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TT disk material

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  • Kent L. Aldershof
    Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 20:18:21 -0000 From: djtmat1@myyellowstone.net Subject: Re: help What do you think about the use of cold roll steel as a
    Message 1 of 5 , Aug 1 9:08 AM
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      Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 20:18:21 -0000
      From: djtmat1@...
      Subject: Re: help

      <snip> What do you think about
      the use of cold roll steel as a substitute for stainless for the
      purpose of testing models? At one web site they are making 20 horse
      gensets out of anything over 50,000 PSI tensile strength and cold
      roll has a tensile strength of 60,000 PSI as for the disk warping, I
      run a 1200 watt laser and once we made slats for it out of 14ga
      stainless, they warped soon after putting them in currently we are
      using cold roll it does not warp but it does melt at a faster rate.


      Don,

      I think the advantage of using SS instead of cold-rolled is that the SS
      can be polished to a smoother and brighter surface finish. This improves
      the adhesion, and should add to the efficiency of your turbine.

      The issue is not tensile strength, but surface finish. If you use
      unpolished SS, you would not be much better off than by using CRS. I
      think tests of identical runners, one of polished SS and the other of
      plain CRS, would show that the SS runner would perform significantly
      better.

      Sorry if this is discouraging, if you aren't able to get a free supply of
      SS to match your free CRS.

      Kent
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    • tomntucker@home.com
      All, I would like to see test data to confirm that a smooth surface will out-perform an as-rolled surface. The key is how thick is the boundary layer that
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 16, 2001
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        All,

        I would like to see test data to confirm that a smooth surface will
        out-perform an as-rolled surface. The key is how thick is the
        boundary layer that doesn't flow smoothly, and so one would expect
        that a rougher surface would tend to thicken this surface phenomenia.
        Test data would be helpful.

        Tom


        --- In TeslaTurbine@y..., "Kent L. Aldershof" <Aldershof-MSI@J...>
        wrote:
        > Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 20:18:21 -0000
        > From: djtmat1@m...
        > Subject: Re: help
        >
        > <snip> What do you think about
        > the use of cold roll steel as a substitute for stainless for the
        > purpose of testing models? At one web site they are making 20 horse
        > gensets out of anything over 50,000 PSI tensile strength and cold
        > roll has a tensile strength of 60,000 PSI as for the disk warping,
        I
        > run a 1200 watt laser and once we made slats for it out of 14ga
        > stainless, they warped soon after putting them in currently we are
        > using cold roll it does not warp but it does melt at a faster rate.
        >
        >
        > Don,
        >
        > I think the advantage of using SS instead of cold-rolled is that
        the SS
        > can be polished to a smoother and brighter surface finish. This
        improves
        > the adhesion, and should add to the efficiency of your turbine.
        >
        > The issue is not tensile strength, but surface finish. If you use
        > unpolished SS, you would not be much better off than by using CRS.
        I
        > think tests of identical runners, one of polished SS and the other
        of
        > plain CRS, would show that the SS runner would perform significantly
        > better.
        >
        > Sorry if this is discouraging, if you aren't able to get a free
        supply of
        > SS to match your free CRS.
        >
        > Kent
        > ________________________________________________________________
        > GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
        > Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
        > Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
        > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
      • wyzed
        Tom, Smooth helps the boundary layer stick. Rough will cause laminar flow and disturb the adhesive aspect of the boundary layer. Telsa mentioned this in one of
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 18, 2001
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          Tom, Smooth helps the boundary layer stick. Rough will cause laminar flow
          and disturb the adhesive aspect of the boundary layer. Telsa mentioned this
          in one of his many papers, I think it was in " Tesla's Engine A new
          Dimension for Power. complied by Jeffery A Hayes available at TEBA.
          Neil
        • Tom E Arnold
          ... is that the SS ... improves ... I ... of ... supply of ... The turbine would have to be designed around the available diameters, but disks could be
          Message 4 of 5 , Sep 28, 2001
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            --- In TeslaTurbine "Kent L. Aldershof" wrote:
            >
            > <snip> > I think the advantage of using SS instead of cold-rolled
            is that the SS
            > can be polished to a smoother and brighter surface finish. This
            improves
            > the adhesion, and should add to the efficiency of your turbine.
            >
            > The issue is not tensile strength, but surface finish. If you use
            > unpolished SS, you would not be much better off than by using CRS.
            I
            > think tests of identical runners, one of polished SS and the other
            of
            > plain CRS, would show that the SS runner would perform significantly
            > better.
            >
            > Sorry if this is discouraging, if you aren't able to get a free
            supply of
            > SS to match your free CRS.
            >
            The turbine would have to be designed around the available diameters,
            but disks could be scavenged from old computer disk drives. They are
            polished and flat to microinch tolerances, and designed to be spun at
            high speed. I'm still finding discarded 5-1/4 inch drives, and 8 inch
            disks should still be obtainable.
          • tomntucker@home.com
            ... laminar flow ... mentioned this ... new ... Tesla was a genius and so he may be correct, however: 1) a rough surface should cause turbulent and not laminar
            Message 5 of 5 , Sep 30, 2001
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              --- In TeslaTurbine@y..., "wyzed" <wyzed@f...> wrote:
              > Tom, Smooth helps the boundary layer stick. Rough will cause
              laminar flow
              > and disturb the adhesive aspect of the boundary layer. Telsa
              mentioned this
              > in one of his many papers, I think it was in " Tesla's Engine A
              new
              > Dimension for Power. complied by Jeffery A Hayes available at TEBA.
              > Neil

              Tesla was a genius and so he may be correct, however:
              1) a rough surface should cause turbulent and not laminar or smooth
              flow.
              2) Since the goal of a turbine is to essentially cause "friction"
              between the surface and the working fluid or gas, one could also
              argue that the more roughness the better.
              3) On page 68 of "Performance of Multiple-disk-rotors Pumps with
              Varied Interdisk Spacings", by Joseph H. Morris, "Significant
              increases in pressure rise were noted fo the roughened as compared to
              smooth disks." Also "Improved pumping performance was noted with the
              roughened disks as shown in Tables..."

              Tom Tucker
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