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Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps Trains

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  • Thomas Clemens
    Not really as the woods obscured their position and Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect fire. If they could not see it, they usually did not shoot
    Message 1 of 16 , Feb 26, 2008
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      Not really as the woods obscured their position and Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect fire. If they could not see it, they usually did not shoot at it.


      Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
      Professor of History
      Hagerstown Community College



      >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008 10:27 AM >>>
      Dear Tom,

      Would it have made more sense for the ordnance trains of the
      First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper Bridge? IIRC,
      that would be well out of range of even the longest ANV artillery
      positions on the field.

      Yr. Obt. Svt.
      G E "Gerry" Mayers

      To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
      on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
      Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
      the Almighty God. --Anonymous
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
      To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
      Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps Trains


      Dean,
      I see you did not get any replies to this query. I don't know
      that the location of the supply trains is recorded anywhere, but
      your suppositions make sense. I think J. Pofenberger was too
      exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was too far out on
      the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps back at their
      bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.


      Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
      Professor of History
      Hagerstown Community College



      >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008 9:02 AM >>>
      Hi Everyone!

      Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is with the army
      ordinance trains on both
      sides, I've got two additional details to fill in...

      As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its ordinance trains
      with it across the Antietam
      on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War" was pretty
      explicit that orders specified that
      the trains were to cross over with the corps).

      Did 12th Corps do the same?

      And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is there any
      information as to _where_ these
      trains were posted by morning?

      Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical place would be in
      back of the East Woods
      probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger farms.

      1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes sense based on the
      location of the corps that
      night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My guess would be the
      trains would not have
      accompanied the infantry into positions on the Hagerstown Pike,
      but would have been
      dropped off someplace further back... perhaps even back where the
      12th Corps trains
      might have been.

      Any ideas?
    • Dean Essig
      Thanks for the responses guys... I ve been bedridden with the flu for a week now, so work has not exactly progressed at all. Dean ...
      Message 2 of 16 , Feb 27, 2008
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        Thanks for the responses guys... I've been bedridden
        with the flu for a week now, so work has not exactly
        progressed at all.

        Dean

        --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@...> wrote:

        > Not really as the woods obscured their position and
        > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect fire.
        > If they could not see it, they usually did not shoot
        > at it.
        >
        >
        > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
        > Professor of History
        > Hagerstown Community College
        >
        >
        >
        > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008
        > 10:27 AM >>>
        > Dear Tom,
        >
        > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
        > trains of the
        > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
        > Bridge? IIRC,
        > that would be well out of range of even the longest
        > ANV artillery
        > positions on the field.
        >
        > Yr. Obt. Svt.
        > G E "Gerry" Mayers
        >
        > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
        > adoption, or even
        > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any
        > state in the
        > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
        > benediction from
        > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
        > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
        > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
        > Trains
        >
        >
        > Dean,
        > I see you did not get any replies to this query. I
        > don't know
        > that the location of the supply trains is recorded
        > anywhere, but
        > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
        > Pofenberger was too
        > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was too
        > far out on
        > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps back
        > at their
        > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
        >
        >
        > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
        > Professor of History
        > Hagerstown Community College
        >
        >
        >
        > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008
        > 9:02 AM >>>
        > Hi Everyone!
        >
        > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is with
        > the army
        > ordinance trains on both
        > sides, I've got two additional details to fill in...
        >
        > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
        > ordinance trains
        > with it across the Antietam
        > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War" was
        > pretty
        > explicit that orders specified that
        > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
        >
        > Did 12th Corps do the same?
        >
        > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is there
        > any
        > information as to _where_ these
        > trains were posted by morning?
        >
        > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
        > place would be in
        > back of the East Woods
        > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
        > farms.
        >
        > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes sense
        > based on the
        > location of the corps that
        > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My guess
        > would be the
        > trains would not have
        > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
        > Hagerstown Pike,
        > but would have been
        > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps even
        > back where the
        > 12th Corps trains
        > might have been.
        >
        > Any ideas?
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >



        ____________________________________________________________________________________
        Looking for last minute shopping deals?
        Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
      • eighth_conn_inf
        Dean, If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments book, vol. 5, no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number: 110231175913. Larry F. ...
        Message 3 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          Dean,

          If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments book, vol. 5,
          no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number: 110231175913.
          Larry F.

          --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig <dean_essig@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been bedridden
          > with the flu for a week now, so work has not exactly
          > progressed at all.
          >
          > Dean
          >
          > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Not really as the woods obscured their position and
          > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect fire.
          > > If they could not see it, they usually did not shoot
          > > at it.
          > >
          > >
          > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
          > > Professor of History
          > > Hagerstown Community College
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008
          > > 10:27 AM >>>
          > > Dear Tom,
          > >
          > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
          > > trains of the
          > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
          > > Bridge? IIRC,
          > > that would be well out of range of even the longest
          > > ANV artillery
          > > positions on the field.
          > >
          > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
          > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
          > >
          > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
          > > adoption, or even
          > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any
          > > state in the
          > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
          > > benediction from
          > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
          > > ----- Original Message -----
          > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
          > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
          > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
          > > Trains
          > >
          > >
          > > Dean,
          > > I see you did not get any replies to this query. I
          > > don't know
          > > that the location of the supply trains is recorded
          > > anywhere, but
          > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
          > > Pofenberger was too
          > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was too
          > > far out on
          > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps back
          > > at their
          > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
          > >
          > >
          > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
          > > Professor of History
          > > Hagerstown Community College
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008
          > > 9:02 AM >>>
          > > Hi Everyone!
          > >
          > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is with
          > > the army
          > > ordinance trains on both
          > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill in...
          > >
          > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
          > > ordinance trains
          > > with it across the Antietam
          > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War" was
          > > pretty
          > > explicit that orders specified that
          > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
          > >
          > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
          > >
          > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is there
          > > any
          > > information as to _where_ these
          > > trains were posted by morning?
          > >
          > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
          > > place would be in
          > > back of the East Woods
          > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
          > > farms.
          > >
          > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes sense
          > > based on the
          > > location of the corps that
          > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My guess
          > > would be the
          > > trains would not have
          > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
          > > Hagerstown Pike,
          > > but would have been
          > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps even
          > > back where the
          > > 12th Corps trains
          > > might have been.
          > >
          > > Any ideas?
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          ______________________________________________________________________
          ______________
          > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
          > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
          http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
          >
        • Dean Essig
          Thanks Larry! I was able to get a copy via interlibrary loan, but I really want to add it to my collection... so I m bidding away. Hope I get it. Dean ...
          Message 4 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            Thanks Larry!

            I was able to get a copy via interlibrary loan, but I
            really want to add it to my collection... so I'm
            bidding away.

            Hope I get it.

            Dean
            --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:

            > Dean,
            >
            > If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
            > book, vol. 5,
            > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
            > 110231175913.
            > Larry F.
            >
            > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
            > <dean_essig@...>
            > wrote:
            > >
            > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
            > bedridden
            > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
            > exactly
            > > progressed at all.
            > >
            > > Dean
            > >
            > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
            > and
            > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
            > fire.
            > > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
            > shoot
            > > > at it.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
            > > > Professor of History
            > > > Hagerstown Community College
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008
            > > > 10:27 AM >>>
            > > > Dear Tom,
            > > >
            > > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
            > > > trains of the
            > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
            > > > Bridge? IIRC,
            > > > that would be well out of range of even the
            > longest
            > > > ANV artillery
            > > > positions on the field.
            > > >
            > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
            > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
            > > >
            > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
            > > > adoption, or even
            > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
            > any
            > > > state in the
            > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
            > > > benediction from
            > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
            > > > ----- Original Message -----
            > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
            > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
            > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
            > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
            > > > Trains
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Dean,
            > > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
            > I
            > > > don't know
            > > > that the location of the supply trains is
            > recorded
            > > > anywhere, but
            > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
            > > > Pofenberger was too
            > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
            > too
            > > > far out on
            > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
            > back
            > > > at their
            > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
            > > > Professor of History
            > > > Hagerstown Community College
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008
            > > > 9:02 AM >>>
            > > > Hi Everyone!
            > > >
            > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
            > with
            > > > the army
            > > > ordinance trains on both
            > > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
            > in...
            > > >
            > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
            > > > ordinance trains
            > > > with it across the Antietam
            > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
            > was
            > > > pretty
            > > > explicit that orders specified that
            > > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
            > > >
            > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
            > > >
            > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
            > there
            > > > any
            > > > information as to _where_ these
            > > > trains were posted by morning?
            > > >
            > > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
            > > > place would be in
            > > > back of the East Woods
            > > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
            > > > farms.
            > > >
            > > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
            > sense
            > > > based on the
            > > > location of the corps that
            > > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
            > guess
            > > > would be the
            > > > trains would not have
            > > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
            > > > Hagerstown Pike,
            > > > but would have been
            > > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
            > even
            > > > back where the
            > > > 12th Corps trains
            > > > might have been.
            > > >
            > > > Any ideas?
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            ______________________________________________________________________
            > ______________
            > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
            > > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
            >
            http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            === message truncated ===



            ____________________________________________________________________________________
            Looking for last minute shopping deals?
            Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
          • Dean Essig
            Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it violated e-bay policy or some such. Very odd.
            Message 5 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
              notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
              "violated e-bay policy" or some such.

              Very odd.

              --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:

              > Dean,
              >
              > If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
              > book, vol. 5,
              > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
              > 110231175913.
              > Larry F.
              >
              > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
              > <dean_essig@...>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
              > bedridden
              > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
              > exactly
              > > progressed at all.
              > >
              > > Dean
              > >
              > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
              > and
              > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
              > fire.
              > > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
              > shoot
              > > > at it.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
              > > > Professor of History
              > > > Hagerstown Community College
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008
              > > > 10:27 AM >>>
              > > > Dear Tom,
              > > >
              > > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
              > > > trains of the
              > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
              > > > Bridge? IIRC,
              > > > that would be well out of range of even the
              > longest
              > > > ANV artillery
              > > > positions on the field.
              > > >
              > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
              > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
              > > >
              > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
              > > > adoption, or even
              > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
              > any
              > > > state in the
              > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
              > > > benediction from
              > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
              > > > ----- Original Message -----
              > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
              > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
              > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
              > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
              > > > Trains
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Dean,
              > > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
              > I
              > > > don't know
              > > > that the location of the supply trains is
              > recorded
              > > > anywhere, but
              > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
              > > > Pofenberger was too
              > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
              > too
              > > > far out on
              > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
              > back
              > > > at their
              > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
              > > > Professor of History
              > > > Hagerstown Community College
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008
              > > > 9:02 AM >>>
              > > > Hi Everyone!
              > > >
              > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
              > with
              > > > the army
              > > > ordinance trains on both
              > > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
              > in...
              > > >
              > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
              > > > ordinance trains
              > > > with it across the Antietam
              > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
              > was
              > > > pretty
              > > > explicit that orders specified that
              > > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
              > > >
              > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
              > > >
              > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
              > there
              > > > any
              > > > information as to _where_ these
              > > > trains were posted by morning?
              > > >
              > > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
              > > > place would be in
              > > > back of the East Woods
              > > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
              > > > farms.
              > > >
              > > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
              > sense
              > > > based on the
              > > > location of the corps that
              > > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
              > guess
              > > > would be the
              > > > trains would not have
              > > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
              > > > Hagerstown Pike,
              > > > but would have been
              > > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
              > even
              > > > back where the
              > > > 12th Corps trains
              > > > might have been.
              > > >
              > > > Any ideas?
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              ______________________________________________________________________
              > ______________
              > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
              > > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
              >
              http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              === message truncated ===



              ____________________________________________________________________________________
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            • eighth_conn_inf
              Too bad--sure is strange. Maybe the seller found out the book is worth big bucks? Larry ... category=shopping ...
              Message 6 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                Too bad--sure is strange. Maybe the seller found out the book is
                worth big bucks?
                Larry

                --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig <dean_essig@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
                > notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
                > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                >
                > Very odd.
                >
                > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Dean,
                > >
                > > If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
                > > book, vol. 5,
                > > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
                > > 110231175913.
                > > Larry F.
                > >
                > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                > > <dean_essig@>
                > > wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                > > bedridden
                > > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
                > > exactly
                > > > progressed at all.
                > > >
                > > > Dean
                > > >
                > > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
                > > and
                > > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
                > > fire.
                > > > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
                > > shoot
                > > > > at it.
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                > > > > Professor of History
                > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@> 2/26/2008
                > > > > 10:27 AM >>>
                > > > > Dear Tom,
                > > > >
                > > > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
                > > > > trains of the
                > > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
                > > > > Bridge? IIRC,
                > > > > that would be well out of range of even the
                > > longest
                > > > > ANV artillery
                > > > > positions on the field.
                > > > >
                > > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                > > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                > > > >
                > > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
                > > > > adoption, or even
                > > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
                > > any
                > > > > state in the
                > > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
                > > > > benediction from
                > > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@>
                > > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                > > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
                > > > > Trains
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Dean,
                > > > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
                > > I
                > > > > don't know
                > > > > that the location of the supply trains is
                > > recorded
                > > > > anywhere, but
                > > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
                > > > > Pofenberger was too
                > > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
                > > too
                > > > > far out on
                > > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
                > > back
                > > > > at their
                > > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                > > > > Professor of History
                > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@> 2/17/2008
                > > > > 9:02 AM >>>
                > > > > Hi Everyone!
                > > > >
                > > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
                > > with
                > > > > the army
                > > > > ordinance trains on both
                > > > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
                > > in...
                > > > >
                > > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
                > > > > ordinance trains
                > > > > with it across the Antietam
                > > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
                > > was
                > > > > pretty
                > > > > explicit that orders specified that
                > > > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
                > > > >
                > > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
                > > > >
                > > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
                > > there
                > > > > any
                > > > > information as to _where_ these
                > > > > trains were posted by morning?
                > > > >
                > > > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
                > > > > place would be in
                > > > > back of the East Woods
                > > > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
                > > > > farms.
                > > > >
                > > > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
                > > sense
                > > > > based on the
                > > > > location of the corps that
                > > > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
                > > guess
                > > > > would be the
                > > > > trains would not have
                > > > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
                > > > > Hagerstown Pike,
                > > > > but would have been
                > > > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
                > > even
                > > > > back where the
                > > > > 12th Corps trains
                > > > > might have been.
                > > > >
                > > > > Any ideas?
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
                ______________________________________________________________________
                > > ______________
                > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
                > > > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
                > >
                > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?
                category=shopping
                > > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > === message truncated ===
                >
                >
                >
                >
                ______________________________________________________________________
                ______________
                > Be a better friend, newshound, and
                > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
                http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
                >
              • joseph_pierro
                Dean: I forget how this conversation started. Was there a particular article you wanted from that issue? ILL departments can get you articles as well as books.
                Message 7 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
                • 0 Attachment
                  Dean:

                  I forget how this conversation started. Was there a particular article
                  you wanted from that issue?

                  ILL departments can get you articles as well as books. (usually they
                  provide a photocopy, though some now will send you a PDF.) I know that
                  several of the larger research libraries here in VA have CW Regiments
                  in their holdings.

                  If you can't find a copy on the secondary market, that might be your
                  best bet. Ask your local library to ILL it for you.

                  --jake

                  >
                  > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig <dean_essig@>
                  > wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
                  > > notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
                  > > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                  > >
                  > > Very odd.
                  > >
                • G E Mayers
                  Dear Dean, It might not be the book itself but the seller..... Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                  Message 8 of 16 , Mar 7, 2008
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Dear Dean,

                    It might not be the book itself but the seller.....

                    Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    G E "Gerry" Mayers

                    To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                    on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                    Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                    the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Dean Essig" <dean_essig@...>
                    To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 9:15 PM
                    Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: 1st and 12th Corps Trains


                    > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
                    > notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
                    > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                    >
                    > Very odd.
                    >
                    > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >> Dean,
                    >>
                    >> If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
                    >> book, vol. 5,
                    >> no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
                    >> 110231175913.
                    >> Larry F.
                    >>
                    >> --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                    >> <dean_essig@...>
                    >> wrote:
                    >> >
                    >> > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                    >> bedridden
                    >> > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
                    >> exactly
                    >> > progressed at all.
                    >> >
                    >> > Dean
                    >> >
                    >> > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@...> wrote:
                    >> >
                    >> > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
                    >> and
                    >> > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
                    >> fire.
                    >> > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
                    >> shoot
                    >> > > at it.
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                    >> > > Professor of History
                    >> > > Hagerstown Community College
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 2/26/2008
                    >> > > 10:27 AM >>>
                    >> > > Dear Tom,
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
                    >> > > trains of the
                    >> > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
                    >> > > Bridge? IIRC,
                    >> > > that would be well out of range of even the
                    >> longest
                    >> > > ANV artillery
                    >> > > positions on the field.
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    >> > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    >> > >
                    >> > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
                    >> > > adoption, or even
                    >> > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
                    >> any
                    >> > > state in the
                    >> > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
                    >> > > benediction from
                    >> > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    >> > > ----- Original Message -----
                    >> > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
                    >> > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                    >> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                    >> > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
                    >> > > Trains
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Dean,
                    >> > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
                    >> I
                    >> > > don't know
                    >> > > that the location of the supply trains is
                    >> recorded
                    >> > > anywhere, but
                    >> > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
                    >> > > Pofenberger was too
                    >> > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
                    >> too
                    >> > > far out on
                    >> > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
                    >> back
                    >> > > at their
                    >> > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                    >> > > Professor of History
                    >> > > Hagerstown Community College
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@...> 2/17/2008
                    >> > > 9:02 AM >>>
                    >> > > Hi Everyone!
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
                    >> with
                    >> > > the army
                    >> > > ordinance trains on both
                    >> > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
                    >> in...
                    >> > >
                    >> > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
                    >> > > ordinance trains
                    >> > > with it across the Antietam
                    >> > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
                    >> was
                    >> > > pretty
                    >> > > explicit that orders specified that
                    >> > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
                    >> > >
                    >> > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
                    >> there
                    >> > > any
                    >> > > information as to _where_ these
                    >> > > trains were posted by morning?
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
                    >> > > place would be in
                    >> > > back of the East Woods
                    >> > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
                    >> > > farms.
                    >> > >
                    >> > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
                    >> sense
                    >> > > based on the
                    >> > > location of the corps that
                    >> > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
                    >> guess
                    >> > > would be the
                    >> > > trains would not have
                    >> > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
                    >> > > Hagerstown Pike,
                    >> > > but would have been
                    >> > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
                    >> even
                    >> > > back where the
                    >> > > 12th Corps trains
                    >> > > might have been.
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Any ideas?
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> > >
                    >> >
                    >> >
                    >> >
                    >> >
                    >>
                    > ______________________________________________________________________
                    >> ______________
                    >> > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
                    >> > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
                    >>
                    > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
                    >> >
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    > === message truncated ===
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ____________________________________________________________________________________
                    > Be a better friend, newshound, and
                    > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
                    > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
                    >
                    >
                    >
                  • eighth_conn_inf
                    Dean, Best price I ve found on other sites so far is $20 plus shipping, ISBN-13: 9781882810536. Savas shows not in stock:
                    Message 9 of 16 , Mar 8, 2008
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Dean,
                      Best price I've found on other sites so far is $20 plus shipping,
                      ISBN-13: 9781882810536. Savas shows not in stock:
                      http://www.savaspublishing.com/CWR5-3.html

                      Volume Five, No. 3:
                      Antietam: The Maryland
                      Campaign of 1862

                      200pp. Maps, photos, index,
                      paper. CORRECT 10 ISBN 1882810538

                      See also: Part II, Vol. 6, No. 2)

                      $12.99 SOLD OUT

                      SOLD OUT--Let us know if you would like your name on a waiting list
                      for this book. It might be reprinted.

                      Antietam: The Maryland Campaign of 1862 Essays on Union and
                      Confederate Leadership (ISBN: 1882810538)

                      Bookseller: Apoonbooks
                      (Ames, IA, U.S.A.)
                      Bookseller Rating:
                      Price: US$ 19.88
                      [Convert Currency]
                      Quantity: 1 Shipping within U.S.A.:
                      US$ 3.25
                      [Rates & Speeds]

                      Book Description: Stackpole Books, Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania,
                      U.S.A., 1997. Soft Cover. Book Condition: Very Good. No Jacket. 8vo -
                      over 7¾" - 9¾" tall. Very nice, very clean softcover book. Very clean
                      interior. Close to like new. AH. Bookseller Inventory # 000157

                      Larry

                      --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig <dean_essig@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
                      > notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
                      > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                      >
                      > Very odd.
                      >
                      > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > Dean,
                      > >
                      > > If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
                      > > book, vol. 5,
                      > > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
                      > > 110231175913.
                      > > Larry F.
                      > >
                      > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                      > > <dean_essig@>
                      > > wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                      > > bedridden
                      > > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
                      > > exactly
                      > > > progressed at all.
                      > > >
                      > > > Dean
                      > > >
                      > > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
                      > > and
                      > > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
                      > > fire.
                      > > > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
                      > > shoot
                      > > > > at it.
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                      > > > > Professor of History
                      > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@> 2/26/2008
                      > > > > 10:27 AM >>>
                      > > > > Dear Tom,
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
                      > > > > trains of the
                      > > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
                      > > > > Bridge? IIRC,
                      > > > > that would be well out of range of even the
                      > > longest
                      > > > > ANV artillery
                      > > > > positions on the field.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                      > > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                      > > > >
                      > > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
                      > > > > adoption, or even
                      > > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
                      > > any
                      > > > > state in the
                      > > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
                      > > > > benediction from
                      > > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                      > > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@>
                      > > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                      > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                      > > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
                      > > > > Trains
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Dean,
                      > > > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
                      > > I
                      > > > > don't know
                      > > > > that the location of the supply trains is
                      > > recorded
                      > > > > anywhere, but
                      > > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
                      > > > > Pofenberger was too
                      > > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
                      > > too
                      > > > > far out on
                      > > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
                      > > back
                      > > > > at their
                      > > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                      > > > > Professor of History
                      > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@> 2/17/2008
                      > > > > 9:02 AM >>>
                      > > > > Hi Everyone!
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
                      > > with
                      > > > > the army
                      > > > > ordinance trains on both
                      > > > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
                      > > in...
                      > > > >
                      > > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
                      > > > > ordinance trains
                      > > > > with it across the Antietam
                      > > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
                      > > was
                      > > > > pretty
                      > > > > explicit that orders specified that
                      > > > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
                      > > > >
                      > > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
                      > > there
                      > > > > any
                      > > > > information as to _where_ these
                      > > > > trains were posted by morning?
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
                      > > > > place would be in
                      > > > > back of the East Woods
                      > > > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
                      > > > > farms.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
                      > > sense
                      > > > > based on the
                      > > > > location of the corps that
                      > > > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
                      > > guess
                      > > > > would be the
                      > > > > trains would not have
                      > > > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
                      > > > > Hagerstown Pike,
                      > > > > but would have been
                      > > > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
                      > > even
                      > > > > back where the
                      > > > > 12th Corps trains
                      > > > > might have been.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Any ideas?
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > >
                      >
                      ______________________________________________________________________
                      > > ______________
                      > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
                      > > > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
                      > >
                      > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?
                      category=shopping
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > === message truncated ===
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      ______________________________________________________________________
                      ______________
                      > Be a better friend, newshound, and
                      > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
                      http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
                      >
                    • Stephen Recker
                      On Saturday March 15, at 10am, I will be giving a tour to a prospective battlefield guide. We will probably spend about three hours on the field. The tour will
                      Message 10 of 16 , Mar 8, 2008
                      • 0 Attachment
                        On Saturday March 15, at 10am, I will be giving a tour to a prospective
                        battlefield guide. We will probably spend about three hours on the
                        field. The tour will cover the whole campaign and the three main areas
                        of the field, with a concentration on the monuments.

                        At Antietam Battlefield Guides we offer mentoring to our guide
                        candidates. Veteran guides offer their time and talents to the
                        up-and-comers in an effort to ensure a strong, skilled guide force. And
                        besides that, it's just a lot of fun walking the battlefield with these
                        folks. This event is part of that program.

                        If you or anyone you know would like to join us, let me know, or simply
                        show up at the VC at 10am. You get a free tour and you get to support
                        our talented guide candidate. Thanks.

                        Cheers,
                        Stephen Recker
                        Antietam Battlefield Guides

                        P.O. Box 705
                        Sharpsburg, MD 21782
                        240-217-3664
                        800-417-9596

                        http://www.virtualantietam.com
                        http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
                        http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com
                      • Dean Essig
                        Found the Apoonbooks copy and ordered it. Hope this way works... thanks for all the help guys. Oh, I was able to get a copy of Tyler to Sharpsburg through
                        Message 11 of 16 , Mar 8, 2008
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Found the Apoonbooks copy and ordered it. Hope this
                          way works... thanks for all the help guys.

                          Oh, I was able to get a copy of "Tyler to Sharpsburg"
                          through ILL and they _did_ photocopy it for me, so now
                          I have one. :-)


                          --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:

                          > Dean,
                          > Best price I've found on other sites so far is $20
                          > plus shipping,
                          > ISBN-13: 9781882810536. Savas shows not in stock:
                          > http://www.savaspublishing.com/CWR5-3.html
                          >
                          > Volume Five, No. 3:
                          > Antietam: The Maryland
                          > Campaign of 1862
                          >
                          > 200pp. Maps, photos, index,
                          > paper. CORRECT 10 ISBN 1882810538
                          >
                          > See also: Part II, Vol. 6, No. 2)
                          >
                          > $12.99 SOLD OUT
                          >
                          > SOLD OUT--Let us know if you would like your name on
                          > a waiting list
                          > for this book. It might be reprinted.
                          >
                          > Antietam: The Maryland Campaign of 1862 Essays on
                          > Union and
                          > Confederate Leadership (ISBN: 1882810538)
                          >
                          > Bookseller: Apoonbooks
                          > (Ames, IA, U.S.A.)
                          > Bookseller Rating:
                          > Price: US$ 19.88
                          > [Convert Currency]
                          > Quantity: 1 Shipping within U.S.A.:
                          > US$ 3.25
                          > [Rates & Speeds]
                          >
                          > Book Description: Stackpole Books, Mechanicsburg,
                          > Pennsylvania,
                          > U.S.A., 1997. Soft Cover. Book Condition: Very Good.
                          > No Jacket. 8vo -
                          > over 7¾" - 9¾" tall. Very nice, very clean softcover
                          > book. Very clean
                          > interior. Close to like new. AH. Bookseller
                          > Inventory # 000157
                          >
                          > Larry
                          >
                          > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                          > <dean_essig@...>
                          > wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just
                          > got a
                          > > notice that the book was removed from e-bay
                          > because it
                          > > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                          > >
                          > > Very odd.
                          > >
                          > > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > > Dean,
                          > > >
                          > > > If you are still looking for the Civil War
                          > Regiments
                          > > > book, vol. 5,
                          > > > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item
                          > number:
                          > > > 110231175913.
                          > > > Larry F.
                          > > >
                          > > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                          > > > <dean_essig@>
                          > > > wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                          > > > bedridden
                          > > > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
                          > > > exactly
                          > > > > progressed at all.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Dean
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > > Not really as the woods obscured their
                          > position
                          > > > and
                          > > > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used
                          > indirect
                          > > > fire.
                          > > > > > If they could not see it, they usually did
                          > not
                          > > > shoot
                          > > > > > at it.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                          > > > > > Professor of History
                          > > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@> 2/26/2008
                          > > > > > 10:27 AM >>>
                          > > > > > Dear Tom,
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Would it have made more sense for the
                          > ordnance
                          > > > > > trains of the
                          > > > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the
                          > Upper
                          > > > > > Bridge? IIRC,
                          > > > > > that would be well out of range of even the
                          > > > longest
                          > > > > > ANV artillery
                          > > > > > positions on the field.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                          > > > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth,
                          > marriage,
                          > > > > > adoption, or even
                          > > > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction
                          > to
                          > > > any
                          > > > > > state in the
                          > > > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country,
                          > and a
                          > > > > > benediction from
                          > > > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                          > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@>
                          > > > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                          > > > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th
                          > Corps
                          > > > > > Trains
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Dean,
                          > > > > > I see you did not get any replies to this
                          > query.
                          > > > I
                          > > > > > don't know
                          > > > > > that the location of the supply trains is
                          > > > recorded
                          > > > > > anywhere, but
                          > > > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
                          > > > > > Pofenberger was too
                          > > > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it
                          > was
                          > > > too
                          > > > > > far out on
                          > > > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even
                          > perhaps
                          > > > back
                          > > > > > at their
                          > > > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be
                          > logical.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                          > > > > > Professor of History
                          > > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@> 2/17/2008
                          > > > > > 9:02 AM >>>
                          > > > > > Hi Everyone!
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal
                          > is
                          > > > with
                          > > > > > the army
                          > > > > > ordinance trains on both
                          > > > > > sides, I've got two additional details to
                          > fill
                          > > > in...
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought
                          > its
                          > > > > > ordinance trains
                          > > > > > with it across the Antietam
                          > > > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's
                          > War"
                          > > > was
                          > > > > > pretty
                          > > > > > explicit that orders specified that
                          > > > > > the trains were to cross over with the
                          > corps).
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate),
                          > is
                          > > > there
                          > > > > > any
                          > > > > > information as to _where_ these
                          > > > > > trains were posted by morning?
                          > > > > >
                          >
                          === message truncated ===



                          ____________________________________________________________________________________
                          Looking for last minute shopping deals?
                          Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
                        • Jim Rosebrock
                          Alabris, a book site has four copies. They are pricy. But I bought a copy earlier this week from them and it was in mint condition. Here is the link if you
                          Message 12 of 16 , Mar 8, 2008
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Alabris, a book site has four copies. They are pricy. But I bought a copy earlier this week from them and it was in mint condition. Here is the link if you would like to pursue.

                            Jim Rosebrock


                            http://www.alibris.com/booksearch?isbn=1882810538

                            eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                            Dean,
                            Best price I've found on other sites so far is $20 plus shipping,
                            ISBN-13: 9781882810536. Savas shows not in stock:
                            http://www.savaspublishing.com/CWR5-3.html

                            Volume Five, No. 3:
                            Antietam: The Maryland
                            Campaign of 1862

                            200pp. Maps, photos, index,
                            paper. CORRECT 10 ISBN 1882810538

                            See also: Part II, Vol. 6, No. 2)

                            $12.99 SOLD OUT

                            SOLD OUT--Let us know if you would like your name on a waiting list
                            for this book. It might be reprinted.

                            Antietam: The Maryland Campaign of 1862 Essays on Union and
                            Confederate Leadership (ISBN: 1882810538)

                            Bookseller: Apoonbooks
                            (Ames, IA, U.S.A.)
                            Bookseller Rating:
                            Price: US$ 19.88
                            [Convert Currency]
                            Quantity: 1 Shipping within U.S.A.:
                            US$ 3.25
                            [Rates & Speeds]

                            Book Description: Stackpole Books, Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania,
                            U.S.A., 1997. Soft Cover. Book Condition: Very Good. No Jacket. 8vo -
                            over 7¾" - 9¾" tall. Very nice, very clean softcover book. Very clean
                            interior. Close to like new. AH. Bookseller Inventory # 000157

                            Larry

                            --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig <dean_essig@...>
                            wrote:
                            >
                            > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and just got a
                            > notice that the book was removed from e-bay because it
                            > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                            >
                            > Very odd.
                            >
                            > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > > Dean,
                            > >
                            > > If you are still looking for the Civil War Regiments
                            > > book, vol. 5,
                            > > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item number:
                            > > 110231175913.
                            > > Larry F.
                            > >
                            > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                            > > <dean_essig@>
                            > > wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                            > > bedridden
                            > > > with the flu for a week now, so work has not
                            > > exactly
                            > > > progressed at all.
                            > > >
                            > > > Dean
                            > > >
                            > > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > > Not really as the woods obscured their position
                            > > and
                            > > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used indirect
                            > > fire.
                            > > > > If they could not see it, they usually did not
                            > > shoot
                            > > > > at it.
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                            > > > > Professor of History
                            > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@> 2/26/2008
                            > > > > 10:27 AM >>>
                            > > > > Dear Tom,
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Would it have made more sense for the ordnance
                            > > > > trains of the
                            > > > > First Corps to be more in the area of the Upper
                            > > > > Bridge? IIRC,
                            > > > > that would be well out of range of even the
                            > > longest
                            > > > > ANV artillery
                            > > > > positions on the field.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                            > > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                            > > > >
                            > > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
                            > > > > adoption, or even
                            > > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to
                            > > any
                            > > > > state in the
                            > > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a
                            > > > > benediction from
                            > > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                            > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@>
                            > > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                            > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                            > > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th Corps
                            > > > > Trains
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Dean,
                            > > > > I see you did not get any replies to this query.
                            > > I
                            > > > > don't know
                            > > > > that the location of the supply trains is
                            > > recorded
                            > > > > anywhere, but
                            > > > > your suppositions make sense. I think J.
                            > > > > Pofenberger was too
                            > > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north of it was
                            > > too
                            > > > > far out on
                            > > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even perhaps
                            > > back
                            > > > > at their
                            > > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be logical.
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                            > > > > Professor of History
                            > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > >>> "dean_essig" <dean_essig@> 2/17/2008
                            > > > > 9:02 AM >>>
                            > > > > Hi Everyone!
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Now that I'm satisfied I know what the deal is
                            > > with
                            > > > > the army
                            > > > > ordinance trains on both
                            > > > > sides, I've got two additional details to fill
                            > > in...
                            > > > >
                            > > > > As far as I understand, 1st Corps brought its
                            > > > > ordinance trains
                            > > > > with it across the Antietam
                            > > > > on the evening of the 16th. ("McClellan's War"
                            > > was
                            > > > > pretty
                            > > > > explicit that orders specified that
                            > > > > the trains were to cross over with the corps).
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Did 12th Corps do the same?
                            > > > >
                            > > > > And (in one or both cases as appropriate), is
                            > > there
                            > > > > any
                            > > > > information as to _where_ these
                            > > > > trains were posted by morning?
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Assuming 12th Corps brought theirs, the logical
                            > > > > place would be in
                            > > > > back of the East Woods
                            > > > > probably near the M. Miller or S. Poffenberger
                            > > > > farms.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > 1st Corps is tougher. J. Poffenberger makes
                            > > sense
                            > > > > based on the
                            > > > > location of the corps that
                            > > > > night, but is terribly exposed and forward. My
                            > > guess
                            > > > > would be the
                            > > > > trains would not have
                            > > > > accompanied the infantry into positions on the
                            > > > > Hagerstown Pike,
                            > > > > but would have been
                            > > > > dropped off someplace further back... perhaps
                            > > even
                            > > > > back where the
                            > > > > 12th Corps trains
                            > > > > might have been.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Any ideas?
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > >
                            >
                            __________________________________________________________
                            > > ______________
                            > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?
                            > > > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
                            > >
                            > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?
                            category=shopping
                            > > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > === message truncated ===
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            __________________________________________________________
                            ______________
                            > Be a better friend, newshound, and
                            > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
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                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Dean Essig
                            That s OK... I didn t see his post before ordering. A few $$ matters not as long as I get a copy. ;-) ... === message truncated ===
                            Message 13 of 16 , Mar 8, 2008
                            • 0 Attachment
                              That's OK... I didn't see his post before ordering. A
                              few $$ matters not as long as I get a copy. ;-)


                              --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:

                              > Dean,
                              > Tom Shay found a much better price--sorry I didn't
                              > find that one.
                              > Larry
                              > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                              > <dean_essig@...>
                              > wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Found the Apoonbooks copy and ordered it. Hope
                              > this
                              > > way works... thanks for all the help guys.
                              > >
                              > > Oh, I was able to get a copy of "Tyler to
                              > Sharpsburg"
                              > > through ILL and they _did_ photocopy it for me, so
                              > now
                              > > I have one. :-)
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@...> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > > Dean,
                              > > > Best price I've found on other sites so far is
                              > $20
                              > > > plus shipping,
                              > > > ISBN-13: 9781882810536. Savas shows not in
                              > stock:
                              > > > http://www.savaspublishing.com/CWR5-3.html
                              > > >
                              > > > Volume Five, No. 3:
                              > > > Antietam: The Maryland
                              > > > Campaign of 1862
                              > > >
                              > > > 200pp. Maps, photos, index,
                              > > > paper. CORRECT 10 ISBN 1882810538
                              > > >
                              > > > See also: Part II, Vol. 6, No. 2)
                              > > >
                              > > > $12.99 SOLD OUT
                              > > >
                              > > > SOLD OUT--Let us know if you would like your
                              > name on
                              > > > a waiting list
                              > > > for this book. It might be reprinted.
                              > > >
                              > > > Antietam: The Maryland Campaign of 1862 Essays
                              > on
                              > > > Union and
                              > > > Confederate Leadership (ISBN: 1882810538)
                              > > >
                              > > > Bookseller: Apoonbooks
                              > > > (Ames, IA, U.S.A.)
                              > > > Bookseller Rating:
                              > > > Price: US$ 19.88
                              > > > [Convert Currency]
                              > > > Quantity: 1 Shipping within U.S.A.:
                              > > > US$ 3.25
                              > > > [Rates & Speeds]
                              > > >
                              > > > Book Description: Stackpole Books,
                              > Mechanicsburg,
                              > > > Pennsylvania,
                              > > > U.S.A., 1997. Soft Cover. Book Condition: Very
                              > Good.
                              > > > No Jacket. 8vo -
                              > > > over 7¾" - 9¾" tall. Very nice, very clean
                              > softcover
                              > > > book. Very clean
                              > > > interior. Close to like new. AH. Bookseller
                              > > > Inventory # 000157
                              > > >
                              > > > Larry
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean Essig
                              > > > <dean_essig@>
                              > > > wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Well pooh... I put in a bid on the book and
                              > just
                              > > > got a
                              > > > > notice that the book was removed from e-bay
                              > > > because it
                              > > > > "violated e-bay policy" or some such.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Very odd.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > --- eighth_conn_inf <eighth_conn_inf@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > > Dean,
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > If you are still looking for the Civil War
                              > > > Regiments
                              > > > > > book, vol. 5,
                              > > > > > no. 3, there is one for sale on ebay Item
                              > > > number:
                              > > > > > 110231175913.
                              > > > > > Larry F.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Dean
                              > Essig
                              > > > > > <dean_essig@>
                              > > > > > wrote:
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > Thanks for the responses guys... I've been
                              > > > > > bedridden
                              > > > > > > with the flu for a week now, so work has
                              > not
                              > > > > > exactly
                              > > > > > > progressed at all.
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > Dean
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > --- Thomas Clemens <clemenst@> wrote:
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Not really as the woods obscured their
                              > > > position
                              > > > > > and
                              > > > > > > > Civil War artillery very seldom used
                              > > > indirect
                              > > > > > fire.
                              > > > > > > > If they could not see it, they usually
                              > did
                              > > > not
                              > > > > > shoot
                              > > > > > > > at it.
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                              > > > > > > > Professor of History
                              > > > > > > > Hagerstown Community College
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@> 2/26/2008
                              > > > > > > > 10:27 AM >>>
                              > > > > > > > Dear Tom,
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Would it have made more sense for the
                              > > > ordnance
                              > > > > > > > trains of the
                              > > > > > > > First Corps to be more in the area of
                              > the
                              > > > Upper
                              > > > > > > > Bridge? IIRC,
                              > > > > > > > that would be well out of range of even
                              > the
                              > > > > > longest
                              > > > > > > > ANV artillery
                              > > > > > > > positions on the field.
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                              > > > > > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth,
                              > > > marriage,
                              > > > > > > > adoption, or even
                              > > > > > > > on one's mother's side, is an
                              > introduction
                              > > > to
                              > > > > > any
                              > > > > > > > state in the
                              > > > > > > > Union, a passport to any foreign
                              > country,
                              > > > and a
                              > > > > > > > benediction from
                              > > > > > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                              > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                              > > > > > > > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@>
                              > > > > > > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 9:56 AM
                              > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 1st and 12th
                              > > > Corps
                              > > > > > > > Trains
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Dean,
                              > > > > > > > I see you did not get any replies to
                              > this
                              > > > query.
                              > > > > > I
                              > > > > > > > don't know
                              > > > > > > > that the location of the supply trains
                              > is
                              > > > > > recorded
                              > > > > > > > anywhere, but
                              > > > > > > > your suppositions make sense. I think
                              > J.
                              > > > > > > > Pofenberger was too
                              > > > > > > > exposed, and the Middlekauf farm north
                              > of it
                              > > > was
                              > > > > > too
                              > > > > > > > far out on
                              > > > > > > > the flank. Sam Poffenberger, or even
                              > > > perhaps
                              > > > > > back
                              > > > > > > > at their
                              > > > > > > > bivouac at eh George Line farm would be
                              > > > logical.
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              >
                              === message truncated ===



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