot down, for both his protection and the
                      studios. And if he insists even after you point out the potential
                      ramifications, then it might be time to walk away. (Or tell the producer
                      and let them put their foot down.) It's a neat idea, but just not
                      practical.

                      The only way I see around all that is to advertise the fact that the
                      audience may get gory, but then you're going to hurt your ticket sales
                      badly. And besides, there will always be the person who ignores the warning
                      and wears a mink coat and sits in the front row.

                      On a related note, how would you even do this? The quantity of blood needed
                      to splatter even 3' away from the source (and be seen from at least the
                      first 10 rows) is quite a bit, isn't it? Wouldn't the cost be prohibitive
                      if you did it more than once or twice ? I'm thinking not so much of the
                      blood itself, because I think it's easy to make (isn't it?) but the cleaning
                      for the costumes and stage. And the stage curtains!

                      Is it a danger to the actors to have blood on the stage? What are your
                      plans to clean the stage because I know the theatre isn't going to like a
                      speckled floor.

                      Sorry... off on a tangent there! Good luck!


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • lanorte1@aol.com
                      The short answer is, your director is nuts. This is a disaster waiting to happen. Someone (or more likely, several someones) will have garments ruined - or
                      Message 10 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                        The short answer is, your director is nuts. This is a disaster waiting to
                        happen. Someone (or more likely, several someones) will have garments ruined -
                        or just won't be happy to be pelted with sticky goo at a performance. If this
                        were being performed for college students/young adults and it were WIDELY
                        publicized (ALL press releases, interviews, large-print lobby signs) that "you,
                        the audience, will have stage blood thrown on you during this performance,"
                        then maybe...

                        Oh hell, who am I kidding? Even then, you'd STILL have some audience members
                        pissed off. This is not a good idea.

                        Donna
                        **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy
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                      • Mandy
                        Me too about the nuts thing... but... Ever thought of that slime that kids use? I know you can get it in red. Might not be exactly the right thing, but would
                        Message 11 of 25 , Feb 17, 2009
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                          Me too about the nuts thing... but... Ever thought of that slime that kids
                          use? I know you can get it in red. Might not be exactly the right thing,
                          but would give the audience member a bit of a stir and would be colour safe,
                          non-toxic and horrible feeling... or If you could get some non-toxic red
                          colouring that is also guaranteed not to stain, then mix it with water and
                          that flour that is wet, but isn't (Can't think what it's called! Corn
                          flour!) you'd get a slimy feeling, but when compressed it becomes hard like.
                          Or finally - outfit them in long rubber gloves like vets use, neck to floor,
                          long sleeved plastic apron, and a splatter guard type of helmet that the
                          doctors wear now, and let them go nuts with fake blood! This stuff is all
                          washable and reusable and you might find that after the initial shows, the
                          reviews will bring in people itching to get nice and gooey. :D

                          Having said that. now after all, aren't we the ones that are supposed to try
                          hard to make the directors ideas come true? If we said no to every hard
                          thing, we wouldn't be where we are today with all the wonderful effects
                          that we have. And believe it or not, you aren't going to please all of the
                          audience for the whole performance. We've had people walk out highly
                          offended by something that they read into the script... You never know.

                          But yes, the director is nuts! LOL

                          you could always try something like this - Walk into rehearsal one night
                          with something sticky and yucky (but colour safe - childs stove top slime
                          without colour) and get into the conversation again. Then when in full
                          flight of the "conversation" about the blood.. smack him/her in the chest
                          with the slimy horrible stuff... Stand back and see what reaction you get.
                          If he/she fires up, you could use that in your argument... If he/she cracks
                          up laughing - well, you aint never gonna win!

                          Mandy
                          My 2 cents

                          http://craftandsuch.blogspot.com/
                          http://www.pcgirl.com.au
                        • Poppy Shell
                          ALOHA: In reply to the bloody request of the director for LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS. Well, I ve costumed this play for a high school production, where there were
                          Message 12 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                            ALOHA: In reply to the bloody request of the director for LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS. Well, I've costumed this play for a high school production, where there were many children and teens in the audience. If I were a mom bringing my child - any age - I'd be upset with the detail of realism this director wants. This is a campy play, and while it deals with death, and murder really, I think to emphasize the death with blood on the audience is a HUGE mistake. The play is dark enough without that added detail. AND this isn't even talking about the difficulties you will have as the costumer, with your own costumes, the sets, the floor, the actors - possible allergic reactions or fake blood in someone's eyes or mouth, yuck. I agree you should talk to the producers, this director's request is opening everyone up for a real nightmare.....good luck. Poppy on Kauai






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                          • lanorte1@aol.com
                            Oh yeah...cockroaches. The more blood you spatter and the further you spatter it, the more difficult it will be to get absolutely every speck cleaned up. And
                            Message 13 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                              Oh yeah...cockroaches. The more blood you spatter and the further you
                              spatter it, the more difficult it will be to get absolutely every speck cleaned up.
                              And little multi-legged critters will find it.

                              Donna
                              **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy
                              steps!
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                            • ~lisa.s
                              A good director doesn t have to resort to gags and gimmicks. But I don t suppose there s a polite way to point that out. ; I dealt with a similar circumstance
                              Message 14 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                                A good director doesn't have to resort to gags and gimmicks. But I don't
                                suppose there's a polite way to point that out. ;>

                                I dealt with a similar circumstance with a production of "Sweeney Todd".
                                To the point the director insisted the show change venues to a smaller,
                                more intimate space so there would be a very good chance audience
                                members would have blood spatter on them every time Sweeney brandished
                                the razor, after a kill.

                                Well, after the first dress-tech, even using the brand of stage blood I
                                always use, that has *always* washed out easily, there was staining: the
                                interfacing down the front placket of several shirts grabbed the dye
                                from the blood, leaving the shirts with a distinctive pink stripe
                                running down the front. If it had been in a larger space, the pink
                                probably wouldn't have shown. It was only this--that the blood might
                                *not* wash out if it did get on the audience, that made the director see
                                reason. (It was the strangest thing--some of them were old, pulled from
                                stock, one was a new store bought and the most important one, Judge
                                Turpin, was newly build. I still have no idea why)

                                I'm not suggesting you sabotage a shirt or other costume piece, but...

                                Good luck. May St. Genesius (the patron saint of theater) spare us from
                                crazy directors.

                                ~lisa.s

                                --
                                ~lisa.s * llsturtsATgreatlakesDOTnet
                              • Wendy Starn
                                Given the litiginous society that we live in, I could easily see a nasty lawsuit coming from throwing fake blood onto people.  I suspect the theater would
                                Message 15 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                                  Given the litiginous society that we live in, I could easily see a nasty lawsuit coming from throwing fake blood onto people.  I suspect the theater would lose.  It's not Halloween, and you are not running a haunted house, where this might be more expected.  I'm not a lawyer, but I keep up with the news, and these days, people will sue over anythihng.

                                  Wendy L Starn
                                  Alexandria, Louisiana
                                  http://public.fotki.com/wlstarn/
                                  http://splendiferousfiber.blogspot.com/
                                  SplendiferousFiber.etsy.com




                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • babsdesign3
                                  ... stupid??? I did Zoo Story once and the blood splashed onto the shoe of someone inthe front row and they were NOT happy. To top it off, I have several
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                                    ---Oh yea, I too, must ask - is this director crazy or just plain
                                    stupid??? I did Zoo Story once and the blood splashed onto the shoe
                                    of someone inthe front row and they were NOT happy. To top it off, I
                                    have several recipes for washable blood and depending on the fabric,
                                    sometimes they do not wash out completely. Just say no.
                                    Barby Kahl

                                    In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Paula McWhirter-Buck
                                    <keridwyn_98@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > hey y'all,
                                    >
                                    > i'm costuming LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS, see...
                                    > and this director wants "the audience to literally get blood on
                                    their hands" by having someone come up and feed the dentist's body
                                    parts to the plant (and he insists they actually leave the stage with
                                    stage blood on them).
                                    > now, my concern is getting the "blood" on an audience member's clothes.
                                    > i dont have the budget to clean someone's vintage silk blouse, or
                                    good wool suit...or...or...
                                    >
                                    > i'm talking as fast as i can to talk him out of this little adventure.
                                    >
                                    > he's sent me some recipes for "washable" stage blood, but, i dont
                                    intend to wash some random person's clothes after each performance,
                                    nor ask them to.
                                    >
                                    > how realistic am i in my unwillingness to budge on this?
                                    > how realistic is he to ask me to?
                                    >
                                    > he's sent me all kinds of "documentation" from stage blood
                                    manufacturers about how washable their product is. but, i've been in
                                    costuming for a pretty long time, and i've sold all the products he's
                                    told me about, and used most of them. and i have yet to see one that
                                    i'd be comfortable splashing on an unsuspecting audience member. and
                                    i'm very wary of trying a concoction of dish detergent and whatever...
                                    > i'm freaked out, enough about having to get the stuff out of my own
                                    costumes every day, between performances....not to mention a rented
                                    plant...and how housekeeping reacts to this idea...well....
                                    >
                                    > i'd love to go to him with a list of "WHAT ARE YOU....CRAZY???"
                                    responses from costumers around the globe...or even the state...
                                    >
                                    > can you help me out?
                                    >
                                    > brightest of blessings,
                                    > paula mcwhirter-buck
                                    > costume designer/shop supervisor
                                    > mars hill college theatre arts department
                                    > &
                                    > southern appalachian repertory theatre
                                    > mars hill, nc
                                    > 828-689-1385
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > "THE TIME HAS COME", THE WALRUS SAID,"TO TALK OF MANY THINGS.
                                    > OF SHOES, AND SHIPS AND SEALING WAX, OF CABBAGES AND KINGS.
                                    > AND WHY THE SEA IS BOILING HOT, AND WHETHER PIGS HAVE WINGS."
                                    >
                                  • Catherine Leeson
                                    Could be dangerous, could be interesting. There was a professional stage show done in toronto recently that involved the audience and blood. I think it was
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Feb 18, 2009
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                                      Could be dangerous, could be interesting.

                                      There was a professional stage show done in toronto recently that
                                      involved the audience and blood. I think it was the texas chainsaw
                                      masacre. I didn't go - I remember something about blood and a
                                      chainsaw.

                                      To get to my point - when people were sold their seats they could
                                      book the splatter or non-spatter zones. If you were in the spaltter
                                      zone when the chainsaw started you would get doused - a friend's
                                      brother went and sat in that area. Apprently he got some weird
                                      looks on the subway afterwards as his white tshirt was covered.

                                      Personally, I like you am very frightened of the idea.

                                      If the director can't be talked out of his insane idea the only
                                      suggestion I can offer is to modify it. If possible have a sign up
                                      place where people can volunteer to do this .... [then they can be
                                      warned and they know what is going on]

                                      I can still see disaster as there will be stage blood everywhere -
                                      how easily can the carpet and seats in the theatre be cleaned. Has
                                      this insane idea been discussed with the management - one thing
                                      stage blood on a stage that can be scrubbed but in the seats....
                                      Theatre management might be a strong ally in killing the idea.

                                      Cathy Leeson
                                    • Paula McWhirter-Buck
                                      you folks are the best. the responses have been wonderfully supportive. i have a meeting with him today to discuss it further. i told him of this discussion,
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Feb 19, 2009
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                                        you folks are the best.

                                        the responses have been wonderfully supportive.
                                        i have a meeting with him today to discuss it further.
                                        i told him of this discussion, and have offered to let him read these emails. though, i've also warned him that we are costumers...and some not as "appreciative" of the plight of the director as others, and sometimes "the language reflects those feelings".

                                        i have also spoken to his (and my) superiors, the set designer, housekeeping, etc. everyone agrees with me.
                                        i'm thinking the outcome is to be a "planted" audience member who will come up and reach into a bucket of "body parts" and "blood". feed the plant, and be escorted off to the side to clean up before returning to their seat.
                                        though i still have concerns for my costumes (and the rented plant...but that's not MY problem)...i'm more comfortable with the situation.

                                        and while we're on the subject...does anyone have any suggestions on how to deal with getting stage blood out of white lab coats, that can be executed by theatre students that cant seem to pick their costumes up off the floor?
                                        maybe a giant bottle of OXY CLEAN back stage?

                                        again, thank you all for your wonderful emails.
                                        i cant tell you what a help you've all been.

                                        blessings,
                                        paula

                                        "THE TIME HAS COME", THE WALRUS SAID,"TO TALK OF MANY THINGS.
                                        OF SHOES, AND SHIPS AND SEALING WAX, OF CABBAGES AND KINGS.
                                        AND WHY THE SEA IS BOILING HOT, AND WHETHER PIGS HAVE WINGS."


                                        --- On Wed, 2/18/09, Catherine Leeson <dragonleeson@...> wrote:

                                        > From: Catherine Leeson <dragonleeson@...>
                                        > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Re: audience getting blood on their hands...
                                        > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                                        > Date: Wednesday, February 18, 2009, 2:08 PM
                                        > Could be dangerous, could be interesting.
                                        >
                                        > There was a professional stage show done in toronto
                                        > recently that
                                        > involved the audience and blood. I think it was the texas
                                        > chainsaw
                                        > masacre. I didn't go - I remember something about
                                        > blood and a
                                        > chainsaw.
                                        >
                                        > To get to my point - when people were sold their seats they
                                        > could
                                        > book the splatter or non-spatter zones. If you were in the
                                        > spaltter
                                        > zone when the chainsaw started you would get doused - a
                                        > friend's
                                        > brother went and sat in that area. Apprently he got some
                                        > weird
                                        > looks on the subway afterwards as his white tshirt was
                                        > covered.
                                        >
                                        > Personally, I like you am very frightened of the idea.
                                        >
                                        > If the director can't be talked out of his insane idea
                                        > the only
                                        > suggestion I can offer is to modify it. If possible have a
                                        > sign up
                                        > place where people can volunteer to do this .... [then they
                                        > can be
                                        > warned and they know what is going on]
                                        >
                                        > I can still see disaster as there will be stage blood
                                        > everywhere -
                                        > how easily can the carpet and seats in the theatre be
                                        > cleaned. Has
                                        > this insane idea been discussed with the management - one
                                        > thing
                                        > stage blood on a stage that can be scrubbed but in the
                                        > seats....
                                        > Theatre management might be a strong ally in killing the
                                        > idea.
                                        >
                                        > Cathy Leeson
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > ------------------------------------
                                        >
                                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                        >
                                        > (Yahoo! ID required)
                                        >
                                        > mailto:TheCostumersManifesto-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
                                        >
                                      • bonnie carter
                                        Is the theatre management aware of what the director is wanting to do and to the extent that he s described to you?  If this were our theatre, I can t imagine
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Feb 19, 2009
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                                          Is the theatre management aware of what the director is wanting to do and to the extent that he's described to you?  If this were our theatre, I can't imagine our management would allow this idea to foster past the conceptual phase.  I'd think they'd need some sort of release for the audience to sign beforehand and it does sound like it could be costly. 


                                          Bonnie Dalager
                                          www.dramaticallycorrect.com

                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • history_lady25
                                          The only way I can see you avoiding lawsuits is to arrange with an audience member ahead of time, for them to be the blood person, or to hide an actor in the
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Feb 19, 2009
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                                            The only way I can see you avoiding lawsuits is to arrange with an
                                            audience member ahead of time, for them to be the "blood person," or
                                            to hide an actor in the audience, and pick them every night to be
                                            the "blood person" to make it look -- to the actual audience -- that
                                            you're dragging an innocent bystander in.

                                            When I was in high school one of my classes made us do these group
                                            projects that involved the possibility of splashing water on someone
                                            in the class; one student got a splash of *water* on her shoes and
                                            freaked out. I did "King Lear" a few years back and had to do the
                                            bloody costume laundry, and was able to get the blood out only with
                                            long soaking in cold water, and I'm still not sure I got it all out
                                            every night. To be responsible for getting the stuff out of theater
                                            upholstery and carpet, along with the clothes of an irate (very
                                            likely) audience member, is not something that I would agree to do!

                                            If there will be considerable amounts of blood splashed on the first
                                            few rows of seating, I think you should do what someone else
                                            suggested, and sell "blood zone" seats and "dry zone" seats, and even
                                            get plastic seat covers for the seats in the first few rows. Tell
                                            the audience to bring umbrellas and clear plastic bags, etc. like you
                                            see at Gallagher shows. You can't just spring that kind of thing on
                                            people and expect them to understand and appreciate the effect; I
                                            think it's approaching too closely to the line between "realistic
                                            audience participation" and "bullying and terrorizing" people.

                                            Elizabeth Urbach

                                            --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Paula McWhirter-Buck
                                            <keridwyn_98@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > hey y'all,
                                            >
                                            > i'm costuming LITTLE SHOP OF HORRORS, see...
                                            > and this director wants "the audience to literally get blood on
                                            their hands" by having someone come up and feed the dentist's body
                                            parts to the plant (and he insists they actually leave the stage
                                            with stage blood on them).
                                            > now, my concern is getting the "blood" on an audience member's
                                            clothes.
                                            > i dont have the budget to clean someone's vintage silk blouse, or
                                            good wool suit...or...or...
                                            >
                                            > i'm talking as fast as i can to talk him out of this little
                                            adventure.
                                            >
                                            > he's sent me some recipes for "washable" stage blood, but, i dont
                                            intend to wash some random person's clothes after each performance,
                                            nor ask them to.
                                            >
                                            > how realistic am i in my unwillingness to budge on this?
                                            > how realistic is he to ask me to?
                                            >
                                            > he's sent me all kinds of "documentation" from stage blood
                                            manufacturers about how washable their product is. but, i've been in
                                            costuming for a pretty long time, and i've sold all the products he's
                                            told me about, and used most of them. and i have yet to see one that
                                            i'd be comfortable splashing on an unsuspecting audience member. and
                                            i'm very wary of trying a concoction of dish detergent and whatever...
                                            > i'm freaked out, enough about having to get the stuff out of my own
                                            costumes every day, between performances....not to mention a rented
                                            plant...and how housekeeping reacts to this idea...well....
                                            >
                                            > i'd love to go to him with a list of "WHAT ARE YOU....CRAZY???"
                                            responses from costumers around the globe...or even the state...
                                            >
                                            > can you help me out?
                                            >
                                            > brightest of blessings,
                                            > paula mcwhirter-buck
                                            > costume designer/shop supervisor
                                            > mars hill college theatre arts department
                                            > &
                                            > southern appalachian repertory theatre
                                            > mars hill, nc
                                            > 828-689-1385
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > "THE TIME HAS COME", THE WALRUS SAID,"TO TALK OF MANY THINGS.
                                            > OF SHOES, AND SHIPS AND SEALING WAX, OF CABBAGES AND KINGS.
                                            > AND WHY THE SEA IS BOILING HOT, AND WHETHER PIGS HAVE WINGS."
                                            >
                                          • bonnie carter
                                            I m glad you re having a meeting and hope that you re all able to come to a conclusion that you re happy with.  I was taken aback to read that the plant is
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Feb 20, 2009
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                                              I'm glad you're having a meeting and hope that you're all able to come to a conclusion that you're happy with.  I was taken aback to read that the plant is rented--I rent out one of these prop packages and I would be horrified if someone got stage blood on our plant that stained the surfaces.  That's probably the most complicated rental I have to work with, and expensive to build to say the least. 


                                              Bonnie Dalager
                                              www.dramaticallycorrect.com

                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • Curtis
                                              As someone who s not only looking at this from the costuming side of the show, but also the directing side, I ve got to ask myself if this director lacks
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Feb 21, 2009
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                                                As someone who's not only looking at this from the costuming side of
                                                the show, but also the directing side, I've got to ask myself if this
                                                director lacks confidence in his concept of the show, to feel the need
                                                to resort to what is essentially a cheap ploy at audience
                                                participation in order to involve them in the show. That's my initial
                                                reaction when I read about this...then I go into other issues like
                                                blood on the audience, blood on the plant, blood on the floor (that
                                                your actors are going to be walking back and forth across for the rest
                                                of the show, which means blood tracked EVERYWHERE on stage, blood that
                                                will likely be crusted over by the end of the show if the stage crew
                                                is going to stick around to mop then, or definitely caked over by the
                                                next day when the crew would normally mop...not to mention potential
                                                issues with footing and making the stage surface slick...)

                                                Directors have to understand that theater is different from movies,
                                                and there is NO WAY to establish the same degree of realism in the
                                                effects. They also need to understand that, unless you have the kind
                                                of budget that shows like Evil Dead have on Broadway, you can't afford
                                                to splatter the entire theater with stuff and pay a crew to clean it
                                                up every night. Any boost the theater would get in attendance for the
                                                show would be lost in paying the cleaning crew (and that before we get
                                                into the potential lawsuits from irate audience members, the potential
                                                increased insurance payments due to injured actors, and the
                                                more-than-likely extra cleaning fees charged by the company renting
                                                the plant.) People don't go to see Little Shop expecting a
                                                splatter-fest...it's a dark comedy. Unless you can find a funny way
                                                to incorporate something like that, it doesn't fit the show. Besides,
                                                it also defeats the scene...the dentist is supposed to be SECRETLY fed
                                                to the plant, Seymour is trying to cover up the fact that he killed
                                                the dentist (well, was going to kill him, at least--but he dismembered
                                                him) and is also trying to keep the secret of the plant's growth--so,
                                                logically, the LAST thing he would want is somebody (even an anonymous
                                                stranger from the audience) helping him feed the dentist to the plant.
                                                Nothing like throwing the premise of the show out the window for a
                                                cheap ten-second gimmick...
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