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Mnemosyne

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  • gregory_candy
    I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of some Zhaung Zhi perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin. Greg Mnemosyne A sign we are,
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 22, 2008
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      I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of some Zhaung Zhi
      perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin.

      Greg


      Mnemosyne

      A sign we are, inexplicable
      Without pain we are and have nearly
      Lost our language in foreign lands.
      For when the heavens quarrel
      Over humans and moons proceed
      In force, the sea
      Speaks out and rivers must find
      Their way. But there is One,
      Without doubt, who
      Can change this any day. He needs
      No law. The rustle of the leaf and then the sway of oaks
      Beside glaciers. Not everything
      Is in the power of the gods. Mortals could sooner
      Reach toward the abyss. With them
      The echo turns. Though the time
      Be long, truth
      Will come to pass.
    • lisa
      ... some Zhaung Zhi ... What came to mind on reading Mnemosyne was the title of a book by Ayn Rand, _Atlas Shrugged_. In the book it talks about the humans
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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        --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_candy" <gcandy@...> wrote:
        >
        > I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of
        some Zhaung Zhi
        > perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin.
        >
        > Greg
        >
        >
        > Mnemosyne
        >
        > A sign we are, inexplicable
        > Without pain we are and have nearly
        > Lost our language in foreign lands.
        > For when the heavens quarrel
        > Over humans and moons proceed
        > In force, the sea
        > Speaks out and rivers must find
        > Their way. But there is One,
        > Without doubt, who
        > Can change this any day. He needs
        > No law. The rustle of the leaf and then the sway of oaks
        > Beside glaciers. Not everything
        > Is in the power of the gods. Mortals could sooner
        > Reach toward the abyss. With them
        > The echo turns. Though the time
        > Be long, truth
        > Will come to pass.
        >

        What came to mind on reading Mnemosyne was the title of a book by Ayn
        Rand, _Atlas Shrugged_. In the book it talks about the humans who are
        doing the actual creative thinking and whose motive force keeps the
        species alive walking away and letting the rest of us fend for
        ourselves. Atlas, from mythology, is the figure who holds the planet
        upon his mighty shoulders. The meaning of the title is to question,
        what would happen if Atlas shrugged and said I'm through with it.

        Taking it to the next level, let us assume that Mother Gaia [google
        Gaia Hypothesis if you don't know who I'm talking about with Mother
        Gaia] needs no human to keep her viable. To the contrary, what if it
        is humankind itself that threatens her viability? What if Mother Gaia
        Shrugs?

        I read a little on Holderlin. An interesting fellow to be sure. He
        spent the last 10 years of his life "insane" and playing the piano and
        living with a carpenter, according to the literature. One person's
        madness is another person's genius is what my mom used to say. Did he
        write the above, or what is at the following link, before he went mad?

        http://home.att.net/~holderlin/poem/breadandwine.htm
      • Patrick Burrows
        For as many times as I ve been party to discussions about that book, you d think I d have read it by now. ... -- -- Patrick Burrows http://www.CleverHumans.com
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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          For as many times as I've been party to discussions about that book,
          you'd think I'd have read it by now.

          On Jan 27, 2008 12:56 PM, lisa <ms_jade_li@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_candy" <gcandy@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of
          > some Zhaung Zhi
          > > perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin.
          > >
          > > Greg
          > >
          > >
          > > Mnemosyne
          > >
          > > A sign we are, inexplicable
          > > Without pain we are and have nearly
          > > Lost our language in foreign lands.
          > > For when the heavens quarrel
          > > Over humans and moons proceed
          > > In force, the sea
          > > Speaks out and rivers must find
          > > Their way. But there is One,
          > > Without doubt, who
          > > Can change this any day. He needs
          > > No law. The rustle of the leaf and then the sway of oaks
          > > Beside glaciers. Not everything
          > > Is in the power of the gods. Mortals could sooner
          > > Reach toward the abyss. With them
          > > The echo turns. Though the time
          > > Be long, truth
          > > Will come to pass.
          > >
          >
          > What came to mind on reading Mnemosyne was the title of a book by Ayn
          > Rand, _Atlas Shrugged_. In the book it talks about the humans who are
          > doing the actual creative thinking and whose motive force keeps the
          > species alive walking away and letting the rest of us fend for
          > ourselves. Atlas, from mythology, is the figure who holds the planet
          > upon his mighty shoulders. The meaning of the title is to question,
          > what would happen if Atlas shrugged and said I'm through with it.
          >
          > Taking it to the next level, let us assume that Mother Gaia [google
          > Gaia Hypothesis if you don't know who I'm talking about with Mother
          > Gaia] needs no human to keep her viable. To the contrary, what if it
          > is humankind itself that threatens her viability? What if Mother Gaia
          > Shrugs?
          >
          > I read a little on Holderlin. An interesting fellow to be sure. He
          > spent the last 10 years of his life "insane" and playing the piano and
          > living with a carpenter, according to the literature. One person's
          > madness is another person's genius is what my mom used to say. Did he
          > write the above, or what is at the following link, before he went mad?
          >
          > http://home.att.net/~holderlin/poem/breadandwine.htm
          >
          >
          >
          >



          --
          --
          Patrick Burrows
          http://www.CleverHumans.com
        • lisa
          ... I ve attempted to read it from cover to cover twice. Once was when I was in 10th grade and once a few years later. Both times I got stuck at the place
          Message 4 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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            --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Burrows" <pburrows@...> wrote:
            >
            > For as many times as I've been party to discussions about that book,
            > you'd think I'd have read it by now.

            I've attempted to read it from cover to cover twice. Once was when I
            was in 10th grade and once a few years later. Both times I got stuck
            at the place where the plan was revealed along with the knowledge that
            a place existed where they all went to.

            Perhaps some part of my psyche is apprehensive about seeing what might
            happen if Rand's vision were to come to pass?

            If you do read it, give us the Cliff notes will you on what happens?
            I don't see myself giving it a 3rd try at this point. Subsequent
            knowledge about Rand and a belief that her being subjected to Stalin's
            socialism warped her mind, has been a deterrent. Maybe many moons
            hence when I'm not so caught up in the tarry details of a cog's
            existence.

            Maybe it isn't the details of her work so much as the idea of Atlas
            shrugging that is thought-provoking.

            >
            > On Jan 27, 2008 12:56 PM, lisa <ms_jade_li@...> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_candy" <gcandy@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of
            > > some Zhaung Zhi
            > > > perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin.
            > > >
            > > > Greg
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Mnemosyne
            > > >
            > > > A sign we are, inexplicable
            > > > Without pain we are and have nearly
            > > > Lost our language in foreign lands.
            > > > For when the heavens quarrel
            > > > Over humans and moons proceed
            > > > In force, the sea
            > > > Speaks out and rivers must find
            > > > Their way. But there is One,
            > > > Without doubt, who
            > > > Can change this any day. He needs
            > > > No law. The rustle of the leaf and then the sway of oaks
            > > > Beside glaciers. Not everything
            > > > Is in the power of the gods. Mortals could sooner
            > > > Reach toward the abyss. With them
            > > > The echo turns. Though the time
            > > > Be long, truth
            > > > Will come to pass.
            > > >
            > >
            > > What came to mind on reading Mnemosyne was the title of a book by Ayn
            > > Rand, _Atlas Shrugged_. In the book it talks about the humans who are
            > > doing the actual creative thinking and whose motive force keeps the
            > > species alive walking away and letting the rest of us fend for
            > > ourselves. Atlas, from mythology, is the figure who holds the planet
            > > upon his mighty shoulders. The meaning of the title is to question,
            > > what would happen if Atlas shrugged and said I'm through with it.
            > >
            > > Taking it to the next level, let us assume that Mother Gaia [google
            > > Gaia Hypothesis if you don't know who I'm talking about with Mother
            > > Gaia] needs no human to keep her viable. To the contrary, what if it
            > > is humankind itself that threatens her viability? What if Mother Gaia
            > > Shrugs?
            > >
            > > I read a little on Holderlin. An interesting fellow to be sure. He
            > > spent the last 10 years of his life "insane" and playing the piano and
            > > living with a carpenter, according to the literature. One person's
            > > madness is another person's genius is what my mom used to say. Did he
            > > write the above, or what is at the following link, before he went mad?
            > >
            > > http://home.att.net/~holderlin/poem/breadandwine.htm
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            > --
            > --
            > Patrick Burrows
            > http://www.CleverHumans.com
            >
          • Patrick Burrows
            someone told me about a 600 page speech at the end of it... that kinda turned me off. ... -- -- Patrick Burrows http://www.CleverHumans.com
            Message 5 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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              someone told me about a 600 page speech at the end of it... that kinda
              turned me off.

              On Jan 27, 2008 1:10 PM, lisa <ms_jade_li@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Burrows" <pburrows@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > For as many times as I've been party to discussions about that book,
              > > you'd think I'd have read it by now.
              >
              > I've attempted to read it from cover to cover twice. Once was when I
              > was in 10th grade and once a few years later. Both times I got stuck
              > at the place where the plan was revealed along with the knowledge that
              > a place existed where they all went to.
              >
              > Perhaps some part of my psyche is apprehensive about seeing what might
              > happen if Rand's vision were to come to pass?
              >
              > If you do read it, give us the Cliff notes will you on what happens?
              > I don't see myself giving it a 3rd try at this point. Subsequent
              > knowledge about Rand and a belief that her being subjected to Stalin's
              > socialism warped her mind, has been a deterrent. Maybe many moons
              > hence when I'm not so caught up in the tarry details of a cog's
              > existence.
              >
              > Maybe it isn't the details of her work so much as the idea of Atlas
              > shrugging that is thought-provoking.
              >
              >
              >
              > >
              > > On Jan 27, 2008 12:56 PM, lisa <ms_jade_li@...> wrote:
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_candy" <gcandy@> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > I found this poem very engaging and wanted to share. Reminiscent of
              > > > some Zhaung Zhi
              > > > > perhaps? By Freidrich Holderlin.
              > > > >
              > > > > Greg
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Mnemosyne
              > > > >
              > > > > A sign we are, inexplicable
              > > > > Without pain we are and have nearly
              > > > > Lost our language in foreign lands.
              > > > > For when the heavens quarrel
              > > > > Over humans and moons proceed
              > > > > In force, the sea
              > > > > Speaks out and rivers must find
              > > > > Their way. But there is One,
              > > > > Without doubt, who
              > > > > Can change this any day. He needs
              > > > > No law. The rustle of the leaf and then the sway of oaks
              > > > > Beside glaciers. Not everything
              > > > > Is in the power of the gods. Mortals could sooner
              > > > > Reach toward the abyss. With them
              > > > > The echo turns. Though the time
              > > > > Be long, truth
              > > > > Will come to pass.
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > > What came to mind on reading Mnemosyne was the title of a book by Ayn
              > > > Rand, _Atlas Shrugged_. In the book it talks about the humans who are
              > > > doing the actual creative thinking and whose motive force keeps the
              > > > species alive walking away and letting the rest of us fend for
              > > > ourselves. Atlas, from mythology, is the figure who holds the planet
              > > > upon his mighty shoulders. The meaning of the title is to question,
              > > > what would happen if Atlas shrugged and said I'm through with it.
              > > >
              > > > Taking it to the next level, let us assume that Mother Gaia [google
              > > > Gaia Hypothesis if you don't know who I'm talking about with Mother
              > > > Gaia] needs no human to keep her viable. To the contrary, what if it
              > > > is humankind itself that threatens her viability? What if Mother Gaia
              > > > Shrugs?
              > > >
              > > > I read a little on Holderlin. An interesting fellow to be sure. He
              > > > spent the last 10 years of his life "insane" and playing the piano and
              > > > living with a carpenter, according to the literature. One person's
              > > > madness is another person's genius is what my mom used to say. Did he
              > > > write the above, or what is at the following link, before he went mad?
              > > >
              > > > http://home.att.net/~holderlin/poem/breadandwine.htm
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > --
              > > --
              > > Patrick Burrows
              > > http://www.CleverHumans.com
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >



              --
              --
              Patrick Burrows
              http://www.CleverHumans.com
            • Rick Matz
              Atlas Shrugged is a GREAT book. The Jungle, by Upton Sinclair is ruined by the last 3rd being a Socialist rant. Patrick Burrows wrote:
              Message 6 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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                Atlas Shrugged is a GREAT book.

                The Jungle, by Upton Sinclair is ruined by the last 3rd being a Socialist rant.

                Patrick Burrows <pburrows@...> wrote:
                someone told me about a 600 page speech at the end of it... that kinda
                turned me off.



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              • bradford hatcher
                ... Gotta concur. Not a book for the levelers and equalitarians, though. It celebrates the best of what we are, not the average, and that our ideas about what
                Message 7 of 7 , Jan 27, 2008
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                  --- In TaoTalk@yahoogroups.com, Rick Matz <rickmatz@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Atlas Shrugged is a GREAT book.

                  Gotta concur.
                  Not a book for the levelers and equalitarians, though.
                  It celebrates the best of what we are, not the average,
                  and that our ideas about what that is may and do vary.
                  That might be a long speech at the end (she do get preachy),
                  but it's damn fine speech.
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