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Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question

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  • G E Mayers
    James, Priest is good also, but a lot of what he writes or cites is just plain wrong.... There are many instances of his citations being wrong or incorrect. He
    Message 1 of 30 , May 29, 2007
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      James,

      Priest is good also, but a lot of what he writes or cites is just
      plain wrong.... There are many instances of his citations being
      wrong or incorrect.

      He also can be very confusing to read..............

      Yr. Obt. Svt.
      G E "Gerry" Mayers

      To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
      on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
      Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
      the Almighty God. --Anonymous
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "James W. Durney" <JWD2044@...>
      To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 11:07 AM
      Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question


      No one has mentioned Priest's book on the battle. The first
      Antietam
      book I read was Sears' book, somehow it left me with a very bad
      impression of the battle. Years later, I picked up the Preist
      book and
      found a different view, which lead me to Harsh's work. I know
      Priest
      has been savaged for his South Mt. battle book by some people.
      However, I would like to know why his Antietam book has been left
      off
      every list.

      James
    • Phen62
      Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through, and Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it is helpful to Read Confederate
      Message 2 of 30 , May 29, 2007
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        Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through, and
        Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it is
        helpful to Read Confederate Tide Rising as well as Taken at the Flood.
        I believe he meant them to be one work. Of all the books mentioned,
        Sears has by far the best maps, not a small consideration.

        Stephen
      • G E Mayers
        Dear Stephen, Your point about Harsh is definitely well taken. However, Sears maps are not as good as those in Murfin s Gleam of Bayonets. Yr. Obt. Svt. G E
        Message 3 of 30 , May 29, 2007
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          Dear Stephen,

          Your point about Harsh is definitely well taken.

          However, Sears' maps are not as good as those in Murfin's Gleam
          of Bayonets.

          Yr. Obt. Svt.
          G E "Gerry" Mayers

          To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
          on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
          Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
          the Almighty God. --Anonymous
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Phen62" <phen@...>
          To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:18 PM
          Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question


          Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through, and
          Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it
          is
          helpful to Read Confederate Tide Rising as well as Taken at the
          Flood.
          I believe he meant them to be one work. Of all the books
          mentioned,
          Sears has by far the best maps, not a small consideration.

          Stephen
        • T. R. Livesey
          I agree with Gerry: Murfin s maps are better than Sears . Priest s maps are better than Sears . The Carman-Cope Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam , of
          Message 4 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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            I agree with Gerry: Murfin's maps are better than Sears'. Priest's
            maps are better than Sears'.

            The Carman-Cope "Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam", of course, is
            in a class of its own.

            TRL

            --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> wrote:
            >
            > Dear Stephen,
            >
            > Your point about Harsh is definitely well taken.
            >
            > However, Sears' maps are not as good as those in Murfin's Gleam
            > of Bayonets.
            >
            > Yr. Obt. Svt.
            > G E "Gerry" Mayers
            >
            > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
            > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
            > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
            > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Phen62" <phen@...>
            > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:18 PM
            > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
            >
            >
            > Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through, and
            > Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it
            > is
            > helpful to Read Confederate Tide Rising as well as Taken at the
            > Flood.
            > I believe he meant them to be one work. Of all the books
            > mentioned,
            > Sears has by far the best maps, not a small consideration.
            >
            > Stephen
            >
          • G E Mayers
            Dear Todd, IIRC Murfin used the Cope maps for his book.... Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
            Message 5 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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              Dear Todd,

              IIRC Murfin used the Cope maps for his book....

              Yr. Obt. Svt.
              G E "Gerry" Mayers

              To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
              on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
              Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
              the Almighty God. --Anonymous
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
              To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 12:40 PM
              Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question


              I agree with Gerry: Murfin's maps are better than Sears'.
              Priest's
              maps are better than Sears'.

              The Carman-Cope "Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam", of
              course, is
              in a class of its own.

              TRL

              --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > Dear Stephen,
              >
              > Your point about Harsh is definitely well taken.
              >
              > However, Sears' maps are not as good as those in Murfin's Gleam
              > of Bayonets.
              >
              > Yr. Obt. Svt.
              > G E "Gerry" Mayers
              >
              > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
              > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
              > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
              > from
              > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: "Phen62" <phen@...>
              > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:18 PM
              > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
              >
              >
              > Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through,
              > and
              > Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it
              > is
              > helpful to Read Confederate Tide Rising as well as Taken at the
              > Flood.
              > I believe he meant them to be one work. Of all the books
              > mentioned,
              > Sears has by far the best maps, not a small consideration.
              >
              > Stephen
              >
            • T. R. Livesey
              Gerry, In Murfin s introduction, he states that the maps are the work of James D. Bowlby, the result of 10 years of field surveys, a revision of the Cope maps.
              Message 6 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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                Gerry,

                In Murfin's introduction, he states that the maps are the work of
                James D. Bowlby, the result of 10 years of field surveys, a revision
                of the Cope maps. The base map looks a lot like the Cope maps, but
                use terrain symbols much more suitable for smaller-scale reproduction.
                There are a few differences: one shows a corn field where the other
                shows clover, etc. Inexplicably, the elevation contour lines have
                been removed in Murphin's, seriously compromising their usefulness.

                Priest uses the "Parks and History Association" map as his base, which
                I think more closely follows the Cope maps. It uses symbols that are
                similar, but not identical to the Cope maps. I don't know the history
                of this map. It too lacks elevation markings.

                From my experience, including elevation markings is always a
                challenge, especially if you want to zoom out and show a broader
                expanse of area. The downside, of course, is that you end up with
                maps that look like the way Sears' text reads: there is no way to
                really understand how the terrain affects the situation. For example,
                in the maps of all three of these books, the reader cannot appreciate
                the situation in the 40 acre cornfield: how can the 4RI get `lost'?
                How can A.P. Hill come up out of nowhere on Burnside's left? I think
                a serious argument can be made that the elevation information is more
                important than the ground cover information (woods vs. corn vs.
                clover, etc.). But ground cover maps are more aesthetically pleasing
                to look at and readers are drawn to them.

                The obvious solution to the `busying-up' effect of contour lines is to
                use contours of greater intervals: 50 ft. instead of 20 ft. or
                whatever. Curiously, the version of the Parks and History Association
                map sold at the Antietam bookstore is plenty large for contour
                makings, but they are nonetheless omitted. I think somehow the authors
                of these maps have simply decided that elevation markings are not
                necessary. This is why the Cope maps are far more useful than any of
                these others.

                TRL

                --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> wrote:
                >
                > Dear Todd,
                >
                > IIRC Murfin used the Cope maps for his book....
                >
                > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                >
                > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                > ----- Original Message -----
                > From: "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
                > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                > Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 12:40 PM
                > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
                >
                >
                > I agree with Gerry: Murfin's maps are better than Sears'.
                > Priest's
                > maps are better than Sears'.
                >
                > The Carman-Cope "Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam", of
                > course, is
                > in a class of its own.
                >
                > TRL
                >

                >
              • G E Mayers
                Thanks Todd. BTW the Trailhead Graphics map of Antietam is simply superb... but unfortunately not possible to put in a book. Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers
                Message 7 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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                  Thanks Todd.

                  BTW the Trailhead Graphics map of Antietam is simply superb...
                  but unfortunately not possible to put in a book.

                  Yr. Obt. Svt.
                  G E "Gerry" Mayers

                  To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                  on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                  Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                  the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
                  To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 1:36 PM
                  Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question


                  Gerry,

                  In Murfin's introduction, he states that the maps are the work of
                  James D. Bowlby, the result of 10 years of field surveys, a
                  revision
                  of the Cope maps. The base map looks a lot like the Cope maps,
                  but
                  use terrain symbols much more suitable for smaller-scale
                  reproduction.
                  There are a few differences: one shows a corn field where the
                  other
                  shows clover, etc. Inexplicably, the elevation contour lines
                  have
                  been removed in Murphin's, seriously compromising their
                  usefulness.

                  Priest uses the "Parks and History Association" map as his base,
                  which
                  I think more closely follows the Cope maps. It uses symbols that
                  are
                  similar, but not identical to the Cope maps. I don't know the
                  history
                  of this map. It too lacks elevation markings.

                  From my experience, including elevation markings is always a
                  challenge, especially if you want to zoom out and show a broader
                  expanse of area. The downside, of course, is that you end up
                  with
                  maps that look like the way Sears' text reads: there is no way to
                  really understand how the terrain affects the situation. For
                  example,
                  in the maps of all three of these books, the reader cannot
                  appreciate
                  the situation in the 40 acre cornfield: how can the 4RI get
                  `lost'?
                  How can A.P. Hill come up out of nowhere on Burnside's left? I
                  think
                  a serious argument can be made that the elevation information is
                  more
                  important than the ground cover information (woods vs. corn vs.
                  clover, etc.). But ground cover maps are more aesthetically
                  pleasing
                  to look at and readers are drawn to them.

                  The obvious solution to the `busying-up' effect of contour lines
                  is to
                  use contours of greater intervals: 50 ft. instead of 20 ft. or
                  whatever. Curiously, the version of the Parks and History
                  Association
                  map sold at the Antietam bookstore is plenty large for contour
                  makings, but they are nonetheless omitted. I think somehow the
                  authors
                  of these maps have simply decided that elevation markings are not
                  necessary. This is why the Cope maps are far more useful than any
                  of
                  these others.

                  TRL

                  --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Dear Todd,
                  >
                  > IIRC Murfin used the Cope maps for his book....
                  >
                  > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                  > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                  >
                  > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                  > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                  > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction
                  > from
                  > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
                  > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                  > Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 12:40 PM
                  > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
                  >
                  >
                  > I agree with Gerry: Murfin's maps are better than Sears'.
                  > Priest's
                  > maps are better than Sears'.
                  >
                  > The Carman-Cope "Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam", of
                  > course, is
                  > in a class of its own.
                  >
                  > TRL
                  >

                  >
                • Thomas Clemens
                  TR, I couldn t agree more! The P&H map is the base map of the Carman/Cope maps, but they do indeed leave out the elevation markings. Great if you want to
                  Message 8 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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                    TR,
                    I couldn't agree more! The P&H map is the base map of the Carman/Cope maps, but they do indeed leave out the elevation markings. Great if you want to know crops types, fences, etc. but not good for understanding the battle. Preist used this map, but the whole thing never appears in the book so if you don't know the field to begin with, you'll be lost like a hiccup in a hurricane. Also he used some odd symbols for artillery, etc.
                    Tom Clemen

                    Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                    Professor of History
                    Hagerstown Community College

                    s
                    >>> "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...> 05/30/07 1:36 PM >>>

                    Gerry,

                    In Murfin's introduction, he states that the maps are the work of
                    James D. Bowlby, the result of 10 years of field surveys, a revision
                    of the Cope maps. The base map looks a lot like the Cope maps, but
                    use terrain symbols much more suitable for smaller-scale reproduction.
                    There are a few differences: one shows a corn field where the other
                    shows clover, etc. Inexplicably, the elevation contour lines have
                    been removed in Murphin's, seriously compromising their usefulness.

                    Priest uses the "Parks and History Association" map as his base, which
                    I think more closely follows the Cope maps. It uses symbols that are
                    similar, but not identical to the Cope maps. I don't know the history
                    of this map. It too lacks elevation markings.

                    From my experience, including elevation markings is always a
                    challenge, especially if you want to zoom out and show a broader
                    expanse of area. The downside, of course, is that you end up with
                    maps that look like the way Sears' text reads: there is no way to
                    really understand how the terrain affects the situation. For example,
                    in the maps of all three of these books, the reader cannot appreciate
                    the situation in the 40 acre cornfield: how can the 4RI get `lost'?
                    How can A.P. Hill come up out of nowhere on Burnside's left? I think
                    a serious argument can be made that the elevation information is more
                    important than the ground cover information (woods vs. corn vs.
                    clover, etc.). But ground cover maps are more aesthetically pleasing
                    to look at and readers are drawn to them.

                    The obvious solution to the `busying-up' effect of contour lines is to
                    use contours of greater intervals: 50 ft. instead of 20 ft. or
                    whatever. Curiously, the version of the Parks and History Association
                    map sold at the Antietam bookstore is plenty large for contour
                    makings, but they are nonetheless omitted. I think somehow the authors
                    of these maps have simply decided that elevation markings are not
                    necessary. This is why the Cope maps are far more useful than any of
                    these others.

                    TRL

                    --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Dear Todd,
                    >
                    > IIRC Murfin used the Cope maps for his book....
                    >
                    > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    >
                    > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                    > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                    > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                    > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
                    > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                    > Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 12:40 PM
                    > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
                    >
                    >
                    > I agree with Gerry: Murfin's maps are better than Sears'.
                    > Priest's
                    > maps are better than Sears'.
                    >
                    > The Carman-Cope "Atlas of the battlefield of Antietam", of
                    > course, is
                    > in a class of its own.
                    >
                    > TRL
                    >

                    >





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • James W. Durney
                    ... example, ... appreciate ... think ... more ... I think Anitetam cannot be understood w/o elevation markings. My first chance to walk the battlefield was a
                    Message 9 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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                      --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > From my experience, including elevation markings is always a
                      > challenge, especially if you want to zoom out and show a broader
                      > expanse of area. The downside, of course, is that you end up with
                      > maps that look like the way Sears' text reads: there is no way to
                      > really understand how the terrain affects the situation. For
                      example,
                      > in the maps of all three of these books, the reader cannot
                      appreciate
                      > the situation in the 40 acre cornfield: how can the 4RI get `lost'?
                      > How can A.P. Hill come up out of nowhere on Burnside's left? I
                      think
                      > a serious argument can be made that the elevation information is
                      more
                      > important than the ground cover information (woods vs. corn vs.
                      > clover, etc.).


                      I think Anitetam cannot be understood w/o elevation markings. My
                      first chance to walk the battlefield was a revelation that I will
                      never forget. Neither Sears, Priest or Harsh had told me how much
                      elevation impacts the battle.

                      James
                    • T. R. Livesey
                      Murfin s maps also suffer somewhat from the problem that there is no image of the whole battlefield, making orientation difficult. Since I owned a copy of the
                      Message 10 of 30 , May 30, 2007
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                        Murfin's maps also suffer somewhat from the problem that there is no
                        image of the whole battlefield, making orientation difficult. Since I
                        owned a copy of the Parks and History Association map before I read
                        any of these books, I never really had a problem with orientation.

                        While it is certainly not the 'best' book (at least not for an overall
                        introduction to the battle), Luvaas & Nelson's "US Army War College
                        Guide to the Battle of Antietam" is worthy of mention, particularly
                        for actually visiting the battlefield and related sites at S Mountain
                        and Harper's Ferry. Definitely the best driving directions for getting
                        around S Mountain. Whenever I take visitor's to the battlefield, I
                        always take the route that they suggest: start at the Pry House, then
                        to the Keedysville road, over the little Antietam, past Pry's Mill,
                        over the upper bridge, down the Smoketown road into the east woods.
                        Not only does it take you past fields, roads and houses that look like
                        they haven't changed much since 1862, but it also gives a good sense
                        the kind of ground in the area. And, there will be no other tourists
                        entering the battlefield from that route. At first glance their maps
                        are somewhat primitive, but they do show contour lines, which in my
                        opinion makes them far more useful than the maps in the other three.
                        Cute symbols for corn and clover and stubble are cool but they just
                        don't work when the map is reduced to book page size. Also
                        indispensable if you are using the map while visiting the battlefield
                        is the inclusion of modern features (e.g. roads, structures and tour
                        stops) so that you can figure out where you are in relation to the
                        historical features. None of the big three's maps show modern
                        features, but the Luvaas & Nelson maps do. It's too bad that Luvaas &
                        Nelson only did little map segments at Antietam to illustrate the
                        portions of ground they study instead of producing a whole battlefield
                        map because I think they had the right idea given the limitations of
                        maps that appear in a book. Their map of the Harper's Ferry area is great.

                        TRL

                        --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
                        wrote:
                        >
                        > TR,
                        > I couldn't agree more! The P&H map is the base map of the
                        Carman/Cope maps, but they do indeed leave out the elevation markings.
                        Great if you want to know crops types, fences, etc. but not good for
                        understanding the battle. Preist used this map, but the whole thing
                        never appears in the book so if you don't know the field to begin
                        with, you'll be lost like a hiccup in a hurricane. Also he used some
                        odd symbols for artillery, etc.
                        > Tom Clemen
                        >
                        > Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                        > Professor of History
                        > Hagerstown Community College
                        >
                        > s
                        > >>> "T. R. Livesey" <tlivesey@...> 05/30/07 1:36 PM >>>
                        >
                        > Gerry,
                        >
                        > In Murfin's introduction, he states that the maps are the work of
                        > James D. Bowlby, the result of 10 years of field surveys, a revision
                        > of the Cope maps. The base map looks a lot like the Cope maps, but
                        > use terrain symbols much more suitable for smaller-scale reproduction.
                        > There are a few differences: one shows a corn field where the other
                        > shows clover, etc. Inexplicably, the elevation contour lines have
                        > been removed in Murphin's, seriously compromising their usefulness.
                        >
                        > Priest uses the "Parks and History Association" map as his base, which
                        > I think more closely follows the Cope maps. It uses symbols that are
                        > similar, but not identical to the Cope maps. I don't know the history
                        > of this map. It too lacks elevation markings.
                        >
                        > From my experience, including elevation markings is always a
                        > challenge, especially if you want to zoom out and show a broader
                        > expanse of area. The downside, of course, is that you end up with
                        > maps that look like the way Sears' text reads: there is no way to
                        > really understand how the terrain affects the situation. For example,
                        > in the maps of all three of these books, the reader cannot appreciate
                        > the situation in the 40 acre cornfield: how can the 4RI get `lost'?
                        > How can A.P. Hill come up out of nowhere on Burnside's left? I think
                        > a serious argument can be made that the elevation information is more
                        > important than the ground cover information (woods vs. corn vs.
                        > clover, etc.). But ground cover maps are more aesthetically pleasing
                        > to look at and readers are drawn to them.
                        >
                        > The obvious solution to the `busying-up' effect of contour lines is to
                        > use contours of greater intervals: 50 ft. instead of 20 ft. or
                        > whatever. Curiously, the version of the Parks and History Association
                        > map sold at the Antietam bookstore is plenty large for contour
                        > makings, but they are nonetheless omitted. I think somehow the authors
                        > of these maps have simply decided that elevation markings are not
                        > necessary. This is why the Cope maps are far more useful than any of
                        > these others.
                        >
                        > TRL
                        >
                      • Stephen Recker
                        Anyone know anything about this fellow? Thanks. Stephen Recker
                        Message 11 of 30 , Jun 1, 2007
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                          Anyone know anything about this fellow? Thanks.

                          Stephen Recker
                        • G E Mayers
                          Stephen, What other information do you have about his unit? Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
                          Message 12 of 30 , Jun 1, 2007
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                            Stephen,

                            What other information do you have about his unit?

                            Yr. Obt. Svt.
                            G E "Gerry" Mayers

                            To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                            on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                            Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                            the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                            To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 1:41 PM
                            Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lt. March of the 32nd MA


                            > Anyone know anything about this fellow? Thanks.
                            >
                            > Stephen Recker
                            >
                            >
                          • Stephen Recker
                            I seem to remember hearing/reading somewhere that Stonewall Jackson, some time around the morning of September 15th, wrote Lee from Harper s Ferry that, I
                            Message 13 of 30 , Jun 1, 2007
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                              I seem to remember hearing/reading somewhere that Stonewall Jackson,
                              some time around the morning of September 15th, wrote Lee from Harper's
                              Ferry that, "I will meet you in Sharpsburg". Can't find the cite.
                              Actually can only find Stonewall asking Lee where he should go after
                              the fall of HF. Any thoughts? Thanks.

                              Stephen Recker
                            • Thomas Clemens
                              Steve, 1st lt. James E. March mustered in with te regiment, mustered out 10/27/1864 on expiration of service, was recommissioned from civil life 12/1/1864.
                              Message 14 of 30 , Jun 2, 2007
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                                Steve,
                                1st lt. James E. March mustered in with te regiment, mustered out
                                10/27/1864 on expiration of service, was "recommissioned from civil
                                life" 12/1/1864. Offical Army Register, Vol. I, p. 200.

                                Tom Clemens


                                Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                                Professor of History
                                Hagerstown Community College


                                >>> "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> 06/01/07 1:48 PM >>>
                                Stephen,

                                What other information do you have about his unit?

                                Yr. Obt. Svt.
                                G E "Gerry" Mayers

                                To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                                on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                                Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                                the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                                To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 1:41 PM
                                Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lt. March of the 32nd MA


                                > Anyone know anything about this fellow? Thanks.
                                >
                                > Stephen Recker
                                >
                                >
                              • Thomas Clemens
                                Steve, The only message recorded as sent by Jackson to Lee on the 15th was the announcement of the surrender of HF. In that message, OR, Vol. 19, pt. 1, p.
                                Message 15 of 30 , Jun 2, 2007
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                                  Steve,
                                  The only message recorded as sent by Jackson to Lee on the 15th was the
                                  announcement of the surrender of HF. In that message, OR, Vol. 19, pt.
                                  1, p. 951, he asks Lee where to send his troops. If there is something
                                  else I don't know of it, and neither does Joe Harsh, who discusses it in
                                  Sounding the Shallows, Chap. 8, section L.


                                  Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                                  Professor of History
                                  Hagerstown Community College


                                  >>> Stephen Recker <recker@...> 06/01/07 6:34 PM >>>
                                  I seem to remember hearing/reading somewhere that Stonewall Jackson,
                                  some time around the morning of September 15th, wrote Lee from Harper's
                                  Ferry that, "I will meet you in Sharpsburg". Can't find the cite.
                                  Actually can only find Stonewall asking Lee where he should go after
                                  the fall of HF. Any thoughts? Thanks.

                                  Stephen Recker
                                • joseph_pierro
                                  Having just joined the group, I realize I m coming into this discussion a tad late (so please forgive). For anyone interested in a broad study of the entire
                                  Message 16 of 30 , Jun 23, 2007
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                                    Having just joined the group, I realize I'm coming into this
                                    discussion a tad late (so please forgive).

                                    For anyone interested in a broad study of the entire campaign at the
                                    operational level, I'd recommend Harsh as a good first start.

                                    If the tactical mechanics of Antietam itself are more your concern,
                                    I'd recommend either Murfin or Sears.

                                    Mike Priest's books contain a good deal of "color" from soldiers in
                                    the ranks; his "big picture" can be a bit difficult to follow if you
                                    are not already well versed on the basics of the battle.

                                    The Ezra Carman manuscript is incredibly detailed (imagine Sears or
                                    Murfin, but on a regimental level-focus instead of brigade or
                                    division). Wonderful for later study, but not a place I would
                                    recommend someone to start their investigation. (It's similar in
                                    that regard to Bigelow's "Campaign of Chancellorsville," if you are
                                    familiar with that massive study.)

                                    As for maps, Murfin's are quite good, and are baszed off of the
                                    original Carman Atlas of Antietam. It's long out of print, but the
                                    Library of Congress was recently scanned it in in its entirety as
                                    part of its "American Memory" digital archive. I don;t have the link
                                    to hand -- I'm writing this from the road-- but if you search Carman
                                    and Antietam in American Memory, you'll get teh link for the Atlas.
                                    Best of all, the map reading software--which you can download for
                                    free--allows you to zoom as tight as you might want in crystal clear
                                    resolution).


                                    -- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
                                    wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Dear Stephen,
                                    >
                                    > Your point about Harsh is definitely well taken.
                                    >
                                    > However, Sears' maps are not as good as those in Murfin's Gleam
                                    > of Bayonets.
                                    >
                                    > Yr. Obt. Svt.
                                    > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                                    >
                                    > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                                    > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                                    > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                                    > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: "Phen62" <phen@...>
                                    > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:18 PM
                                    > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: Question
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Having read Sears, as much as Priet as I could wade through, and
                                    > Harsh, I favor Harsh. I think if you are going to read Harsh it
                                    > is
                                    > helpful to Read Confederate Tide Rising as well as Taken at the
                                    > Flood.
                                    > I believe he meant them to be one work. Of all the books
                                    > mentioned,
                                    > Sears has by far the best maps, not a small consideration.
                                    >
                                    > Stephen
                                    >
                                  • Thomas Clemens
                                    A friend on another list pointed out that Isaac Wistar s memoirs mention going to Keedysville after he was wounded and being treated at a shopkeeper s house
                                    Message 17 of 30 , Oct 6, 2007
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                                      A friend on another list pointed out that Isaac Wistar's memoirs mention
                                      going to Keedysville after he was wounded and being treated at a
                                      shopkeeper's house where other 71st PA officers were also treated. The
                                      shopkeeper, accordnig to Wistar, was killed by a stray shot. has anyone
                                      ever heard this story before? It is not in O.T. Reilly's book, or other
                                      accounts I have seen. Any data?


                                      Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                                      Professor of History
                                      Hagerstown Community College
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