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Re: [TheCostumersManifesto] Re: Wardrobe duties

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  • Bo Persson
    I cannot see any reason you should not get paid! Bo Bo Persson, M.A. Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher bo_persson@ntlworld.com Skype name: bossep64
    Message 1 of 12 , Oct 25, 2008
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      I cannot see any reason you should not get paid!

      Bo

      Bo Persson, M.A.
      Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher
      bo_persson@...
      Skype name: bossep64
      http://bopersson64.wordpress.com/



      25 okt 2008 kl. 22.14 skrev Sylvia Rognstad:

      > Nothing. Its a standard contract that doesnt relate at all to my
      > duties. Several pages of generic stuff and the last page is titled
      > "Scope of Specific Terms" and says "Scope of work" with Costume
      > designer filled in, term (gives dates) and "payment terms and Timing"
      > and lists amount and the date it was to be paid.
      >
      > On Oct 25, 2008, at 3:09 PM, Bo Persson wrote:
      >
      > > What does the contract say?
      > >
      > > Bo
      > >
      > > Bo Persson, M.A.
      > > Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher
      > > bo_persson@...
      > > Skype name: bossep64
      > > http://bopersson64.wordpress.com/
      > >
      > > 25 okt 2008 kl. 22.00 skrev Sylvia Rognstad:
      > >
      > > > This is the only production this group has done. They wrote an
      > > > original rock opera, found an investor and produced it themselves.
      > > >
      > > > On Oct 25, 2008, at 1:18 PM, geneiak wrote:
      > > >
      > > > > i woould try to find out if other people who have worked for
      > this
      > > > > company have had similar problems-
      > > > >
      > > > > retshopbuyer
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Sylvia Rognstad
      > > > > <sylvia@...> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I would like to ask one more questions regarding my recent
      > case
      > > of
      > > > > not
      > > > > > being paid for work done on my rock opera, which,
      > incidentally,
      > > > was
      > > > > > titled "Magdalene, Woman of Light," so I don't keep
      > referring to
      > > > it
      > > > > as
      > > > > > just a rock opera. I hope I haven't done this subject to
      > death,
      > > > > but I
      > > > > > am in the throes of trying to get paid and a question arose in
      > > my
      > > > > mind.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > The producers claim is that the show wasn't done by opening
      > > night
      > > > > and
      > > > > > they had to pay the dresser to finish it. It is true that the
      > > > > dresser
      > > > > > told me about 2-3 small things that needed finishing or
      > > repairing
      > > > > on
      > > > > > preview night. I knew that I myself didn't have time to do
      > them,
      > > > > as I
      > > > > > had too many notes that I had to personally get done, and I
      > knew
      > > > > that
      > > > > > taking those things to one of the two stitchers I had would
      > have
      > > > > eaten
      > > > > > up into my time with driving back and forth and since they
      > would
      > > > > have
      > > > > > had to pay my stitchers for the work, I figured it was more
      > > > > efficient
      > > > > > to ask the dresser to do them if she didn't mind. I told her
      > to
      > > > > make
      > > > > > sure she got reimbursed.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Is that out of line, do those of you think who either work
      > with
      > > a
      > > > > > wardrobe crew or are dressers yourself? She wasn't a union
      > > > > person,
      > > > > > just a recent college grad who has done some wardrobe work. I
      > > > > felt it
      > > > > > was within the parameters of her duties, especially since I
      > > asked
      > > > > her
      > > > > > if she could, rather than telling her, and also because I told
      > > her
      > > > > to
      > > > > > get paid additionally for it. But the producers are claiming
      > it
      > > > > means
      > > > > > I was shirking my duties.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Sylvia
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >






      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Stickfries@aol.com
      If there were just some final wardrobing notes, and repairs, then it was definitely within the scope of Wardrobe.? The producers are just trying to get out of
      Message 2 of 12 , Oct 25, 2008
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        If there were just some final wardrobing notes, and repairs, then it was definitely within the scope of Wardrobe.? The producers are just trying to get out of paying you.? Also, it is standard for many designers to get paid in 3 parts.? Once upon signing of contract, once upon the completion of sketches or design, third upon opening.? For there to be a few stitching notes to get done and the producers acting as if they didn't have actor's in costumes is ridiculous.? Keep on top of them.







        -----Original Message-----
        From: Sylvia Rognstad <sylvia@...>
        To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 5:14 pm
        Subject: Re: [TheCostumersManifesto] Re: Wardrobe duties

























        Nothing. Its a standard contract that doesnt relate at all to my

        duties. Several pages of generic stuff and the last page is titled

        "Scope of Specific Terms" and says "Scope of work" with Costume

        designer filled in, term (gives dates) and "payment terms and Timing"

        and lists amount and the date it was to be paid.



        On Oct 25, 2008, at 3:09 PM, Bo Persson wrote:



        > What does the contract say?

        >

        > Bo

        >

        > Bo Persson, M.A.

        > Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher

        > bo_persson@...

        > Skype name: bossep64

        > http://bopersson64.wordpress.com/

        >

        > 25 okt 2008 kl. 22.00 skrev Sylvia Rognstad:

        >

        > > This is the only production this group has done. They wrote an

        > > original rock opera, found an investor and produced it themselves.

        > >

        > > On Oct 25, 2008, at 1:18 PM, geneiak wrote:

        > >

        > > > i woould try to find out if other people who have worked for this

        > > > company have had similar problems-

        > > >

        > > > retshopbuyer

        > > >

        > > > --- In TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com, Sylvia Rognstad

        > > > <sylvia@...> wrote:

        > > > >

        > > > > I would like to ask one more questions regarding my recent case

        > of

        > > > not

        > > > > being paid for work done on my rock opera, which, incidentally,

        > > was

        > > > > titled "Magdalene, Woman of Light," so I don't keep referring to

        > > it

        > > > as

        > > > > just a rock opera. I hope I haven't done this subject to death,

        > > > but I

        > > > > am in the throes of trying to get paid and a question arose in

        > my

        > > > mind.

        > > > >

        > > > > The producers claim is that the show wasn't done by opening

        > night

        > > > and

        > > > > they had to pay the dresser to finish it. It is true that the

        > > > dresser

        > > > > told me about 2-3 small things that needed finishing or

        > repairing

        > > > on

        > > > > preview night. I knew that I myself didn't have time to do them,

        > > > as I

        > > > > had too many notes that I had to personally get done, and I knew

        > > > that

        > > > > taking those things to one of the two stitchers I had would have

        > > > eaten

        > > > > up into my time with driving back and forth and since they would

        > > > have

        > > > > had to pay my stitchers for the work, I figured it was more

        > > > efficient

        > > > > to ask the dresser to do them if she didn't mind. I told her to

        > > > make

        > > > > sure she got reimbursed.

        > > > >

        > > > > Is that out of line, do those of you think who either work with

        > a

        > > > > wardrobe crew or are dressers yourself? She wasn't a union

        > > > person,

        > > > > just a recent college grad who has done some wardrobe work. I

        > > > felt it

        > > > > was within the parameters of her duties, especially since I

        > asked

        > > > her

        > > > > if she could, rather than telling her, and also because I told

        > her

        > > > to

        > > > > get paid additionally for it. But the producers are claiming it

        > > > means

        > > > > I was shirking my duties.

        > > > >

        > > > > Sylvia

        > > > >

        > > >

        > > >

        > > >

        > >

        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        > >

        > >

        > >

        >

        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        >

        >

        >



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Bo Persson
        Well said!! It is too see to be nice and then e blown. Bo Bo Persson, M.A. Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher bo_persson@ntlworld.com Skype name:
        Message 3 of 12 , Oct 26, 2008
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          Well said!! It is too see to be nice and then e blown.

          Bo

          Bo Persson, M.A.
          Independent Dress Consultant & Researcher
          bo_persson@...
          Skype name: bossep64
          http://bopersson64.wordpress.com/


          26 okt 2008 kl. 12.05 skrev Randolph Keator:

          > Sounds like the show didn't do quite as well as the investors were
          > led to believe it might and the producers are paring costs to make
          > the bottom line look better. Here's what I do in my contracting
          > business. When the job is completed, or about 98% complete, I tally
          > the bill, adding in for the completion of course. Then personally
          > hand the bill to the party responsible for the payment. I make sure
          > they understand in laymans terms that the bill is due in 15 days and
          > then follow up the hand delivered bill with a mailed copy. The bill
          > states plainly that all overdue amounts after the 15 day period will
          > be assessed interest and added to the bill. Make sure they know you
          > intend to follow up legally if needed. What they are attempting to
          > do is STEAL your services. Looks like they want to play hardball so
          > trade in your plastic bat for the real McCoy and go in swinging.
          > HARD ! ! Is there a way to put a lien on the production company ? If
          > so, do it and don't even think twice about it.
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Sylvia Rognstad
          > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 9:55 AM
          > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Wardrobe duties
          >
          > I would like to ask one more questions regarding my recent case of not
          >
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        • Randolph Keator
          Sounds like the show didn t do quite as well as the investors were led to believe it might and the producers are paring costs to make the bottom line look
          Message 4 of 12 , Oct 26, 2008
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            Sounds like the show didn't do quite as well as the investors were led to believe it might and the producers are paring costs to make the bottom line look better. Here's what I do in my contracting business. When the job is completed, or about 98% complete, I tally the bill, adding in for the completion of course. Then personally hand the bill to the party responsible for the payment. I make sure they understand in laymans terms that the bill is due in 15 days and then follow up the hand delivered bill with a mailed copy. The bill states plainly that all overdue amounts after the 15 day period will be assessed interest and added to the bill. Make sure they know you intend to follow up legally if needed. What they are attempting to do is STEAL your services. Looks like they want to play hardball so trade in your plastic bat for the real McCoy and go in swinging. HARD ! ! Is there a way to put a lien on the production company ? If so, do it and don't even think twice about it.
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Sylvia Rognstad
            To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 9:55 AM
            Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Wardrobe duties


            I would like to ask one more questions regarding my recent case of not




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          • Sylvia Rognstad
            I think it is too late to do that now do to my very ambiguous contract but I certainly will remember that in the future, should I be inclined to take on any
            Message 5 of 12 , Oct 26, 2008
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              I think it is too late to do that now do to my very ambiguous contract
              but I certainly will remember that in the future, should I be inclined
              to take on any more costume jobs.

              Sylvia

              On Oct 26, 2008, at 6:05 AM, Randolph Keator wrote:

              > Sounds like the show didn't do quite as well as the investors were led
              > to believe it might and the producers are paring costs to make the
              > bottom line look better. Here's what I do in my contracting business.
              > When the job is completed, or about 98% complete, I tally the bill,
              > adding in for the completion of course. Then personally hand the bill
              > to the party responsible for the payment. I make sure they understand
              > in laymans terms that the bill is due in 15 days and then follow up
              > the hand delivered bill with a mailed copy. The bill states plainly
              > that all overdue amounts after the 15 day period will be assessed
              > interest and added to the bill. Make sure they know you intend to
              > follow up legally if needed. What they are attempting to do is STEAL
              > your services. Looks like they want to play hardball so trade in your
              > plastic bat for the real McCoy and go in swinging. HARD ! ! Is there a
              > way to put a lien on the production company ? If so, do it and don't
              > even think twice about it.
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Sylvia Rognstad
              > To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 9:55 AM
              > Subject: [TheCostumersManifesto] Wardrobe duties
              >
              > I would like to ask one more questions regarding my recent case of not
              >
              > Recent Activity
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              >
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              >
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              >
              > Connect and share with
              >
              > dog owners like you
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups
              > w/ John McEnroe
              >
              > Join the All-Bran
              >
              > Day 10 Club.
              > .
              >
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              >
              >
              >

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            • Curtis
              I haven t had experience from the designer side of this (as the only shows for which I ve done costume design also had me as the wardrobe crew), but I have
              Message 6 of 12 , Oct 26, 2008
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                I haven't had experience from the designer side of this (as the only
                shows for which I've done costume design also had me as the wardrobe
                crew), but I have been involved in a number of productions where props
                designers/set designers/costume designers had final touch-ups and
                tweaks that were left to the run crew of the show, or were taken care
                of by other designers or even the administrative staff of the theater
                (Utah is a right-to-work state so there are not requirements that such
                work must be completed by specific personnel). I have been a scenic
                artist on shows where I didn't even get set renderings from the set
                designer until the night before dress rehearsals, and as props
                designer have been involved in solving a lot of problems that were
                originally the claimed domain of the set designer.

                I have never, however, seen or heard of a theater refusing to pay a
                designer for failure to complete a project because of such a
                situation. There were clauses in all of my contracts that allowed for
                the theater to withhold part of my design fee if I failed to have
                everything finished on time...but nobody I've worked with would
                withhold $150 for such trivial issues as this. And I have, as a
                dresser, been involved in numerous alterations and final touches on
                costumes for multiple shows that I've worked on.

                I'd have to agree with the assessment that these guys thought they had
                the next 'Jesus Christ Superstar' on their hands, and when it had a
                less-than-stellar run, they decided to try and cut their losses. I've
                only had one experience that is anywhere close to that situation,
                where the producing entity of a show I worked on had to go through
                bankruptcy proceedings after the show they produced didn't provide an
                adequate return on their investment...and even then, they never
                refused to pay, they just asked for more time in which to get the
                money to me (and they did make their payment).

                I'm the last person in the world to preach leaving theater to the
                professionals, as I'm a great believer in learning by doing...but
                stuff like this really annoys me--if you're going to bring someone in
                on your experiment--err, project--then you should either be up-front
                with them about the possibility that the show may not do well and ask
                them to share the risk, or you should honor the contract...I mean,
                even if they want to withhold what it cost for the dresser to do the
                finishing work for you, how much are they paying that dresser? Even a
                difficult zipper shouldn't take an hour to put in, and it sounds like
                the zipper is the only major item on the list...(ironically, from the
                sound of things, if you had offered to pay the dresser for her work
                out of your budget, you could simply have said that you hired her as a
                stitcher to finish the work and they would have had no claim...)

                I also agree that legal action should be pursued, because if they get
                away with it once, they're going to do it again...talk to the other
                designers and see if they got paid in full--if not then you can all
                split the cost of the legal fees (if any are actually required) and
                maximize the slap on the wrist. Although, if they set up a
                corporation to produce the show, and then dissolve it, you may be out
                of luck. At the very least, spread the word among everyone you know
                and work with in the area so no one else gets taken to the cleaners by
                these people.
              • Randolph Keator
                Maybe Slyvia but personally I would pursue it legally if you have the means. See if you can find a Civil Rights attorney who would work for a lesser fee or
                Message 7 of 12 , Oct 28, 2008
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                  Maybe Slyvia but personally I would pursue it legally if you have the means. See if you can find a Civil Rights attorney who would work for a lesser fee or maybe even pro-bono. You can sometimes find help through the legal aid network also. You got burned and yes we all know that taste it leaves on the tongue. Best of luck. (~:
                  Randy
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Sylvia Rognstad
                  To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 9:14 AM
                  Subject: Re: [TheCostumersManifesto] Wardrobe duties


                  I think it is too late to do that now . . .

                  .


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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