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Re: [TalkAntietam] Wings

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  • Stephen Recker
    Excellent. I ll look these up. Thanks. There is a sad irony in the second note - Brig. Gen. J. K. F. Mansfield is TEMPORARILY assigned to the command of
    Message 1 of 25 , Aug 16 6:39 AM
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      Excellent. I'll look these up. Thanks.

      There is a sad irony in the second note - "Brig. Gen. J. K. F.
      Mansfield is TEMPORARILY assigned to the command of Bank's (12) corps."

      Stephen

      On Tuesday, August 16, 2005, at 08:51 AM, Thomas Clemens wrote:

      > The "wings" order was made offiical on Sept. 14, by Special Order. See
      > p. 290, OR, Vol. 19 pt. 2. It was suspended on Sept. 15, see p. 297,
      > op. cit.
    • Harry Smeltzer
      Is that the set that comes in a zip-lock baggie? I think I have that as well. Harry ... From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
      Message 2 of 25 , Aug 16 9:34 AM
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        Is that the set that comes in a zip-lock baggie? I think I have that as
        well.



        Harry



        -----Original Message-----
        From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com [mailto:TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of Stephen Recker
        Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 8:33 AM
        To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Wings



        Tom,

        Thanks for pointing me to this. I have a stack of park brochures and
        found it in there. It is really helpful.

        Actually I never really looked through this stack of brochures, but
        there is some really great stuff in hear. The Antietam bookstore sells
        the whole bunch for about $1. What a great deal.

        Stephen



        On Tuesday, August 16, 2005, at 08:51 AM, Thomas Clemens wrote:

        > The best summary of casualtires by location that I have seen is one
        > made
        > up by the interp staff and I carry in my notebook. I'll be happy to
        > make a copy for you, or talk to Keith.
        > Tom









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      • Stephen Recker
        I am trying to get a handle on the number of casualties in the Morning Phase of the battle of Antietam. In the NPS pamphlet called Casualties of Battle it
        Message 3 of 25 , Aug 24 8:00 AM
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          I am trying to get a handle on the number of casualties in the Morning
          Phase of the battle of Antietam. In the NPS pamphlet called "Casualties
          of Battle" it states that there were 13,860 casualties in the morning
          phase. In the Cornfield Trail pamphlet it states that 'as many as 8,000
          men were killed or wounded from dawn until 9:00 am'.

          I have seen this range stated in a number of places. Is there a
          distinction that I am missing between the two numbers? Thanks.

          Stephen Recker
        • Thomas Clemens
          It sounds until 9:00 does not include the West Woods action. That would account for at least some of the disparity. I will look at Carman s chart tonight
          Message 4 of 25 , Aug 24 8:33 AM
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            It sounds "until 9:00" does not include the West Woods action. That
            would account for at least some of the disparity. I will look at
            Carman's chart tonight and get back to you.
            Tom Clemens

            >>> recker@... 8/24/2005 11:00:05 AM >>>

            I am trying to get a handle on the number of casualties in the Morning

            Phase of the battle of Antietam. In the NPS pamphlet called "Casualties

            of Battle" it states that there were 13,860 casualties in the morning
            phase. In the Cornfield Trail pamphlet it states that 'as many as 8,000

            men were killed or wounded from dawn until 9:00 am'.

            I have seen this range stated in a number of places. Is there a
            distinction that I am missing between the two numbers? Thanks.

            Stephen Recker








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          • Stephen Recker
            Thanks, Tom. And the lower number doesn t seem to include captures, although that number is less than one thousand. Stephen Recker
            Message 5 of 25 , Aug 25 5:02 AM
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              Thanks, Tom. And the lower number doesn't seem to include captures,
              although that number is less than one thousand.

              Stephen Recker

              On Wednesday, August 24, 2005, at 11:33 AM, Thomas Clemens wrote:

              >
              > It sounds "until 9:00" does not include the West Woods action. That
              > would account for at least some of the disparity. I will look at
              > Carman's chart tonight and get back to you.
              > Tom Clemens
            • rotbaron@aol.com
              Stephen, Antietam casualties are broken out on the NPS webpage at: http://www.nps.gov/anti/casualty.htm Tom Shay - Cresssona, PA [Non-text portions of this
              Message 6 of 25 , Aug 25 8:59 AM
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                Stephen,

                Antietam casualties are broken out on the NPS webpage at:
                http://www.nps.gov/anti/casualty.htm

                Tom Shay - Cresssona, PA



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Stephen Recker
                Thanks. These statistics make Tom Clemens case that the pamphlet I was looking at did not include the West Woods. Awesome. Thanks to both Toms. Stephen
                Message 7 of 25 , Aug 25 10:49 AM
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                  Thanks. These statistics make Tom Clemens' case that the pamphlet I was
                  looking at did not include the West Woods. Awesome. Thanks to both Toms.

                  Stephen

                  On Thursday, August 25, 2005, at 11:59 AM, rotbaron@... wrote:

                  >
                  > Stephen,
                  >
                  > Antietam casualties are broken out on the NPS webpage at:
                  > http://www.nps.gov/anti/casualty.htm
                  >
                  > Tom Shay - Cresssona, PA
                • dickeyr46
                  Stephen, just as reinforcement to the two Toms conclusions, Dr. Harsh in Taken at the Flood also addresses casualties up to 9 am and then the total for the
                  Message 8 of 25 , Aug 25 2:15 PM
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                    Stephen, just as reinforcement to the two Toms' conclusions, Dr. Harsh
                    in "Taken at the Flood" also addresses casualties up to 9 am and then
                    the total for the "Morning Phase." Addressing up to 9 am (the
                    Cornfield and East Woods), on p. 376, Dr. Harsh writes, "In all,
                    during the three hours, 27,000 men had struggled over the same 160
                    acres and 8,700 (32.2 percent) had fallen." I believe I can accounted
                    for 604 missing from units engaged up to this time. If you subtract
                    the missing, that comes very close to the "Cornfield Trail" pamphlet
                    statement of "as many as 8,000 men were killed or wounded."

                    Dr. Harsh concluded on p. 394 that 4,481 caualties occured during the
                    fighting in the West Woods and around the Dunker Church. This includes
                    casualties suffered by Col. Irwin's brigade in the vicinity of the
                    Dunker Church, less those of the 7th Maine. On p. 395, he gives 13,179
                    for the total "Morning Phase". Again, very close to the NPS morning
                    phase casualty number.

                    Dr. Harsh references Section K of Chapter 9 of "Sounding the Shallows"
                    to address allocating casualties for units when divisions and even
                    regiments could be split between phases.

                    Ron Dickey

                    --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Stephen Recker <recker@v...> wrote:
                    > Thanks. These statistics make Tom Clemens' case that the pamphlet I was
                    > looking at did not include the West Woods. Awesome. Thanks to both Toms.
                    >
                    > Stephen
                  • Stephen Recker
                    Great stuff. Thanks. Stephen
                    Message 9 of 25 , Aug 25 2:35 PM
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                      Great stuff. Thanks.

                      Stephen

                      On Thursday, August 25, 2005, at 05:15 PM, dickeyr46 wrote:

                      > Stephen, just as reinforcement to the two Toms' conclusions, Dr. Harsh
                      > in "Taken at the Flood" also addresses casualties up to 9 am and then
                      > the total for the "Morning Phase." Addressing up to 9 am (the
                      > Cornfield and East Woods), on p. 376, Dr. Harsh writes, "In all,
                      > during the three hours, 27,000 men had struggled over the same 160
                      > acres and 8,700 (32.2 percent) had fallen." I believe I can accounted
                      > for 604 missing from units engaged up to this time. If you subtract
                      > the missing, that comes very close to the "Cornfield Trail" pamphlet
                      > statement of "as many as 8,000 men were killed or wounded."
                      >
                      > Dr. Harsh concluded on p. 394 that 4,481 caualties occured during the
                      > fighting in the West Woods and around the Dunker Church. This includes
                      > casualties suffered by Col. Irwin's brigade in the vicinity of the
                      > Dunker Church, less those of the 7th Maine. On p. 395, he gives 13,179
                      > for the total "Morning Phase". Again, very close to the NPS morning
                      > phase casualty number.
                      >
                      > Dr. Harsh references Section K of Chapter 9 of "Sounding the Shallows"
                      > to address allocating casualties for units when divisions and even
                      > regiments could be split between phases.
                      >
                      > Ron Dickey
                      >
                      > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, Stephen Recker <recker@v...>
                      > wrote:
                      >> Thanks. These statistics make Tom Clemens' case that the pamphlet I
                      >> was
                      >> looking at did not include the West Woods. Awesome. Thanks to both
                      >> Toms.
                      >>
                      >> Stephen
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