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Re: [TalkAntietam] Gettysburg CWRT trip to Antietam on May 19

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  • richard@rcroker.com
    Tom -- If you ain t an expert -- no body is! Richard ... From: RoteBaron@comcast.net To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 10:50 AM
    Message 1 of 24 , Apr 25, 2007
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      Tom --

      If you ain't an expert -- no body is!

      Richard
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: RoteBaron@...
      To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 10:50 AM
      Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Gettysburg CWRT trip to Antietam on May 19


      Gerry,

      Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii within the email to this group.

      I know quite a few people in other roundtables and have spent time hiking Antietam with many of them. They welcome people such as myself who are willing to prepare and present topics on Antietam. Based on the amount of preparation required, I guarantee that I don't do it for the money!

      There will be experts along for the trip, including several Gettysburg guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).

      For the Gettysburg CWRT trip, I plan to donate half my fee to a fund we're trying to get underway. It will seek to replace General Nagle's sword on his statue at Antietam.

      Tom Shay

      -------------- Original message --------------
      From: "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...>
      Tom,

      Congrats on being considered an "expert" on Antietam....

      How did you manage to become so well known and contacted by CWRT
      groups? A response privately would be acceptable....

      Yr. Obt. Svt.
      G E "Gerry" Mayers

      To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
      one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the Union, a
      passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from the Almighty
      God. --Anonymous
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: <RoteBaron@...>
      To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 10:08 AM
      Subject: [TalkAntietam] Gettysburg CWRT trip to Antietam on May 19

      > The Gettysburg Civil War Roundtable is sponsoring a field trip to
      > Antietam National Battlefield on Saturday May 19th.
      >
      > This trip departs from Gettysburg at 7:30 AM and returns by 5:30 PM.
      > I believe there may be a few seats on the bus [available on a first
      > come first serve basis].
      >
      > The cost of this full day tour, which includes lunch, is $60 for
      > roundtable members and $80 for non-members. Non-members will be
      > automatically enrolled in the Gettysburg CWRT with all rights and
      > privledges
      >
      > Contact me or the Gettysburg CWRT if interested.
      >
      > Tom Shay - Cressona, PA.
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Stephen Recker
      Tom, ... You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one. This reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes someone an
      Message 2 of 24 , Apr 27, 2007
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        Tom,

        On Wednesday, April 25, 2007, at 11:50 AM, RoteBaron@... wrote:

        > Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was
        > used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii
        > within the email to this group.
        >
        You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one. This
        reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes
        someone an 'historian'. I think we also discussed why people use the
        word 'an' before the word 'historian'.

        > There will be experts along for the trip, including several Gettysburg
        > guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).
        >

        Calling me an expert, now you are pushing it. <g>

        BTW, there is no longer a position of 'director of the guides'. We have
        folded most of my duties into the bookstore, led by Bob Casey and the
        other good folks at WMIA. You can now book a tour right there in the
        book store. The guides retain a three-person advisory committee (Mike
        Gamble, Jeff Driscoll and myself). Ted Alexander and I still handle
        recruitment, so if you want to be a guide, let us know.

        Cheers,
        Stephen Recker
        Antietam Battlefield Guides

        P.O. Box 705
        Sharpsburg, MD 21782
        240-217-3664
        800-417-9596

        http://www.virtualantietam.com
        http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
        http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com
      • G E Mayers
        Thanks for the update Stephen! Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on one s mother s side, is an
        Message 3 of 24 , Apr 27, 2007
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          Thanks for the update Stephen!

          Yr. Obt. Svt.
          G E "Gerry" Mayers

          To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
          one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the Union, a
          passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from the Almighty
          God. --Anonymous
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
          To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:51 AM
          Subject: [TalkAntietam] 'Expert' battlefield guides


          > Tom,
          >
          > On Wednesday, April 25, 2007, at 11:50 AM, RoteBaron@...
          > wrote:
          >
          >> Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was
          >> used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii
          >> within the email to this group.
          >>
          > You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one.
          > This
          > reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes
          > someone an 'historian'. I think we also discussed why people use the
          > word 'an' before the word 'historian'.
          >
          >> There will be experts along for the trip, including several
          >> Gettysburg
          >> guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).
          >>
          >
          > Calling me an expert, now you are pushing it. <g>
          >
          > BTW, there is no longer a position of 'director of the guides'. We
          > have
          > folded most of my duties into the bookstore, led by Bob Casey and
          > the
          > other good folks at WMIA. You can now book a tour right there in the
          > book store. The guides retain a three-person advisory committee
          > (Mike
          > Gamble, Jeff Driscoll and myself). Ted Alexander and I still handle
          > recruitment, so if you want to be a guide, let us know.
          >
          > Cheers,
          > Stephen Recker
          > Antietam Battlefield Guides
          >
          > P.O. Box 705
          > Sharpsburg, MD 21782
          > 240-217-3664
          > 800-417-9596
          >
          > http://www.virtualantietam.com
          > http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
          > http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com
          >
          >
        • RoteBaron@comcast.net
          Does John Michael Priest still give tours of Antietam? I used to see him often on the battlefield. He also used to be a member of several online groups, but I
          Message 4 of 24 , Apr 27, 2007
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            Does John Michael Priest still give tours of Antietam?

            I used to see him often on the battlefield. He also used to be a member of several online groups, but I haven't read any postings from him in a long time.

            Tom Shay



            -------------- Original message --------------
            From: Stephen Recker <recker@...>
            Tom,

            On Wednesday, April 25, 2007, at 11:50 AM, RoteBaron@... wrote:

            > Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was
            > used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii
            > within the email to this group.
            >
            You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one. This
            reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes
            someone an 'historian'. I think we also discussed why people use the
            word 'an' before the word 'historian'.

            > There will be experts along for the trip, including several Gettysburg
            > guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).
            >

            Calling me an expert, now you are pushing it. <g>

            BTW, there is no longer a position of 'director of the guides'. We have
            folded most of my duties into the bookstore, led by Bob Casey and the
            other good folks at WMIA. You can now book a tour right there in the
            book store. The guides retain a three-person advisory committee (Mike
            Gamble, Jeff Driscoll and myself). Ted Alexander and I still handle
            recruitment, so if you want to be a guide, let us know.

            Cheers,
            Stephen Recker
            Antietam Battlefield Guides

            P.O. Box 705
            Sharpsburg, MD 21782
            240-217-3664
            800-417-9596

            http://www.virtualantietam.com
            http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
            http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • G E Mayers
            Maybe he moved?? Yr. Obt. Svt. G E Gerry Mayers To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on one s mother s side, is an introduction to
            Message 5 of 24 , Apr 27, 2007
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              Maybe he moved??

              Yr. Obt. Svt.
              G E "Gerry" Mayers

              To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
              one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the Union, a
              passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from the Almighty
              God. --Anonymous
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: <RoteBaron@...>
              To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 11:51 AM
              Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 'Expert' battlefield guides


              > Does John Michael Priest still give tours of Antietam?
              >
              > I used to see him often on the battlefield. He also used to be a
              > member of several online groups, but I haven't read any postings
              > from him in a long time.
              >
              > Tom Shay
              >
              >
              >
              > -------------- Original message --------------
              > From: Stephen Recker <recker@...>
              > Tom,
              >
              > On Wednesday, April 25, 2007, at 11:50 AM, RoteBaron@...
              > wrote:
              >
              >> Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was
              >> used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii
              >> within the email to this group.
              >>
              > You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one.
              > This
              > reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes
              > someone an 'historian'. I think we also discussed why people use the
              > word 'an' before the word 'historian'.
              >
              >> There will be experts along for the trip, including several
              >> Gettysburg
              >> guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).
              >>
              >
              > Calling me an expert, now you are pushing it. <g>
              >
              > BTW, there is no longer a position of 'director of the guides'. We
              > have
              > folded most of my duties into the bookstore, led by Bob Casey and
              > the
              > other good folks at WMIA. You can now book a tour right there in the
              > book store. The guides retain a three-person advisory committee
              > (Mike
              > Gamble, Jeff Driscoll and myself). Ted Alexander and I still handle
              > recruitment, so if you want to be a guide, let us know.
              >
              > Cheers,
              > Stephen Recker
              > Antietam Battlefield Guides
              >
              > P.O. Box 705
              > Sharpsburg, MD 21782
              > 240-217-3664
              > 800-417-9596
              >
              > http://www.virtualantietam.com
              > http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
              > http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
            • richard@rcroker.com
              While talking about expert battlefield guides, please allow me to pay tribute to Walter Smith. While researching my book, I hired Walter to guide me for two
              Message 6 of 24 , Apr 27, 2007
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                While talking about expert battlefield guides, please allow me to pay tribute to Walter Smith. While researching my book, I hired Walter to guide me for two days. He was a good man, with a marvelous sense of humor and respectful guardian of the field and the men who fought there. He was an encyclopedia. On a later trip I wanted to hook up with him again and was told that he had past away, suffering a heart attack at the visitor center while preparing to take another group on another tour.
                I will never forget those two days. The things I learned from him are the spices that are sprinkled throughout the book -- the very things that made the story of a fight into a story of heroes. The next time you visit Ted Alexander in his office, note the photo of Walter on his board.
                "To Make Men Free" is dedicated in part to him and his memory.
                Thank you, Walter, and thank all of you who guard the memory.

                Richard Croker

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: G E Mayers
                To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:19 AM
                Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] 'Expert' battlefield guides


                Thanks for the update Stephen!

                Yr. Obt. Svt.
                G E "Gerry" Mayers

                To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even on
                one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the Union, a
                passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from the Almighty
                God. --Anonymous
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:51 AM
                Subject: [TalkAntietam] 'Expert' battlefield guides

                > Tom,
                >
                > On Wednesday, April 25, 2007, at 11:50 AM, RoteBaron@...
                > wrote:
                >
                >> Be assured that use of the term 'expert' was not my choice. It was
                >> used in the CWRT's original emails, but note that I did not use ii
                >> within the email to this group.
                >>
                > You need not shy from the term. You are seen in the group as one.
                > This
                > reminds me of a topic we covered about a year ago as to what makes
                > someone an 'historian'. I think we also discussed why people use the
                > word 'an' before the word 'historian'.
                >
                >> There will be experts along for the trip, including several
                >> Gettysburg
                >> guides and Stephen Recker (head of Antietam guides).
                >>
                >
                > Calling me an expert, now you are pushing it. <g>
                >
                > BTW, there is no longer a position of 'director of the guides'. We
                > have
                > folded most of my duties into the bookstore, led by Bob Casey and
                > the
                > other good folks at WMIA. You can now book a tour right there in the
                > book store. The guides retain a three-person advisory committee
                > (Mike
                > Gamble, Jeff Driscoll and myself). Ted Alexander and I still handle
                > recruitment, so if you want to be a guide, let us know.
                >
                > Cheers,
                > Stephen Recker
                > Antietam Battlefield Guides
                >
                > P.O. Box 705
                > Sharpsburg, MD 21782
                > 240-217-3664
                > 800-417-9596
                >
                > http://www.virtualantietam.com
                > http://www.virtualgettysburg.com
                > http://www.anothersoftwaremiracle.com
                >
                >





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Stephen Recker
                Does anyone know of a photo of Lee s Rock in the Antietam National Cemetery? Where is it written about? Thanks. Stephen Recker
                Message 7 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                  Does anyone know of a photo of Lee's Rock in the Antietam National
                  Cemetery? Where is it written about? Thanks.

                  Stephen Recker
                • G E Mayers
                  Stephen, Kyde Douglass mentions it, IIRC, in his I Rode with Stonewall. As for the location of the rock itself, I do not recall reading that it still is in
                  Message 8 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                    Stephen,

                    Kyde Douglass mentions it, IIRC, in his I Rode with Stonewall. As
                    for the location of the rock itself, I do not recall reading that
                    it still is in existence....IIRC, it was broken up during the
                    construction of the National Cemetery on Cemetery Hill at
                    Sharpsburg after the war....

                    Yr. Obt. Svt.
                    G E "Gerry" Mayers

                    To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                    on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                    Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                    the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                    To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:01 PM
                    Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lee rocks


                    > Does anyone know of a photo of Lee's Rock in the Antietam
                    > National
                    > Cemetery? Where is it written about? Thanks.
                    >
                    > Stephen Recker
                    >
                    >
                  • Tom Shay
                    Stephen, Lee s Rock is one of the stops we ll make during the CWRT tour in two weeks. I got my material from THE BIVOUACS OF THE DEAD by Steven Stotelmeyer.
                    Message 9 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                      Stephen,

                      Lee's Rock is one of the stops we'll make during the CWRT tour in two weeks.
                      I got my material from THE BIVOUACS OF THE DEAD by Steven Stotelmeyer.
                      Check pages 23-24. The rock was at current site of Mrs. Bryant's grave.

                      Tom Shay




                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Stephen Recker
                      To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:01 PM
                      Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lee rocks


                      Does anyone know of a photo of Lee's Rock in the Antietam National
                      Cemetery? Where is it written about? Thanks.

                      Stephen Recker





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Stephen Recker
                      Gerry, Thanks for the note. I know it s not there, I m just trying to see if there is a photo of it. Thanks for pointing me to HKD. Cheers, Stephen
                      Message 10 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                        Gerry,

                        Thanks for the note. I know it's not there, I'm just trying to see if
                        there is a photo of it. Thanks for pointing me to HKD.

                        Cheers,
                        Stephen

                        On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 08:12 PM, G E Mayers wrote:

                        > Kyde Douglass mentions it, IIRC, in his I Rode with Stonewall. As
                        > for the location of the rock itself, I do not recall reading that
                        > it still is in existence....IIRC, it was broken up during the
                        > construction of the National Cemetery on Cemetery Hill at
                        > Sharpsburg after the war....
                      • Stephen Recker
                        Speaking of HKD, does anyone know what his signature looks like, or his handwriting in general? Thanks. -sjr
                        Message 11 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                          Speaking of HKD, does anyone know what his signature looks like, or his
                          handwriting in general? Thanks.

                          -sjr

                          On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 08:12 PM, G E Mayers wrote:

                          > Kyde Douglass mentions it, IIRC, in his I Rode with Stonewall. As
                          > for the location of the rock itself, I do not recall reading that
                          > it still is in existence....IIRC, it was broken up during the
                          > construction of the National Cemetery on Cemetery Hill at
                          > Sharpsburg after the war....
                        • Stephen Recker
                          Tom, That s great. Thanks. BOD mentions O.T. s book. I ll check it out. Still looking for a photo, though. Stephen
                          Message 12 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                            Tom,

                            That's great. Thanks.

                            BOD mentions O.T.'s book. I'll check it out. Still looking for a photo,
                            though.

                            Stephen

                            On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 08:25 PM, Tom Shay wrote:

                            > Lee's Rock is one of the stops we'll make during the CWRT tour in two
                            > weeks.
                            > I got my material from THE BIVOUACS OF THE DEAD by Steven Stotelmeyer.
                            > Check pages 23-24. The rock was at current site of Mrs. Bryant's grave.
                            >
                          • G E Mayers
                            Stephen, The museum at Antietam NBP has in one of its cases the original pencilled note from HKD to his father announcing the fall of Harpers Ferry.... does
                            Message 13 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                              Stephen,

                              The museum at Antietam NBP has in one of its cases the original
                              pencilled note from HKD to his father announcing the fall of
                              Harpers Ferry.... does that help?

                              Yr. Obt. Svt.
                              G E "Gerry" Mayers

                              To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
                              on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
                              Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
                              the Almighty God. --Anonymous
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                              To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 9:13 PM
                              Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Lee rocks


                              > Speaking of HKD, does anyone know what his signature looks
                              > like, or his
                              > handwriting in general? Thanks.
                              >
                              > -sjr
                              >
                              > On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 08:12 PM, G E Mayers wrote:
                              >
                              >> Kyde Douglass mentions it, IIRC, in his I Rode with Stonewall.
                              >> As
                              >> for the location of the rock itself, I do not recall reading
                              >> that
                              >> it still is in existence....IIRC, it was broken up during the
                              >> construction of the National Cemetery on Cemetery Hill at
                              >> Sharpsburg after the war....
                              >
                              >
                            • Stephen Recker
                              Does anyone have this book: The Douglas diary;: Student days at Franklin and Marshall College, 1856-1858 It supposedyl has handwriting facsimile endpapers. If
                              Message 14 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                                Does anyone have this book: The Douglas diary;: Student days at
                                Franklin and Marshall College, 1856-1858

                                It supposedyl has handwriting facsimile endpapers. If anyone has it,
                                I'd appreciate seeing what HKD's handwriting looks like. Thanks.

                                Stephen

                                On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 09:13 PM, Stephen Recker wrote:

                                > Speaking of HKD, does anyone know what his signature looks like, or his
                                > handwriting in general? Thanks.
                              • Stephen Recker
                                That is perfect. Thanks! Stephen
                                Message 15 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                                  That is perfect. Thanks!

                                  Stephen

                                  On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 09:28 PM, G E Mayers wrote:

                                  > The museum at Antietam NBP has in one of its cases the original
                                  > pencilled note from HKD to his father announcing the fall of
                                  > Harpers Ferry.... does that help?
                                • Stephen Recker
                                  Isn t there a picture of that in some book. Possibly Time-Life. I ll look. Thanks. Stephen
                                  Message 16 of 24 , May 7, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Isn't there a picture of that in some book. Possibly Time-Life. I'll
                                    look. Thanks.

                                    Stephen

                                    On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 09:28 PM, G E Mayers wrote:

                                    > The museum at Antietam NBP has in one of its cases the original
                                    > pencilled note from HKD to his father announcing the fall of
                                    > Harpers Ferry.... does that help?
                                  • Stephen Recker
                                    Yup, it s in the Voices of the Civil War. tephen
                                    Message 17 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                                      Yup, it's in the Voices of the Civil War.

                                      tephen

                                      On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 09:31 PM, Stephen Recker wrote:

                                      > Isn't there a picture of that in some book. Possibly Time-Life. I'll
                                      > look. Thanks.
                                    • jeffcowvplanning
                                      In my research I found an article in the Middletown Valley Register reporting on the destruction of the rock. I ll see if I can dig it up. Steve
                                      Message 18 of 24 , May 7, 2007
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                                        In my research I found an article in the Middletown Valley Register
                                        reporting on the destruction of the rock. I'll see if I can dig it up.

                                        Steve
                                      • Stephen Recker
                                        Thanks. That would be great. Stephen
                                        Message 19 of 24 , May 7, 2007
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Thanks. That would be great.

                                          Stephen

                                          On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 10:21 PM, jeffcowvplanning wrote:

                                          > In my research I found an article in the Middletown Valley Register
                                          > reporting on the destruction of the rock. I'll see if I can dig it up.
                                          >
                                        • Stephen Recker
                                          Jeff, Did you ever find that? Is there somewhere I can go check this? Thanks. Stephen
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Oct 24, 2007
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Jeff,

                                            Did you ever find that? Is there somewhere I can go check this? Thanks.

                                            Stephen

                                            On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 10:21 PM, jeffcowvplanning wrote:

                                            > In my research I found an article in the Middletown Valley Register
                                            > reporting on the destruction of the rock. I'll see if I can dig it up.
                                            >
                                            > Steve
                                          • jeffcowvplanning
                                            Stephen... It fell off my plate with my recent move. I will check my files this week for you. Steve Bockmiller ... Thanks. ... up.
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Oct 29, 2007
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                                              Stephen...

                                              It fell off my plate with my recent move.

                                              I will check my files this week for you.

                                              Steve Bockmiller

                                              --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Stephen Recker <recker@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > Jeff,
                                              >
                                              > Did you ever find that? Is there somewhere I can go check this?
                                              Thanks.
                                              >
                                              > Stephen
                                              >
                                              > On Monday, May 7, 2007, at 10:21 PM, jeffcowvplanning wrote:
                                              >
                                              > > In my research I found an article in the Middletown Valley Register
                                              > > reporting on the destruction of the rock. I'll see if I can dig it
                                              up.
                                              > >
                                              > > Steve
                                              >
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