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Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.

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  • eighth_conn_inf
    Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of essays, Antietam.
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
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      Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
      essays, "Antietam."

      --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
      wrote:
      >
      > Dear Larry;
      >
      > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
      > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
      > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
      >
      > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
      > again might not.
      >
      > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough as
      > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
      > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
      >
      > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
      > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
      >
      > Yr. Obt. Svt.
      > G E "Gerry" Mayers
      >
      > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
      > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
      > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
      > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
      > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
      > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
      >
      >
      > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to hear
      > them
      > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
      > references pls let me know.
      >
      > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
      > everywhere
      > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
      > discuss the
      > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the National
      > Road
      > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading out
      > of
      > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question has
      > to do
      > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
      > marching
      > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on both
      > sides
      > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor for
      > the
      > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
      > minor
      > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
      > from
      > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
      >
      > <snip>
      >
    • G E Mayers
      Dear Larry, The Gallagher book Antietam is the one I was referring to. Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage,
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
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        Dear Larry,

        The Gallagher book "Antietam" is the one I was referring to.

        Yr. Obt. Svt.
        G E "Gerry" Mayers

        To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
        on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
        Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
        the Almighty God. --Anonymous
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
        To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:02 PM
        Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.


        Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
        essays, "Antietam."

        --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Dear Larry;
        >
        > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
        > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
        > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
        >
        > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
        > again might not.
        >
        > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough
        > as
        > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
        > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
        >
        > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
        > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
        >
        > Yr. Obt. Svt.
        > G E "Gerry" Mayers
        >
        > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
        > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
        > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
        > from
        > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
        > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
        > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
        >
        >
        > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to
        > hear
        > them
        > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
        > references pls let me know.
        >
        > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
        > everywhere
        > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
        > discuss the
        > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the
        > National
        > Road
        > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading
        > out
        > of
        > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question
        > has
        > to do
        > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
        > marching
        > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on
        > both
        > sides
        > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor
        > for
        > the
        > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
        > minor
        > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
        > from
        > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
        >
        > <snip>
        >
      • Harry Smeltzer
        For those who may be confused, there are two collections, one from Kent State and one from UNC. They are two different collections of Gallagher edited essays
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
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          For those who may be confused, there are two collections, one from Kent State and one from UNC. They are two different collections of Gallagher edited essays on the Maryland Campaign.

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: G E Mayers
          To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:08 PM
          Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.


          Dear Larry,

          The Gallagher book "Antietam" is the one I was referring to.

          Yr. Obt. Svt.
          G E "Gerry" Mayers

          To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
          on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
          Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
          the Almighty God. --Anonymous
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
          To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:02 PM
          Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.

          Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
          essays, "Antietam."

          --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Dear Larry;
          >
          > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
          > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
          > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
          >
          > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
          > again might not.
          >
          > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough
          > as
          > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
          > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
          >
          > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
          > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
          >
          > Yr. Obt. Svt.
          > G E "Gerry" Mayers
          >
          > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
          > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
          > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
          > from
          > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
          > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
          > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
          >
          >
          > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to
          > hear
          > them
          > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
          > references pls let me know.
          >
          > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
          > everywhere
          > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
          > discuss the
          > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the
          > National
          > Road
          > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading
          > out
          > of
          > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question
          > has
          > to do
          > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
          > marching
          > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on
          > both
          > sides
          > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor
          > for
          > the
          > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
          > minor
          > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
          > from
          > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
          >
          > <snip>
          >





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • eighth_conn_inf
          Thank you Gerry and Harry--fortunately for me I have both. I see references about straggling and bare feet but nothing specific yet about the Macadamized
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            Thank you Gerry and Harry--fortunately for me I have both. I see
            references about straggling and bare feet but nothing specific yet
            about the Macadamized turnpikes, but Carman has a couple. Just makes
            sense though that bare feet walking on crushed stone does not work no
            matter how tough those feet may be, IMO.

            Reminds me of my Conn. days when a fellow runner, Dr. Charlie
            Robinson, would run road races in bare feet! He was about 25 years
            older than I and always beat me--I started catching up when he
            reached his 70's. Of course his feet were toughened before he did
            this consistently and he did wear socks in the winter. I assume he
            had good biomechanics: no flat feet, no bunions, etc. Still, I always
            marveled at him. BTW, his doctorate was reportedly in psychology,
            figures.

            Larry F.

            --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > For those who may be confused, there are two collections, one from
            Kent State and one from UNC. They are two different collections of
            Gallagher edited essays on the Maryland Campaign.
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: G E Mayers
            > To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:08 PM
            > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
            >
            >
            > Dear Larry,
            >
            > The Gallagher book "Antietam" is the one I was referring to.
            >
            > Yr. Obt. Svt.
            > G E "Gerry" Mayers
            >
            > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
            > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
            > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
            > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
            > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:02 PM
            > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
            >
            > Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
            > essays, "Antietam."
            >
            > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@>
            > wrote:
            > >
            > > Dear Larry;
            > >
            > > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
            > > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
            > > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
            > >
            > > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
            > > again might not.
            > >
            > > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough
            > > as
            > > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
            > > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
            > >
            > > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
            > > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
            > >
            > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
            > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
            > >
            > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
            > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
            > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
            > > from
            > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
            > > ----- Original Message -----
            > > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@>
            > > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
            > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
            > > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
            > >
            > >
            > > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to
            > > hear
            > > them
            > > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
            > > references pls let me know.
            > >
            > > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
            > > everywhere
            > > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
            > > discuss the
            > > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the
            > > National
            > > Road
            > > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading
            > > out
            > > of
            > > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question
            > > has
            > > to do
            > > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
            > > marching
            > > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on
            > > both
            > > sides
            > > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor
            > > for
            > > the
            > > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
            > > minor
            > > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
            > > from
            > > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
            > >
            > > <snip>
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Harry Smeltzer
            Back in the 70 s, when a different version of me ran cross-country, we would occasionally run on the blacktop roads barefoot to toughen up our feet. We d also
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              Back in the 70's, when a different version of me ran cross-country, we would
              occasionally run on the blacktop roads barefoot to toughen up our feet.
              We'd also spray the soles of our feet with something called "Tuf Skin" - I
              don't think it actually made your skin tough, but we thought it did.
              Everyone wanted to be Abebe Bikila.

              Yep, I imagine macadam (not nearly as smooth as blacktop, and less stable)
              would wreak havoc on bare feet, no matter how tough.



              -----Original Message-----
              From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com [mailto:TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com] On
              Behalf Of eighth_conn_inf
              Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 7:20 PM
              To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.



              Thank you Gerry and Harry--fortunately for me I have both. I see
              references about straggling and bare feet but nothing specific yet
              about the Macadamized turnpikes, but Carman has a couple. Just makes
              sense though that bare feet walking on crushed stone does not work no
              matter how tough those feet may be, IMO.

              Reminds me of my Conn. days when a fellow runner, Dr. Charlie
              Robinson, would run road races in bare feet! He was about 25 years
              older than I and always beat me--I started catching up when he
              reached his 70's. Of course his feet were toughened before he did
              this consistently and he did wear socks in the winter. I assume he
              had good biomechanics: no flat feet, no bunions, etc. Still, I always
              marveled at him. BTW, his doctorate was reportedly in psychology,
              figures.

              Larry F.

              --- In TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com, "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > For those who may be confused, there are two collections, one from
              Kent State and one from UNC. They are two different collections of
              Gallagher edited essays on the Maryland Campaign.
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: G E Mayers
              > To: TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:08 PM
              > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
              >
              >
              > Dear Larry,
              >
              > The Gallagher book "Antietam" is the one I was referring to.
              >
              > Yr. Obt. Svt.
              > G E "Gerry" Mayers
              >
              > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
              > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
              > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
              > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...>
              > To: <TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:02 PM
              > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
              >
              > Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
              > essays, "Antietam."
              >
              > --- In TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > Dear Larry;
              > >
              > > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
              > > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
              > > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
              > >
              > > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
              > > again might not.
              > >
              > > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough
              > > as
              > > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
              > > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
              > >
              > > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
              > > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
              > >
              > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
              > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
              > >
              > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
              > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
              > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
              > > from
              > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
              > > ----- Original Message -----
              > > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@>
              > > To: <TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com>
              > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
              > > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
              > >
              > >
              > > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to
              > > hear
              > > them
              > > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
              > > references pls let me know.
              > >
              > > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
              > > everywhere
              > > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
              > > discuss the
              > > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the
              > > National
              > > Road
              > > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading
              > > out
              > > of
              > > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question
              > > has
              > > to do
              > > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
              > > marching
              > > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on
              > > both
              > > sides
              > > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor
              > > for
              > > the
              > > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
              > > minor
              > > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
              > > from
              > > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
              > >
              > > <snip>
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Thomas Clemens
              Yes the dates of destruction of bridges, Johnson s orders, are correct. Hagerstown Pike and Boonsboro Shepherdstown Pike were private toll roads. Although
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                Yes the dates of destruction of bridges, Johnson's orders, are correct. Hagerstown Pike and Boonsboro Shepherdstown Pike were private toll roads. Although perhaps not of the quality of the National Road, both were nominally macademized.
                There are several accounts of shoeless Confederates being weeded out before crossing the Potomac. Supposedly they were sent to Winchester to get supplied with shoes and then meet Lee in Hagerstown area. Therfore, most rebs in the MD campaign had shoes, or at least were supposed to have shoes. I have a newspaper account from a Lt. writing his hometown paper about guys left in VA for lack of shoes, or other physical ailments.


                Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                Professor of History
                Hagerstown Community College


                >>> "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...> 01/16/08 4:46 PM >>>
                If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to hear them
                but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
                references pls let me know.

                Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were everywhere
                but he does not say which roads were and to what length or discuss the
                quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the National Road
                was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading out of
                D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question has to do
                with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and marching
                around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on both sides
                but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor for the
                Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very minor
                concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg from
                Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?

                I've read that the bridges at Point of Rocks, Shepherdstown, and
                Brunswick were all burned at Jackson's orders (Johnston's?) on 9 June
                1861--I have 2 references (Robertson: "Stonewall" and
                Turner "Railroads" showing the RR bridge at HF was blown up on 14 June.
                Are these dates correct?

                The RR bridge at HF was the only bridge across either river in 1861?
                But what about the Winchester and Potomac RR; did it cross the
                Shenendoah at HF or how did it connect with the B&O? I understand that
                during the Maryland Campaign the pontoon bridge above the burned B&O RR
                bridge was the only bridge still intact?

                Thank you,
                Larry F.
              • eighth_conn_inf
                Thanks Tom, Any idea about the RR bridge for the Winchester Potomac? Was there a RR bridge that carried the WP across the Shenandoah or Potomac near HF? I
                Message 7 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
                • 0 Attachment
                  Thanks Tom,

                  Any idea about the RR bridge for the Winchester Potomac? Was there a
                  RR bridge that carried the WP across the Shenandoah or Potomac near
                  HF?

                  I wonder if the Macadamized road also had a bad effort upon horses.
                  Of course they had shoes but I guess they would last the month that
                  they spend in Maryland regardless. I read in Carman that the
                  Confederates tried to weed out weaker horses before entering
                  Maryland; I also read that some Confederates threw away their shoes
                  so they could stay in Virginia.

                  --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Yes the dates of destruction of bridges, Johnson's orders, are
                  correct. Hagerstown Pike and Boonsboro Shepherdstown Pike were
                  private toll roads. Although perhaps not of the quality of the
                  National Road, both were nominally macademized.
                  > There are several accounts of shoeless Confederates being weeded
                  out before crossing the Potomac. Supposedly they were sent to
                  Winchester to get supplied with shoes and then meet Lee in Hagerstown
                  area. Therfore, most rebs in the MD campaign had shoes, or at least
                  were supposed to have shoes. I have a newspaper account from a Lt.
                  writing his hometown paper about guys left in VA for lack of shoes,
                  or other physical ailments.
                  >
                  >
                  > Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                  > Professor of History
                  > Hagerstown Community College
                  >
                  >
                  > >>> "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...> 01/16/08 4:46 PM >>>
                  > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to hear
                  them
                  > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
                  > references pls let me know.
                  >
                  > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
                  everywhere
                  > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or discuss
                  the
                  > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the National
                  Road
                  > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading out of
                  > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question has
                  to do
                  > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
                  marching
                  > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on both
                  sides
                  > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor for
                  the
                  > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
                  minor
                  > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
                  from
                  > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
                  >
                  > I've read that the bridges at Point of Rocks, Shepherdstown, and
                  > Brunswick were all burned at Jackson's orders (Johnston's?) on 9
                  June
                  > 1861--I have 2 references (Robertson: "Stonewall" and
                  > Turner "Railroads" showing the RR bridge at HF was blown up on 14
                  June.
                  > Are these dates correct?
                  >
                  > The RR bridge at HF was the only bridge across either river in
                  1861?
                  > But what about the Winchester and Potomac RR; did it cross the
                  > Shenendoah at HF or how did it connect with the B&O? I understand
                  that
                  > during the Maryland Campaign the pontoon bridge above the burned
                  B&O RR
                  > bridge was the only bridge still intact?
                  >
                  > Thank you,
                  > Larry F.
                  >
                • eighth_conn_inf
                  Back then running shoes supplied little support anyway IIRC. In recent years, the great variety of shoes makes it easy. Now I run so slow and short that
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jan 16, 2008
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                    Back then "running" shoes supplied little support anyway IIRC. In
                    recent years, the great variety of shoes makes it easy. Now I run so
                    slow and short that whatever Costco has on sale is good enough.

                    My guess is that CW Macadamized roads unless they were well
                    maintained probably had more dirt than crushed stone on the roadbed.

                    --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > Back in the 70's, when a different version of me ran cross-country,
                    we would
                    > occasionally run on the blacktop roads barefoot to toughen up our
                    feet.
                    > We'd also spray the soles of our feet with something called "Tuf
                    Skin" - I
                    > don't think it actually made your skin tough, but we thought it did.
                    > Everyone wanted to be Abebe Bikila.
                    >
                    > Yep, I imagine macadam (not nearly as smooth as blacktop, and less
                    stable)
                    > would wreak havoc on bare feet, no matter how tough.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
                    [mailto:TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com] On
                    > Behalf Of eighth_conn_inf
                    > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 7:20 PM
                    > To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Thank you Gerry and Harry--fortunately for me I have both. I see
                    > references about straggling and bare feet but nothing specific yet
                    > about the Macadamized turnpikes, but Carman has a couple. Just
                    makes
                    > sense though that bare feet walking on crushed stone does not work
                    no
                    > matter how tough those feet may be, IMO.
                    >
                    > Reminds me of my Conn. days when a fellow runner, Dr. Charlie
                    > Robinson, would run road races in bare feet! He was about 25 years
                    > older than I and always beat me--I started catching up when he
                    > reached his 70's. Of course his feet were toughened before he did
                    > this consistently and he did wear socks in the winter. I assume he
                    > had good biomechanics: no flat feet, no bunions, etc. Still, I
                    always
                    > marveled at him. BTW, his doctorate was reportedly in psychology,
                    > figures.
                    >
                    > Larry F.
                    >
                    > --- In TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > yahoogroups.com, "Harry Smeltzer" <hjs21@>
                    > wrote:
                    > >
                    > > For those who may be confused, there are two collections, one
                    from
                    > Kent State and one from UNC. They are two different collections of
                    > Gallagher edited essays on the Maryland Campaign.
                    > >
                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                    > > From: G E Mayers
                    > > To: TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
                    yahoogroups.com
                    > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:08 PM
                    > > Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Dear Larry,
                    > >
                    > > The Gallagher book "Antietam" is the one I was referring to.
                    > >
                    > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    > >
                    > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                    > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                    > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                    > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                    > > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@>
                    > > To: <TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > yahoogroups.com>
                    > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 6:02 PM
                    > > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
                    > >
                    > > Thanks Gerry, I will check out that book and his other book of
                    > > essays, "Antietam."
                    > >
                    > > --- In TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@>
                    > > wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Dear Larry;
                    > > >
                    > > > To the best of my knowledge the National Road was definitely
                    > > > macadamized; the Boonsborough Pike may have been but, since it
                    > > > led right into Sharpsburg, I would doubt it.
                    > > >
                    > > > The Hagerstown Turnpike also might have been macadamized but
                    > > > again might not.
                    > > >
                    > > > At that point in the war, Southern footsoles were not as tough
                    > > > as
                    > > > they would be about a year later. Straggling due to the road
                    > > > surfaces was a major problem during the campaign.
                    > > >
                    > > > Gary Gallaher's editing of the volume titled "The Antietam
                    > > > Campaign" has several good essays in it that might be helpful.
                    > > >
                    > > > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    > > > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    > > >
                    > > > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                    > > > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                    > > > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
                    > > > from
                    > > > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    > > > ----- Original Message -----
                    > > > From: "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@>
                    > > > To: <TalkAntietam@ <mailto:TalkAntietam%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > yahoogroups.com>
                    > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:46 PM
                    > > > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Macadamized turnpikes, RR's, etc.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > If folks have some answers/opinions re the below I'd like to
                    > > > hear
                    > > > them
                    > > > but pls don't spend time researching: if you have good specific
                    > > > references pls let me know.
                    > > >
                    > > > Macadamized (crushed rock) roads according to Carman were
                    > > > everywhere
                    > > > but he does not say which roads were and to what length or
                    > > > discuss the
                    > > > quality of the use of crushed rock. My guess is that the
                    > > > National
                    > > > Road
                    > > > was fully macadamized as were many of the main roads leading
                    > > > out
                    > > > of
                    > > > D.C. How about the roads/pikes around Sharpsburg? My question
                    > > > has
                    > > > to do
                    > > > with the many barefoot Confederates coming out of Virginia and
                    > > > marching
                    > > > around during the Maryland Campaign. Straggling was heavy on
                    > > > both
                    > > > sides
                    > > > but wasn't the factor of shod v. unshod feet more of a factor
                    > > > for
                    > > > the
                    > > > Confederates? Or are road surfaces during the campaign of very
                    > > > minor
                    > > > concern? I wondered about Jackson's slow marches to Martinsburg
                    > > > from
                    > > > Frederick and then to HF--barefooted, slow soldiers?
                    > > >
                    > > > <snip>
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                  • Thomas Clemens
                    Larry, Only one bridge crossed the river at HF. It carried the B&O RR across the river as well as foot traffic. On the VA shore a station lay between the B&O
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jan 17, 2008
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                      Larry,
                      Only one bridge crossed the river at HF. It carried the B&O RR across the river as well as foot traffic. On the VA shore a station lay between the B&O which curved to the right and went west, and the Winchester & Potomac which went straight ahead. Although the station is gone the same split in the tracks exists today.


                      Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                      Professor of History
                      Hagerstown Community College
                    • eighth_conn_inf
                      Thanks Tom--that clears that up for me. ... across the river as well as foot traffic. On the VA shore a station lay between the B&O which curved to the right
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jan 17, 2008
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                        Thanks Tom--that clears that up for me.

                        --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
                        wrote:
                        >
                        > Larry,
                        > Only one bridge crossed the river at HF. It carried the B&O RR
                        across the river as well as foot traffic. On the VA shore a station
                        lay between the B&O which curved to the right and went west, and the
                        Winchester & Potomac which went straight ahead. Although the station
                        is gone the same split in the tracks exists today.
                        >
                        >
                        > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
                        > Professor of History
                        > Hagerstown Community College
                        >
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