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5600Re: [TalkAntietam] Re: queston about parallel routes to HagerstownTurnpike north from Sharpsburg

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  • Thomas Clemens
    Mar 18, 2009
      Larry, I am away from home and sources right now, but IIRC one ofthe
      cavalry regiments camps on the night of the 16th up past the Squirrel
      Level Church, with a few hundred yards of the Bakersville road. It
      strikes me as logical that they'd know about a road that close to them,
      but maybe not.
      BTW, I am in HOG HEAVEN at the NYPL looking at the Ezra Carman
      Collection. A lot of stuff not on the microfilm!


      Thomas G. Clemens D.A.
      Professor of History
      Hagerstown Community College


      >>> "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...> 03/17/09 4:15 PM >>>
      Tom,

      Thanks to Carman, we have an
      idea where the 17th's expedition was but the scout on the 16th I
      think we only have Blackford. Do you think Stuart's scout on the
      morning/afternoon of the 16th was in the same area that Lee wanted
      Jackson to attack on the 17th? Were there any Union troops in that
      area on the 16th? If not, and if Blackford is correct about running
      into Union troops he had to be closer to the Hagerstown Pike around
      the North Woods later in the afternoon on the 16th when Doubleday
      arrived? Do you think Blackford and Stuart went all the way to the
      Williamsport-Keedysville Road (today's Bakersville and Spielman Rds
      part of Rt 63) on the 16th west of the Hagerstown Pike or even to the
      Boonsboro-Williamsport Road (today's Rt 68)?

      It is about 1 ¾ straight-
      line miles from the Dunkard Church to the Keedysville-Williamsport Rd
      and about 4 ½ to the Boonsboro-Williamsport Rd. There is a road to the
      west,
      the Downsville Pike Rt 632 which runs from Rt 63 to
      Hagerstown in pretty much a straight line which road I believe
      existed in 1862. I guess Stuart did not get that far either day but he
      may have had a chance on the 16th?

      Many of the modern-day roads in the area from Sharpsburg to
      Williamsport to Hagerstown seem to have been the same in 1862 so
      Stuart did have some options to the NW but if he could not get
      further north than Mercersville, I guess those options wouldn't
      help.


      --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "G E Mayers" <gerry1952@...> wrote:
      >
      > Dear Tom,
      >
      > Was the Cox's Farm Road expedition a viable one? Did Harsh ever
      > indicate to you his thoughts on it? Apparently Stuart must have
      > communicated something of worth to Lee if Lee, Longstreet and
      > Jackson were reviewing the larger scale maps of the area when
      > word comes to them at the Grove House of Hooker's crossing the
      > Antietam.
      >
      > Yr. Obt. Svt.
      > G E "Gerry" Mayers
      >
      > To Be A Virginian, either by birth, marriage, adoption, or even
      > on one's mother's side, is an introduction to any state in the
      > Union, a passport to any foreign country, and a benediction from
      > the Almighty God. --Anonymous
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "Thomas Clemens" <clemenst@...>
      > To: <TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 12:04 PM
      > Subject: [TalkAntietam] Re: queston about parallel routes to
      > HagerstownTurnpike north from Sharpsburg
      >
      >
      > >I think what Gerry is talking about is the road now known as
      > >Mondell road and then Taylor's Landing Road which led to the
      > >aforementioned site on the Potomac. From there a road led along
      > >the banks for some distance and roads branching off that led
      > >back to the Pike and others to the Boonsboro - Williamsport
      > >road. It shows on local maps and the names are not mentioned,
      > >thus I am using modern names. It was Harsh's opinion that the
      > >"Cox Farm expedition" was an attempt to see if that road was
      > >usable to evacuate the army northward toward Hagerstown.
      > >
      > >
      > > Dr. Thomas G. Clemens
      > > Professor of History
      > > Hagerstown Community College
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >>>> "eighth_conn_inf" <eighth_conn_inf@...> 3/17/2009 8:22
      > >>>> AM >>>
      > >
      > > I should have looked at Carman more closely; he says about the
      > > Antietam battlefield "The turnpike, country roads, and farm
      > > lanes gave ready access to all parts of the field upon which,
      > > save along the banks of the Antietam itself, there were no
      > > obstacl> > of artillery." Later he mentions "farm lanes" in several
      > > places. He often names the lanes for the farms to which they
      > > lead likely echoing usage at the time. In another place Carman
      > > mentions a "stock lane" which implies only a cattle path rather
      > > than a "regular" farm lane.
      > >
      > > Lanes were important as they usually had some type of fencing
      > > on either side (as did pikes and other roads) as they traversed
      > > various farmers' fields so provided some cover as well as
      > > barriers for troop movements. Looks like determining which
      > > lanes couriers/cavalry used will be interesting lacking primary
      > > sources.
      > >
      > > Larry
      > >
      > > --- In TalkAntietam@yahoogroups.com, "eighth_conn_inf"
      > > <eighth_conn_inf@> wrote:
      > >>
      > >> Gerry,
      > >>
      > >> Looking at the CC maps closely, the spaces between the various
      > >> types of fences around fields frequently have a regular dotted
      > >> line shown. The map legend doesn't list this symbol so I
      > >> wonder if it indicates a farm path. This makes sense as
      > >> farmers must get their teams to fields to plow and wagons to
      > >> harvest crops. So if many/most of these are wide enough to let
      > >> a wagon pass, they are also passable to couriers, etc.?
      > >>
      > >> Following the Smoketown Rd from the Dunkard Church towards
      > >> Smoketown shows that this dotted line splits as it enters the
      > >> East Woods and connects the parts of the road. I don't recall
      > >> reading comments about this link--anyone have any cites
      > >> referencing this connection or helpful statements about farm
      > >> lanes? Any thoughts? Or am I just coming late to this
      > >> realization about lanes = regular dotted lines?
      > >>
      > >>
      > >> Larry
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      >
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