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Re:"Unfurl Those Colors!"

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  • David W. Gaddy
    Ref Digest 1004, Item 1a ( Rats! from Harry): I was so pleased to read Harry s comment on the conventional wisdom concerning the siege of HF (which wasn t
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 12, 2008
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      Ref Digest 1004, Item 1a ("Rats!" from Harry):

      I was so pleased to read Harry's comment on the conventional wisdom
      concerning the "siege" of HF (which wasn't one, nor was conceived of
      being one, unless it was an even worse job of staff/logistical
      planning that it was). Harry, your point of departure was spot on.
      Instead, we have been fed for decades the pap based upon what
      happened, not what was ordered. (Even Lee was sensitive about this,
      after the fact, defensive of the "accepted" history and of the late
      Jackson.) I hoped (hope) to develop this, based upon the CS
      (non-)provision for coordination among "three converging bodies" of
      troops, wherein Jackson was left depending upon a detailed private as
      his "signal officer," with none provided to Walker and McLaws left to
      improvise. We should judge events based upon READING SO 191, as Harry
      has done. McLaws had the primary task of eliminating the HF garrison.
      Walker was to make certain no one escaped to the south and Jax was to
      eliminate the Martinsburg troops. Only one general had a "qualified"
      signal officer with him and that was Powell Hill, with Capt RHT
      Adams, both still chafing under Jackson's arrest (Hill) and leak
      investigation (Adams). Ironically, it was Adams who brought Hill to
      the side of the wounded Jackson six months later.

      Dave Gaddy
    • Harry Smeltzer
      I think Harsh has it right. Lee never really thought that the garrison at HF would hold out. The untenable nature of the place was well known from the
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 12, 2008
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        I think Harsh has it right. Lee never really thought that the garrison at
        HF would hold out. The untenable nature of the place was well known from
        the beginning (see Joe Johnston in 1861), and it was pretty much assumed the
        garrison would flee, the only question being in what direction. Halleck
        unintentionally kicked over Lee's applecart by ordering Miles to hold out.
        It was that decision, or rather Lee's failure to consider that option on the
        9th, that wrested the initiative from the Confederacy. This was exacerbated
        by Lee's inaccurate intel regarding the movement of the AotP up to that
        point. The blame for that rests firmly on the shoulders of JEB Stuart, IMO.

        Harry



        -----Original Message-----
        From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com [mailto:TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of David W. Gaddy
        Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 4:46 PM
        To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re:"Unfurl Those Colors!"



        Ref Digest 1004, Item 1a ("Rats!" from Harry):

        I was so pleased to read Harry's comment on the conventional wisdom
        concerning the "siege" of HF (which wasn't one, nor was conceived of
        being one, unless it was an even worse job of staff/logistical
        planning that it was). Harry, your point of departure was spot on.
        Instead, we have been fed for decades the pap based upon what
        happened, not what was ordered. (Even Lee was sensitive about this,
        after the fact, defensive of the "accepted" history and of the late
        Jackson.) I hoped (hope) to develop this, based upon the CS
        (non-)provision for coordination among "three converging bodies" of
        troops, wherein Jackson was left depending upon a detailed private as
        his "signal officer," with none provided to Walker and McLaws left to
        improvise. We should judge events based upon READING SO 191, as Harry
        has done. McLaws had the primary task of eliminating the HF garrison.
        Walker was to make certain no one escaped to the south and Jax was to
        eliminate the Martinsburg troops. Only one general had a "qualified"
        signal officer with him and that was Powell Hill, with Capt RHT
        Adams, both still chafing under Jackson's arrest (Hill) and leak
        investigation (Adams). Ironically, it was Adams who brought Hill to
        the side of the wounded Jackson six months later.

        Dave Gaddy





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • G E Mayers
        Spot on, Harry! Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on one s mother s side, is an introduction to
        Message 3 of 7 , Apr 13, 2008
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          Spot on, Harry!

          Yr. Obt. Svt.
          G E "Gerry" Mayers

          To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
          on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
          Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
          the Almighty God. --Anonymous
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@...>
          To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 5:21 PM
          Subject: RE: [TalkAntietam] Re:"Unfurl Those Colors!"


          >I think Harsh has it right. Lee never really thought that the
          >garrison at
          > HF would hold out. The untenable nature of the place was well
          > known from
          > the beginning (see Joe Johnston in 1861), and it was pretty
          > much assumed the
          > garrison would flee, the only question being in what direction.
          > Halleck
          > unintentionally kicked over Lee's applecart by ordering Miles
          > to hold out.
          > It was that decision, or rather Lee's failure to consider that
          > option on the
          > 9th, that wrested the initiative from the Confederacy. This
          > was exacerbated
          > by Lee's inaccurate intel regarding the movement of the AotP up
          > to that
          > point. The blame for that rests firmly on the shoulders of JEB
          > Stuart, IMO.
          >
          > Harry
          >
          >
          >
        • flagflop
          Harry, Generally agree. Lee (or staff?) either under-estimated or was unrealistically demanding in time allocation, and seems to have under-estimated the
          Message 4 of 7 , Apr 14, 2008
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            Harry, Generally agree. "Lee" (or staff?) either under-estimated or
            was unrealistically demanding in time allocation, and seems to have
            under-estimated the difficulty of getting arty on Elk Ridge/Md Hgts
            and the resistence Kershaw would encounter. In So Hist Coll at Chapel
            Hill, there is a McLaws complaint of being blocked from prompt
            movement by failure of Longstreet to move ahead, prompting McL to
            seek an alternate route. (This is an "off-the-top" long ago recall on
            my part.)
            Dave Gaddy
            --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Spot on, Harry!
            >
            > Yr. Obt. Svt.
            > G E "Gerry" Mayers
            >
            > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
            > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
            > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
            > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@...>
            > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2008 5:21 PM
            > Subject: RE: [TalkAntietam] Re:"Unfurl Those Colors!"
            >
            >
            > >I think Harsh has it right. Lee never really thought that the
            > >garrison at
            > > HF would hold out. The untenable nature of the place was well
            > > known from
            > > the beginning (see Joe Johnston in 1861), and it was pretty
            > > much assumed the
            > > garrison would flee, the only question being in what direction.
            > > Halleck
            > > unintentionally kicked over Lee's applecart by ordering Miles
            > > to hold out.
            > > It was that decision, or rather Lee's failure to consider that
            > > option on the
            > > 9th, that wrested the initiative from the Confederacy. This
            > > was exacerbated
            > > by Lee's inaccurate intel regarding the movement of the AotP up
            > > to that
            > > point. The blame for that rests firmly on the shoulders of JEB
            > > Stuart, IMO.
            > >
            > > Harry
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
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