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Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: New Hampshire officials want battlefield monument

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  • Stephen Recker
    I ve been giving tours at Antietam lately and I hear a lot of people specifically marvel at how wonderful it is to see a pristine battlefield without modern
    Message 1 of 23 , Jun 28, 2005
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      I've been giving tours at Antietam lately and I hear a lot of people
      specifically marvel at how wonderful it is to see a pristine
      battlefield without modern obstructions. I have yet to hear one person
      lament that there are too few monuments.

      Stephen


      On Tuesday, June 28, 2005, at 06:54 PM, robert blama wrote:

      >
      > I don't reply that much but as an avid civil war buff I like to listen
      > to what others say. I think being against the monuments may be an
      > over reation. I'm not to sure it will open any flood walls and have
      > monuments pop up all over the place. He has one point and that is
      > most people that visit a battle field look at the monuments for
      > reference, information and a better understanding. These are the same
      > people that donate lots of money for battlefield preservation.
      > Without their support alot of historic turf would be now paved. I
      > know I will get a lot of negative feedback but each has their opinion
      > so let it fly.
      >
    • Thomas Clemens
      Brian, Exactly, he cannot see the forest for the trees. Tom Thomas G. Clemens D.A. Professor of History Hagerstown Community College
      Message 2 of 23 , Jun 28, 2005
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        Brian,
        Exactly, he cannot see the forest for the trees.
        Tom
        Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
        Professor of History
        Hagerstown Community College


        >>> bdowney@... 06/28/05 12:47 PM >>>
      • Thomas Clemens
        I can only tell you that John Howard has a file folder of groups wanting monuments, at least 15 at present, who now will have a precedent. I understand your
        Message 3 of 23 , Jun 28, 2005
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          I can only tell you that John Howard has a file folder of groups wanting
          monuments, at least 15 at present, who now will have a precedent. I
          understand your point, but do not agree with it. How many monuments are
          at Normandy? Or is it important tot see what those brave soldiers
          faced? Let the restored/preserved be the monument!
          Tom Clemens

          Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
          Professor of History
          Hagerstown Community College


          >>> civilwar1@... 06/28/05 6:54 PM >>>
        • Brian Morris
          The reason there is a moratorium to begin with was to put a stop to political monuments being placed on these battlefields. Specifically it was in response to
          Message 4 of 23 , Jun 28, 2005
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            The reason there is a moratorium to begin with was to put a stop to
            political monuments being placed on these battlefields. Specifically it was
            in response to the North Carolina monument and 11 Mississippi monuments near
            the Angle at Gettysburg that were placed in the wrong place and in direct
            violation of the rules created for monument placement at Gettysburg by the
            veterans who fought there. In the case of the North Carolina monument, it
            also tells a story that is a complete fiction. They are monuments to modern
            day politics more than anything connected to the battle, placed by
            politicians who used the campaigns to place them there for political gain.

            As for not opening a flood of monuments, there are as far as I know 15 new
            monuments, mostly from southern groups, currently proposed for Antietam
            alone if this goes through. I am sure that there are others that have not
            gone public. If that isn't a flood, I don't know what is. You know once we
            start seeing groups getting a monument put up for their favorite regiment at
            Antietam, every reenactment group is going to want one for their regiment
            and of course they'll get their congressman to support it because it's good
            for grabbing votes.

            Brian


            > I don't reply that much but as an avid civil war buff I like to listen to
            what others say. I think being against the monuments may be an over
            reation. I'm not to sure it will open any flood walls and have monuments
            pop up all over the place. He has one point and that is most people that
            visit a battle field look at the monuments for reference, information and a
            better understanding. These are the same people that donate lots of money
            for battlefield preservation. Without their support alot of historic turf
            would be now paved. I know I will get a lot of negative feedback but each
            has their opinion so let it fly.
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: Brian Downey
            > To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 12:47 PM
            > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: New Hampshire officials want battlefield
            monument
            >
            >
            > > "I don't look at the grass. I don't look at the trees," Letourneau
            > > said about visiting battlefields. "I look at the monuments."
            >
            > This is just sad. In so many ways.
            >
            > [opinion, fwiw]
            > What's seems likely is that he and the other NH politicians are not
            > really thinking of the Boys of 1862 - just the voters of today. Their
            > jobs, I suppose ...
            >
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          • Stephen Recker
            Last night I was reading Taken at the Flood and came across a sentence that has me very confused. This is from p. 226. He stopped short of Vestal Gap in the
            Message 5 of 23 , Jun 30, 2005
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              Last night I was reading "Taken at the Flood" and came across a
              sentence that has me very confused. This is from p. 226.

              'He stopped short of Vestal Gap in the Blue Ridge (Elk Ridge in
              Maryland) and the Short Hills (South Mountain in Maryland).'

              Now, I have always heard that South Mountain was the northern extension
              of the Blue Ridge. In McLaw's report, OR19, p852, he refers to Elk
              Ridge by name and refers to South Mountain as the Blue Ridge. Looking
              at a map, though, it looks like I agree with Joseph Harsh.

              Comments? Thanks.

              Stephen Recker
            • G E Mayers
              Dear Stephen, Both could be correct. Very respectfully, G E Gerry Mayers Confederate Signal Corps, Longstreet s Corps ... From: Stephen Recker
              Message 6 of 23 , Jun 30, 2005
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                Dear Stephen,

                Both could be correct.

                Very respectfully,
                G E "Gerry" Mayers
                Confederate Signal Corps,
                Longstreet's Corps



                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 8:41 AM
                Subject: [TalkAntietam] Blue Ridge Mountains...or not


                > Last night I was reading "Taken at the Flood" and came across a
                > sentence that has me very confused. This is from p. 226.
                >
                > 'He stopped short of Vestal Gap in the Blue Ridge (Elk Ridge in
                > Maryland) and the Short Hills (South Mountain in Maryland).'
                >
                > Now, I have always heard that South Mountain was the northern extension
                > of the Blue Ridge. In McLaw's report, OR19, p852, he refers to Elk
                > Ridge by name and refers to South Mountain as the Blue Ridge. Looking
                > at a map, though, it looks like I agree with Joseph Harsh.
                >
                > Comments? Thanks.
                >
                > Stephen Recker
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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              • Stephen Recker
                Dear Gerry, i was afraid you would say something like that! Stephen
                Message 7 of 23 , Jun 30, 2005
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                  Dear Gerry,

                  i was afraid you would say something like that!

                  Stephen

                  On Thursday, June 30, 2005, at 08:55 AM, G E Mayers wrote:

                  > Dear Stephen,
                  >
                  > Both could be correct.
                  >
                  > Very respectfully,
                  > G E "Gerry" Mayers
                  > Confederate Signal Corps,
                  > Longstreet's Corps
                • G E Mayers
                  Stephen, Actually CW terminology was not as precise as we use today. However, South Mountain in MD is indeed considered part of the Blue Ridge, with Elk Ridge
                  Message 8 of 23 , Jun 30, 2005
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                    Stephen,

                    Actually CW terminology was not as precise as we use today. However, South
                    Mountain in MD is indeed considered part of the Blue Ridge, with Elk Ridge
                    more of an extension of the Blue Ridge.

                    Tom Clemens might be able to help you sort this out better, as he lives
                    nearby.

                    Very respectfully,
                    G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    Confederate Signal Corps,
                    Longstreet's Corps



                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                    To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 8:59 AM
                    Subject: Re: [TalkAntietam] Blue Ridge Mountains...or not


                    > Dear Gerry,
                    >
                    > i was afraid you would say something like that!
                    >
                    > Stephen
                    >
                    > On Thursday, June 30, 2005, at 08:55 AM, G E Mayers wrote:
                    >
                    >> Dear Stephen,
                    >>
                    >> Both could be correct.
                    >>
                    >> Very respectfully,
                    >> G E "Gerry" Mayers
                    >> Confederate Signal Corps,
                    >> Longstreet's Corps
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                  • Thomas Clemens
                    I believe the aqccount by Joe is correct. If you go to Weverton, the base of South Mountain and look acrossthe river there is only Short Hill. OTOH, if you
                    Message 9 of 23 , Jun 30, 2005
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                      I believe the aqccount by Joe is correct. If you go to Weverton, the
                      base of South Mountain and look acrossthe river there is only Short
                      Hill. OTOH, if you go to Sandy Hook and look across you see Loudoun
                      Hts. which extends southward as the Blue Ridge. I think this is correct
                      but am away from maps and home right now.


                      Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                      Professor of History
                      Hagerstown Community College


                      >>> recker@... 06/30/05 8:41 AM >>>
                    • Stephen Recker
                      What would be the best source for an overview of the correspondence between Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign? Thanks. Stephen Recker
                      Message 10 of 23 , Jul 8 9:31 AM
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                        What would be the best source for an overview of the correspondence
                        between Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign? Thanks.

                        Stephen Recker
                      • Harry Smeltzer
                        The best source would be the McClellan papers on microfilm. Apparently, the papers themselves have become hopelessly disordered. The selected (keep in mind, it
                        Message 11 of 23 , Jul 8 9:39 AM
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                          The best source would be the McClellan papers on microfilm.



                          Apparently, the papers themselves have become hopelessly disordered.



                          The selected (keep in mind, it is selected) correspondence in "The Civil War
                          Paper of George B.McClellan" are not all copied from original documents.
                          Much of the personal correspondence between the general and his wife are
                          copied from notes taken by McClellan regarding those letters, and sometimes
                          even notes of McClellan's notes taken by his daughter.



                          I would check the newer works by Rafuse and Beatie for the sources they
                          used.



                          Harry



                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com [mailto:TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com] On
                          Behalf Of Stephen Recker
                          Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 11:31 AM
                          To: TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign



                          What would be the best source for an overview of the correspondence
                          between Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign? Thanks.

                          Stephen Recker









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                        • richard@rcroker.com
                          The Civil War Papers of Geo. Brinton McClellan editied by Steven W. Sears ... From: Stephen Recker To:
                          Message 12 of 23 , Jul 8 12:25 PM
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                            The Civil War Papers of Geo. Brinton McClellan editied by Steven W. Sears
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "Stephen Recker" <recker@...>
                            To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 12:31 PM
                            Subject: [TalkAntietam] Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign


                            > What would be the best source for an overview of the correspondence
                            > between Lincoln and McClellan during the Maryland Campaign? Thanks.
                            >
                            > Stephen Recker
                            >
                            >
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                          • Thomas Clemens
                            In addition to Harry s suggestions, look at Basler s Collected Works of Abraham lincoln and Vol. 19 pt. 2 of the ORs, which has correspondence. Tom C. Thomas
                            Message 13 of 23 , Jul 8 12:51 PM
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                              In addition to Harry's suggestions, look at Basler's "Collected Works of
                              Abraham lincoln and Vol. 19 pt. 2 of the ORs, which has correspondence.
                              Tom C.
                              Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
                              Professor of History
                              Hagerstown Community College


                              >>> hjs21@... 07/08/05 12:39 PM >>>
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